Question For the WWM Team. SPS RTN and Diatom growth... cause/s? Allowance/s?   6/11/08
Dear WWM Staff,
<Justin>
Your website has been a great resource too me and would like to thank you for your contribution to the hobby through this website, it is invaluable.
<Glad you find it useful>
I started in the hobby one and a half ago with a 12 gallon nano that was very successful. Six months into it I did my research and upgraded to a 70 gallon system. My current system setup is as follows:
Equipment
50g Clear for life pentagon corner acrylic tank with a back corner overflow box. The top front corners are drilled for the two returns, which is powered buy an in sump Eheim 1260 generating a 10x. I installed a closed loop by drilled the bottom right hand side of the tank for intake and the bottom right for the split returns. (see attached illustration 1).
<None of these came through. Must be attached...>
An external Poseidon PS3, generating an estimated 18x turnover, powers the closed loop creating a circular closed loop flow. I run a VorTech pump in an opposite position to the closed loop at half speed in reef crest mode creating turbulence and an additional 35x. I have a JBJ 1/10th Titanium chiller running in the well ventilated attic directly above the tank that is powered by an external Poseidon PS1, generating an estimated 8x turnover, and returns to the main tank. The lighting is a PFO mini pendant 250 MH running a 14,000K phoenix bulb, replaced last month. I run a 24” 65W, retro fit SunPaq PC actinic bulb and a set of two Current USA moon lights. I recently switched from an ASM G1 skimmer to a Tunze 9010. My sump is a custom built 20 gallon with a built in 3g refuge where I keep 5 lbs of miracle mud and Chaeto under a low watt bulb 24/7.
<Stop! I would not have the lighting on continuously here. Chaetomorpha needs a dark phase... I'd arrange the light to overlap, be on when the main display lighting is cycled off>
The overflow splits into two where 75% of the flow ends up in the skimmer side of the sump and 25% ends up in the refuge. I run a PhosBan reactor with Eco-Phos connected to a Maxijet 400 that pulls from the skimmer side of the sump and returns to the return side of the sump. I do not run a heater as the house is maintained at 74º and in combination with the MH I have been very successful in maintaining a stable temp of 77º.
Current Parameters – Very stable.
Temp 77º
Salinity 1.025
pH 8.3
Calcium 450
Alkalinity 10
Magnesium 1350
Nitrates 0
Nitrites 0
Phosphates 0
<Mmm... I'd read a bit re the need for soluble phosphate... your system, with the reactor, may be too "clean" for the livestock's good>
Ammonia 0
Maintenance Schedule
I change 10% weekly using Reef Crystals, but recently switched to
Reefer’s Best.
<The ZEOvit product>
All sponges are removed from the skimmer, pumps, PhosBan reactors and cleaned out, to ensure no phosphate built up. I dose B-Ionic and or DT’s new CA/Alk/Mag chemical additives. I dose a little Potassium (explanation later on) and Eco-Systems trace minerals. I run carbon for 5 days a month. I test all water parameters every Sunday at 8pm using Salifert test kits.
Feeding Schedule
I feed sparingly once a day and or every other day. I feed with Rod’s Food (http://www.rodsfood.com/).
Bio Load
1 Med. Yellow Tang
1 Dusky Jaw
1 Blue Chromis
2 small Clown fish
1 Royal Blue Tang
1 Small Six-line Wrasse
1 Peppermint Shrimp
1 Emerald crab
Large cleanup crew (no stars), snails, (Hawaiian Trochus Grazers, Hawaiian Turbo Grazer, Micro Hermits, Blue hermits, Strombus Grazers conch, ninja, Pinky Cuke, Hawaiian Littorinid Grazers, Astraea, Nassarius)
Natural Filtration
I have about 50 lbs of live rock and 30lbs of live sand.
Light Cycle
Moonlights off 7am
Actinic on 11am
MH on noon
MH off 9 pm
Actinic off 10 pm
Moonlights on 11pm
Issues
I have two ongoing issues that I cannot seem to resolve.
1) Diatoms – (one year later)
2) SPS RTN/STN
<This both may well be due to the lack/absence of HP04...>
I went through a very patient cycle and waited and waited. However I still to this day suffer from Diatoms. I have done everything listed on WWM site and more I have done two days of darkness, however they always return and are very prominent on the sand bed. They are densest by my Dusky Jaw, as assume it’s because the snails get used in the construction of his burrow and hence they stay away from him and the sand does not get mixed up in that area, however the rest of tank still suffers from bad diatom blooms.
I can keep pink and green Birdsnest that grow thick branches and have wonderful plop extension and color. However, I cannot keep any other SPS. Monti’s die by STN/RTN within weeks and never show signs of growth. I started adding potassium as the ZEOvit system promotes it and I had run out of options. I acclimate slowly via the drip method and place the coral low in the tank and slowly raise up towards the light as to not light shock the coral. All other forms of corals start to loose their tissue and then the diatoms start to attach and I inevitably loose the coral. (See illustration 2)
I have recently increased the weekly water changes to 15% and switched salts from reef crystals to Reefer’s Best to address the low potassium issue as tested by a ZEOvit user.
<K presence/concentration is rarely a rate limiting factor>
Other Info
The only piece of equipment that I did not buy new was the tank and it was used as a freshwater system.
My build thread on sdreefs : http://www.sdreefs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25429&highlight=50g+build
Illustration 1
Illustration 2
Illustration 3
<Again, these graphics didn't make it>
Kind regards,
--
Justin A. Hai
<I'd pull the Phosban out... run this system for a few weeks... see what happens. Bob Fenner>

Black Diamond Activated Carbon and Phosphates - 06/08/2007
Dear Crew,
<Andy>
I have been battling Cyanobacteria for a few months in my 110g reef tank that has been running a little over a year. I have read and tried everything to eliminate the BGA, but to no avail. I siphon off all the BGA from my rocks each week when I do my water changes, but it grows back full force by the next week's water change. I have limited my photoperiod, I have been very careful about feeding, I upgraded my skimmer to an AquaC EV-180, I employ a 30g fuge with Chaeto, I run a PhosBan reactor with media, I removed my bio-balls, I use RO/DI water for all my water changes/top-offs . . . you get the picture. The one variable that I have not eliminated is the use of activated carbon.
<Mmmm, the Chaetomorpha and Phosban material should remove all soluble phosphate>
In fact, I believe I can trace the start of my problem to a switch from ESV activated carbon to Black Diamond activated carbon.
<Both are fine products in my experience>
It seems that since I made that switch, the BGA went from being here and there to being everywhere. I switched because I was thinking the ESV was leaching phosphates and causing the small amount of BGA I had, but this switch seems to have only made matters worse. I've read Steven Pro's article on phosphates in activated carbon, and see that Black Diamond leached 1 ppm of phosphates in the sample, and I'm thinking this must be my problem. My water parameters check out fine--0 ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, silicates and phosphates; pH is a steady 8.3; alk is a steady 3.5 meq/L; specific gravity is 1.026; temp is 78-80.
So, today I replaced all my carbon with Purigen and am hoping that this solves my mystery. Has anyone had similar experiences with Black Diamond (or other carbons) and do you think the switch to Purigen was a good one? The guy at the LFS convinced me to try it over Chemi-Pure, as you can regenerate Purigen and it was about the same price.
Thanks for your help!
Andy
<The API product has been known to pose excess HPO4 issues, but again, as stated, this should not be a problem here. In fact, I propose removing the contactor (Phosban) as your real issue may well be a lack of this essential nutrient... that is fueling the BGA, which can exist at much lower levels than is healthy for true algae/thallophytes and other purposeful photosynthetic livestock (e.g. "corals"). Put in another ways SOME phosphate is absolutely essential... the Cyano may well be being favored by its exclusion here. Bob Fenner>
 

Question on phosphates & hairy algae – 4/11/08 Hello again <Hello Sam>- I have been fighting hairy algae for a while now. I have taken the following steps: 1) replace my light bulbs (have 2x 96w compact fluorescent for a 40BR); 2) got PhosBan 150 and put maybe 40% of it into a tray in my wet dry trickle filter; 3) bought more snails (now have 2 Mexican Turbos and maybe 8 smaller ones, I think, Astrea (?); also have about 8 sand-sifting snails and 9 or so hermit crabs and 3 emerald crabs. My water parameters are: Alkalinity: 3 (or 8.4dkh) Calcium: looks to be between 430 and 475 (I find the Calcium tests hard to read, both the Instant Ocean and Salifert one - am not sure 100% when the water becomes 'clear blue' ph: 8.4 (evening) phosphates: appear to be 0.03 (Salifert kit) salinity: approx. 1.025 Temp: approx. 78 mag: 1320 ammonia, nitrites, nitrates: test kit says 0 <So good so far!> I dose approx. 10ml per day of ESV B-Ionic Alkalinity and Calcium. I have a Aqua C protein skimmer, keep 3 fish (2 clowns and a royal Gramma) and several (mainly soft) corals. Tank is approx. 8 months old now. Do you have any suggestion as to what I should do to get rid of the hairy algae (would getting a phosphate reactor improve the situation a lot?)<Yes, a reactor does improve the removal capabilities> Also, it appears that whenever I am gone for a few days (4 last time) and thus do not dose alkalinity/calcium the algae has a new outbreak (could this be the case?) <Nuisance algaes have a better/stronger chance of competing when alkalinity is lower. What I see being the problem here is your phosphate reading is far too high. .03ppm will indeed grow nuisance algaes. You want this reading to be undetectable.(0ppm)What I recommend is that you check your source water for evaporation and new salt mixes and make sure the TDS (Total Dissolved Solids) is 0ppm. To get to this level you need to be using RO/DI water. If you are not already using RO/DI water I suggest that you begin to. It will help greatly. If you do not have a digital TDS meter, then I suggest you purchase one as these are inexpensive handheld units that help you understand if your source water is OK or not. (nutrient/mineral free) Finally, I would continue the use of the Phosban, but would change the media every 7 days until the PO4 level reaches 0ppm. Then you could use it longer. You may go thru several(3)jars of the 150g size before you see progress. Just remember to check your source water with the TDS meter.> Thanks tons in advance for any advice.<no problem, Rich> Best Regards, Sam Re: question on phosphates & hairy algae 4/13/08 Thanks Rich. I have a RODI unit and have been planning to get a TDS meter. Now I certainly will get one. ok, will test continuously for phosphates and continue to use PhosBan. I also have started to increase the Alkalinity dosage to 15ml. Maybe this will increase alkalinity a bit. Will write you in a while to report on (hopefully) progress. <Good to hear! I would also like to add that if this system is less than a year old it is part of the cycling/maturing process of the tank and some patience will be needed as the hair algae uses up the nutrients. Rich> Thanks, Sam Re: question on phosphates & hairy algae Thanks again Rich. Good to hear that the system may get better with time (I have patience). Btw, I tested new RODI water and tank water for phosphates and doubled the sensitivity scale. In both cases the water was almost clear (one might argue for zero on the scale, but I'd conservatively say that it was 0.03, or 0.015 when halved given the double sensitivity). Nevertheless there must be phosphates as I have all the algae. I will take your advice and go through some PhosBans to get them down further. Thanks and regards, Sam<Sounds good let us know how it works out, Remember to check the RO/DI water for TDS.- Rich>

Clam troubles... no data of use, not reading...   2/21/08 Hi! <Howzit?> I have a newly setup 330g main tank and 70g sump setup in December. As a part of the new tank I migrated from a well established 46 gallon reef tank. I had a maxima clam and a Crocea clam I have kept for over 2 years in my 46g tank. However, last week I lost my Crocea clam and my maxima is fading quickly (clam not opening very wide, sinking mantle, bleaching of mantle). The new tank water quality is kept very clean, stable pH, temp, water parameters are great, salinity 1.025, calcium is a bit low but climbing 350-380. <Alkalinity, Magnesium?> I am dosing every other day w/ DT phyto. <... of not much use in this setting> After the Crocea perished I dosed the maxima in a separate container with tank water and heavy dose of DT phyto, despite this the maxima is still declining quickly. The tank is kept under 1600 watts of (4 x 400w HQI halides). The clam is kept on a flat rock laying in the sand substrate. <... may well need to be elevated...> Given the new tank would you suspect: The maxima clam size is about 4". 1.) The tank is to new and does not contain enough natural phyto and other items in water column needed for health of this clam. <...> 2.) A water quality or chemistry problem. <Possibly> 3.) A light problem <Likely> Thanks for all of your help as always! Bryan <Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/tridcacdisf5.htm and the linked files above... You need to know a bunch more... and provide more data... For now, read. Bob Fenner> Re: clam troubles... lack of nutrient...  2/21/08 Thanks, I did some reading on that URL. <Okay> The maxima perished. Alk is 11 dKH, calc is about 390. ammonia: 0 nitrites: 0: nitrates: barely detectable. I had always thought under halides keeping a clam on the substrate was doable, <Mmmm> I have seen several healthy looking clams in other tanks like this. The tank is 30" tall and the halides are about 7" off the top of the aquarium. I obviously want to figure out what went wrong before buying anything else. <This depth... the light would have to be directly above...> Given the slow decline I didn't speculate it was a pest. <Agreed> The only thing recently I have changed in the tank was the addition of PhosBan media per your teams recommendation. <...! Clams (actually all life... e.g. ADP, ATP...) absolutely require "some" soluble phosphate... This sudden removal may well have been a factor> Within 2 weeks, both clams are gone. Coincidence? <Not likely> I have not tested phosphate prior to this, and I had no reason to believe I had a phosphate problem, I simply added it as a precaution for long term health. <... I would not have done this... there are other, easier means of phosphate limitation, control... Posted on WWM> Is your bet still on light? <Partly... but am hedging/spreading my bets more and more. How about you?> Best Bryan <Bob Fenner>

Unattractive Sand Bed, Lack of Coralline and Green Live Rock   2/5/08
Dear Crew:
<Hello Alesha>
Well, here goes. It turns out I had more questions than I thought.
I run a 26g DSB FOWLR system. However, I desperately want corals (to survive). I have some accompanying issues, as well.
My tank has been up and running for a year. I have conquered most algaes in the first months (diatom, Cyano, hair) but my tank water remains clear with proper parameters at this time.
<You should be testing for Calcium, Alkalinity (preferably in DKH), Magnesium, Nitrates, and Phosphates. Ca=400-480ppm, Alk=8-10DKH, Mg=1,350ppm, Nitrates less than 10ppm, and 0ppm Phosphates. ZERO!)
However, there are still things which are wrong (and/or annoying) with my tank and I was hoping you can offer some sage advice:
My live rock and some larger pieces of substrate (seashells, etc.) have a green tint to them. I have scrubbed/siphoned, but the rock seems to remain/return to algal green. It seems that this may be a lighting issue - since the portions of the rock which are mostly hidden from the light are not green! Seems simple enough - but that's not my luck!
I also get a slight greenish film on some of the glass approximately every 2 days, which I magnet-scrape off. Clearly, this is a green algae problem, but my parameters are fine (so it says). What do I do?
I'd really like to have purple/pink rocks and crisp white sand - and despite constant reading on the subject (and $2000 into a virtually barren 26g) - my tank looks nothing like the ones in my LFS.
I have:
2 false percula clowns
1 green chromis damsel
1 feather duster
1 small (about 1 in.) pincushion urchin (see explanation below)
1 small Turbo snail (not Mexican) (just added)
Several clumps of Gracilaria (just added)
A few bumble bee snails
A few Nassarius snails
1 blue leg hermit.
Other detritivores have died intermittently over the last few months.
Shall I add more? Hard to tell if they are already "old" when I get them or what - but I do drip acclimate for 2 hours. They survived, then died off over a period of months - is this the average life span of these detritivores? Seems like I had a lot more at one time!
I run an Aqua C Remora HOT skimmer, a Magnum Canister filter with carbon and (sometimes) Phosban, a UV sterilizer and 2 wavemakers - and a small fan in the summer.
<The Phosban should always be used and the carbon and PhosBan should be changed every 3 weeks>
Temperature and salinity are always in the appropriate range.
<Temp=77F-82F and Salinity=1.025 s.g.>
But as I indicated, I have been unable to keep corals. Each has died early on (after a few weeks): Frogspawn, xenia, blue-green mushrooms, clove polyps - though the mushrooms lasted the longest.
I don't want to give up on corals - they make the saltwater hobby what it is, but I am at wit's end as to how to allow them to survive.
I've added, a few days ago - giving it ONE MORE TRY - a very small frag of a zoanthid - my first zoo. It opened right away and seems happy - so far. However, I am concerned that this photosynthetic creature needs too much light, as to allow green algae to grow even more.
<I did not see where your light was listed, but a Power Compact, T5, or 150w Metal Halide should be used. PC should be at least 130w dual strip>
Is there a simple test for TDS? A dip strip? Could this be my problem?
I recently started using a liquid phosphate remover (according to the directions), when I ran out of PhosBan. However, even without these removers, my phosphates were never above 1. So why the green scourge?
<TDS meters are less than $30 US and should be used at the output of the source water. I recommend RO/DI water with a TDS reading of Zero ppm. Anything more will grow algae.
As far as PO4 goes, any reading above 0ppm(ZERO) will grow algae and is too high. 1.0ppm is very high for a reef tank. Anything above .025ppm will grow algae and inhibit coralline and coral growth.>
I must have something that is creating this green ugliness.
Also, no coralline after one year. Actually a small patch on the skeleton of the frogspawn (as well as little tiny feather dusters!) - but the coralline has not spread - at all. I have just seeded the tank with a another rock (with coralline) from a fellow hobbyist and the new zoanthid has some on its rock - so we'll see what happens.
<This is due to PO4, and Alk/Ca levels being off. Once the PO4 is eliminated and the proper Alk/Ca/Mg levels are maintained coralline algae will be everywhere!>
I never impulse purchase but I wanted some interesting inverts recently - SOMETHING to make my tank look better - and it seems most stars would strip my sand bed, so I thought the little pincushion would do OK, after being assured by the LFS it was a GREEN algae eater and would be largely indifferent to my coralline. However, I now see conflicting posts online. I am monitoring what little coralline I have. Shall my pincushion (my niece named him "Stewie") go back?
<No. I have 7 sea urchins in my 180g and they can't keep up with coralline growth. Proper levels mentioned above will give your urchin plenty to eat.>
What kinds of safe inverts/sand stirrers can I get (I think serpent stars are creepy) in a tank this size? I never see Fromias (I like the red kind) in stores and realize the mortality rate of Linckias. What to do? I do love stars. But other interesting invert suggestions are appreciated.
<Use Nassarius Snails. They will do the job you seek.>
Additionally, I have run the gamut from adding every additive under the sun to this tank in proper amounts (essential elements, etc.) to getting frustrated and adding nothing at all.
<Stop adding anything. In a 26g system just do weekly 5g water changes with good clean source water. Check with a TDS meter and make sure it is RO/DI.>
I've also used properly filtered tap water both as top off, and for water changes - to not doing anything at all but top off of straight tap water. Still -- green tint. So, at that point, water changes seemed a waste of time - as there was no difference. I am starting them again, however, - in earnest.
<Tap water is very unstable as the pollutants from the water company are always changing. Please look into RO/DI water for all your water needs for the tank>
My light fixture bulbs are one year old - could this be causing the green? Or are 6 month changes just a way for retailers to make money?
<It is a general recommendation to replace bulbs after 8 months>
I have resumed B-Ionic and starting using Purple Up, in a renewed effort to keep coralline. Do you think this will help it to grow and combat the green algae while I figure out what is causing it?
<No. The PO4 will inhibit the growth>
My LFS says they use only tap (same municipal water system) and B-Ionic - what am I doing wrong? They have loads of coralline and NO green anything! I don't have room for a reactor (of any kind), or a refugium, and Kalkwasser seems quite complex. But, as I indicated, I am adding B-Ionic and Purple Up daily. Shall I also add Liquid Calcium? This would be too much, I think - but I have it, if I need it.
<Your LFS is using B-ionic which is a 2-part additive. Buffer/Calcium. It is quite possible if their doses are high enough they are precipitating PO4 out of solution and exporting it via water changes and a strong skimmer. Their advise is not good advise. You must test for Alk/Ca to see if it is needed before dosing is done so as not to overdose one product over the other.>
Further, I was told by a fellow hobbyist that certain salts - even though very popular - are less than desirable, and to use Tropic Marin.
Any thoughts? I believe you may have recommended a brand of carbon, as well - can you restate that, if so? Even carbon can be of low quality, apparently. Tropic Marin is expensive, so I want to get more informed opinions as to this salt before I buy.
<Instant Ocean is fine for a 26g. Reef Crystals is better for your application, but if your system was larger I would just stick with the IO.>
Additionally, many say GARF Grunge is the way to go - others say it's just ugly rubble with a fancy name. I already have many copepods and amphipods - no need for these - so any opinion as to Grunge helping with any other good critters AND more coralline spores, would be appreciated.
However, I like a smooth sand bed - will Grunge give me unattractive rubble?
<Yes. Grunge will add surface area for more undesirable algae to grow on. PO4 needs to be eliminated first and then Alk/Ca/Mg maintained.>
Also, I have little circular white crusty deposits on the powerheads and back glass - and even on the bumblebee snails' shells! I scrape them off the glass. But there are zillions of them. Do these crusties mean I am doing something wrong - or something right?
<These are small tube worms. Harmless.>
If I can "grow" these obviously calcareous things (what are they?!) -
why no coralline?
<Because of PO4 and continually adding TDS from Tap water.>
My lights are:
2 of T5HO 24W 10000K
2 of T5HO 24W 400nm actinic
Moonlights
I have no set light cycle (anymore) - because this too has frustrated me: too much light and I get algae - but not enough and nothing else will grow - UGH!
<Lights need to be maintained at a minimum of 8 hrs per day with 12 hr cycle preferred.>
Also, toward the goal of getting white shimmering sand (a myth?), can I add some find grain aragonite (or Southdown) to the top of my DSB without damaging any organisms or biological processes? My sand sometimes has a green cast to certain spots on the top of it. I'd like to avoid this in the future. It seems that when surface vacuuming the DSB - the smooth sand (if I add any) will get overturned with the rubble sand and defeat my purpose? True?
<The finer sands will always settle to the bottom of the tank and the larger pieces or grains will rise.>
Thank you for taking time to read this gargantuan post, and for any answers you maybe able to provide.
Aleasha in Baltimore, MD
P.S. The clowns and chromis are very happy - at least I am doing something right.
<PO4 will not harm the fish. There is plenty of phytoplankton in your system which will help feed your copepods which will feed your fish. Nice food web for FOWLR.>
<HTH, Please try to get some RO/DI with TDS 0ppm. Then please test for Alk/CA/Mg and adjust. Then I believe you will see great improvements! Rich...aka...Mr. Firemouth>

Phosban Use 2/3/08
Hey there!
<Dean>
I have been battling an algae problem that I can't seem to eradicate though I have been following your advice, and I have an odd question. I have a 55 gallon tank, with 3 Zebra Bar dartfish, two Ocellaris clowns, and one
lawnmower blenny. The tank has a 5 inch sugar sized sand DSB; nitrates are <5. I try to make watch my feedings so that all the food is eaten. Do about 10% a week water changes.
<I would increase the water changes this to further combat nitrate.>
Euro Reef RS80 Skimmer.
I have done PO4 tests and it is always 0, but I know that the test only shows organic phosphate.
<Or it is being consumed as fast as it is produced.>
So today I hooked up a Phosban Reactor. General plan, was to clean out the PO4 from the system then use the reactor for chemical filtration if need be. Long term plan is to hook up a Nielsen Reactor via a Tunze Osmolator I just won off eBay cheap.
<OK>
Following the directions for Phosban, I added water to the container to eliminate the dust when handling. I took the water out of my water change mixing tank. When I added it to the container of Phosban, it sizzled and smoked. To me, this is an indication of a chemical reaction. My question - does this indicate the presence of PO4 in my water change water?
<No, Phosban usually makes a sizzling noise when you hydrate it. As far as smoke, I would bet it was dust already in the container, it is very fine and appears smoke-like when you add water. I would carefully rinse all of the dust out before adding it to the reactor.>
I use a RO unit to filter the water before mixing. Is my salt in question then? Or am I all wet?
<Test both your RO water and mixed salt water if you want to see if there is any phosphate in either. What you describe above is normal, not an indication of phosphate.>
Thanks for the help - hope this isn't a dumb question.
<Welcome, not a dumb question, Scott V.>
Dean

Snow storm... Phosphate removal rxn on Cnid.s    1/3/08
Hi Crew,
Small 10 gallon saltwater tank.
I bought a filter pad that is made for reducing phosphates. I was able to cut out two pieces to match my filter. I put in the first one almost 8 weeks ago and it did a good job. I hardly have any hair algae left. The water was not going through so easily so I just replaced it with the second pad and I noticed white flecks coming out of the filter. By morning I had what looked like the aftermath of a snow storm. The part of the tank directly in front of the filter was covered in white. Sand and mushrooms and candy canes.
<Mmm, these need some soluble phosphate...>
The mushrooms were closing up. I contacted the seller and after convincing them it was not pods they said it may be some of the phosphate remover from the pad.
<Maybe>
How important is it to remove from the tank.
<I would>
They did not think it was much of an issue other than to remove from the corals. I rinsed it well before I put it in the tank so I do not know why this pad was different than the first being that they both are from one big pad.
<I don't think "it" is the pad per se, but a reaction/series from the pad... the life...>
Anyway the main concern is will it harm anything by staying on the sand.
Thanks
<I would remove the new pad. Bob Fenner>

PO4... – 11/13/07
Thanks Bob!
<Welcome David>
One of the retailers mentioned that if I just started using my RO/DI...
I should still cycle in some sort of phosphate removing media as skimming and water changes won't remove phosphate that is currently in the tank.
<Will go in time, some small amount re-added through feeding mostly. Necessary>
With the use of my RO/DI unit I can assume now that my water quality input should be under control... I know my feeding is under control. I shouldn't really be introducing any troublesome quantities of phosphate knowingly... Are you in agreement with his statement to use PhosBan or RowaPhos. He also suggest Kalkwasser (sp?)... But I happen to have both PhosBan and RowaPhos in my inventory of goodies.
<Both are good products... Kalk has its place>
Of note, the small bits of cyano in my 200g tank have pretty much disappeared since using my RO/DI water... And portions of that green/brown hair algae are starting to look more greyish... Dying off very very slowly perhaps?
<Oh yes>
On a sidenote, I had asked your advice about stocking my 200gallon tank. If I happen to abandon my idea of a medium to larger angel, would a Lemon Peel and a Flame Angel be an appropriate choice together in my 200g tank?
<Yes>
Stock would be with: Snowflake Moray, 2xBannerfish, Harlequin Tusk,
Hippo Tang, Longnose Hawk, Magnificent Foxface, Picasso Trigger.
<Sounds like a nice mix... the Trigger may be a wild card. B>

Chemistry lovers...  ferric oxide hydroxide color, Phosphate contactor   4/14/07
Dear Crew,
I have used Phos-Ban in my system and recently tried Tropic Marin's Elimi-phos.  My understanding is both are ferric oxide hydroxide.  The Phos-Ban is small rust colored pellets.  The Elimi-Phos has white pellets.  I don't understand how they could be white.  Any ideas what else could be in the Elimi-Phos?
Thanks,
Jeff
<Mmm, well the TLF product is touted as being "synthetic"... Say what? Whereas the TM product is what it states... is white in its oxidized state... Perhaps the Two Little Squishies go is just not as moisture and air-exposed from the containers its shipped in by the real manufacturer. Bob Fenner>

Replacing Aluminum-Based Phosphate Remover – 03/17/07
Hey Eric –
<<Hello Linda>>
Am emailing you from my personal email address now, not the one from work that reads "freedomrealtorsga".
<<Ah yes...and now you won't have to wait until Monday to see my reply [grin]>>
Anyway, I just ordered some Rowaphos from Marine Depot - should be here mid of next week.
<<A good brand of iron-based phosphate remover…and other (less expensive) brands available as well>>
Can't wait to use it.
<<Please keep me posted on its efficacy>>
Going home to remove the PhosGuard.
<<Good>>
Since you pointed out the PhosGuard could be the problem I tapped into WetWeb site on Phosphates and PhosGuard and come to find out, a LOT of people have been having the same troubles I have due to using PhosGuard or having high phosphates.
<<Yes indeed>>
I never would have dreamed that such a small amount of Phosphate could do so much to a tank!
<<Not so small when you consider these organisms can be sensitive to/mal-affected by fluctuations in water chemistry in the parts-per-billion range>>
Will certainly keep you posted.
<<Excellent!>>   
Is it against the WetWeb "rules" to give out a personal email address, especially since you are "next door" to GA...a good, ol' southern gentleman"?  hahaha
<<Not against the rules…but we prefer to keep the queries/exchanges coming through WWM for the benefit of the public>>
It sure would be great to communicate with just one knowledgeable person rather than many, since so many have different opinions.
<<Indeed…and my opinions are not necessarily better than the next person’s.  But you are always welcome to ask for me (or someone else for that matter) when writing in>>
Thanks for responding...it really means a lot.
<<Quite welcome…is what we do>>
Take care and I will keep you posted on my results.  Linda in GA
<<I look forward to our next exchange.  EricR>>

Re: Replacing Aluminum-Based Phosphate Remover – 03/17/07
Been thinking too much,
<<Never!>>
but....I have just one more little concern...(ha-ha, yeah right!)...my gph in the tank.
<<Let’s hear it>>
I believe I have a 10 gal sump (well, wet/dry filter) with a Rio 2100 (695gph) with a 6" wide overflow box incl. 1" U tube.
<<Ah yes…and after head-loss this pump is likely giving you closer to 350gph…and about all that 1” tube can handle>>
I have 5 powerheads in the tank...3 Maxi Jet 1200, and 2 Hagen 70's.  I know I have enough flow in the tank with all these powerheads, but am wondering if I have enough filtration for my 100 gal tank?
<<Do you mean the flow through the sump?...yes, you have enough (can’t really “handle” more)>>
Today, I was going to purchase a more powerful pump from Marine Depot, like a Mag Drive 9.5 (950gph) to increase the flow, but am concerned over whether that would fit my system or not.
<<Nope…is way too much for your overflow box.  I would get a better pump though, and a Mag-Drive 5 would be fine…plumbed with a gate-valve on the output side to temper flow if necessary>>
The guy I bought the system from owns his own fish store in Albany (and an old hand in the field) put together my system.
<<Understood…but the RIO products are quite dodgy>>
I remember him stating that it was important to have the right overflow box for the size wet/dry.
<<Mmm, more accurately put would be the right pump/overflow combination…in my opinion.  Doesn’t matter what size wet/dry you have if the pump overwhelms the overflow and puts water on your floor>>
He said if I had a 125 gal. I would need the dual overflow, but since it is a 100 gal, he said the single overflow box would be the correct one.  (He had both to offer, so it wasn't like he couldn't have made more money off of me selling me the dual.)
<<I disagree…the dual overflow would have been the better choice…if only for the redundancy>>
He said if I were to hook up a dual overflow box with a powerful pump on a 100 gal, it will blow my fish out of the water (?).
<<Hmm, a surprising and ridiculous statement from an “old hand”…considering the flow limitations of even two 1” overflow tubes.  But I suspect you already realize this>>
Now should I be concerned with the size sump I have, size tank OR the size overflow box I have to increase the power of a pump?
<<While a bigger sump would be a good thing…your limiting factor here is definitely your overflow>>
If I had a dual overflow box with a Mag Drive 1200, would it be too much for the size wet/dry (sump) I have and size tank I have?
<<Not so much a matter of too much for the sump (though I think you would find the noise/resulting plumbing issues a problem), but definitely more than you “need”>>
You may answer this after the weekend...I will give you a weekend break from all my questions!!!  lol!!!  Linda in GA   
<<No worries my dear…is my pleasure to assist.  Eric Russell>>

R2: Replacing Aluminum-Based Phosphate Remover - 03/18/07
Hey - having a nice Saturday Eric?
<<I did, yes>>
I planted my tomato plants last night, but since it's turned a little cool, having to cover them up at night.
<<Mmm yes, cool here as well...but back in to the 70s next week>>
Anyway, back to our discussion.:  You guessed it right, I am not so sure what was recommended at purchase is the best setup since I am having some trouble.  Would purchasing a dual overflow box with a Mag pump be better for my overall tank?
<<More reliable/more margin for safety, yes (though you could simply add another "single" along with the one you already have)...just don't get too large a pump/try to max-out the tubes (something like a Mag-7 maybe)>>
It would be comfortable to know I've got it setup properly so that when "things" go wrong, at least I know the equipment is correct.
Ya know?
<<Indeed I do>>
The more I learn the more I question what I purchased from the old guy at the fish store.
<<Always best to do your own research and rely on your own good judgment>>
And, I laugh when I say this, and you will, too, but when I asked him about an AquaC skimmer and he stated that he had never heard of that brand before...well, that was the moment I started to question the guy.
<<Hmm...does seem odd...>>
Anyway, that was how I ended up with a Coralife Super Skimmer...he knew ALL about those!
<<Unfortunate...perhaps you can upgrade to an AquaC or Euro-Reef>>
Yet, he sold me one that fits up to a 65 gal. tank!  I reminded him I have a 100 gal. and he said that the smaller one would be plenty.  (Geez...sounds like the guy is afraid to go "bigger" on everything.)
<<Mmmm...>>
So sad that we have to learn things the hard way.  I have to say that the skimmer seems to work really well, though.
<<Ok>>
I have an AquaC Urchin in a small 46 gal. that I still can't get "tweaked" just right.
<<Do contact Jason Kim (owner), I have no doubt he will be able to help>>
So-o-o, Eric, would you recommend or suggest my getting a dual overflow box with a Mag pump (that fits) OR should I just stick with what I have and buy the Mag 5 pump?
<<I like the idea of some redundancy with siphon overflows...either the double or an additional single would work...along with a Mag 5/7 pump (you want to leave some "room" in case of a stoppage)>>
And possibly get a nicer skimmer???
<<Something to consider...>>
A-h-h-h...something else in the picture now....(smiling)...Linda in GA  
<<Be chatting my friend.  EricR in SC>>

Phosphate reduction   3/11/07
Hello crew, and thank for all of the great information.  
<Hello Susan, Brandon here, and thank you for the kind words.>
After searching the FAQs I couldn't find exactly what I was looking for on the following questions: 1) Is the Marc Weiss phosphate reduction agent an effective and safe additive?
<Not really sure.  All of the Marc Weiss products make astounding claims without much data to back them up.  I would toss it.>
I use it prophylactic, but maybe I should reconsider.  
<Since you did not say, I will assume that we are discussing a marine system here.  If your Ca, and Alk parameters are in line, then there should not any useable PO4 in your system.>
What chemical agents are safe and effective for phosphate reduction as its hard to tell given all the marketing.  
<Rowaphos and Boyd’s Chemipure are two highly recommended  products.>
Thanks again and I appreciate all of your experienced advice.
<You are welcome.  In the future please remember to send us your tank size, lighting, filtration, and water parameters.  This information helps us help you.  Brandon.>

Ocean's Blend Phosphate remover 8/19/05
Is this NON synthetic Ferric Oxide media safe to use on reef tanks?
I can't find anything bad about it on the Internet and some people have had good experiences.  My concern is that it is real Ferric Oxide.  I found this definition:
A dark red compound, Fe2O3, occurring naturally as hematite ore and rust and used in pigments and metal polishes and on magnetic tapes.
And from it I'm a bit concerned about the rust part.  The product essentially looks like rust.  I know synthetic products like Rowaphos and Phosban have received much praise for their effectiveness and "safeness" but the Ocean's Blend product is about 1/2 the price and can be purchased @ my LFS.  Any advice would be greatly appreciated. <Raul, I did some checking on the company and as far as I can see, I would feel comfortable trying this product.  Their products are tried in their own aquariums and they welcome feedback for continuous improvement.  James (Salty Dog)>

Bad experience with PhosGuard - Example of Good Husbandry w/Bioballs 10/12/05
First of all I wanted to say I have found the information on your site to be very informative. Good Job! Anyway, this
isn't a question, just wanted to add my recent bad experience with Seachem's PhosGuard to the others I have read on your site.
<I see>
I had a 75 gallon reef tank that I ran back in the bare bottom tank days from 1989-1995. I gave all of the rock and livestock away and tore down the tank when I got laid off from my job.  The tank was stored in my Grandmother's garage. I finally got off my butt and set it up again this July. I really missed it. 
My 75 Gallon reef has been up for 3 months and my water parameters are very stable so I won't waste space with the details. I majored in Organic Chemistry,
<My arms' are starting to ache with memories of Morrison & Boyd's bicep breaker>
so I can assure you my params are fine. Although I have a heavy Chemistry background, I ended up an IBM Mainframe Systems Programmer (Dinosaur!).
<Could've been pet-fish...>
Some tank details: Filtration consists of 140 lbs fine grain Arag-Alive live sand, 120 lbs live rock, Poly-Filters, Miracle Mud hang on refugium w/Chaeto, EV-180 skimmer, Iwaki pumps, RO/DI system for all water that goes in the tank of course.
I still use my bio balls and have no plans to remove them for reasons I outline in the last paragraph. Bought some nice cured Kaelini
<One of Walt Smith's daughters Fijian names BTW...>
live rock from Premium Aquatics and I added a couple of "Detritivore Kits"
<Detritivore...>
as well for good measure. The tank has never tested positive for NH3 so I guess the sand and rock must have been active since day one. The highest the NO2 ever got during the first 2 weeks was 5ppm. I guess it was from the rock or maybe that is what Carib-Sea puts in the bags to keep the bacteria culture alive.
<The rock>
2ppm is the highest NO3 reading I have ever seen which was in the first 2 weeks as the NO2 cycled through. It was less than 0.5 ppm by the 3rd week. So I put in a Centropyge loricula
<A fave species, but would wait a few to several months to place dwarf angels>
and the Plerogyra sinuosa after 3 weeks and all has gone well since. NO3 has only been trace amounts for the past month (just a slight tinge of purple in the vial viewed from the side). I have seen worms in the sand when viewed from the side since the 3rd week before I even added the Detritivore kits. I use Salifert test kits and really like the Ca and Alk kits as they give precise readings via titration from a syringe instead of counting drops.
There are Two 175 6500k Halides, 1 VHO Actinic and 1 VHO 50/.50 in the canopy. I have a solenoid operated water top off system and add Seachem Ca and buffer as needed according to the Salifert test results. Minimal algae blooms, everything is going very well so far. I used Seachem Marine Buffer, Reef Builder and Reef Advantage Calcium with success in the past so I continue to use them now.
I only have 3 fish, a Flame Angel, Copperband Butterfly and a Fire Fish all doing well so far. Will add a Mandarin after maybe 6 more months or so, but that is all I plan to have as far as fish go. After all it's only a 75! I am a firm believer in having only a few fish even in my freshwater tanks. 
I only feed 1 cube of frozen Mysis when I get home from work and another in later in the evening. Unfortunately the butterfly won't even look at anything else, so that's what I've ended up feeding the fish as a staple to avoid polluting the water with uneaten food. Every few days I feed some Mega-Angel for the Flame and to see if the Copperband will try it but no luck so far. It will only go for whole Mysis and ignores anything that isn't a whole shrimp that looks alive.
I clean the filter pads every night before going to bed and I do a 6 gallon water change every Wednesday and Saturday. I've been thinking about going to a 3 gallon a day routine instead. 
I was really into Discus years ago and back then I learned that there is no amount of filtration that can substitute for routine water changes. I did large daily water changes for them which is no big deal in a freshwater tank. I have read that Discus don't appreciate NO3 and so it must be kept to a minimum just like a in a reef tank. The Discus really loved the new water and would usually swim right into the stream from the bucket as I poured it in.
<I am in strong agreement with your synopsis>
Two weeks ago PO4 was approaching 0.1 ppm so I bought some PhosGuard at the LFS just to insure that PO4 stays low. I rinsed it according to the directions, put it in a filter bag and added it to the chemical chamber in my sump along with the Poly-Filters. After a few days the Pachyclavularia violacea no longer emerged. One of my Actinodiscus Red
Mushrooms detached from it's rock and the rest weren't fully extending. The Lavender Rock polyps (they may be a type of Ricordea. I bought Borneman's book and still not really sure what they are, but I've always liked them) started looking sick and one of them detached as well. My Zoanthids quit emerging too.
The Plerogyra sinuosa, Goniopora, Carport, a Cauliflower Coral I can't identify and some other type of Tree Coral I can't identify that came on a piece of live rock seem unaffected. The PhosGuard doesn't seem to have affected the Blastomussa Merleti, Xenia or the Crocea Clam either. 
I've read some things on this site and others about mixing some types of soft and hard corals, but I kept most of these same species together successfully for 6 years in the past and everything has looked healthy this time around until the recent PhosGuard incident. I pulled out the PhosGuard 5 days ago and stuck with my routine 6 gallon Wed/Sat water changes. The organisms that were affected are finally doing better today.
<Ah, good>
The Pachyclavularia violacea came out for the first time in a week this afternoon. Unfortunately I bought a 1 liter jar of it, so I still have a bunch that I will never use. I ordered some RowaPhos and will give it a try in a week or so as I have read the iron based phosphate removal products are safer to use with the types of organisms I have in my tank. I just want to insure that phosphates stay low. 
<0.1 ppm should be no problem... phosphate is a "critical compound", needed (in low concentration... though not "free" in solution"...>
In my tank at least, it seems that PhosGuard only affected certain types of Cnidarians and very quickly. I am unwilling to continue the experiment by using it long term to see if affects any of my other tank inhabitants. My wife was really upset when it made some of our corals sick.
About the bio balls. I still use my Bi-Ox media with 4 air pumps blowing into it and rinse my pre-filters and 100 micron filter pad in the drip tray daily just like I did 10 years ago. The chemist in me refuses to give up the surface area for gas exchange they have. I never had a problem with NO3 back then, so I will continue to use them. I never saw much
NO3 after running this setup for 6 years, so I really don't comprehend why people have problems with them. I basically had the same inhabitants/ bio load in the tank that I have now.  I just happen to like keeping these particular species since I had good luck with them in the past. 
When I tore down the tank I didn't find any detritus build up on the Bi-Ox which I assume is due to the daily cleaning of the filter pads. The only thing I am doing different these days is I've added the sand bed, a hang on refugium and a modern, more efficient skimmer than the one that was built into my US Aquarium wet/dry. As I ran this setup a successfully as a bare bottomed tank for years, the only thing I really worry about this time around is that the sand bed will end up packed with detritus and become a NO3 sink and that I will end up having to tear it out. I just don't trust it yet. I spent many sleepless nights debating with myself on whether or not to have a substrate on the bottom or not when I was in planning stages. I hope I don't end up regretting this addition to what was a very successful setup in the past.
Bryan 
<Thank you for sharing. Bob Fenner>

Re: Bad experience with PhosGuard 10/13/05
Hi,
This response goes back to Bob Fenner.  Yes, I also hauled a copy of Morrison and Boyd around campus from 1976-1979 while attending classes at the University of Southern Colorado and at CU -Boulder. Now I live in St. Louis, MO and I really miss Colorado of course. The tap water here in STL maxes out my ph and PO4 test kits and NO3 looks to be between 30-50 ppm.
<Not good... for human consumption or pet-fish use>
This is nasty stuff indeed for use in an aquarium. Not at all like the freshly melted snow that makes up the water supply in
Colorado Springs. Hmm, maybe I really don't need to fertilize my lawn this fall after all with all of this free fertilizer coming right out of the tap.
<Likely just a bit of potash needed>
Once again, I really enjoy the site and look through the new postings every day.
Take care, Bryan Gatewood 
<Will do. Bob Fenner>  

Re: RowaPhos    4/6/06
Att Bob Fenner     Bob you asked that I send the original message.   
   Bob... Loved your talk to the Seabay Aquarium club in the Bay Area last year!        Here is the original question.............                                                                                        
Greetings from California!  A quick question for you.  If RowaPhos is an iron based media.  What would you think of running the outgoing effluent through activated carbon before it returns to the sump?
  Thanks
  Richard
James (salty dog) replied with.... For what reason?
<Ahh! Thank you for this. There are variable qualities in such ferrous based Phosphate filtrants, but the ROWA line are consistently high quality... Leach little to no iron of consequence. Cheers, Bob Fenner>