Angelfish Die Off, FW comm.    9/27/07
Hello
<Hi there>
I own a live tropical fish store in Michigan and within the past six months, I have not been able to keep freshwater angelfish alive. Is there a problem that you know of that is causing these poor creatures to perish after 72 to 96 hours of arrival?
<Yes... a couple in particular... One, an older plaque of Octomita that was the causative organism of "Angelfish Disease" years back... can/should be treated with treatment of existing systems (with Metronidazole/Flagyl), and strict quarantine and treatment with same for all questionable/Far East imported angels or angels that may have come in contact with... The second syndrome is "just exhaustion/stress" from import... Both situations can/are best remedied by buying your Angels from local, or as local as you can find, breeder/s>
My suppliers out west will not ship to anyone via plane because they have had other customers complaining of the same problem. Six months prior, angels were great, healthy, and eating. Now they come in looking healthy but within a couple of days, perish. Could it be the same as with the piranha deal?
<Mmm, yes>
Thank you!
Sincerely,
W.L.
<Try the Metronidazole... get folks about you to breed/supply you... Bob Fenner>

Most Common Nitrate Export Method at LFS   7/2/07
Dear Crew,
<Pablo>
At local fish stores (LFS), I notice that very few tanks seriously employ refugiums, DSBs or live rock. Sand and rocks appear to be ornamental in most tanks. They seem to use a variant of the "bare bottom" method. What is the primarily means of nitrate export at an LFS?
<Mmm, likely water changes... replacement of such with bagging, selling the livestock... Some shops do incorporate various means of filtration that incorporate nitrate reduction/export... LR, DSB's, lighted algal et al. refugiums, chemical filtrants... physical devices like UV, ozone that affect such nitrogenous accumulation... What would you do? Bob Fenner>
Thanks,
Paul.

LFS
Hello, 
<Hello Jonathan, James here>
My name is Jonathan, and I spoke to you before. I'm pleased to talk with knowledgeable people about fish. Right now I am in a unique position. I work nights at a local pet store with salt water fish. I'm 7 year fishaholic. Right now, I can try things out and gain insight into what products work. 
<Nice position to be into> 
I'm interested in helping the fish out, and will learn whatever I can. 
<Great!>
So off the bat, I know there are things I can't control and realities that exist. Some fish will always die due to the stress of shipping, that's just unavoidable. Some fish arrive in very poor condition, they are hard to help. But once I get my hands on them, I want to try.
P.S. I'm also fortunate enough to work with an experienced veteran who is open minded and willing to try new things. (as long as I don't tint the color of the water, or of course endanger the fish)
Off to a salty start. Our salt water section is about 16 tanks, some with a partition. Each tank is about 80 gallons; total system is about 900 gallons. Each tank having 2 very large sponges filter each attached to a powerhead, also the tanks are centralized, each sharing a common source of water through a sump with wet-dry. I have one tank shut off from the
system, which acts as a treatment tank. We have copper in the system to help combat disease. Occasional use of Maracyn is also delivered.
One interesting issue is the red Cyano bacteria we get on the crushed coral substrate. Since we cannot limit lighting, it has to be on about 14 hours, and we have a dealer fish load. We are combating this foe by removing heavily infested gravel into a bucket to dry out, occasionally mixing in some MelaFix on the gravel. By rotating the gravel in this manner we are making progress. Also increasing water changes and removing debris in the tank helps. We are about to Chemi-clean. An expensive option, but recommended to help get rid of the infestation. Any tips would be appreciated. 
<The Cyano you are experiencing is helped along by excess nutrients. I suggest cleaning the sponge filters in salt water every other day. Some dealers do not put any substrate on the bottom. This makes vacuuming easier in removing waste from the tanks. Maracyn works much better than MelaFix for killing Cyano.>
My main concern is marine angels. They come in and half the time they do poorly / die. Mostly I’m referring to the large angels, the dwarfs are a bit better. One recurring issue is when one of the eyes gets cloudy, from just a little to completely. I don't like thinking that there is nothing I can do. The fish can be eating great, well adjusted and swimming fine for weeks. But the eye gets worse and worse, and then the behavior changes to being lethargic or hiding, then death. 
I was thinking about trying a medicated antibacterial food for the ones that will eat. Medi-gold comes to mind, since it seems powerful, yet untested on tropical or marine. I'd be willing to try others. I also have SeaChem's Focus. Something which lets me bind a medication to food, even if I have to have a vet prescription med I could try that. I can separate to treatment tank. I can perform freshwater dips if very necessary. Please any suggestions? 
Dealers I know will not stock large angels for just that reason. They will special order only. Most dealer's tanks are overstocked and that adds to the fungal/bacterial problem. Obviously, dealers want to sell the fish as soon as possible to relieve the overstocking problem. If I were to "stock" large angels in my store, I would have a 180 gallon or larger tank for that purpose, where I could treat the angels I have for any diseases. I would also dose this tank with an iodine supplement. I would also employ the use of UV sterilization in all systems. One dealer I frequent has a large Lifeguard UV system. I rarely see a diseased fish in his tanks.
Also I'm looking to entice fish to eat. off course many will not eat the first few days. It seems also, that many never learned to eat fish food. 
<True> 
Like the angels which pick off the gravel, but seem to snub whatever I try. Any recipes you have. I have SeaChem garlic guard,
<Good> 
and a little food processor. Could I make something more appealing? 
<Yes. Here is a link to an article by Adam Blundell on a homemade recipe.> <<Where is a link?>><<Sheesh: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/cav1i3/Progressive_Recipe/Progressive_Recipe.htm RMF>>
Thank you again for any words you have to offer. 
<You're welcome>
Any referrals to books or articles would also be appreciated. 
<Search the Wet Web Media. There are tons of articles just waiting to be read that cover most any subject. James (Salty Dog)> 

Bio-balls and LR, CuSO4 in commercial systems
Dear Bob,
<Charles>
Thx for your advice. Can I place bio-ball and live rock
together in my holdings without removing any of them?
Will nitrate level going down?
<Yes, and yes, it should>
I guess UV light is still cheaper than Ozonizer such
as SANDER.
<Yes... to buy and operate>
What do you think of alternative such as adding
Copper Sulphate? Do you know the exact dosage
for 1 litre such that it will kill all bacteria but not
toxic enough to kill the fishes?
<Very dangerous to use copper sulfate on an ongoing basis... if you do get involved in such practice, make your choice a chelated/sequestered variety (e.g. Coppersafe)... I encourage you to develop and adhere to a protocol of pH-adjusted freshwater baths (on arrival) instead to discount the introduction and spread of ectoparasites. Information re these practices can be understood from a cursory reading of materials archived on WWM. Bob Fenner>
Pls advise.
Cheers,
Charles