Snapper Removal Problems 10/17/09
Hello WWM Crew! Hope all of you are doing well and thank you in advance for reading this email.
<Welcome Cory>
I was hoping you could help my father with a predicament he is in. I am writing this email on his behalf.
<Will try>
Tank is currently a 90 Gallon Reef Tank, not going to include water parameters because they are not relevant to the issue. Anyway, the problem is for years I have been unable to convince him to switch to synthetic water, and he still swears natural sea water is the best and he collects it for his water changes.
<Mmm, too much work... not cost-effective period in this day of high fuel et al. related costs... and too much risk of introducing pests, parasites and pollution... And a bunch of other negatives... But there are ancillary benefits (e.g. exercise, fun...) to gathering your own>
However, apparently he managed to
scoop up a tiny mangrove snapper during his last water change, and it has grown to about 2 inches so far.
<Neat!>
His stocking list (besides the snapper) is:
1 - Juvenile Blueface Angelfish (~7 Inches)
3 - Blue Reef Chromis (Between 1 and 2 inches)
1 - Yellow Damselfish (1 Inch)
1 - Yellow Watchman Goby
1 - Flame Dartfish (missing last two weeks, probably jumped out)
<Very common>
1 - Neon Goby
2 - False Percula Clownfish (~ 2.5/3 Inches)
2 - Sand Sifting Stars (over two years old each)
20-25 Turbo Snails
12 - Hermit Crabs (Nasty/Big ones often removed)
1 - Scarlet Skunk Cleaner Shrimp
3 - Peppermint Shrimps
Corals: Red, Green, Orange Mushrooms, Xenia Coral, Pink Sea Polyps I am petrified that this snapper is going to munch down on first, the neon goby,
<Not this fish... likely will recognize as a purposeful cleaner... But the small crustaceans for sure in time, and the other smaller fishes as well>
then probably the damsel, and work his way up. We have tried to remove it via the following methods (none have worked, obviously)
1 - Drinking Glass Trick - Angelfish found how to remove bait using his tail
<They are smart>
1 - Hook and Line with Cooked Shrimp (No other fish besides snapper will touch it, unfortunately, he shook off hook when pulled above tank and fell back in, now won't go near a hook)
<Wait a few weeks... they forget>
1 - Converted Freshwater Breeder Box (you know the ones that hang on the side), but fish won't go anywhere near the thing
We are at the point where we might need to break down the whole tank to get him out, but we don't want to because our corals are starting to propagate and we don't want to disturb them, as we have been waiting over a year for the mushrooms to start to divide.
Is there anything else we should try first? I would really appreciate any advice you would have on the matter. Thank you very much!
CD, Miami
<Two nets, two netters are likely the most assured method... besides waiting to re-try the hook and line. Bob Fenner>

Re: Snapper Removal Problems   01/18/09
Thanks for the reply Bob. Will take your advice and try the hook again <Look for very small size, no barb, light clear line... some retailers sell such rigs>
in a few weeks - we simply want to remove him to a more aggressive tank, or possibly trade him. We know it is not safe to return him to the ocean at this point (being exposed to store bought fish). The two nets with some tickle sticks might work but I forgot to mention there is quite a lot of rockwork so it could be tricky.
Thanks again!
CD
<Good fishing! RMF>

Please help me identify this cichlid! (It's not a cichlid, it's a brackish water snapper... oops!) – 09/08/09 I have some problems recognizing this cichlid.... <Isn't a cichlid.> I have tried searching its name but with no success. It would be a great help if you would help me identify this. <It is a fish called a Mangrove Jack, Lutjanus argentimaculatus, a brackish water to marine snapper found across the Indo-West Pacific from the Red Sea to Australia. The species spawns in estuaries and the juveniles are commonly found in freshwater rivers close to the sea. Adults will sometimes swim into freshwater rivers, but they don't live permanently in freshwater. Basic care similar to other brackish water fish; you'll need around SG 1.005 for juveniles up to about 6 inches/15 cm, but after that, half-strength to full-strength seawater is required, SG 1.010 to 1.025 at 25 degrees C. The main problem is its size: adults can reach 100 cm/39 inches in length and weight 15 kg/33 lb, but most are somewhat smaller. Still, expect a fish some 50 cm/20 inches in length within a couple of years.> I bought two of these cichlids named as "African cichlids" but when I saw them closely in my tank, I saw sharp teeth like Piranhas. <They are snappers. They snap!> They are two of them around 3" placed with a Green Terror and Blood Parrot Cichlid. <Both of these fish will, eventually, become food.> And sorry for the bad picture quality (Its added as an attachment) <Good enough! These are really a food fish, with little/no value as aquarium fish. Hope you have a big, and I mean BIG aquarium for them! These are super-aggressive, extremely predator fish that need lots of robust seafood (squid, cockles, lancefish) to do well, though they should also take quality pellets such as Cichlid Gold. Very likely will eventually need to be kept alone. Hardy, can become very tame. Overall, similar to other large snappers, such as Lutjanus sebae. Cheers, Neale.>

Brackish to totally fresh water? 5/14/09
Dear WWM crew,
Hi, i live in Indonesia.
<Ahh! Am on my way next week to Sulawesi>
I have a question, i bought a Caranx spp which is a Giant Trevally and a mangrove jack. As far as i
know, this both fish are a brackish when juvenile and move to saltwater in adult.
When i look at the fish store, they said that this fish are already convert to fresh water and put together with other fresh water fishes. So i bought 7 giant Trevally and 2 mangrove jack about a month ago, i put them in my Koi's pond. Until now they are still alive and eat very greedy with blood worm or frozen shrimp. Their grow bigger now. My question is, will this fish really convert to fresh water, because i just afraid that this fish will dead in certain size if not move to salt water. Thanks.
<These fishes cannot stay in freshwater indefinitely as far as I know... their kidneys will fail in time... Bob Fenner>

Re: Brackish to totally fresh water? 5/14/2009
<<Yes, as Bob says, I doubt that either of these fish will adapt permanently to freshwater conditions. Both will need to be kept in at least strongly brackish conditions (50% seawater, around SG 1.012 at 25 C). In the case of Lutjanus argentimaculatus, it is the juveniles that are brackish water (or freshwater) fish; the adults live offshore, on the deep reef, down to 100 metre depths. That said, Lutjanus argentimaculatus does quite well in strongly brackish water for long periods of time, probably permanently, though their sheer size (above 100 cm) has meant that few specimens have been kept in brackish water aquaria for any length of time.
It is also an extremely aggressive and highly predatory species. Caranx ignobilis is a bit more complicated. Most populations are marine fish as adults, though juveniles are found in estuaries commonly enough. However, there are some populations where adults will enter brackish and even freshwater bodies of water. That said, I'm not aware of any populations that spend their entire life cycle in freshwater habitats. Besides, at up to 170 cm in length and highly predatory as well, even in a pond, these fish surely have limited usefulness. Cheers, Neale.>>
<Thanks much Neale... BobF, even more punctuated in replying...>

Fishbase not helping. can you help identify please?   8/6/08 Hello there! I Hope this finds all of you well. I have spent a week and many hours pouring over fishbase trying to determine exactly what I have here. I scuba dive in the Gulf of Mexico and got these guys about a month ago. They seem to be doing very well in my quarantine tank but before I think about keeping them or moving them to one of my display tanks I really need to find out exactly what they are. The first guy was found in grass beds and I think I have determined he is from the Combtooth blenny family. Perhaps a Florida Blenny ? Would you agree ? <Mmm, this is/was a bit of a teaser... am out in HI, away from in-print ref. works... thinking that I could see a bit more of the vomer, I thought maybe this was/is a Lutjanid... taking a look on Fishbase, sorting by the family info, species... I do think this is Hoplopagrus guentherii... a juvenile Mexican Barred Snapper http://fishbase.org/summary/SpeciesSummary.php?id=1393> This one however I have NO idea. He was found in some fairly strong waves amongst some rocks. They were quite plentiful and seemed to share hiding spots. And should you be able to help with those two above there was another guy that I was unable to catch in my slurp gun. I am hoping a description may be able to help in figuring out what he was. The elusive guy looked to me very much like a 6 line wrasse. He did have a bit more yellow on his fins and seemed a bit wider in his body. I would say his body looked more like a grouper or perhaps a mis-shaped Hawaiian Wrasse. <Mmm, there are several species...> I realize that it could not be that since I was in the Gulf of Mexico off the coast of Florida. Any ideas on what he might have been ? <Not from this description, sorry> I will be going back to the same area and hope to have better luck next time. Thanks in Advance for any help you can give. I fear I am going cross eyed from looking at all of the pictures online. Thanks So Much ! Ralph Port Charlotte, Florida <Thank you for sharing! Bob Fenner>

Red Emperor Snapper, beh., reading, data  1/31/08
hey,
<?>
I've had a red emperor snapper for about 4 months and it has pretty much doubled his size since I got him but recently his been getting red blotches when I turn off the lights in the tank and seems to just stop swimming and floats there.
<Mmm, could be "normal" night time behavior... sort of behavioral and marking camouflage against predators... but... what other fish species are present?>
In the mornings he's better but it kinda worries me that one morning I'll wake up to a dead fish. He's been worse since we added a powder
blue tang to our tank.
<Mmm, may feel threatened by this Acanthurus>
He did not have this problem with our damsel. Well hope to hear back thank you.
<How large a tank? Lutjanus sebae gets very large... please... read re these fishes care... systems, compatibility... at least on WWM. BobF>

Snappers   9/20/06
I am have been looking for information on blue line snappers. but I can not find much information on them could you give me some information on the species  Lutjanus kasmira?
<http://www.wetwebmedia.com/snappers.htm ; read this and the linked FAQs in blue at the top...Adam J.>

About blue line snappers   8/30/06
could you tell me how big they get and what size of tank they would  require?
I looked at the article and couldn't find this information. What  should I be looking for when if I purchase one?
<Mmm, Lutjanus viridis? Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/snappers.htm
There are at least three such lutjanids with this common nomen... Once you know the species, take a look/see on fishbase.org
Bob Fenner>

Snapper compatibility
Dear Bob,
<Hi there>
I used to have a snapper living together with my golden maroon clown in harmony...
the snapper, emperor, though larger in size, does not attack my clown...
it got a little active and big, so I transferred it to another tank. it has been hand feeding well for a month.
<Neat>
I introduced a new baby snapper to my tank w my current golden maroon, both of which are very similar in size. I understand from your site (highly recommended by my uncle who's been rearing marines for a decade) that the snapper will not attack fishes big in size it cannot digest...
<Usually not>
however, this new baby snapper, 3 days in my tank, has been biting the fins of my maroon occasionally... unlike the other one that leaves harmoniously w my clown.
Is there a way I can salvage the situation??
<Possibly. I'd try isolating the snapper in a "floating jail"... a plastic colander (ask if you can use one... for straining spaghetti, other noodles usually) in the tank for a few days... often "takes the spunk" out of fighting fishes>
I thought maroon's are rather strong and aggressive fishes...
<Usually>
I don't understand the reason why but please note that my maroon's fins have been bitten by the old snapper (by accident I'm quite sure) during feeding time while they were rushing for food...
Some friends say its the size of the snapper same as clown) while others claim different emperor snappers have different characteristics...
what should I do??
<Try the separation>
I've thought of keeping the maroon in a separate under tank till its fins heal before moving it back w my snapper...
<Better to remove the snapper instead>
it seems a little scared of the baby snapper now, and doesn't look as happy and active as before...
lastly, my friend has a black beauty snapper (very healthy) in his tank for weeks already...can I include it in my tank?
<I'd wait till the current situation is resolved. Bob Fenner>

Re: Symphorichthys spilurus
Dear Jason <<Hello...>>
Thank you very much for your rapid answer. <<You are quite welcome.>>
Fortunately for his life, my Symphorichthys is about 20cm and the miniata 10cm. I removed the miniata this morning and tonight I plan to remove the sympho in the aim of rearing him alone in a 300l tank as long as he gets again his magnificent dorsals rays. <<Glad to hear it.>>
You'll find attached to this email 3 pictures of it taken one month ago.
Thank you very much again
Cheers
Pascal
<<And cheers to you. J -- >>

Lutjanid/Snapper Input (brackish too!)
hello Robert,
I've been keeping fish for over 15 years. and I've always been fascinated by the salt water species that are found or can live in freshwater. which some I and wondering. do you have pictures of, the following :Lutjanus fuscescens, Lutjanus goldiei, Lutjanus maxweberi
<Wow, struck out... Have pix of about twenty five species in this genus, but none of these three. There are some drawings, one pic of them on fishbase.org>
I've kept and caught L. argentimaculatus many times, and they are awesome.
now I'm wondering about the rest in the genera.
<Have some coverage under the family name on our site here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/snappers.htm
and the associated FAQs beyond... Do agree with you re these fishes. Much under-utilized, under-appreciated. Bob Fenner>
much appreciated.
Wes

Re: Lutjanid/Snapper Input (brackish too!)
hello Robert,
thanks for the prompt reply. I did find one picture of l. goldiei. here it is.
let me know what you think of it.
<Good looking... and probably delicious barbecued! Bob Fenner>
Wes

about yellowtail snapper
How do I raise yellowtail snapper in open water cages? I'm not sure what to feed them in order to make them grow. I also have trouble keeping them alive. Is there any advice you can give me?
James >>
Is this a commercial (size, type) operation, trying to rear lutjanids for food? Or a hobby, speculative small scale venture? From what size to what size do you want to raise them? What other fin fish do you have aquaculture experience with?
Bob Fenner

Re: about yellowtail snapper
This is a test to see if yellowtail can be grown in captivity. the snapper are caught by hook and line in the normal way, chumming over the reef. they are not baby fish but are not full grown. I want to see if I can get them to grow over the legal limit which I believe is 13 inches. They have been fed raw fish twice a day but are not growing. I don't have any other fin fish experience. I need to show up at the school with ideas on how to make the project work. I will be there for 1 semester but I have to present my findings to the Bahamian Government in December. >>
>>
I see. Have you tried different diets? What sort of literature search(es) have you done to look into Lutjanid culture? Which species of Lutjanus is this? Have you looked through the resources of FishBase?
Bob Fenner

Re: about yellowtail snapper
I haven't tried different diets because I haven't been to the school yet. I am trying to get an idea of what to do when I get there. I have been sent some information but not in great detail. I would like to know if there are any supplements that would help increase fish size. Also what type of cage do you recommend for housing the snapper. The species is Yellowtail Snapper. >>
>>
Okay... pls cut and paste the following link to fishbase:
http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.cfm?genusname=Ocyurus&speciesname=chrysurus
for Ocyurus chrysurus... and click on the references section there, and look on our website for articles on how to search the literature to find what is currently known re this species, family... and its aquaculture: Home Page 
Bob Fenner

Red emperor snapper
Bob, What is the largest Red Emperor Snapper You have in stock? Or, In the next two weeks? I would like to know the growth rate of this species also. Thanks , Ed Noble 
>>
Gosh... am down in sunny southern California... and FFExpress/Petstore.com are in Emeryville, near San Fran... and their liveholding/shipping facility is around LAX... but will send this note along, as my direct liaison, John Caskie... who sorts through my feeble response attempts and edits (thank goodness) and posts a few will know how to get the answer to your query...
The snapper in question, Lutjanus sebae, gets to about a foot in length... and can do so within a year... if its fed (even starting tiny... most are imported at 3/4 to one inch) like it wants to be (i.e. all the time, a lot!)
Bob Fenner

Shy red emperor snapper
Delicious on a bed of rice and a lemon wedge! Actually, these beauties (Lutjanus sebae) are typically shy when new to a system or small... but they don't stay either with age and rapid growth. Take care to only keep larger-than-mouth size tankmates with this gulper.
Bob Fenner