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FAQs about Caryophyllid Coral Disease, Pests, Predation 4

Related Articles: Coral Pests and Disease; pests, predators, diseases and conditions by Sara Mavinkurve, Caryophyllid Corals, Elegance Coral

FAQs on Euphylliid Disease: Caryophyllid Disease 1, Caryophyllid Disease 2, Caryophyllid Disease 3, Caryophyllid Disease 5, Caryophyllid Disease 6, Caryophyllid Disease 7, Euphylliid Health 8, Euphylliid Health 9, Euphylliid Health 10, & Elegance Coral Disease/Pests,
FAQs on Euphylliid Disease by Category: Diagnosing, Environmental (Pollution/Poisoning, Lighting...), Nutritional, Social (Allelopathy), Trauma, Pathogenic (Infectious, Parasitic, Viral) Predatory/Pest, Treatments 

FAQs on Stony Coral Disease by Category: Diagnosing, Environmental (Pollution/Poisoning, Lighting...), Nutritional, Social (Allelopathy), Trauma, Pathogenic (Infectious, Parasitic, Viral) Predatory/Pest, Treatments  & Caryophylliids 1Caryophylliids 2Caryophylliids 3, Caryophylliids 4, Caryophyllid ID, Caryophyllid Compatibility, Caryophyllid Systems, Caryophyllid Selection, Caryophyllid Behavior, Caryophyllid Feeding, Caryophyllid Propagation/Reproduction,

Weird frogspawn coral question... likely burned by a Galaxea neighbour   3/6/08 Good Evening, <Am here now for me> I have scoured this site and the internet for two weeks now with no answer to this puzzling question, although you guys have answered my 10,000 other questions without me even having to ask. Its all here for the taking. <Ah, yes> All comments on my methods/system are welcome. Anyway, back to the problem at hand. I have a frogspawn coral which I purchased three weeks ago and it is losing tentacles. About one tentacle is lost from each of its five polyps each day. <Mmmm, bad> The tentacles constrict at the base and eventually pinch off completely and float away. Otherwise, the polyps look fairly good. They extend each day, close at night, and eat mysis shrimp every other day. Also, the polyps are not receding where they attach to the skeleton. I suspect that this may be a response to the different lighting I have them under, as the colors are becoming richer as the days pass. <... could be> The store used 14000K 175 watt or 150, I forgot) metal halides, with about 7 watts per gallon. I have two 100 watt 6700K screw-in compact fluorescents, which give me 12 watts per gallon. I have used these bulbs on the tank since it was created 14 months ago; I have replaced them once already. I suppose some other background info will help also. The tank is 16 gallons, tiny, but I have failed twice with larger ones. I have about 40 pounds of live rock <! not much room left for water> in there with 3.5 inches of crushed coral substrate. I am using a sulphur based denitrification media in the lower layers of the substrate. <Mmm, this could be...> My protein skimmer is a SeaClone 100, which I have had for years and I like it due to its simplicity. I use no other filters. Parameters are as follows: SG 1.023 Temp 80F pH 8.3 Ammonia 0 Nitrites 0 Nitrates 0 never a problem because of the reduction of NO3 <Need to have some...> KH 10 Ca 450 ppm <A bit high...> I do about a 25 percent water change every week with a peristaltic pump to add water at the same time I remove it. I realize this is not as good as removing water then adding, but coral placement does not allow for it. I actually add a 5 gallon bucket of new water made from Oceanic salt mix, but some is removed due to the simultaneous siphoning out of tank water (the 25% I roughly calculated). I do not supplement any trace elements, as I perform such frequent water changes. <Good technique for small volumes> I also do nothing special to keep the parameters as they are. I do top off with RO water which has been remineralized with 10 micron powered aragonite and a dose of "purple-up" from CaribSea. <I would discontinue this immediately> Water flow is medium too low for the frogspawn and is multidirectional. It is placed lower in the tank, about 10 inches from the lights. Other livestock: 1 galaxy coral, rapidly growing, opposite side from the frogspawn <D'oh! Oculinids are very "stingy"... THIS is most likely the cause of trouble here> 1 Kenya tree, also growing, <Secondarily allelopathogenic...> 1 orange Fungia, 2 inches across, doing great on the sand bed. various mushrooms, Zoanthids, a little anthelia 1 green banded goby 1 Firefish 1 yellowtail damsel 1 brittle star snails and crabs All of these are long term inhabitants having been in the tank longer than 9 months (except the frogspawn). None of the corals have direct contact with each other via sweeper tentacles. Any suggestions, comments, and criticism is welcomed, as I want to solve the disappearing tentacle problem. Best Regards, Ken <Oh, I see by your titling below you have some life-science backgd.. There are a few possibilities, sources of potential loss of vitality that you hint at... But definitely read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/cnidcompppt.htm and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

Torch Coral Symptom--Conflicting Information (Umm'¦Not Really The Case) -- 03/04/08 First, let me thank you for your hard work on a great site. <<We are pleased to be of assistance>> I am now into my second year of reef keeping and have come a long way thanks to WWM. <<Gratifying to know>> A couple weeks ago, I noticed that two of my green mushrooms were shrinking considerably and appeared to be shriveling up with some kind of curly, spaghetti-like filamentous stuff. <<Hmm'¦sounds like Mesenterial fibers'¦and possibly a response to encroachment/aggression from another organism>> Yesterday I noticed my metallic green torch had a small ball of the same stuff near the mouth on one of the heads. <<I wonder what the 'proximity' is between these animals'¦>> Today it looks like it has expanded into the mouth/insides of this head. I found these photos on WWM of a torch that has the same stuff on it. <<I see it, and I agree with Sara'¦looks to be digestive organs>> The problem is that in one case it appears that the poster is being told the problem is predatory Nudibranchs and in the other that this is a normal occurrence (mesentery material) and of no concern. Here are the photos and the links. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/carydisf7.htm  http://www.wetwebmedia.com/carydisfaq3.htm  Any direction you can offer is appreciated. Many thanks, Tom <<Well Tom, first let me point out that this is NOT an instance of two conflicting opinions for the same query/issue (not that it can't be found here [grin]). These questions and photos were submitted by different people nearly 18-months apart'¦and do appear to be two different issues. The first photo is quite good and very much appears to be a case of exposed Mesenterial fibers. Whether or not this is anything to worry about may well be up for debate, but I would suggest making sure this very aggressive Euphylliid is placed well away from those very noxious Corallimorpharians'¦if this issue matches your situation. The second photo is much less distinct, but close scrutiny does seem to bear out the presence of 'frilly rolled-flaps' that appear much different than the Mesenterial fibers and would support Bob's suggestion that they may be predatory Nudibranchs and thus require immediate steps to eradicate to save the coral'¦again, if this issue matches your situation. So hopefully you see this is not a case of contradiction, but more a case of two seemingly different issues with differing solutions. Bottom line'¦without a sharp, close-up photo of your problem, along with the 'details' of your system and livestock, about all any of us can do is guess. As it stands, you are in the best position to determine which of these two issues pertains to you. Regards, Eric Russell>>
Re: Torch Coral Symptom--Conflicting Information (Umm...Not Really The Case) - 03/04/08
Thank you for your reply and the clarification! <<Always welcome, mate. EricR>>

Re: Coral eater 2/24/08 Hi, Yesterday I didn't feed my tank for the night and by today morning, I lost half my frog spawn. The frog spawn was 100 bucks. Can you tell me how to catch the predator or can you point to a list of predators for reef? Any help would be appreciated guys. <Are you sure the coral isn't just dying? Hermits can be predators when they get hungry enough, but I'm not sure how likely it is that they'd eat half a coral colony overnight. And most things that eat coral you would have likely witnessed already (especially if it were consuming so much so quickly).> Regards, PraKash <Best, Sara M.>

Re: Coral eater -02/24/08 Hi Sara, Thanks for the quick reply. If the coral was dying how could it have died so much over night? <It's quite possible. It's not unusual for corals to suffer something called "Rapid Tissue Necrosis" or "RTN." Once they get this, they can completely die within less than 24hrs. Here's some more info on the condition: http://www.reefs.org/library/article/rtn.html > I have removed 6-7 hermits from the tank 2 weeks ago thinking they were the predators. Can long nose hawk, sail fin tang, Anthias fishes be predators? <highly unlikely> If the coral was dying what could be the cause? Ca 500PPM, 11dkh, 8.2 Ph. I have never checked for Mg. Can you please help? <Oh geez, it could be a lot of things. What is your salinity, temp? It could simply be the shock of being in a new tank if it wasn't acclimated slowly enough. How old is the tank? Are there any other corals near the Euphyllia? Btw, unless this is a rather large colony, $100 more than I'd pay for this coral.> Regards, PraKash <Best, Sara M.>

Re: Coral eater -02/25/08 Hi Sara, I think it was RTN. So there is no cure for this disease is it? <Unfortunately, no, not really. You can just hope and prey it stops. And if your coral is still alive by tomorrow, it probably has stopped (or wasn't RTN). Or, you can frag off the rapidly dying parts of the coral (if it's still dying).> My salinity is 1.233. My temperature is always 80-81. <Your salinity is too low for corals/marine inverts. It should be closer to 1.025-1.026. You should raise it slowly.> As always thanks. <De nada and good luck, Sara M.>

Bubble Coral/Health 2/19/08 Hello, <Hi FJ> I have a Bubble Coral that I added about a month ago. About two weeks ago I noticed it had reddish brown algae on the four highest tips of the plates on the skeleton. I assume that there was some damage to the plates somewhere in-between collection and me. Do I/ should I do anything to remove the algae or should I leave it alone. If so, what is the safest way to remove it. <I'd leave alone, more bad than good may result. If nutrient control is practiced, there shouldn't be any problem with the algae spreading.> Thanks, <You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)> FJ

Bubble Coral Disease? (Or Maybe Environmental Issues) -- 02/02/08 Hi Eric! <<Morning Don!>> Sorry to bother you again but any chance of telling me what's going on with this Bubble coral? I have had it for about 2 months and the last week it has been looking like this. Thanks again. <<Hmm'¦It is hard for me to discern much from this photo (too small, too distant), but it appears the coral is experiencing polyp bailout. This is usually a result of stinging/poisoning from another coral in too-close proximity, a result of 'light-shock' (either from being placed too high in the aquarium or as a result of new bulbs, or maybe just clarifying of the water from the addition/changing of filter carbon), or a result of a decline in water quality or an imbalance/deficiency of Earth/alkaline elements. If the coral is not too close to another (or not being harassed by a fish), and if lighting is not the issue, then look to your water quality/chemistry. Ensure Nitrates are below 5ppm and that Magnesium/Calcium/Alkalinity are all within NSW levels. Also'¦have you been feeding this coral? Plerogyra species are quite voracious predators and usually require supplemental feeding for their long-term wellbeing (as do most ALL corals, in my opinion). Small meaty foods like frozen mysis (twice a week) are a good supplemental food for this coral. EricR>>

Frogspawn stalk question... hlth. mostly, and a "blue" light LED f'  -- 1/26/08 Hi there, I have a seemingly healthy and happy frogspawn that has grown from three heads to seven in about 5 months (he loves mysis shrimp). <Mmm, needs more than this, nutrition and water quality supplement-wise> I have the 5 inch stalk stuffed into a hole in one of my rocks to anchor it. well.. something is eating away at the stalk and it is looking pretty weak at this point so I have two questions. 1) what do I do once it breaks? <Re-orient, place it> and 2) what is eating the stalk? <Perhaps nothing. Have you observed a predator?> I have two ridiculously large black urchins, <Mmm, could be poking it> 1 scooter blenny, 1 fox face (he came after this started) 4 green chromis, 1 mandarin, two tank bred percula clowns, and something that is 1/2 pink 1/2 yellow his make eludes me at the moment. I add calcium occasionally <How and why?> and an all in one nutrient supplement once every week or two. <... of what constituency, and how do you test for?> I'll admit that I almost never change my water but I seem to have a high evaporation rate and add a gallon of distilled water per day( not sure if that is good or not but it certainly stopped my algae issues). <And your stony coral health evidently> I used to test my water constantly but now I do it rarely because all looks well. <... can be deceiving. I "measure" such events in life by "results"> I do have a bristle worm problem that I am trying to solve. <Small possibility that these polychaetes might be involved as well...> Thanks in advance. <Ummm, well... there could be "something" chewing et al. here... but could just as well be an anomaly of water quality and/or nutrition at play... making the skeleton of the Euphylliid "soft"... Need more/real data to assess better... Or you might read: http://wetwebmedia.com/carydisfaqs.htm and the linked files above...> P.S. would you consider the PowerBrite 460 led blue light a moon light? <Sure> I just bought it today and the salesmen said it was a moonlight but it says its for growth?? <Mmm, blue? What wavelengths? See WWM re... will not likely boost growth, or photosynthesis period. Bob Fenner>

Re: frogspawn stalk question -- 1/28/08 Thanks for the response. Here is more info including photos to help with the diagnosis. <Good ones too> My tank is 90 gallons. It's been up for about 8 mo.s since we moved to Florida and prior to that about 1 yr. My lights are CF, 3 10,oook, 2 50/50 actinic, 1 6700k (accidental purchase). GH 180, KH 80-120, Ph 7.5, <Yikes... way too low... unable to biomineralize...> Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10, temp 78. I did pluck a tiny star fish off my frogspawn last night and another was on the rock nearby. I have removed 6-8 over the last 6 months or so. I read that they were a nuisance. Do you think they could be the problem? Stacy T. <Could be some aspect of predation, but the pH... is a huge issue here. Could be "it" alone... please... read re: on WWM and nutrition of Euphylliids/Caryophylliids... RMF>



Injured pearl bubble coral  1/19/08 I have a "pearl bubble coral" that was absolutely gorgeous when I bought him about a year and a half ago for my first reef tank, a 29g tank. I took good care of him, fed him, and gave him a home where he seemed happy for several months - expanding up to six inches above his skeleton. About 4 months after having him (and only 5 months experience with reef systems) I let a friend watch my system for a week while I was out of town. This friend made one vital mistake, and she explained to me exactly what happened. She had forgotten to mix some ph buffer with the top off water, and so thought it would be fine to just add the powder directly to the tank. It didn't dissolve as she had hoped (duh) and landed directly into the middle section of my gorgeous coral. <Yikes> I have to admit I thought he was a goner for a while, but I tried my best to nurse him back. He was completely white and sickly looking for about three months. It has now been nearly a year since the incident, and the coral has regained some of its color and still feeds regularly. It has also been moved into a 75 gallon tank and has been in there for about 6 months. It does not however extend nearly as much as it used to (maybe only 2 inches at the most now) and the middle section is very clearly dead. I am extremely strict on my water quality and there is little to no variation from my current parameters. I do a 5 gallon water change every 2-3 days, with 1 ten gallon change once a week. 1.25 salinity, 0 ph4, 0 no3/no4, 0 ammonia, ph 8.3, 79-80 F. I would love to see a full recovery of this animal, but am starting to fear that it may not happen. I have given him a whole corner of the tank to himself <Actually... your pic shows a polypoid life form to the upper left of this Physogyra> to avoid any further stress from other corals, and he is sitting in the sand, where he has always seemed happiest. There is an Aiptasia anemone on the backside of his skeleton <Ah yes> which I have tried to kill several times, only to have him reappear (sometimes with a twin!). The tentacles of the pest do not reach the flesh of the coral however. <I do think they or their assigns do...> You can see in the photo the right half of him is still alive and partially extended. The middle section is dead (I approximate 2 mouths lost). And there is still a single mouth on the far left that is still alive. I just happen to have this photo on my computer at work, but can get a clearer one if you'd like.  I guess there are several questions here. Is there a chance he will ever fully recover? Will the dead section ever regenerate? <Possibly times two> If not, would it be safe to cut him into two through the dead skeleton in the middle? <Could try, but I wouldn't at this stage... too weak, and may re-populate this area given better conditions, time> (there is no fleshy part here) Is there anything more I can do to help him out? <Mmm, yes. Principally the removal of the pest anemone... See WWM re... and iodide/ate applications, feeding... the use of a refugium....> I would love to see him as happy as he was in the past. Any insight or suggestions are greatly appreciated. <All are posted, expanded upon on WWM> Also have in this tank: variety of xenia, colt, variety of zoanthids, Fungia plate, green cup coral, mushrooms, frog spawn; pacific cleaner shrimp, 2 perc clowns, purple firefish, Swissguard basslet, 3 green chromis, yellow watchman goby, variety snails and hermits. As always, thanks for helping with the headache of understanding how to manage an oceanic world in our living rooms! A wonderful resource that all aquarists would benefit from! Josh <Mmm, do see WWM re the Glass Anemone removal et al.. And this spiffy ppt. pres. re what's going on here: http://wetwebmedia.com/cnidcompppt.htm
Bob Fenner>

LPS Lighting (One More Time!) - 05/18/06 Dear Eric R. <<Hello Diane>> It's been a long time since I've written in and the first time to you. <<Welcome back>> I have been trying to follow Bob's advice; read, read, read some more, then make up your own darn mind.  (To paraphrase). <<Indeed>> Well, I got the first part down.  However, just when I thought I had this lighting figured out I went to a different LFS and POOF! here we go again. <<Ha!...nature of the beast/hobby...opinions abound!>> If you would be so kind to go over what I have and help me straighten this out. <<Would be glad to provide my input>> We have a 125 gal. acrylic tank 72" X 18" X 20"  with a 6" DSB.  Lights hang 11 to 12" above the water line and can be raised or lowered as needed. <<Ok>> The lights are two 36" Power Compacts, the left-one is SunPaq 10,000K/460-Actinic and the right-one is SunPaq  Dual-Daylight 6,700/10,000K.  The halides are 3 X 175 watts.  Left is 6500K, middle is 20,000K and right is 14,000K. <<Mmm, why the variation across the length of the tank?  Are you attempting to create differing "zones/niches"?>> The yellow of the daylight halide is tempered by the blue of the actinic and the blue of the 14K Halide is tempered by the yellow of the daylight PCs (the 20K is because I have read so many raves and Anthony's book BOCP says for LPS you can go bluer.) <<Ok>> Well yesterday we went to a different LFS and they had the MOST beautiful corals!  We purchased several and during the selection and bagging process I questioned the manager as to his procedures for maintenance and lighting. He told me that 15K are THE best and that my 6500K should only be used for high light SPS. <<Too "general" a statement...I disagree>> Now Drs. Foster and Smith will let me return bulbs for replacement but am I that far off with my lights? <<I don't know, what are you keeping/trying to accomplish with this lighting?>> There can't be that much difference between 14K and 15K! <<Or even 20K...agreed>> However, I am not sure about the 6500K and the 20K. <<A marked difference in spectral output...but the 6500K still contains enough "blue light" for most all corals>> We have: (all bought yesterday),1 6" green Bubble (Plerogyra sinuosa), 1 6" Favites (?) shared corallite walls. <<Favites, yes...a shared wall between the calyces>> They are both under the 65K with the Favites on the sand and the Bubble three inches higher, on a rock. <<It may be fine, but keep an eye on the Bubble coral.  Plerogyra are not high light requiring corals, if the "bubbles" looks to be turning brown or stop expanding, do move it lower/to a more subdued lighting location>> One 4" green Long Tentacle Plate/Disc (Fungia scutaria) on the sand under the 20K with the most gorgeous green Fox (Nemenzophyllia turbida) also under the 20K but under a ledge.  To the right of them are 2 separate pieces of Branching Hammer (Euphyllia parancora) consisting of 8 and 9 heads respectively (after adaptation, thought of moving apart under different lights to experiment?). <<Sure>> They are also placed just three inches above the sand bed, however the highest two heads are 6" below the water line and they are centered between the 20K and the 14K.  Now, under the 14K is my baby, an Open Brain coral (Trachyphyllia geoffroyi) whom I've had 2 years now.  She is not the vivid color when I purchased her (bright green and deep maroon) but I would swear in the last few days her red is coming back! <<Maybe had "too much" light before hand.  It's not a hard and fast rule by any means, but many LPS with "red" pigments require/demand lower light levels than those with "green" pigments>> The new bulbs are either more to her liking or else the color was always there and I just couldn't see it under the old 5500Ks.   <<A bit of both>> After all that I guess my questions are, is the 6500K that bad? <<Nope...especially considering the wattage/distance you have the bulbs above the tank.  That's not to say I think it's the best bulb for your particular selection of livestock.  Speaking for me...for an LPS dominant tank I would go with a higher Kelvin rating...10000K is a good "all around" spectrum...but in this instance I would be tempted to go with a quality 14000K or 20000K bulb for each fixture.  Much depends on your own sense of aesthetics and what your trying replicate in your system>> (I have a 10K that I can replace it with but it is WHITE!)  Am not interested in SPS (never say never). << <grin> >> Is the 20K a good bulb for LPS? <<With enough intensity, yes.  If you go with 20000K I recommend you move the lights to within 6-8 inches of the water's surface>> The blue look is nice and the corals are beautiful under them but I want what is best for the animals (short of leaving them in the oceans of course). <<...of course>> These are the only corals I want with the possible addition of a nice Hammer (E. ancora) and maybe, sometime down the road a ways, I would love to have an Elegance (Catalaphyllia jardinei). <<Do please read up/research the Catalaphyllia well (you can begin here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/elegance.htm).  This is not an easy coral to keep, and is best tried in a specie specific system designed to/for its care>> Thank you so much for your time and patience.  All of you are appreciated and I hope one day you will all know how much! <<Thank you for the kind words...we're happy to assist>> Wishing you the best of life, Diane. <<And to you in kind, Eric Russell>> P.S. the LFS is ATM in Las Vegas, Nevada the one on the corner of Patrick and Sandhill in the Southeast part of the valley.  Beautiful corals and good prices. <<Hmm, will have to make a point to stop in next time I'm in Vegas.  EricR>>
LPS Lighting (One More Time!) II - 05/20/06
Polyp Bailout in Branching Hammer Dear Eric, Thank you so much for answering so quickly. You guys (yes, and gals) are great! <<You're welcome...and thank you>> But it seems quick as you were problems arise quicker! <<Uh oh>> The Branching Hammer has just been dissolving continuously since adding them to the tank.  I have been reading for two days now and since 2 a.m. this morning,  But other than photo shock (?) which I didn't think happened that quickly, I am at a loss.  I have also siphoned off two more gooey brown heads of the Hammer. <<Mmm, photo shock "can" have a rapid effect, especially if the coral was already stressed...but from the "gooey brown" description, I'm inclined to suspect a bacterial/protozoa infection.  Though admittedly pure speculation, but have you read through our coral disease FAQs?>> I separated the two pieces, leaving the best (?) of the two in its original location and moving the other to the far left end where I have removed the 6500K halide (to be replaced by another 14K Thank You <<welcome>>).  I also dipped this piece in an iodine mix of one quart aquarium water and ten drops Lugol's for ten minutes.  It only has two heads, out of nine, that look even halfway viable so I figured we had nothing to lose.  The other piece has two heads that look great and two that look iffy. <<I would dip "both" pieces in the iodine solution:   http://www.wetwebmedia.com/iodfaqs.htm >> We bought these corals on the 17th of May and this is the first day the Green Bubble has inflated but it is no longer the fluorescent green it was in the store, but rather a much paler green. <<Hmmm, would have thought the bubble coral to inflate before now...possibly telling (something in your water parameters?).  The color is "possibly" a function of the lighting...maybe the LFS had more "actinic" over the coral in the store>> The Long Tentacled Plate is starting to show himself and the Fox looks to be doing O.K.  Only the E. parancora crashed (but I know it's still real early in the game).  At the LFS the corals were in maybe six inches of water approximately 18 inches under 175 watt 14 and 20K (3).  The salinity was 1.025 but I forgot to ask about pH.  Anyhow I drip acclimated them over four plus hours and swore I would not move them around for at least 2 weeks if at all.  But I'll probably move the Bubble lower when the new bulb gets here. <<Okay>> Right now it is about 16 inches to the left of 20K, 5 inches below the water surface and 15 inches under the 10K/actinic P.C.  My water parameters are temp. 80 ; salinity 1.025; my pH was 8.3 at 6:30 last night and 8.0 at 7 this morning. <<Is fine>> I had added 1 tsp. Seachem Reef builder directly to the tank in an effort to get my alk. up from 2.5.  Added it last night and this morning my alk is 3.  Amm. is 0, nitrites are 0, but my nitrates are 10. <<Mmm...possibly a result of the decomposing Euphylliid...or an indication something else is amiss>> I have a 6 inch DSB and never had a problem with nitrate.  I use a Turboflotor-Multi HOB skimmer and (temporarily) an Aquaclear 110 with 2 new bags Chemi-pure and one Polyfilter. <<Both good stuff>> My iodine kit showed no iodine even after a couple of small water changes (approx. 20%) over 2 days so I added 4 drops Lugol's, still nothing on the test so I added 3 more drops, still nothing this morning. <<Hmmm...>> I use I.O. salt and the new water tests at .05 iodine, (perhaps the chemical filtration). <<Ah...yes>> Water movement is with 3 Aquaclear 70s <<...?  Aquaclear 70 power filters?  How often do you clean these...should be done "at least" weekly>> and 1 Seio 820. <<Some additional "vigorous" water movement would likely do this tank some good as well>> I don't know what else to do except maybe another small water change today to get the nitrates back to zero. <<I recommend a 30-40 percent water change>> I did not think my set-up was that different from the LFS where all the corals looked fantastic!  Do you have any suggestions. <<Mmm, yes...dip both Euphylliids again (remove any diseased/dieing heads first), perform a 40% water change, and keep monitoring water quality/performing water changes as needed>> The sad thing is I truly love the Euphylliid family and could easily picture a tank of just them. <<Would be beautiful I'm sure.  Don't give up...get over this hurdle, learn from the experience, and pursue your dream tank>> One more thing.  Do they dye corals? <<Some...mainly "soft" coral species...a terrible practice>> The Bubble was a very vivid neon green and the Fox is bright, almost fluorescent green. (But the Hammer is/was a more normal brown and green). <<Is rather unlikely these were/are dyed corals...have not heard of this being attempted with stony/LPS corals.  Regards, Eric Russell>> <Unfortunately... I have. RMF>

Bubble Coral health, systems  - 05/17/2006 Hello everyone, I have read and read on your site and others about my problem.  I have been in the hobby of reef aquariums for approximately two years.  I cannot seem to keep a bubble coral alive.  Everything I read states they are a hardy, good beginner coral.  I have a 110 gallon with approximately 160-200 pounds of live rock, various fish and many corals.  Nitrite, ammonia, are zero, calcium 360-400, ph 8.3 to 84, alkalinity (test kit is in high range color), nitrate 20-30ppm.  I dose every morning with B-Ionic and add 16 drops of iodine daily.  I installed a refugium around three months ago.  I also have an Excalibur skimmer, chiller, 400 watts of MH in addition to actinic blue lights.  I do a 20 to 30% water change weekly, with RO water, aerate it for couple of days, heat water to same temp. in aquarium, etc. My bubbles always do great for four to six weeks.  Then, the septa's begin turning black and ½ to ¾ of the bubble stops opening up.  I feed the bubble nightly with Mysid shrimp.  Each time this has happened, the bubble coral was on the bottom of the tank.  The last time this happened I moved it about half way up the tank.  The remaining few bubbles did fine for around two months, then the bubbles just stopped inflating and died. I am very stubborn and determined to get a bubble to live.  This time I have purchased a large bubble coral and am hoping for the best.  What am I doing wrong?  I have an elegance coral and other more difficult corals doing very well.  Any help would be very much appreciated.   Thank you,   Robin R. Shelton <<Robin: Do you know specifically what species you have?  In general, Bubble Corals like moderate light and low to med flow.  With your lighting, I would think they would like a quiet place on the sand.  As you know, many reefers regularly get their tanks to 0 Nitrates.  Thus, for corals 20-30 ppm would be considered quite high.  For me, having a skimmer solved part of the problem.  The rest was solved by growing Chaeto algae in the sump.  For you, switching from RO to RO/DI should also help. Why are you dosing iodine? Most people don't and a general rule of thumb is don't add something you can't test for.  Until you resolve your nitrate problem, you it would be better off not to introducing more corals into your tank.  Take a look at the links I have attached.  Given your previous luck with Bubbles, I think a smaller one would better handle the transition to a new tank than a big one that spent a long time living somewhere else.  Best of luck,  Roy http://www.wetwebmedia.com/nitratesmar.htm http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/august2003/chem.htm>>

Damaged Frogspawn ... prop., health    4/25/06 Hi all, <Debi> Well to make this short and not so sweet.  I was cleaning my tank, 46 bow front salt, changing water etc, when I stupidly decided to shorten the stem on my very pretty Frogspawn.  The LFS told me I could just break off the end and made it sound simple so I did, but I had to put more force on it than I expected and when it broke off it banged it's head (sort of opened up) on a rock and several little green pieces broke off. <Mmm, best/better by far to do such "operations" outside the main tank... with the animal shaken (not stirred?) a few moments ahead to cause the polyps to retract...>   Needless to say, it immediately retracted in shock and I also retracted from the tank in shock. I had no idea what to do so I repositioned it in the same place it had been, quickly finished my tasks and decided to leave it alone, either to die or recover.   My question is whether or not I can do anything else for it (anything good) aside from leaving it alone.  Should I take it out and put it in the QT tank of which I am not so sure it is ready? <Mmm, I would not... given just the information presented here. Much more likely to cause further trouble at this point likely> Should it be dosed with Iodine and can that be done in the show tank?   <This is likely best> I feel awful, he was so pretty and now he's just all sucked in and I have no idea if he is beyond repair or not. Thanks <Euphylliids are very tough if/once established... I give you good odds of complete recovery. Bob Fenner>

Losing my torch coral (semi-urgent) and treating a clown goby  - 5/5/2006 against ich... Hi Mr. Fenner, Hi Everybody, <Dominique> Sorry if I have been writing a bit too often these days... Hope I'm not pushing too far with my once a month average at the moment... My reef tank has one year this month and very healthy and successful and I owe you a lot for that result. Now that said, nothing is ever perfect and I have a few problems right now... of course... 1- My greatest concern for now is my torch coral (Euphyllia glabrescens). I wrote a few months ago because he was invaded by what we finally id as ostracods. We concluded that they were not a problem and I still stick to that conclusion. Just mentioning it here in case you see a link. Two weeks ago the otherwise apparently healthy and expended coral very quickly lost a complete branch. Large fleshy parts were hanging until showing the septae/skeleton. Then bunches of polyps hanging/falling together... Within a week the branch was clean, white, and dead. The rest of the coral still seemed very healthy and I thought everything would be ok now... until today. I noticed the same thing was happening to another branch and I fear I will lose the whole coral if I do nothing so here are some pictures I took today. <No pix came through> I tried find something in my books but no success (I have Aquarium Corals from Borneman, Coral Propagation, and Reef Invertebrates). I have potassium iodine and Lugol's (not used to dose the system) so should I try a dip and with which one (I guess Lugol's)? <Yes and yes> Please help me if you can. That would be my first failure with my corals. It hurts even more when I think that that species is not so widespread and fast-growing in the ocean... I also fear contagion to my two hammer corals... Here are my parameters: temperature: 81.4F (very stable with Neptune + heater and fans...) salinity: 1.0255 (very stable with Tunze Osmolator...) calcium: 375 Alk: 9.2 Nitrate and Phosphate: 0 Ammonia: 0 under 250w 13.5k megachrome at 18" deep with gentle current and partly shadowed by some high placed LR. 2- I am now treating a green clown goby (Gobiodon hystrio) against ich. I set-up a quarantine/hospital tank system with two 10gal and one 25 gal tanks. The goby has periodic ich outbreak since I got him. He seemed to do fine with this condition and no other fish in the tank ever shows symptoms. Now I decided to use the copper treatment in the 10gal hospital tank. Also thinking of leaving him there for 2 months. I did not remove the other fishes from the display but I guess if they don't show symptoms during those 8 weeks and the clown goby too then it shouldn't come back (right?). <Mmm... no... likely the system itself is infested... the other fishes just sub-symptomatic> Only now I discovered that those fish are somehow sensitive to copper. My question is: if hyposalinity is not efficient and if copper and formalin are dangerous to that fish, how do you treat it? <... posted on WWM> 3- BTW could you help ID this coral. I got it several months ago and was never sure about the species. The LFS (one I don't trust too much) sold it as a "cats paw" Pocillopora. Now while I am quite sure it's a Pocilloporidae, I hesitate between the genus Stylophora and Pocillopora. The species I can't tell for sure (damicornis?). Can you tell with that picture? <No pic> In any case I think it requires very strong water flow and lighting. Well at least that's what he gets now and seems fine with it, showing growth and improving color (turning from brownish greenish orange to pink). I can send a few more pictures of the Pocilloporidae and of the agonizing glabrescens, just didn't want to overload you... Many Thanks! Dominique <Please do try re-sending these. Perhaps to my personal email addr.: fennerrobert@hotmail.com Bob Fenner>
Pix did come through on my personal addy. The Coral in question does appear to be a Stylophora species, and for the health of the Euphyllia, please read over the section on WWM re the family Caryophyllidae. RMF

Frogspawn Frustration - 05/07/2006 Hi, Sorry but I forgot to mention one thing in the previous email.  About a day and a half after the water change (original text included below) when I noticed that the coral was not doing well I checked the SG and it was then at 1.018 according to my hydrometer.  I quickly called the LFS I had bought the water from and they thought that my measurement probably wasn't correct but said if I believed it to be that low to add one cup of salt dissolved in some RO/DI water.  I did that and the next day was when the other LFS measured it at the current 1.023.  So it occurs to me that maybe there was something wrong with the salt water I got from the first store causing the salinity to drop and would that have affected the coral this way?  Also, one other thing.  When I changed the water I removed the salt water first, replaced the salt water I had removed with the new and then topped off with RO/DI.  Does the order I did this in matter?  Could that have caused the problem? Thanks again, Debi Original message was......... (Hello Bob or whichever expert happens to answer this, hope all is well with you.)  My frogspawn isn't well and I cannot figure out what can be the problem.  I have attached two pics so you can see the decline for yourself.  My tank specs are as follows:  46 gallon bow front, 60 lbs. live rock and one inch of substrate sand, Aragonite I think, Remora Skimmer w/Aqua Jet 1200, one Aqua Jet 600 PH, one Seio 600 PH. occasional use of an Aqua Clear Power Filter for running carbon and PolyFilter.  Ran carbon for about two weeks and took it out yesterday, replaced it with PolyFilter.  At the moment the Aqua Filter is not on and has been off since yesterday.  Lighting is 36" 2x96 Coralife Aqualight w/Lunar Lights, 1x Actinic and 1x 10,000K.  Lighting is run Lunar constantly, with Actinic 12 hours and White 10, Actinic comes on one hour before the white and stays on one hour after if goes off.  The tank does have a canopy with a glass top which I leave open for oxygen exchange.  Bioload is light with two false percula, one red striped shrimp, one sand sifting sleeper goby, one frogspawn and various snails and hermit crabs, along with some green hair algae and some red slime.  The water tests are Ammonia-0, PH 8.2 to 8.4, Nitrite-0, Nitrate-0, Phosphorus-0, Calcium 550, Alk 2.5, SG 1.023 and temp 79-80 Fahrenheit controlled by a temp controller.  These results confirmed by my local LFS and myself.  I feed with Mysis and Cyclops-eeze in a squirt bottle, usually once a day, add a little garlic drops and some occasional Selcon to the food. and DT's weekly.  Additives are only Iodine weekly and now I have used Bi-Ionic 2 part for the past couple of days at 30 ml. each both days on the advice of my LFS because he says my alkalinity is low.  Normal water change schedule is 15 percent every 10 days.  It started three days ago, just one day after a  I changed 6 gallons of water and added 2 gallons top off RO/DI.  Both purchased from the LFS and the same as I have been using for the three months this tank has been up and cycled.  I noticed that there were some bubbles around the top edges of the water when I started the change.  I thought that was strange.  The frogspawn was looking pretty good as you can see in the before picture then the morning after the water change he began to look like one side was not coming out very much at all and has been going further and further in for the last two days resulting in the after picture.  The after picture is taken with only the actinic around 10 pm, but he looked this way all day.  As I mentioned all water parameters seemed to be good except for the low Alk which I am working on.  The only thing besides changing the water that I can think of that is different is that during the change I siphoned up quite a bit of red slime that was on the sand and did get the sand stirred up quite a bit.  I also seem to have a small problem with green hair algae in the lower part of the tank.  My LFS has suggested a lawn mower blenny for the algae.  Could I have stirred up something from the sand that could be affecting the coral.  I know that the Cyano is a bacteria and I know I didn't get it all out.  Would that be the problem?  I haven't changed the lighting or the corals position since he came home, I have had him about a month.  I haven't had the best luck so far with this tank as I have lost a Royal Gramma about two months ago, a Yellow Tang about 3 weeks ago and a 6 lined wrasse about 2 weeks ago.  I have no clue what happened to any of them as there were no obvious signs of Ich or anything else.  They just slowly died over a matter of days after my getting them.  The Tang only lasted about 10 hours.  I have decided to try buying my live stock someplace else.  I realize this is a new tank by normal standards and will go through settling in pains, but it has been cycled for three months now and the store says I am doing everything right.  The clowns and shrimp and goby look well and are eating and the shrimp has molted twice in two months, last time just yesterday.  The goby has recently started taking his sand up high to sift (like mid tank, is this significant) and so the sand is on the rocks a lot, occasionally I blow it off with a turkey baster.  That's all I can think of that might be relevant.  Sorry for the length I just wanted to make sure you had all the information.  Please any suggestions or help would be so appreciated as this is getting frustrating to me as a new hobbyist that is trying to do everything good to take care of my fishies...............)  Thanks in advance,  -Debi <Debi - Frogspawn are usually very hardy.  They like medium light and medium to low flow.  Unfortunately, I could not see your images.  When you do water changes, you should try to keep your SG stable.  Thus, if you need to top off with fresh water, you should do it first before you do a water change.  Since Hydrometers can be unreliable, you should invest in a refractometer.  You can get them on eBay for around $40.  The accuracy and piece of mind they give is worthwhile.  I am concerned with your fish dying.  You should have a quarantine tank for all new purchases.  When you get the refractometer, check the SG.  You may find that it is much different than you thought.  Regarding iodine, most people don't add it.  The general rule is don't add something you can't monitor and test for.  Best of luck,  Roy>
Frogspawn Frustration - II - 05/07/2006 Sorry, this is a resend of a sort because when it was sent the first time I accidentally left out what might be pertinent information and also the kind person (Roy) that tried to answer it couldn't see the pics and consequently only commented on a portion of the message.  Does it sound like I should be looking for other problems?  What would they be.  The fish dying are also an issue and the LFS always says the water tests are good and has no idea what could be the cause. <Debi - Frogspawn are usually very hardy.  They like medium light and medium to low flow.  The pictures were helpful.  Sometimes it takes them several days to adjust to a new location or to being moved.  In the before picture, your frogspawn is sweeping in one direction.  In the after picture, the frogspawn has retracted on the side where the flow seems to be coming from (retraction is normal if something is not right).  If you can adjust the flow, I would first try reducing the amount of flow that hits the frogspawn (or find something to put on the left side to block some of the current).  If that works, I think the branches will come back out.  Another possibility is if the lighting is not the same over both sides of the frogspawn (i.e., if one side is in the shade compared to the other side).  I have seen frogspawn branches retract if there is not enough light.  Since frogspawn are hardy, I don't think what you feed, or how often, has anything to do with your current problem (mine grow like crazy and I have never target fed them).  The amount of algae you currently have in the tank may be a result of overfeeding.  You might want to feed a bit less rather than buy a Lawn Mower Blenny which usually won't eat Cyano or Hair Algae.  I don't think the Cyano or Hair Algae will have much effect on the frogspawn as long as they are not growing on it.  When you do water changes, you should try to keep your SG stable.  Thus, if you need to top off with fresh water, you should do it first before you do a water change.  If you don't, you could have a high SG spike if you dump in the new salt water and then use RO/DI to get the SG back down to 1.023.  Since Hydrometers can be unreliable, you should invest in a refractometer.  You can get them on eBay for around $40.  The accuracy and piece of mind they give is worthwhile.  I am concerned with your fish dying.  You should have a quarantine tank for all new purchases.  When you get the refractometer, check the SG.  You may find that it is much different than you thought.  Regarding iodine, most people don't add it.  The general rule is don't add something you can't monitor and test for.  Best of luck,  Roy>

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