CO2 AG Use F

FAQs on Carbon Dioxide and Planted Tanks: Use, Rationale

Related Articles: Carbon dioxide and the planted freshwater aquarium by Neale Monks, CO2 Canopies,

Related FAQs: CO2 & Planted Tanks 1, CO2 & Planted Tanks 2, CO2 Canopies, & FAQs on CO2 Planted Tanks: Sources, Yeast-Bottle Types, Compressed Gas Types, Control/Delivery, Measure, Dangers,

...thekrib.com that discusses CO2 and the pros and cons of adding CO2

gold Gourami 9/15/11
Hello Neale, Chris here. Two quick questions for you. My Gold Gourami has red muscle near the front fins, is this natural or is there a problem here?
<It's not unusual for many fish to have a red band along the "join" between the body and the fin. Obviously inflammation indicates irritation, but if the fish is otherwise normal, and the red is the colour of the blood rather than inflammation, it's normal!>
Also when having live plants, is it necessary to use a Co2 system for them to thrive?
<Yes and no. There are many plants that will only grow under bright light, and most of these also need CO2 as well. The brighter the light, the more CO2 a plant needs, and above a certain light intensity, there isn't enough CO2 in the water coming from the fish alone. On the other hand, there are plenty of plants that can muddle through with just the ambient CO2 from your aquarium fish. These tend to be the low to middling light plants often recommended to beginners -- hardy Cryptocoryne species, some of the Amazon swords, Vallisneria, Java ferns, Anubias, etc. So yes, if you choose carefully, you can have a lush green aquarium without CO2, but the Amano-style tanks with the more demanding plants generally rely on CO2.>
thanks again, Chris.
<Cheers, Neale.>

Lighting/CO2: FW Planted System: CO2 dosing 7/22/2009
Hey Wet Web Crew,
<Hi Joey.>
If I apply bright lighting to a planted aquarium (3 WPG or so), must I also use a high-tech CO2 diffuser system, or can I make it work with a more financially realistic DIY yeast method of CO2 addition?
<Well, being an engineer, I'm going to give you standard engineering answer #1: "It depends">
<There are several variables that will determine the CO2 demand of your system:
1. How big is the tank
2. How is it filtered
3. How much and what kind of livestock are in the tank
4. What supplements, if any, are you using
5. Where is the tank located?
6. What plants are you putting in the tank?
<<And how lighted... the "boosting" of photosynthesis often makes "something" rate-limited... including, often, CO2. RMF>>
All of these will influence the amount of CO2 in your system: A big tank can hold more dissolved CO2 than a smaller one, Filtration and water movement will have an influence on gas exchange, Livestock produces CO2, Fast growing plants will consume CO2 faster than slow growing plants, etc.>
<For what it is worth, I have a 75 gallon planted tank, with about 3 watts per gallon and I do not add any CO2. Between my Rainbowfish, water changes, and from time to time, me blowing bubbles in the tank, it gets all of the CO2 it needs, and this is with at least one plant that has been regarded as near impossible to keep long term. (Lace Leaf), that I have had for three years.>
<I guess my point to all of this is: get your system set up, put your livestock in first then your plants and then watch. If your plants aren't doing well, you may want to look into some sort of system, and I would not
go "high tech" right from the start. CO2 systems can be as elaborate or as simple as you want them to be. They all work. The only variable is how much daily maintenance you wish to deal with. You may do fine with a yeast system, blowing bubbles in the tank yourself, or dropping a small piece of dry ice in the filter.>
<Do read here for some more information:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/co2agfaqs.htm>
Thank you for the help,
<My pleasure.>
Joey E.
<MikeV>

Re: Lighting/CO2: FW Planted System: CO2 dosing 7/23/2009
<Hi Joey.>
Thank you Mike. That was a wonderfully helpful response. I would go into detail about the tank plans, but since my tank will, according to the stated variables, be less likely to need a high-tech system than your 75 gallon, I think I will save us the time.
<Hehehe, OK, actually my CO2 system is 'No-tech' - every now and then I'll take a piece of hose and blow bubbles in the tank.>
I'll try the yeast method first. Hopefully that will work fine, because I cannot afford a nicer system right now.
<Very good. Do remember that a CO2 system can make a 'good' system better, but it will not make a poor system run well.>
I plan on using at least some plants that require bright light, but hopefully it won't be a problem with the proposed CO2 addition method.
<Not likely to be a problem.>
One more question: I'm leaning toward using a Coralife Aqualight 30" (the aquarium will be 29 gallons) compact fluorescent fixture for the tank, which is a single strip with 65W of power.
<Should be fine for a tank of this size. One other option you may want to look into is T-5 lighting - It produces more light per watt than compact fluorescents, and are usually slightly less expensive.>
Strange thing is, the bulb inside this fixture doesn't extend the full 30", but instead runs 24" of the length. To me, it would seem that the part of the aquarium beneath the area of the fixture not covered by bulb would not receive enough light.
<Provided you are using the correct bulbs for a planted tank, this is not something to be concerned with >
Do you think an adequate solution would be to position a compact fluorescent desk lamp above the light-lacking area? I found one that would add 13W to the aquarium (which, I know, may not be the most important aspect of aquaria lighting, but...)...
<This should not be necessary. The one fixture you have should be more than adequate. for this tank, I wouldn't worry about the 6" of the tank that is not under direct light.>
Also, I realize that some of this depends on which plants I put where, as well as other general layout factors, but would such a set up be effective, given that I took unstated variables into account?
<What you have listed is very viable, it sounds like you are off to a good start.>
Thanks once more,
<My pleasure.>
Joey E.
<MikeV>

Re: Lighting/CO2: FW Planted System: CO2 dosing 8/13/2009
Hey Mike,
<Hey Joey.>
Continuing our conversation before, which began with CO2 and evolved into lighting: you suggested T5s over the PCs...Well, Coralife also has a T5 double strip, as you probably know. After all I've read on the internet, it is hard for me to get over the fact the T5s would draw only 36W total and the single PC would pull 65W. Practically everything one reads says you should have 3WPG to grow bright light-requiring plants...Am I really to move beyond the WPG idea; is that really an outdated measurement for considering
aquatic plant growth?
<It is a bit outdated, particularly for a planted tank.>
It makes sense that it is; who cares how much power it sucks up, if it truly provides more light? But then, it seems these PC fixtures are becoming popular...Is it just hype?
<Both PC and T-5 are popular. I prefer T-5 for the lower heat generated, and the lights just seem brighter to me.>
And finally, would you extend your earlier statement about T5s providing more lumens to also say that they will lend higher total photosynthetically usable radiation, and will, overall, be better for plant growth?
<Yes, with the caveat that the bulb is in the correct spectrum. I've had really good luck with a 6700K and a 10000K bulb in my 75>
Is there anything different about "freshwater" and 50-50 "saltwater" fluorescent fixtures except that the latter usually comes with an actinic bulb?
<Yes, Actinic light is an intense blue. It is really more for aesthetics rather than for PAR.>
That is, can I use whatever type of fluorescent I want in it, and it would work to the same effect that a fixture labeled "freshwater" would?

Thanks for the aquatic wisdom,
<My pleasure.>
Joey
<MikeV>

Re: Lighting/CO2: FW Planted System: CO2 dosing 8/14/2009
Mike,
<Hi Joey.>
With the question about the freshwater and 50/50 light fixtures, what I meant was, can I buy a Coralife t5 fixture, for example, designated for saltwater by the actinic bulb included, and use it for freshwater, simply
replacing the actinic bulb with one better for plant growth?
<Most definitely.>
Or is there something about the fixture itself that designates it as better for saltwater use?
<They are identical fixtures, except for the bulbs>
Joey E
<MikeV>

Air Stones and Live Plants 8/1/07 I have thoroughly enjoyed spending some time with your website for the past several hours! Great stuff. I am getting back into the aquarist hobby after taking a 17 year hiatus! I am re-starting my 38 gallon tall aquarium set up with a Magnum 200 canister (still going strong). I would love to have live plants in the tank, but the last time (read 17 years ago), I remember having what I thought were circulation issues due to the depth of the tank. My LFS recommended a large air stone to help circulate the water. Now I read some of the FAQs and aeration doesn't seem to be a recommended practice for planted tanks. I would love your recommendation. I enjoy the serenity of some bubbles in a tank, so can I get away with some, but not a large stone? <Greetings. The deal with airstones, and indeed any form of turbulence in a planted aquarium, is that the splashing causes carbon dioxide (CO2) to leave the water. Since plants need this CO2 to thrive, when this is lost from the water, plant growth slows. In fact, serious plant growers use devices to *add* CO2 to the water and take care not to have any splashing that will cause the CO2 to be lost. To improve circulation, these tanks usually rely on pumps that move water about with the use the air bubbles. Any decent canister filter should provide enough circulation, but additional powerheads can be added if required. Regardless, in planted tanks, it is normal to *understock* the aquarium anyway, so water current is less critical than in a heavily stocked community tank. Bottom line: aim for good plant growth, or go for water with bubbles, but you can't really have both. Cheers, Neale>

Discus In A Planted Tank 1/28/07 Hey there after lots of research and countless hours. My answer was still unclear. Now the question. do I need a CO2 system for a fish and heavily planted tank? < The plants will do better with some CO2 in the water. Some stem plants like frill usually need CO2 to thrive. Sword plants and Cryptocorynes usually don't require CO2.> Is this tank ready for discus? < Discus can live in a bare tank to one that is heavily planted. Discus do not like to be stressed. I would recommend that you wait until you tank is fairly well set up before adding discus. If you are going to add plants after they are in and established, then I would work in small areas over time so not to disturb the tank too much.> I am looking to make an Amazon biotope. < These are very pretty tanks, except that in the Amazon the warm acidic water is so poor in nutrients that there are very few aquatic plants.> Right now I am running a 75 gallon FW. The substrate is 135 lbs.. fluorite 4 in. thick all around and 6 medium driftwood pieces some plants 3 Amazon swords 2 canister filters Eheim pro 2128 thermo and Rena xp3. temp is about 30.6 C. or 85 F. pH.5.7 KH 3 GH 1, Peat is being used in one filter for its added benefits. Fish 20 neon tetra 10 glow light tetra 5 Rasboras 1 king tiger Pleco L 065 The tank is month old, I do 2 water changes a week with RO/DI water 30 gallon each time. I treat the RO water with equilibrium powder form Kent Zoe, Discus Trace < Sounds like a great tank. I would recommend adding Bio-Spira from Marineland to make sure your tank has all the biological bacteria established and you don't get any spikes.-Chuck>

CO2 to keep pH down at higher KH 9/18/06 Hello Crew <Tim> At the moment, my pH is around 6.5 which is roughly where I want it. However, the KH is very low (perhaps 1 dH) and I am worried about pH crash. Whenever I try to raise the KH, the pH goes up with it (no real surprise there). <Mmm, actually... one can raise KH w/o alkalinity... easily enough with calcium or magnesium chloride... Please see the second citation here: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=PCTA,PCTA:2006-31,PCTA:en&q=raising+KH+without+alkalinity> I am also resisting using phosphate-based buffers. I am thinking of adding CO2 to my fish-only, 50-gallon tank in order to maintain the pH at where it is but with KH much higher, say 4-5 dH. <Not altogether safe to make such an ongoing adjustment... I would soften the water here first> Bearing in mind this is a fish-only tank (with silk plants), what would be the most economical setup to add CO2? Thanks Tim <Again... Please read here: http://www.google.com/custom?domains=www.WetWebMedia.com&q=using+carbon+dioxide+for+plants&sa =Search&sitesearch=www.WetWebMedia.com&client=pub-4522959445250520&forid=1&ie=ISO-8859-1&oe=ISO-8859-1&cof=GALT%3A%23008000%3BGL%3A1%3BDIV%3A%23336699%3BVLC%3A663399%3BAH%3Acenter%3BBGC%3A99C9FF%3BLBGC%3A336699%3BALC%3A0000FF%3BLC%3A0000FF%3BT%3A000000%3BGFNT%3A0000FF%3BGIMP%3A0000FF%3BFORID%3A1%3B&hl=en The cached versions... Bob Fenner>

Growing Plants w/o C02 7/4/06 Hi, <Hi, Pufferpunk here> I have a 20g standard tank, Eco-Complete substrate tank with one 18w Power Glo light in the hood. Plants are alive but not growing much at all. I do not want to use C02. If I bought a double florescent light fixture, would I double my plant growth without awaking the algae growth? <It would be helpful to have 2 bulbs instead of one, I have a 90g planted tank w/4 bulbs.> I dose with Excel once a week and do a water change as well, 50 percent. I am pretty much looking for a low light, low maintenance 20g tank. A friend of mine (we have the same set-up except for the substrate and the plants) are not doing too well. One tank that I maintain, has one light, no CO2, Fluorite with freshwater gravel and the plants are huge--java fern growing all over Tis a 38g tank, and a power-Glo light, the next size up from the 24inch. What should I do to step my plant growth up a notch, other than CO2, if possible.

Planted tank question Hello Bob! <James here today> I have a large 96x30x30 tank that I am wanting to make into a freshwater, planted tank. I am looking for opinions on filtration for a tank this size. I was thinking about a large wet dry filter, versus 3 Eheim 2228 filters with the built-in heaters. The tank is reef-ready with one large, center overflow. Also, not wanting to go crazy with plants, is CO2 a necessity? <CO2 is not a necessity. More important to have a nutrient rich bottom for the plants to feed on. Fluorite is one product, but there are several. The wet/dry will definitely improve oxygen levels in the tank as one plus, but will also help rid the tank of CO2 due to the large amount of gas/air/water exchange. You may want to check Pentair's (formerly rainbow) filtration systems. They have systems large enough to filter a tank such as yours. Drs. Foster & Smith is one place that I know that carries them. I'll also post a link here that has FAQ's about wet/dry filters and planted tanks. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/tksstdsagFAQs.htm. James (Salty Dog)>

Phosphates, algae, PMDD, and CO2 injection Hey, WWM-ites, <Glen> Once again, thank you for your time in answering all our questions. The Wife has OK'd making a donation on your new Amazon Honor System link (at the bottom of the homepage, for those of my fellow readers who haven't noticed it yet) after two more paychecks. <Thank you, and her> MacL, your answers on the acrylic questions will save me lots of money, and I appreciate it! <Yay!> I've arrived at a few more tentative decisions for near-future directions, and would appreciate feedback. <Okay> We started our 55g freshwater community tank with sodium biphosphate (to drop the pH 9.5+ tapwater here in Austin), <Wowzah! Liquid rock!> phosphate buffers and fake plants. We've swapped out most of our fake plants for real ones now, and I've stopped adding more phosphates now that we have a luxuriant carpet of algae (more on that in a minute). From what everyone says, using a phosphate buffer in a planted tank is pretty well guaranteed to cause rampant algae growth. Am I wrong in understanding it this way? <Mmm, can, but not necessarily>
Based on this theory, I'm using Poly-Filters (for the last three days) in the Emperor 400 to extract the phosphates. Doesn't this remove the buffering, as well? <Mmm, no... not carbonates, bicarbonates... unless they are bound with metals> (Seems like a "well, duh" question...) I monitor the water chemistry religiously; test the pH (7.1-7.15) at least twice a week with a meter (calibrated every few weeks), do reagent-based nitrate tests (never above 20ppm) twice a week, and ammonia and nitrite tests (both 0.0) every time we've added livestock (but we're at max population density now, so those will go to once a month unless something looks awry). <Outstanding> We change 14+ gallons every week (we make 25 gallons at a time in a dedicated trash can), and with my new phosphate-free regimen the pH is 7.05 to 7.1, but the new-water kH is zero. I bring the tap pH down to just acidic with hydrochloric acid, and balance it back to neutral with sodium bicarbonate - fairly easy to achieve, but a bit too much either way and the pH goes to either under 6 or straight to 8.3 (sodium bicarb buffer point). <Oh!> If the Poly-Filter removes all the phosphate ions, and hence all the buffering in the tank, how fast can the dreaded "pH crash" happen? Hours/days/weeks? <Days, could... likely there is some other buffering mechanism at play here... substrate, decor...> With the water changing regimen, is it still as big a worry? <Not "that" much> Should I spend the money for a "system" like Seachem's Acid/Alkaline Buffer additives (chemically almost the same as what I'm doing now, AFAIK), and add the appropriate blend of them after I've achieved neutrality? <Up to you... I'm a cheapskate and so would not> I've spent hours on the Internet investigating buffers, and there apparently isn't anything remotely as stable as phosphate buffers (without getting into exotic DNA-analysis stuff at $35 per 100 ml). Right? Worry or not too? <Not too... do what I would... add a gallon or so of just straight tap to the whole shebang. No big worries re pH...> When we added our first live plants (Vallisneria and Cabomba) we got quite a growth of hair algae on the Vallisneria and a bit on the edges of our silk plants. (From pictures on the Internet, it looks like Val.s are a pretty good growth medium for hair algae.) We've since added more Cabomba, some dwarf and giant hair grass, a huge planted Watersprite (and some floating), a wad of Java moss, some Ludwigia repens, a cluster of Alternanthera, and we just planted two tiger lotus bulbs which haven't sprouted yet. All the plants are doing better than I expected them to, especially after upgrading to a 110-watt compact fluorescent fixture (the AGA with GE 9325K bulbs). The Val.s are sprouting nicely at the main plants and sending runners everywhere - we have sprouts coming up nearly two feet away from the main plants. <Neat... and good bio-assay evidence of no outright shortage of macronutrient/s> I've been cutting out the older worst-covered Vallisneria blades to physically remove the bulk of the hair algae (the scorched-earth philosophy), and am going to see if the color in the silk plants will stand up to a bleach dip to kill the algal inflorescence thereupon. <Should do so... and/or keeping them in the dark for a week or so> Y'all have indicated that patience, rational fish-feeding, and healthy plants will eventually starve out the rest. <They will>
I've just ordered the components for making some PMDD to boost the plants' micronutrient levels (particularly the iron, as I understand it's important to the algae battle) and will let you know how/if it works. Any other suggestions (other than CO2, the next subject)? <For others reading this PMDD is an acronym for "Poor Man's Dupla Drops"... an ersatz near formulation of Horst and Kipper's business (Dupla) complete plant fertilizer product... you can see more re this on "the krib" (search via the Net please)> I've pretty well convinced myself to put a yeast-based DIY CO2 injection system in the DIY trickle filter I'm building. <Neat... and some semi-sneaky advice... start hinting that what you'd REALLY like for upcoming birthdays, thank yous are carbon dioxide infusion gear... a five-ten pound bottle, regulator, needle-valve... as I am VERY sure you will "out-grow" the pop bottle technology but quick> I'm thinking about a forced-water injector in the final sump compartment before the return pump. The question I have about this concerns our tank aeration. We have what I call a "wall-'o-bubbles" along the back of the tank - a 36" bubble stick (at my Wife's request - she loves the look). <Wow! And a humong oh air pump I'll wager> I know that aeration is danged near a cardinal sin in a planted/injected tank, but too bad - the wall stays, don't argue with Mama. :-) <Hotay!> Will the aeration severely decrease the benefit of an injected system, or is this (1) any CO2 is good CO2 or (2) who the heck knows, Glen, put it in and find out? <It will still be of discernible benefit, bubble wall and all> Will the heavy surface aeration somewhat diminish the pH impact of the CO2 injection (tying this in with my diminishing buffering capacity)? <Yes> Maybe tweak the kH to 90-100ppm or so with sodium bicarbonate after I start and keep an eagle eye on the productivity of the yeast generator (since going from pH7.0 to pH8.3 would be a "bad thing")? <? Yes to raising the KH, GH... the use of CO2 will lower pH, not raise it> Whaddaya think, any comments/ideas/suggestions? <You're doing fine... are you a bonafide member of the Aquatic Gardener's Association? You might enjoy, benefit from such> I'll say it again, thank y'all for your time and advice! Glen <Thank you. Bob Fenner>

Lighting/CO2 and Platy question Good afternoon WWM crew, I have a three part question that I'm hoping you can provide some guidance on. My first relates to lighting/CO2: I've had my 30G tank for about 8 months now and have enjoyed it tremendously. It is stocked with a number of plants like swords, stem plants (Cabomba, wisteria), etc. Right now I have about 1 watt/gallon of light and I feel that my stem plants, in particular, are being effected more due to insufficient light. Now I've read your website re lighting/CO2 etc and it was extremely helpful. I would like to increase the light using full spectrum bulbs (Vita lite, etc per Mr. Fenner's articles) to about 3 watts/gallon. Now my question, since an increase in light intensity gives you more photosynthesis during daytime hours and ultimately more CO2 consumption, do I have to inject CO2 into my system? < Increased lighting will definitely increase the demands by the plants for nutrients like CO2.> Would more frequent water changes help? < The trace minerals found in tap water would need to be replenished as the plants use them up.> I would love to be able to plant all kinds of plants even plants that require bright light, but I don't want to become a chemist and have to go nuts over the amount of CO2 needed, how it affects my pH, etc, etc. Is there an alternative? < Plants will only grow as well as the nutrients around them are made available. Stem plants in particular seem to need more CO2 then others. There are still many beautiful tank setups with out CO2. I would recommend that you set up your tank the way you want. Some plants may flourish while others take off. Try different ones and see what works in your tank.> My second question: I've read articles regarding the use of carbon instead of CO2 (Excel Carbon was the brand name). Would this make my life easier? < Carbon in general does not increase the CO2 content of the water. I am not familiar with this product. There is a carbon block in which a current is run through and it generates CO2 . Look for it at Belowwater.com under products.> My final question is regarding my female platy. I've had her for about 5 months and she has given birth to two fry (or at least 2 I've been able to save) that have grown to be healthy fish. The last few days she's been acting really strange. She has been swimming erratically, kind of like something spooked her, it's almost spastic. She is not swimming erratically 100% of the time just every few minutes she has one of these "fits". There are no signs of discoloration, parasites, bloat, ich, velvet, etc -she looks completely normal! My pH is about 7.2, nitrites zero, nitrates about 10 ppm. The temp is around 79 degrees. I also add some aquarium salt at every water change, which is weekly. She still feeds a bit, but spends most of her "free" time hiding and has become unsocial. I'm afraid that she's getting old or has come down with some disease. I have 1 other male and female platy (also 1F platy that is only 1/2 inch long), 2M and 2F guppies (1F guppy that is 1/2 long-no color yet), 4 Neons, 3 cherry barbs, 1 Cory catfish and (I think) 1 Otocinclus. Do you know what this is? How to treat? Thanks and happy holidays, Chris < She may have come down with a internal bacterial infection. Try and treat her with Metronidazole.-Chuck>

Planted tank set-up, CO2 questions here it is my second try bob Hi guys! don't be gentle. hehe, a good idea with WWM the info is just... beyond value. seriously. hiring? So I started this project. the idea was to plant a slightly heavily planted main display with fish and inverts and then have a smaller 20% or more at least of the main tank volume refugium heavily planted on reverse lighting cycles from each other. and incorporate inline mechanical filtration by use of floss or sponge media inline to the input and output of the refugium. was that clear? < OK so you pump water out of the big tank into small tank and then pump the water from the small tank into the big tank.> the idea is to correct the plants reverse cycles of o2 to co2 during day and night. also supplying co2 and oxygen to the water at all times. < So when the lights are on the big tank and the plants are absorbing CO2 and giving off Oxygen then the smaller tank will be generating CO2 because it will be dark and absorbing oxygen from the big tank.> in the interest of diy I bought filtered, sanitized, non-silica Premium Playsand by Quikrete. I used about 2.5-2.75 inches. it ranges from extremely fine to what would be at least 10-25 grains of sugar for lack of a better measuring system at that size. I started with the refugium, cycling it (also with a bag of established gravel in a nylon toe. hehehe)) and adding fish and some Aponogeton bulbs to start. also a powerfilter while it is stand alone. right now I have with my Red Sea Master Kit: ammonia=0 nitrite=0 gh-8 kh-4 ph-7.6 water temp at=80F I use two pigtail fluorescents 20 watts each in the only spectrum I could find I think 10k, Daylight. Seems white for daylight I feel they misclaim. Grr. <Something with a color tamp of around 5500 K might be better.> questions: this is what I didn't see in my research. some of this I know I could be doing better I just don't have monetary means and I support a few tanks already. am trying to further freelance design career outside of actual design job, anyway right now I'm using a powerhead, cycles I think 90 times an hour. just free hanging, and I'm powering venturi air till plants come in. Should I use any air once plants establish? < Even with live plants you need to provide some water circulation. Check the oxygen levels or watch the fish if they look stressed then definitely add some aeration.> I use Sera Fishtamin and Sera Florena fertilizer. German company, Local Store only carries that brand. any thoughts or exp. with these? < Expensive and many not be needed depending on the plants you are keeping and the CO@ levels.> what should the flow be like in the proposed tank once plants are in? spray bars or basic return? < Check the CO2 levels. Typically aeration releases CO2 from the water, but there is a small amount of CO2 in the air that is absorbed into the water and can be utilized by the plants. Try it both ways and check the CO2 levels and see which one works the best by watching how the plants are reacting to the changes.> I see many claims about livestock that sounds suspicious like 1 Gold clam per gallon over at azgardens.com. how accurate is that? it cant be can it? < Stocking levels are almost always recommendations based on past experience and what usually works for the average aquarist. These can always be modified once you understand the requirements and are prepared to meet them.> I wanted to mix clams and shrimp in both the tank and refugium. any thoughts? freshwater clam info is hard to find! < If you place fish in a tank with invertebrates than you always need to be concerned about medications affecting the invertebrates. Many medications will cure your fish but kill off many invertebrates so stay away from medications that contain any copper. Other than that there is not too much info available to aquarists.> more filtration? canister? I mean the fully submersed media bothers me, a wet/dry should b more efficient, but it robs co2 doesn't it? < I have had poor luck using wet dry filters on planted aquariums. The wet dry filters have such a large surface area that the living bacteria actually absorbed the CO2 making it unavailable to the plants. I use canister filters in my planted tanks.> so I figured plants , livestock and some mechanical inline with the reverse cycles. am I making a mistake, its hard to b sure of oneself without experience. I read filtration which popped those questions... < A good canister that pumps at least three times the tanks volume in one hour would work fine in a plant tank.> my apono's started sprouting so I gently popped them into the sand. one is growing outrageously and is just hairgrass looking right now about 1.5 inches tall, about 4 or 5 of these protrusions. tiny green but mostly reddish deep purple I didn't think my lights would support such a plant as the reds have slower or is it needier photo processes. feelings and thoughts on that? < The bulb may rot if buried in the sand so I would try just letting them lie on the surface of the sand. New growth is often reddish in color wait until they are fully grow and I am sure they will be a bright green.> will killies eat plants I have seen conflicting info? < There are hundreds of species of killifish and I am sure that there are going to be a few that many nibble on plants.> feelings on SeaChem flourish tabs in sand like that? < The tabs will definitely be appreciated by the plants.> thoughts about SeaChem Flourish excel carbonate without co2?? < There have been many different ways of adding CO2 to a planted aquarium. If you add it every morning when you turned on the lights then measure the CO2 levels at different times throughout the day to see when the tanks need more . The question then becomes if and when you are around to add it and how much will it cost in both money and you time to keep it up. When you spend more time working on your tank you may not enjoy it as much.-Chuck> thanks guys you have no idea how much I appreciate this. can I donate or something? I didn't see anything Ian

Planted tank, substrate, CO2 Qs hmmm. I was afraid the Fluorite would be too rocky and damage the roots of any root bearing plants I have.... < Fluorite is like a fired clay and is softer than typical sands and gravels.> hm.... about the current over the plants. I was going to blow a powerhead over them. but stop using aeration from the venturi as it would remove to much co2. in fact I got to thinking and the easiest thing to me is to have two tanks and run one at night and one at day that way there would always be abundant oxygen. < That would be a perfect balance as long as all things were close to each other.-Chuck> Ian

CO2 question First of all, can you please reply to this email at XXXX Thanks. <Done.> Ok. So I have a 20 gal and a 37 gal tank. The 20 is fixing to be upgraded to a 55 in about 2 weeks and I would like for it and my 37 gal to be planted tanks. <Wonderful!> I have some plants in the 37 gal, but they are all very young small, and slow growing. In doing my research on setting up my 55 and ordering the supplies for it, I came across an article on co2 reactors in a catalog. Seeing as my ph is normally high-about 8.0-8.2- (which doesn't seem to bother my fish) <Might be an issue in the long run, though - but usually, a stable pH is more important than an exactly accurate pH.> and I seem to be having trouble getting the plants to grow, I was hoping you could tell me more about these. I was thinking about getting a fully automatic one (less chance for me to screw something up) but I am perplexed by all this bubble counting and stuff. How do these things work? Are they all really complicated? Will I be sitting behind my aquarium for hours each day counting bubbles? :-) As appealing as that sounds, I don't think they would accept that excuse at work. <Here's the article that got me started: http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/CO2/co2-narten.html On my 72g, I have two such yeast systems, and I alternate them, so that when one is petering out, the other is going strong, and vice verse. I haven't (yet) had any major pH issues. This yeast DIY method of CO2 injection is cheap and *relatively* easy, but pressurized canister systems are much more fool proof - with an initial cost of somewhere in the neighborhood of $200. One more link, absolutely LOADED with info: http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/CO2/ > But I digress. I wish I could tell you what plants are in my 37 gal, but the two that I did know, I forgot and the other 3 came in those packages of mystery bulbs. <Ahh, I can at least give you a genus to research, find out what species you have - those "mystery bulb" packages are almost always Aponogeton bulbs.> In the 37 gal, I have 2 clown loaches 6 tiger barbs, 5 Rosie barbs and a Pleco that will be traded in or put in the 55 once he gets big enough. <Sounds great - but do keep in mind the ultimate size (12") of the clown loaches, too. Fortunately, they grow very slowly.> In the 20 (and please don't send fish control to my house to arrest me as my husband did this ignoring my pleas and listening to some very bad advice from an LFS) there is a silver tip shark an Oscar and a very big Pleco (I know, just a touch overcrowded, hence the need for the 55 gal) <Biting my tongue ;) > I have compensated by way overfiltering the 20.. but anyway, I need to know if you recommend co2 reactors for my type of setup for plant growth and ph control (I know I should make my own water w/ peat, but I simply would have no where to put it) or is it too much of a hassle? If co2 reactors are not the best thing for me, what would you recommend? I don't plan on planting the 55 for at least 2 mo.s to allow it to get established, but the 37 is ready to go now. <Above all, to lower your pH, peat is the best route. You can add it in a filter or whatever floats your boat - but it *will* do the trick. It'll also turn the water yellowish/brownish, but I find that nice. All you need for water changes is a Rubbermaid bucket with a filter sock full of peat, fill, let it sit, and you're set. And if you drop pH in any manner, with CO2, peat, whatever, you'll need water of the same pH as in the tank when changing water - again, peat is the answer, IMO. It would benefit you to do both CO2 and peat if you wish to do plants.> Please excuse my long, rambling email. I blame it all on my ADHD! Thanks as always for your good and useful advice. <You bet. -Sabrina>

New Plant tank and CO2 Excellent - thanks again. You've got me a little intimidated with the C02 stuff, though. Is that critical, or can I start without it and see how it goes? -Jason <No Problem, I remember the first time I had CO2, butterflies in the stomach, weak in the knees, wondering if my C02 mix will be as good as others, "what if I add too much sugar and not enough yeast"? just kiddin; the tank will do fine without injecting CO2, that is the beauty of this hobby, there are so many different ways to do things, and the amount of bells and whistles you can add to your tank is almost limitless. Intense lighting, CO2, fertilizer, and warmer water will accelerate the rate of growth of your plants, with less of the above stuff the plants will still grow. It just depends on how nerdy you want to get. Try getting your friends excited about a bloom on an aquatic plant, good luck, guarantee they change the subject. Have fun, Gage>

CO2 in planted tank Hi Bob, I have a 72 gallon discus tank and is "moderately" planted ( I have to be able to vacuum regularly, meaning I have to move the plants and re-plant, and there are only a limited number of plants that will tolerate 84 degree water temperature.) As I have only had this species tank for two months, I have been reluctant to add fertilizer or co2. I just this week-end bought a BioPlast Nutriflex system and installed it. The salesman assured me it would solve both my co2 and fertilizer problems. I can let you know how it works out. It may take 3-4 weeks to ascertain. I if you have any pearls of wisdom on this subject, I will welcome them. Earl Hornsby <Have some exposure to the BioPlast line (a friend "bought them over" to the U.S.), and this unit should indeed aid you in overall plant growth and maintenance. You will still need to monitor major fertilizer components (e.g. nitrate, phosphate) and possibly augment these other than relying on fish wastes. Do take a look on WetWebMedia, Dennerle and Tropica's websites re other plants that range into the mid 80's F. to add to your collection. Bob Fenner>

Re: CO2 in planted tank Thanks, I will check the other web sites mentioned. I do monitor nitrates as I have about 1 1/2 years experience with fish water fish). I have not seen test strips or kits for measuring phosphates. What should I look for? Thanks, Earl Hornsby <I would seek out a decent kit (we have FAQs archived on WetWebMedia.com re these) in a colorimetric assay form (drops of reagents, color changes, comparisons), and shoot for 0.1 or so of soluble HPO4. Bob Fenner>

To inject or not to inject Co2 into aquarium !Will injecting Co2 into my 45 gallon aquarium with DIY yeast setup benefit my java fern, java moss and wisteria taking into account that I have only 1 two-foot fluorescent light? In other words, is injecting Co2 only effective for systems with more lights than mine? Thanks, Paul <It may not make much of a difference without more full spectrum lighting and fertilizer. You want to find a balance between the 3, the more light you have the more CO2 and fertilizer your plants need, and the more CO2 you inject, the more fertilizer and light your plants need, and so on. That being said... go for it! Its cheap to set up, you've really got nothing to lose, except maybe a soda bottle. -Gage http://wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/co2agfaqs.htm>

CO2 Injection (for live plants, Discus system) Greetings and thank you for your previous advice on the Eheim 2128 Pro II Thermofilter! And thank you for Wet Web Media and many hours of dedication to our passion! After forty years of fishkeeping we're setting up our first pot planted 60g Discus tank (months in the study, planning and acquisition of components; sparing virtually no expense) <Yikes! Am I too old for you to adopt?> and are debating the addition of a CO2 injection system with pH controller, solenoid, the works so to speak. I've been to many sites trying to decide if the CO2 system cost is valuable enough in controlling pH and helping our plants and livestock to justify the addition. <It is> Particularly in maintaining pH for Discus which we will be introducing several months down the road. If it will assist in providing a better environment for our future family of Discus I'll go for it! <You will not be disappointed> We will be running water into the RO storage unit and "firing" up the tank in the next two weeks. Your recommendation as to advisability of CO2 and manufacturers of good components would be most helpful. Wildriv, AKA Charlie DeLorme <Mmm, do "shop around" for advice from actual, recent users here. The various chatforums (ours: http://wetwebfotos.com/talk/) are invaluable for this. Compare features (e.g. better needle-valves, larger CO2... at least five pounds) makes, models and buy the better, bigger... they are worth it. Be chatting, Bob Fenner>

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