Pomacanthus arcuatus (Gray Angelfish) 3/28/08
Hi folks,
I recently had emailed you guys to ask about an adult gray poma that wouldn't eat. You suggested I try New Spectrum food, got some, it didn't work either. This angel is still in a 55 gallon quarantine tank, all levels are excellent - even the nitrates barely show up. Here's the thing, it has been over 3 weeks and I have not seen this fish eat anything. I have tried that spectrum food, mysis, brine, bloodworms, formula one, prime reef flake, Nori, smashed carnivore formula on a piece of coral - nothing. He swims toward things sometimes but literally moves his head out of the way. I have seen food hit him in the mouth - nothing. He is in a tank with several damsels ( they keep the tank cycled ) and a Hawkfish. They all eat like pigs and I was hoping the angelfish would learn from them - nope. How long can a fish go without eating or at least not eating in front of me?
<About as long as you have had him now, hopefully it is still alive.>
There is live rock in the tank but it doesn't have much growing on it besides I have never seen him pick at the rock. This is getting frustrating since I have kept several more difficult angelfish. I currently have a 7 year old Japanese Swallowtail and a 3 year old Majestic. I raised an Emperor from juvie to adult and actually gave him to a friend with a 220 gallon tank so he'd have more room, I had him for over 5 years.
<Great.>
In the last 20 years I have raised angels from juvenile to adult many times, had a pair of Coral Beauties for 4 years ( even spawned once) so I am no novice. And that is my frustration, why is this fish so picky and what else can I try to get a feeding response? I am out of tricks. I really don't want to see this fish die although he doesn't seem to be getting thin yet. Thanks for any advice.
<As you probably know, the Gray Angelfish isn't one of the easiest to acclimate, especially being adult size. Seems like you have tried all the foods that would entice him to eat, but unfortunately he is not. This is just one of those fish that refuses to acclimate. Probably too late now, but improving the purity of the water will sometimes trigger a feeding response. One of the best ways is by use of Chemi Pure in the system and/or frequent water changes. This has worked for me a few times. James (Salty Dog)>
Rob M.
Syracuse, NY

Scribbled Angelfish
Finicky Angelfish... fdg.  12/1/2007
I am having trouble getting a 9" Scribbled Angel to eat enough for his size. I have tried shrimp, scallops, mussels, Nori, Caulerpa and frozen preparations for Angelfish.
He is in a 210 tank with only a Flame Angel, 5 damsels, Snowflake Eel, and some urchins. Water quality is excellent. The only foods he is eating at all is a preparation I make with shrimp, scallops, red algae, and green algae ground up together. Any suggestions?
James Wedel
<Well, James, I'd consider feeding frozen mysis shrimp. There are several quality brands out there, such as Hikari or Piscine Energetics, which I really favor. They are high in protein and essential fatty acids, providing both excellent nutrition and natural appetite stimulation for the fish. In my experience, even rather finicky fish do eat this food. Of course, you could always try the old standby, frozen brine shrimp, but only after enriching with a vitamin solution, such as Vita Chem or Selcon. Another old trick is to cut open a small, fresh clam and placing it on a rock in the half shell. Personally, I have rarely used this technique, as mysis seems to work for me. The food you are preparing seems quite good, but I agree that it is important to offer a variety for the long-term health of your fish. Best of luck to you on your effort! Regards, Scott F.>

Re: chrysurus angel sick – 08/27/07
The fact that my Conspic angel isn't eating still... Thats
<That's>
what I was asking help for...Im
<I'm>
about to take my shark out of the display and treat it with copper or drain it and let it sit. All of my fish are barely eating and I haven't yet seen my Conspic eat. My large shark isn't eating as well and I cannot think of anything to do....I have improved water quality, tested fine, ph is 8.3, nitrate is 25
<Too high>
or less, ammonia and nitrite 0. spg 1.025, temp 78 degrees. alk normal.
thank you again bob.
Kelly
<My friend... there is something/s greatly amiss here... what, I cannot discern from your lack of proffered useful information... I would "punt"... do massive water changes, add activated carbon in your filter flow path, utilize appetite enhancers (HUFA's, Vitamins) on foods and weekly directly into the water... IF you have other systems I would MOVE all worthwhile livestock ASAP... Otherwise... do read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/mardisindex.htm
particularly the Articles and FAQs files in the yellow tray... BobF>

Pomacanthus imperator /Feeding 1/15/07
Hello Bob,
<James with you today.>
I need a recommendation on how to proceed or if I should. About a day and a half ago, I bought the above mentioned angelfish (Pomacanthus imperator) a juvenile about 3" TL. In the store it ate Mysid shrimp. Now in my holding tank it looks at food, approaches, but I don't see it actually take in anything.
<Not unusually during acclimation.>
I now am going to try SeaChem Garlic guard with Mysid shrimp. I have tried Nori, brine shrimp, angel formula... He's in with a lone ocellaris who eats like a pig for company. any suggestions, I don't want to lose this fish. It's my first large angelfish.
<Do read here and linked files above, especially the FAQ's on feeding.  http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/pomacanthus/imperator.htm
thanks
<You're welcome.  James (Salty Dog)>

Feeding tangs/angels   9/16/06
Hey.  I have a quick question about properly feeding tangs and angels.  I have a 55 gallon reef with lots of Caulerpa (three different types from what I can tell), covering close to 100 lbs of live rock.  I have a flame angel and purple tang that feed off the rock constantly.  Other than providing some protein in their diet such as Mysis shrimp, do I still need to supplementally feed them?
<Though they don't appear malnourished... I still would...>
I occasionally give them sea veggies dried seaweed.  They seem to like it a lot more than the Caulerpa growing on the rocks, but is it necessary?  
<Might be... Caulerpaceans aren't palatable to all...>
Can they get all their nutritional requirements from the 3 types of Caulerpa growing in my tank or should I continue feeding them the dried seaweed as well?  Thank you
Jon
<I would. Bob Fenner>

Queen Angel won't eat... no useful info.   8/16/06
I have a queen angel, about 6 inches. beautiful fish. Problem is it won't eat.
<How long have you had this animal? At what size was it when you procured it, what foods has it been eating?>
I have tried to feed all kinds of foods with no success. Water quality is good.
<Like the prez, "they're terrorists", non-informational>
I even put a sponge in there and still nothing. The guy at my LFS, said to buy some garlic
<Oh, just like in the wild>
and to mix that with its frozen angel food. My question is could that work??? Or is there anything at all you can recommend? My tank is 125 gallons....
<... Six inches is a bit beyond ideal size for acquisition... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/holacanthus/ciliaris.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

Emp. Angel not eating -dying fish from a fan?-  - 5/7/2006
Hello,
<Mike>
First I admittedly made a terrible mistake in collecting from my local beach (San Diego) a small gorgonian fan and added it to my established
(2yrs) fish only tank with the following:
125 Gallons with Live Rock and Live Sand.
1) Russell's Lion (8in)
1) Clown Trigger (6in)
1) Fiji Puffer (3in)
1) Cow Fish (5in)
1) Zebra Moray (20 in)
1) Yellow Tang (deceased)
1) Christmas Tree Wrasse (deceased)
<Too many fish for this system>
1 month after introducing the fan to my tank the yellow tang went on a hunger strike and passed away.  Shortly after, I acquired a 4 inch Emperor
Angel.  3 Weeks ago the wrasse also would not eat and passed away last week.  While the other fish still appear to have appetites, the Angel has now stopped eating.
<I do NOT believe this is from the fan you added to the tank, while it may have had contaminants and or pollutants on it, Your stocking list of fish seems to be the culprit here.  You have one of the most nasty tempered triggers maybe even the nastiest fish period (the clown trigger) in with a cowfish, one of the few fish in the world that not only carries tetrodotoxin (the most potent toxin on the planet) but the cowfish can release that poison as a deterrent to predators or due to stress.  In a home system such as yours, it can kill everything.>
Could the fan, now back in the Pacific, have been the culprit?  Bacteria, internal parasites? The angel has gone a little over a week without
eating.  He still appears to be active, color is good, no noticeable rubbing on the sand or rocks, no visible signs of disease (As with the
tang and wrasse).  I have tried Angel formula 1 and 2, frozen krill, flakes and brown algae.
<My hunch is that the clown trigger is either harassing the angel, or harassing the cowfish and has made the cowfish release enough poison to seriously injure the other fish.  I would pull the clown trigger immediately and re-home it to another tank, and do the same with the cowfish.  If you do not want to re-home them, setup a tank for the clown trigger by itself, and one for the cowfish by itself as well.  If you decide not to move the cowfish, you will still need a 240 gallon or bigger tank to handle the puffer (gets 12-15") the lionfish (18"+ without fins and is very venomous) the 15+" angel and the 8-10" cowfish.  The clown trigger will hit 2 -15" or more as well and will become a holy terror to tankmates as it ages.>
My water parameters are .22 SPG, Nitrites 0, Ammonia 0, Nitrates b/n 20 - 40 ppm.  I maintain a strict regiment in conducting 12% water changes
every other week.  Is there anything that I can do to help this little guy?  I started with a 30% water change yesterday and gave the angel a fresh water dip for 4 min.s.  Please advise.
<Try setting up another tank for the angel to live stress free for now, and remove the aggressors as above to ensure it is not harassed.>
Thank you,
Mike Ferrante
<Please re-home and remove fish, as this mix will result in death for more if not all of your fish.>
<Justin (Jager)>

Passer, life ongoing.... general and Angel feeding FAQs  - 4/24/2006
Hi Bob
<Alan>
Wow again, sounds like you have lived the life I would give a great deal to have experienced.
<... It's not over yet my friend...>
For whatever reason, I have never had / made the opportunity to be involved with the sea outside the marine hobby. ......
became involved in the zoo world and have not seemed to shake it.
<"Zoa" from the Greek, "animal"... including lower invertebrates... non-verts>
Had some interesting experiences though, having had my back badly torn open by an adult male gorilla (they can be amazingly gentle and quite retiring, but
have the capacity to be incredibly dangerous, with their substantial canine teeth used for battle and to tear bark from trees etc), and having survived
an attack by a 18 year old African elephant bull.
<Yeeikes, and folks have asked me if I fear sharks>
Well back to marines. I am aware of Ron Thresher's work (have a / the book of his on reef fish reproduction) and a copy of one of Robert Straughan's
books somewhere on keeping marines (published in the late 1960's or even 1950's I think),
<Yes... and amazing that we should share these>
but am not aware of his recorded observations on reproduction.
<Mmm, well, this may well be a function, or lack thereof, of my "memory">
Many thanks for the offer to look at your college library Bob, but I truly never meant for you to go out of your way, I just hoped that if
you had any internet sited, that you could pass then on.
<I do make regular sojourns to use their (expensive) computer tools... A blessing to/for the public in much of the U.S.... and largely subsidized by them>
My wife and I purchased a home in Cape Town this weekend (moving from the suburbs),
<Ah, congratulations>
and believe all the paperwork will be through by mid July, so I will put up the 180 gallon tank I mentioned (still in a crate at the moment)
and move the passer into it for the first time when we move. Most of what I have read, indicates that the passer as a species is pretty outgoing in the
aquarium and fairly belligerent, but my specimen is very shy, even after many months in the tank.
<This will change abruptly with age/size (about past ten cm. overall length). Not an outright agonistic species, they are nonetheless the alpha
animal of most of their habitats>
Although the tank it is in is small (63 gallons), I believe that I have managed to create a good balance between rock work
(caves, ledges etc) and open swimming space. There are no children or pets rushing about to panic the fish either. When the passer arrived, I put added
an old breeding pair of common clowns (approximately 16 years old) in its tank so that there would be some relaxed fish to calm the passer down (not
from the geographical area I realize, but hoped that their really relaxed attitude would be a plus). Figure I will try to replace the clowns with a
royal Gramma or two in the 180 gallon tank. Part of the passers diet is pellets, which I drop through a clear plastic pipe to prevent current
whipping them away. The passer has been conditioned to come a one corner when I tap on the glass, and watches the pellets fall down the pipe, and
takes them as they leave the pipe.
<A good technique... will add to our general and Angel feeding FAQs>
Of interest though, if I am wearing anything dark blue, the fish, which spends more time under ledges that
swimming in the open, is less keen to come and feed. If I remove the shirt or jacket, the fish will immediately arrive to feed.
<Interesting>
The passer has been turning blue for a while, so all I can figure is that I represent a huge potential rival passer if I am wearing dark blue........ there could be
other explanations, but I can not think of any. The fish may just be hell of a spoilt though and over pampered.
Enjoy the week.
Best
Alan
<Have done so. Cheers, my friend. Bob Fenner>

Juvenile Chrysurus 27 Jul 2005
I have a juvenile Chrysurus angel that is probably about the size of a quarter. I didn't mean to get him so small.<Hi Brandon, MacL here with you today. No worries on the size as long as we can get past the barrier of getting him to eat.> I ordered him on the net from Marine Center, so I know the fish was properly cared for. That said, I've had him for about 2 to 3 weeks. He hasn't eaten any prepared foods, and that includes live brine. He is constantly picking at the rocks however, showing somewhat of a feeding response. <If he is constantly picking he is probably eating copepods found in the rocks. He is more than likely getting enough to sustain him but unless you have a way to refill what he eats or you reseed the tank with pods he will eventually wear out the supply. There are many places that you can buy pods to restock or you can use this time to get him eating other things. One of my new favorites is www.seapods.com. A new business that sells beneficial pods to help replenish.> There are no fish in the 125G tank to pick on him. <Does that mean there are no other fish at all or just that no one there will pick on him? Often they can learn to eat other foods based on examples from other fish.> He has now developed a large white clump on his left pectoral fin. It looks very large, too large to be ich. <Sounds to me like it might be lymphocystis, you might check the site to determine if it is. If so good water conditions should take care of the problem.> I'm worried that his immune system may be compromised from not eating. <Perhaps just a bit stressed from being a small tyke and shifted.>  Any ideas of what to feed when live brine won't work? <Lots of stuff might appeal to him. He might eat mussels cracked open. He might eat Mysis either frozen or live. Did you contact the marine center to ask them what he was eating while there. I have had a lot of success with fish not eating by putting garlic on the frozen foods. Seems to encourage them to eat.> He chases it, only to look and not eat. <Good luck, MacL>
Thanks.

- Angel Not Eating after Quarantine -
hi there,
<Hi.>
First of all thanks to Bob Fenner who answered my first email, when I asked for help about disease on my fish. After a year and a half of normal aquarium behavior (and not adding new fishes to my 180 gallon tank) my French angel and emperor got some weird spots on their fins, (they weren't really spots it looked like the fins were dirty) I observed them for a week or longer and they disappeared one day and then came back the other, they didn't show any other symptoms or stress and either were my two percula clownfish showing those signs. I gave the French angel away cause he got too big and didn't come along with the emperor that well. I waited some more days and saw that the emperor was getting weak and was now showing white spots on his fins only, now it was pretty obvious to me that this might be an ich outbreak and I decided to take them all out and put them in my quarantine tank for treatment and let the main system go follow up for a month or longer.
As i have ordered some new fish before the disease broke out, the new fish arrived and I put them in the quarantine as well and treated them all together with CLOUT. It was effective after only a few hours, the emperor looked better and the other fish seemed fine too (the new fish added to the quarantine tank were a false falcula butterfly, a raccoon butterfly and a yellow tang) I treated the fish for some more days and even though the white spots seemed gone they all kept scratching and flashing, which didn't seem like a good thing to me at all. I used the CLOUT medication exactly as it was on the box and after a week treating them i did a 25% water change as I couldn't use the skimmer in the 30 gallon quarantine and it seemed like a lot of bio-load for such a small aquarium to me (besides all the medication added). After a day or two the raccoon and the falcula (and only them) were covered with white spots and I was a little disappointed cause I thought that the medicine should take care of that problem and not allow another outbreak. (ps.: water quality was excellent and I gave them a variety of green foods, algae, brine shrimps and krill - a little bit of each) so I decided to a 50% water change and finally tried to use copper (CopperSafe) as everyone said its so effective. I put the right amount in the water and waited to the next day. But the copper didn't do a thing, it only made it worse, the emperor was pale, covered with white spots couldn't breathe on one side and the two butterflies were pretty bad too, the raccoon became some small rashes on its skin. <Angels have difficulties with copper, and you can't expect results in a day... usually takes two weeks to completely break the lifecycle of Cryptocaryon. Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ichartmar.htm > I called the dealer and he told me that copper usually takes a few days to work well, but i couldn't wait another few days cause my fishes were getting worse, and another day they would have died, so i performed a freshwater dip on them three and had to add CLOUT again. <You really shouldn't mix medications. I'm not sure what the active ingredients of CLOUT are, but it's bad practice to mix both the copper and CLOUT. You should run activated carbon between medications to make sure the previous one is removed from the water before adding the new one.> I know mixing medications isn't the best idea but they were literally dying from the ich already so that was the last thing i could do.. <Could be the active ingredient in CLOUT is copper.> next day miraculously they improved a 90%, spots were almost gone, no more scratching, got their color back and breathed normally. I kept using CLOUT till a few days ago until all symptoms finally disappeared (with copper present), then had a 25% water change and put the right amount of copper in the replaced water (without the CLOUT of course, as it wasn't necessary anymore) all fish have been fine, totally recovered from ich, BUT the emperor lost his appetite and didn't eat for the last 4 or 5 days. I don't know what I could do to improve his appetite (yesterday i changed 15-20% of the water and lowered salinity from 1.021 to 1.019, I heard that this improves the appetite and also prevents a new parasite outbreak)
what could i do to make my emperor angel eat again??? <Try some tempting foods - perhaps some open shell fish or similar stinky, meaty item to get the fish interested in food.>
thank you in advance for your answers and sorry for the novel...  :)
best regards,
Sandra
<Cheers, J -- >

LFS
Hello, 
<Hello Jonathan, James here>
My name is Jonathan, and I spoke to you before. I'm pleased to talk with knowledgeable people about fish. Right now I am in a unique position. I work nights at a local pet store with salt water fish. I'm 7 year fishaholic. Right now, I can try things out and gain insight into what products work. 
<Nice position to be into> 
I'm interested in helping the fish out, and will learn whatever I can. 
<Great!>
So off the bat, I know there are things I can't control and realities that exist. Some fish will always die due to the stress of shipping, that's just unavoidable. Some fish arrive in very poor condition, they are hard to help. But once I get my hands on them, I want to try.
P.S. I'm also fortunate enough to work with an experienced veteran who is open minded and willing to try new things. (as long as I don't tint the color of the water, or of course endanger the fish)
Off to a salty start. Our salt water section is about 16 tanks, some with a partition. Each tank is about 80 gallons; total system is about 900 gallons. Each tank having 2 very large sponges filter each attached to a powerhead, also the tanks are centralized, each sharing a common source of water through a sump with wet-dry. I have one tank shut off from the
system, which acts as a treatment tank. We have copper in the system to help combat disease. Occasional use of Maracyn is also delivered.
One interesting issue is the red Cyano bacteria we get on the crushed coral substrate. Since we cannot limit lighting, it has to be on about 14 hours, and we have a dealer fish load. We are combating this foe by removing heavily infested gravel into a bucket to dry out, occasionally mixing in some MelaFix on the gravel. By rotating the gravel in this manner we are making progress. Also increasing water changes and removing debris in the tank helps. We are about to Chemi-clean. An expensive option, but recommended to help get rid of the infestation. Any tips would be appreciated. 
<The Cyano you are experiencing is helped along by excess nutrients. I suggest cleaning the sponge filters in salt water every other day. Some dealers do not put any substrate on the bottom. This makes vacuuming easier in removing waste from the tanks. Maracyn works much better than MelaFix for killing Cyano.>
My main concern is marine angels. They come in and half the time they do poorly / die. Mostly I’m referring to the large angels, the dwarfs are a bit better. One recurring issue is when one of the eyes gets cloudy, from just a little to completely. I don't like thinking that there is nothing I can do. The fish can be eating great, well adjusted and swimming fine for weeks. But the eye gets worse and worse, and then the behavior changes to being lethargic or hiding, then death. 
I was thinking about trying a medicated antibacterial food for the ones that will eat. Medi-gold comes to mind, since it seems powerful, yet untested on tropical or marine. I'd be willing to try others. I also have SeaChem's Focus. Something which lets me bind a medication to food, even if I have to have a vet prescription med I could try that. I can separate to treatment tank. I can perform freshwater dips if very necessary. Please any suggestions? 
Dealers I know will not stock large angels for just that reason. They will special order only. Most dealer's tanks are overstocked and that adds to the fungal/bacterial problem. Obviously, dealers want to sell the fish as soon as possible to relieve the overstocking problem. If I were to "stock" large angels in my store, I would have a 180 gallon or larger tank for that purpose, where I could treat the angels I have for any diseases. I would also dose this tank with an iodine supplement. I would also employ the use of UV sterilization in all systems. One dealer I frequent has a large Lifeguard UV system. I rarely see a diseased fish in his tanks.
Also I'm looking to entice fish to eat. off course many will not eat the first few days. It seems also, that many never learned to eat fish food. 
<True> 
Like the angels which pick off the gravel, but seem to snub whatever I try. Any recipes you have. I have SeaChem garlic guard,
<Good> 
and a little food processor. Could I make something more appealing? 
<Yes. Here is a link to an article by Adam Blundell on a homemade recipe.> <<Where is a link?>><<Sheesh: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/cav1i3/Progressive_Recipe/Progressive_Recipe.htm RMF>>
Thank you again for any words you have to offer. 
<You're welcome>
Any referrals to books or articles would also be appreciated. 
<Search the Wet Web Media. There are tons of articles just waiting to be read that cover most any subject. James (Salty Dog)> 

Queen Angel and food sponges
Bob,
Hi, what types of sponges do Angels eat? Like the Queen angel fish. I know there are many types of sponges in the ocean. Such as tube sponges etc. But what type do these fish like to eat? Thanks again.
<Mmm, you'll need to do some legwork... on fishbase.org: Queen Angel  Look at the link to "Food Items"... and all the way to Gerald Allen's 1985 reference... or get thee to a large college library for a computer based bibliographic search. Bob Fenner>

Feeding at night
HI Guys <Hi Jeff, MacL here with you.> And a Happy New Year to you all.<Why thank you so much.>
Something I have been meaning to ask for quite sometime now. I have gotten
into the habit of feeding my Angel Fish at night just before I go to bed and
just before I turn out all the lights. I was wondering if this is a good
thing?? I use to feed them at night and wait for awhile before I turned out
the lights as I thought that the fish may need the light so "see" the flakes
floating through the water. Then my wife thought that I was crazy ..
thinking that I'd rather spend time with my fish than go to bed with her ;-)
So tell me am I crazy?? Do I need to keep the light on for awhile for the
fish to feed or is it ok to drop the food in the tank and turn out the
lights and go to bed?? <Judging by my fish they could find food regardless but don't you like watching them eat? That's one of my favorite parts of the tank.>
cheers
Jeff
Brisbane. Australia

Fussy Emperor Angel
Hi crew.
<Hi there! Scott F. here today>
I have scoured the emperor FAQs and I've read a lot about their diet and feeding or lack thereof). A week ago today I purchased about a five inch emperor ("Morpheus"), still juvenile in coloration but beginning to change. Perfectly bright and healthy other than not interested yet in being fed prepared foods. The dealer said he would work something out with me if he never adapted to food, and he had a much better chance of doing so with constant attention from me, and I had a much larger tank(120gallon) than the dealer had him in, and with much more live rock for sampling, so I went ahead and purchased him even though he had not shown much in the way of accepting prepared foods yet. Has been actively picking on my live rock for algae and detritus all week.
<That's a good sign!>
I have seen him poop solid "green" twice, which I take as a good sign that he is getting something into his system. No bullying at all and no disease that I can see. Tank is not crowded-(he is by far the biggest) and water conditions are good. About 200 pounds of live rock are currently in there and the tank has been established for almost a year now. He doesn't appear to outwardly be suffering from lack of eating yet (no thinning) 
Here is what I have tried to coax him with:
Marine flakes
Mysis shrimp
Angel formula
Formula I and II
Seaweed Select Red and Green sheets
Nori seaweed sheets
Frozen krill
Frozen clam
Frozen shrimp
Frozen squid
Frozen bloodworms
Fresh opened mussels
Spirulina pellets
Broccoli, Frozen brine shrimp (I know-just trying to encourage feeding)
Kent Marine Garlic Xtreme -directly into the tank and on the food
Vita chem-directly in the tank and on the food.
I considered Sweetwater plankton but took one look at it and decided to avoid the mess and thought it probably wouldn't be the deciding factor so didn't get it. Have considered a live sponge but also thought that also has a low probability for return for the money. I wouldn't know what kind of sponge to get anyways.
<Plus, you don't want to get the fish "hooked" on a food that can be problematic to supply in the long run>
I've put the food on a rubber band on the rock, in a clip on the glass, into the water column, on the floor of the substrate-just about everything. So I know you guys have a secret weapon, so let's have it!
<I'll tell, you- there is no real one secret food that will guarantee success with this fish! What you're doing is great...Keep tempting him with a variety of foods, and maintain the best possible water conditions...In the end, good environment and quality food will do the trick...Just be patient and don't give up. Another idea might be to try some fresh Gracilaria macroalgae. I've found that a variety of angels and tangs will munch on this macroalgae. Once they acquire a taste for it, Gracilaria is an excellent dietary supplement>
Occasionally he'll stare down the food and the best I'll get is some nipping and spitting out but nothing in the way of a nice big healthy gobbley bite. He also likes to half-heartedly pick on my chocolate chip starfish and pincushion sea urchin as well as some small cluster dusters in there. Well, its been a week. I've pretty much tried everything you guys mention in the FAQ's. I guess my question is this: if he hasn't accepted food till this point, is there a still a good chance that he will or is it more likely down hill from here? 
<As long as there is some live rock in the tank, he's got some food items to forage for. Keep trying...If he's otherwise in good health, there is a very good chance that he'll start eating soon.>
I guess I am looking for some encouragement. Is there still a good chance (as I hope) that one of these times he is just going to tear into one of these offerings? Or, is it more likely that he is going to continue to be stubborn and waste away as I continually rotate my offerings over the next few weeks?
Thanks for the advice, Scott
<Well, Scott- I'm a big one for not giving up. Just keep an eye on him and if he eats anything, keep supplying that food until he is satisfied. If it gets much longer than 2 weeks, that could become problematic. Let's hope for the best! Good luck! Regards, Scott F.>

Thanks for the advice and assurance, Emperor eating at last
I wrote a while back about an emperor that was slow to start eating.  Just wanted to let everyone know that  "Morpheus" is now a pig just as you and other forum visitors suggested might transpire.  He eats out of my hand and devours just about anything I give him.  It took a good two and a half weeks before he started adapting to prepared foods.  He started with the mussels and then quickly adapted to the formula foods and Nori sheets once he got going.  I'm not sure if it made a difference, but I did use garlic extracts and chem-vital.  Thanks for all the advice.  Hopefully this set of posts will be encouraging to the next hobbyist going through the process!
Scott Fisk
<Thank you for sharing. Will in turn post, share with others. Bob Fenner>

Personifer Angelfish not eating in quarantine, not unusual
Hello,
I email a couple weeks ago about my new personifer and scribbled angel. They were breathing rapidly, i fixed that, but now the personifer wont eat. I've tried everything in the book. The scribbled eats just fine. It doesn't even show interest. Chopped seafood, open shell clam. i even bought an orange sponge for it. <Another suggestion oriental food store of size and inquire as to whether they stock dried tunicates/sea squirts, sponges and jellyfish... soak these materials in freshwater to do your best to reconstitute them... (from the faq on angels). But remember don't leave them in the water a long time> tried every available macro algae, jelly fish,
romaine, live brine, frozen Mysis, angel formula. I've never had one be this tough before. I usually have great success with angels. Am i forgetting something? <Do you have live rock with pods in the rock in the quarantine tank?> they're still in their 46gallon QT tank. they don't appear to be stressed, a little nervous here and there, but the scribbled approaches the front when i come by for feeding. I saw a LFS have some sort of live jellyfish. i know they don't survive in captivity and i was going to buy it to see if the personifer will eat that, seeing as how they eat jellies, not necessarily this type, in the wild. I've had him for 10 days now. water is fine. i raised the temp during medication to 84F. <One question, did you use copper when you did the treatment? Sometimes it does have an adverse effect on the angels.> Any help would be great.

Finicky Angel
Dear Bob,
<Hi there! Scott F. here today>
I purchased a Singapore angel about a month and a half ago.  After a small outbreak of ich the fish has been pretty healthy.  However the problem is he will not eat.
<An all-too-common problem with these fishes, unfortunately>
I have him in a 85 gallon FOWLR, however most of the live rock is covered in coralline algae.  I did try to give him some fresh macroalgae, but my Yellow Tang wolfed it down (he only got a little bit).  I have tried every other type of food imaginable.  He is only about 3-4 inches long.  The Singapore has gotten noticeably thinner.  Could I put him in a 20 gallon reef that contains a lot of different macroalgae?
<That may be a good idea, too help "turn the corner" on this finicky eater. I'd give it a shot for a while.>
The only corals are button polyps, mushrooms, and starburst polyps.  He will only be in there for about a month until I can set-up a 55 gallon FOWLR (hopefully to become a reef). Thank you. Sam Reef
<The Singapore will nibble on soft corals and zoanthids, so do be prepared for some losses. Certainly avoid LPS corals. However, if it were me- that's a risk I'd be willing to take to keep this beautiful fish alive. Good luck! Regards, Scott F.>

Watanabe On A Hunger Strike?
Hi,
<Hello there. Scott F. with you today!>
I have had a male watanabei angel for about six days now.  He's been mostly hiding under the live rocks and I was wondering if you have any tips on getting him to take food.  He started venturing out from the second day but I haven't seen him eat anything yet.  Also, it seems like he only ventures out when the pump is off and the water is still. Every time I walk by to feed, he quickly swims back under the rocks. The food is quickly gone with all the other fishes in there.  I tried blowing some food into the hole he's hiding in using a turkey blaster but he doesn't seem to eat it.  The cleaner shrimps and other fishes quickly eat up all the food.  I've been trying to feed him frozen Mysis shrimp, brine shrimp,
Hikari mega marine and Hikari mega marine angel.  Also tried zooplankton and seaweed sheets.  Nothing seems to entice him to eat. I understand that they are shy fishes, but when should I start to worry?
<Well, these fish do tend to have difficulties adapting to captive life on occasion. Coming as they do from deeper water, they are often susceptible to collection/decompression traumas. It may simply be a case where you'll have to keep trying to feed him. Fishes can go a surprisingly long time without feeding before it can get critical, but after 10 days or so, I'd begin to worry. Another thought might be to keep the lighting down a bit, which may relax the fish somewhat, and compel it to swim in the open water. Difficulty in acclimation and feeding is yet another reason why we advocate quarantine for all new fishes; it gives them a chance to "harden" from the rigors of collection and transport>
Will having a female in there help?  I have a 275 Gallon tank.
Thanks, John Tong
<Well, John, in the long run, a female might make the fish happier, but the immediate problem is getting him settled and feeding in your tank. Again, my best advice is to keep trying. When you get to two weeks and no feeding, it may be time to capture him and place him in a separate tank  for a little TLC, and to "convince" him to feed. Good luck. Regards, Scott F>

Feeding a Regal Angel
If I could get the angel to eat a polyp would it be more apt to eat other
stuff once it was eating something in captivity?  I'm willing to try if it
could work.<With a Regal Angelfish I would be tempted to try just about
anything in order to keep it alive. I do not know if this will work or not
but its worth a shot. Good luck, IanB>

Queen On A Hunger Strike?
I have a queen angel that has been a voracious eater and bully, but as of late he hasn't eating since taking a nibble on a green Sinularia that I purchased. When I bought the coral, I placed it in the tank, and he took two nibbles of it. I quickly removed the coral and place it in one of my other tanks.
<Good move if you want to save the coral!>
The angel has no external problems and it is in perfect condition, just that it has stop eating. the other fish in the tank are doing fine. The water parameters are perfect. Can you please share some light on this situation? Thanks, Pablo   
<Well, Pablo- I suppose that it's theoretically possible that the Sinularia, which does produce some unusual chemical compounds, any of which could potentially serve to help discourage nibbling by fishes. Perhaps there was some sort of a toxin that the fish ingested while "snacking". Or, it may just be a coincidental "hunger strike" caused by some other stressor. At this stage, do keep a close eye on the fish, and observe for other obvious signs of stress or illness. Sometimes, it might simply take a small water change to bring the fish around. Take appropriate action as necessary. Good luck! Regards, Scott F.>

Angel In Peril?
Hi I was wondering if you could help me. I have had my tank raised half moon angel for about 6 months now he has be doing great until a few days ago he doesn't eat that much eats a bit a day, but he is usually a little pig. Besides that, his color and personality is the same. I saw him go up to my cleaner shrimp once since then I have gave him 2 fresh water dips. Should I treat with copper or continue with the dips. This has been going on for about 5 days.
Thanks, love your site!!! best on to net!
Morgan
<Well, Morgan- I'd hold off on further, possibly stress-inducing treatments of any kind, until you get a handle on what this is. Usually, fishes go off feed for a variety of reasons, such as environmental lapses or illness. In the absence of other obvious disease symptoms, I'd look to environmental conditions as a possible cause. Do a full range of basic water tests to see if things are up to par. Otherwise, continue excellent husbandry practices, and stay the course with this fish. Hopefully, with your good care and the passage of time, He'll get back his appetite and things should work out. Hang in there. Regards, Scott F.>

Majestic Angel not eating!! 1/8/03
Hello Robert & Crew  You guys (gals) have helped me in the past with my Blue-Ring Angel and Golden Puffer; which are still doing EXCELLENT!!
<Hi Gary. Adam with you today.  Glad to  hear things are going well!>
My question is as follows: I purchased a Majestic Angel from my LFS about 3 weeks ago, quarantined him for 10 days (not one problem) put him in another tank (parameters are excellent!!) with a Christmas Wrasse and a Pearlscale Angel (those 2 are as thick as thieves!!).
<Kudos for quarantining, although I would go a bit longer as a rule (two weeks minimum).
The Majestic barely ate in quarantine at all!! He ate fine at the LFS; he was there for 4-5 weeks.
<This could be the stress of moving, being in small quarters, etc.  This fish did have 4-5 weeks to settle in at the LFS.>
I've been feeding him EVERYTHING!! i.e. Spirulina flakes, Sea Veggies, Emerald Entree, Formula 1 & 2 etc. all with no avail.
<Sounds like a nice variety.  You may consider trying frozen Mysis.  These are often irresistible to stubborn feeders.>
I was thinking of putting him back in quarantine and dosing with Maracyn (it contains B vitamins which stimulate appetite).
<I have never heard this about B vitamins, and would hesitate to medicate a fish that isn't sick.  If time and other foods don't entice him to eat in a couple more days, I might move him back just to eliminate the competition.>
I know the species of Angel takes some time to relax in a tank setting. His color, fins, scales, eyes, behavior (swimming fine, all around the tank.) is superb, (THIS IS ONE BEAUTIFUL SPECIMEN). Any suggestions, comments would be greatly appreciated!!!
Regards, Gary Lewandowski
<You are right on the money.  I would give the fish a few more days to get used to it's new surroundings and tank mates.  Do try Mysis too.  As long as it remains healthy, I would only move the fish again as a last resort.  Good Luck. Adam>

- Fish Source and Nutrition -
Hello, its mike here.  I was wondering if you know of any big corp. that ship salt water fish (good quality). <Do check with one of our site sponsors: http://www.themarinecenter.com - they are a great source for marine fish.>  I also have a question about my emperor angel.  We are feeding him nutritious substances (angel formula, Mysis, brine, prime reef with vitamins) and his color is fading a tad bit.  Since he is still eating and very active, we suppose that this slight fading is because of his change into the adult emperor. Is this correct? <Possible, but could be other factors - perhaps too small a system, water quality issues - all should be examined.>
Thanks.
<Cheers, J -- >

Robbed by the bandit (angel)
Hi Bob, I have acquired a black banded angel from a fellow fish fancier. He has given me the angel in hopes of ME being able to keep it alive. 
<A real challenge>
The fish is about 3 month's in captivity and has now stopped eating regularly.
<Typical... actually, not so... this one has lasted much longer than most all>
I have had my best friend build me an acrylic tank (155 gal) to house this treasure that should have been left in the ocean. I am going to put 175 pounds of Fiji premium live rock in with a mixed sand/crushed Puka substrate. I have designed a filter and it should be completed Thursday.  The angel will be housed only with a cleaner wrasse, and 5 cleaner shrimp. I am going to put a Beckett style skimmer and lightly ozonized in the column. I have access to all the local wholesale houses and have asked for their help in acquiring sponges, clams, small shrimp, mussels and a cleaner wrasse (just in case). My question for you is, in your vast knowledge can I get this beauty to eat again. I have tried your tried and true method of the "FENNER BLEND" to no luck this far. Any suggestion would be appreciated. I know leave the damn fish in the ocean where it belongs!!! Thanks
<May seem strange, but do look into the larger pellet sizes of Pablo Tepoot's "Spectrum" fish food... have been friends with Pablo for years, and this past weekend made it down to visit him at his farms in Homestead (FLA) and see firsthand the types of fishes he is keeping solely on this food... including Parrotfishes, some finicky Butterflyfishes and Tangs... even some very nice Apolemichthys spp. angels... Training this fish onto this basic food might "do the trick". Otherwise your plan for the set-up, providing sessile invertebrates to graze on sounds good. Bob Fenner>

Feeding Techniques For A Finicky Fish
Hi Bob,
<Actually, Scott F. in today!>
I have your book "The Conscientious Marine Aquarist". Great book!
<Isn't it? A real "keeper", IMO!>
Anyway, I wanted to tell you about my new Majestic angelfish. I bought him a couple of weeks ago....before I saw the dismal writings in your book about their failure to eat and thrive in captivity.
<I'm sure that Bob will agree that many CAN thrive in captivity (records of 20 years or more exist!), but source and collection techniques can play a large role in success...>
Anyway, when I got him he was fat and healthy looking, but I could not get this shy fish to eat anything. After spending $179 before tax at my local fish store for this 5 inch fish, I was kind of upset as he did not eat for the first 4 or 5 days. I decided that I was determined to get him to eat. He cost too much money to let die! He would not touch
flake food as he is so slow that the smaller fish in the tank would gobble it up before he even came out from the rocks to look at it. Live brine shrimp was another disaster as he is so slow that he only would catch maybe one or two before the other fish gobbled them all up or they got sucked up by the filter. I knew there must be something that he would eat... the frozen krill would float to the top of the tank and he didn't even know it was food.  Well, I read that they like to eat a lot of sponges and algae grazing on the rocks in the wild. I finally got him to eat by taking pieces of seaweed sheets and pieces of frozen angel preparation made from sponges and krill (looks pink like sponges in the wild?) and placed them on a small rock with a rubber band. The other little fish in the tank took to it right away and when he saw them he joined in. These foods last on my 5 inch rock for an hour or two which is long enough for this slow grazing fish to eat.
<Excellent technique for feeding this great food source...Thanks for sharing the idea..>
I also got a brine shrimp feeder from Brine Shrimp Direct to feed him with great success. It is a little mesh cage type thing that you put the live adult brine shrimp into. It keeps them in the little cage until the fish peck at them and suck them through the mesh.... Keeps them together in an area away from the filters where a slow grazing fish like a Majestic can feed over an hour or longer. 
<Another good idea...>
Maybe you can suggest some of these ideas in your next article or book that may help others keep these beautiful fish alive.
<Thanks again for sharing these techniques with your fellow hobbyists! That's what this site is all about!>
Sincerely,  Lesley Sears in Houston
<Take care, Lesley! Regards, Scott F.>

-Passer angel ceases to eat-
Hello to all at WWM: My Passer angel which I have had for almost two years seems to have stopped eating. It's been a couple of days and I have tried all sorts of food. However he is still as active as usual. I was wondering if the water temp may be an issue. It's been running at about 84 degrees for the past couple of weeks. <That could do it> A little high but the other occupants do not seem to be effected. FYI this is the first time the water remained this high for a prolonged period of time since the tank was set up five years ago. Just wanted your thoughts on why he may not be eating and if temp has anything to do with it. (all other water parameters are in their appropriate ranges) <I think you have your answer here, but you may want to double check water chemistry parameters (especially pH). There are many tricks to dropping water temp, my favorite is evaporative cooling with a fan across the top of the aquarium. At this point, there's not much you can do besides make sure that he's not getting picked on and bring the temp slowly back to it's usual. Good luck! -Kevin> Thank you..........gigantically, Gene

-Personifer not getting his feed on-
I just added a near adult Personifer angel to my 240 tank.  He has been in there for 2 days and still won't eat.  I have offered frozen Mysis, frozen clams, ocean nutrition Angel formula one and two (both frozen and pelletized), dried green and red seaweed, freeze dried krill, and fresh Grape Caulerpa. <Did it eat at the store and during quarantine (assuming you quarantined!!!)?> The tank is 3 years old and currently houses a 7" Hepatus tang, 7" red sea Sailfin, 1 blue damsel, a 6" Harlequin tusk, and a 9-10" stars and stripes puffer.  The Personifer is the largest fish in the tank at about 11-12". He seems to have acclimated well to the tank, as he never showed any signs of stress, and is inquisitively swimming about through the LR, etc.  I know that it may take a couple of days for him to eat, but when should I become concerned? <After a week or so of not eating, you'll need to try harder. It will probably be able to sustain itself by picking tasty treats off of the live rock for a few weeks.> If it comes time to be concerned, what should I do to entice him to eat?  I do have a 150 gallon sump in which I grow out LR and Caulerpa (tons of pods in there as well).  I have read that soaking prepared food in liquid garlic will stimulate feeding. <Sometimes it works, sometimes it don't. You can also try other liquid vitamins like Selcon or Kent's Zoe. You're trying the right stuff, just keep on trying and make sure he's not getting bullied by the residents. Good luck! -Kevin> Is there any validity to this?  Thank you. Dave

-Paracentropyge multifasciata: the Multi-Barred Angel-
Hi WWM crew!
First of all : thanks for all your support and sharing your knowledge. I'm reading Bob's and Anthony's books almost every day again&again and still finding something new and interesting. Now to my question: I was enjoying pics of Paracentropyge multifasciata in the marine books and was sure I will never see it in my LFS, all the books say, this angel is very rare and not imported. <A spectacular fish, unfortunately very difficult to feed.> What was my surprise when I've found it in LFS in Vienna last week. The specimen was looking good, healthy and alert, the price was good , so who could resist? <If it wasn't eating I would find it very easy to resist> It is hard to find any more information regarding this angel. Now I have 3" Multi-barred in my 110g reef , my other fishies are: 3" yellow tang 3" maroon clown 2" Yellowtail damsel 1,5" Allen's damsel 2" dimidiatus cleaner 2" bicolor blenny approx 30 soft corals, some LPS , one Montipora.  Water parameters are OK.  So far , the angel is doing well, I dipped him in freshwater dip, bathed twice in aquarium water to wash all parasites and powered on the 15W UV sterilizer. He looks good, not hiding too much and he is discovering holes and caves in the rocks.  My questions are:
1: what should be his meal plan, so far he is sampling the LR and sand, will 110g provide enough food or should I try something to feed? yes there are some algae , but not too much , the tang lives mostly on spinach and lettuce.
<You will most definitely need to feed it. Try all sorts of frozen foods like Mysis shrimp, clam, shrimp, etc. You must also incorporate plenty of algae into its diet as well. I would suggest halting the spinach and lettuce in favor of dried seaweeds. Good luck getting it to eat, they can be very tricky. You may need to try garlic and vitamin supplements in the food as potential attractants.>
2: would it be OK to add one more tang (hepatus) and one more angel (flame) in the future ? <You should be fine with a hepatus tang, but I'd skip the flame since you already have an angel.>
thanks for your help, Roman from Slovakia <Good luck Roman! -Kevin>

Angel food - 07/09/03
What is the best seaweed select to feed my angel fish? the red, green, or brown? What else is a good everyday feeder for him? Mysis shrimp?
<As with humans, variety is the spice of life. All three are a good choice, as well as Mysis. You also should look into frozen foods that are formulated for angel fish, many angels like sponges, which are in short supply in most tanks.>

Tempting An Angel
I just bought a Bicolor Angel on Tuesday and it hasn't eaten anything. I know it is normal for a fish to not eat for the first couple of days but this guy is very active and swims all over the tank. When I put the food in he will act like it isn't there, swimming normally with no interest in the food. He is about 4 1/2 in. including his tail and I have tried brine shrimp, algae sheets, and krill. Should I try something else or just let him be? Thanks, Andy
<Well, Andy- it's very important to continue tempting this fish with as many different foods as you can think of. I'd try to throw in a few small live rocks that have a nice growth of fauna and microalgae on them. You also might want to try some other frozen foods, particularly "Angel Formula" by Ocean Nutrition. I've used this food many times to tempt finicky Centropyge angels into eating a captive diet. Be sure to keep the water quality high, and the feedings varied and frequent. Hopefully, this guy will come around and feed...Good luck! Regards, Scott F>

Angel In Need...?
Hello,
<Hi there! Scott F. with you today>
I got a bicolor angel 12 days ago.   I gave it a freshwater dip with Methylene blue for 5 minutes before placing in to a quarantine tank.
<Very good procedure...>
I have tried all kinds of food and I have never seen this fish eat. I have been feeding a frozen pygmy angel formula, Mysis, seaweed on a clip and also have red feeding algae in the tank and a couple pieces of live rock.  The fish swims around
constantly except when I approach the tank it hides for a minute.   It has very good color and clear eyes, doesn't show any signs of disease but I have watched it for hours and never seen it even pick at anything. I read on your FAQs that I probably shouldn't have used the Methylene blue in the dip, do you
think I have poisoned this fish?  
<No- I personally have never experienced a problem with a Centropyge angel when using a Methylene blue dip. I think that the fish's lack of appetite has little to do with the dip, and a lot more to do with the way it was collected, or the rigors of the journey that it took to get to you. Unfortunately, as you may already be aware from reading on our site, the Bicolor has an unfortunate reputation for not eating or adjusting to captivity. Many Bicolors are still collected with chemicals, and some simply do not make the transition to captivity very well. I'd keep trying to use the foods that you've used so far, and you may want to try using some vitamin preparations, such as VitaChem, added directly to the water. This product may help stimulate his appetite, and may also provide some direct nutrition for him. Keep trying some small pieces of fresh live rock, too. Keep the water quality high, the feedings regular, and don't give up. I have used Ocean Nutrition's "Angel Formula" to feed Centropyge angels that can be tricky (like the Lemonpeel). It has a slightly different formulation than the "Pygmy Angel Formula" (it includes sponge), and sometimes, it can work well for a tough feeder. Sponge may not be a factor, but there seems to be something in there that some of these difficult fishes like...Worth a shot!>
They said that it ate at the LFS. Also read that maybe I should cut the QT short and place in the main tank where I have a
ton of live rock. On Tuesday it will have been in QT for 2 weeks, should I go ahead and place the fish even though I have never seen it eat. Otherwise it is very healthy looking. And should I give it another it another fw dip without blue before introducing to main tank or would that be too stressful.
<I'd leave it in the QT one more week (3 total), just to be safe. I'm reminded of a line from a "Star Trek" movie: "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one..." In other words, don't risk all of your other fishes' health by placing this guy in the display too soon. I don't see the need for another FW dip, unless you see some sort of parasitic problem arising...Unnecessary stress, IMO.>   
How long can a fish survive without eating anything?   I guess it is possible it secretly eats whenever I am not around but I've never even seen a nibble.
<Well, these angels are "secretive", so there may be more feeding of some sort going on when you're not looking. How long a fish can live without feeding is anyone's guess...I'm hopeful that he can hang on for another week. The fact that he seems alert and otherwise healthy is a promising sign...Just don't quit on him...One more week is pretty important...Well worth the risk>
Any advice you have I would greatly appreciate.
Thank you, Kylee
<Just hang in there, Kylee>

Imperator stopped eating !!!
Hi guys need your help !!!
I have an Imperator in an predator tank (Clown Trigger and Snowflake Eel)
Last week I noticed that he had a couple of marks on one of his fins. I kept
an eye on it to see if it spread and it didn't so was able to rule out
disease
I am guessing that he probably got nipped by my clown but again am guessing
Well, his appetite has slowly gone away
I have been feeding him brine shrimp, krill and giving him some seaweed type
stuff in the morning (can't remember it's name. they use it for sushi but
was recommended by my LFS)< The brine is pretty worthless accept as a occasional treat.  Instead try feeding him Mysis shrimp or one of the angel formulas available.>
Anyway, he hasn't eaten anything over he past 2 days and appears to be
breathing pretty rapidly
Did a quick check on my levels and my no3 is at approx 20ppm is so is in
line...Salinity is pretty stable a 1.020...Ran out PH so wasn't able to
check it....There may still be traces of copper in the system (Cupramine)
but that's probably because I used it in my main tank...I already
know...should have used the quarantine and will heed this advise in the
future
I only have approx 5 pc.s of living rock in my system, so there really isn't
a ton of hiding places for him to go...but I have been watching and haven't
seen any outright aggression
What should I do....This is once of my ultimate prizes and really want to
keep him if possible
Is it his co inhabitants ? Should I be looking to trade him ?
If I trade him in, what else can I put in the tank that will put up with my
clown trigger <  Angels can be very sensible to copper so lets work on getting rid of that first, this can be done with a poly filter, when it is removing copper it will turn a blue color.  Slowly raising the salinity up to 1.023-1,026 would also help.  Try to get those nitrates down to 0.  The tank mates might also be part of the problem as the trigger is very aggressive.  If you see the trigger bullying the angel one or the other will likely need to be removed.  Some more live rock would also help.  How big is this tank?  Check the rest of your water parameters ammonia, nitrite, and PH.  Ammonia and nitrite should be at 0 and PH 8.0-8.4. Cody>
Please advise
Thanks
Chris

Juv. Queen Angelfish Not Eating
>Hi.  
>>Hello.
>Recently (three days ago) bought a rather small queen angelfish (~3") just turning into his adult colors.  He looks healthy and is swimming all over the place.  He is in the quarantine tank now and likes swimming in the current from the powerheads and back filter.  Just one problem.  He swims up to the food and won't eat it.  Anything.  I've tried formula one (flake and frozen), formula two (flake, frozen and pellets), frozen angelfish formula, Mysis shrimp, brine shrimp, Nori and generic flake food.  He isn't lethargic, and swims up fast to the food but turns up his nose.  Any advice or suggestions?
>>Well, first thing I would do is either go back to the purveyor, or contact the retailer from whom you purchased the fish.  Find out how long they had him as well as what he was fed.  Next thing I would do is give him a couple of days to get hungry, and then start offering the foods mentioned EXCEPT the brine.  If that fish is really hardcore about being picky, I'd also try (but not long-term) bloodworms, just to see if it's that he doesn't recognize the other items as food.  There are many people who are big proponents of garlic as an appetite stimulant, and I seem to recollect an article written in the online Advanced Aquarist Magazine (I believe you can find it through www.reefs.org).  Also, please search our site for other information here--> http://www.wetwebmedia.com/MarInd3of6.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/part2.htm  (scroll down to the angelfishes)  Now, this may also be a case of the fish not recognizing what's food, in which case you may want to consider putting a cheap, ravenous fish like a very small damsel in there to stimulate feeding response in him.  If you do so, be sure to give it a freshwater dip before putting it in with the angel, and in my mind this would be a last resort.  Hopefully, the retailer you purchased the fish from should be able to tell you what the fish was eating before.
>Thanks in advance.  Steve B.
>>You're welcome, Marina.

Dried Sponges For Food?
Hello there,
<Hey there! Scott F. with you today>
I am the proud owner of a Majestic angel who is doing very well as the sole inhabitant of a 120 gallon tank. Unfortunately in the UK few people have heard of Angel Formula type foods based on sponges and as far as I know there is no retailer stocking any. I
spoke to the main wholesaler in the country and they told me that there are restrictions re the import of such foods, therefore I can't have it imported, particularly in its frozen form.
I want to try and give my angel some sponges and I read somewhere that I can get dried sponges/tunicates from an oriental food store.
Questions:
Is it worth my trying? Are dried sponges good enough?
Do they make an adequate substitute?
<Honestly, I don't think that it is necessary or worth the effort to secure dried sponges for this fish. Number one, I'm not sure what types of sponges they would be, and, number two- I'm questioning what, if any, nutritional value dried sponges would have. Also, P. navarchus does not eat a great deal of sponge material in nature, when compared to say, the Rock Beauty or Regal Angel, so it should be very easy to get this fish to eat other prepared foods. Hikari makes an excellent "Angel" food, which seems to be more "tubeworm based" (although it does include sponge in the ingredient list), and is a great food that may also be available in the UK. Also, Gamma frozen Mysis is one of the best foods you can feed to angels, IMO, and is eagerly accepted>  
Do they (the sponges) have a special name, in other words can I be sure that they have not been treated for human consumption?
<Honestly cannot say- which is yet another reason to pass on these items, IMO>
Thanks for your help, Massimo, Brighton UK
<And thank you for stopping by, Massimo! Enjoy your wonderful Majestic Angel! Regards, Scott F>

Fading Angel?
Hello guys:
<Scott F. your guy today!>
Thanks for the great site (I'd like to rant on, but I really need some advise quickly.)
<No problem!>
I have had a Centropyge Eibli (about 3") for about a month now.  I really love her (well it acts like a "her" to me!!)  spunk, intelligence, and beauty.
<Yep- definitely a chick...LOL>
Unfortunately, I have not been able to get her to eat enough of the food that I offer.  I have tried Formula One, both of the major Angel mixes that I know of, flake food, and my own formula of fresh seafood and kombu/Nori.  I even tried the "freshly opened clam trick" from Bob's book, but she was not interested. My tank has been set up for about seven months and has some algae and detritus accumulation that she munched on during the day, so I thought she must be getting enough to eat that way.  Now, I'm not so sure.  Tank water parameters are good as far as my test kit will read.  
<Well, if she is nibbling on some detritus and algal material, that's a good start, but she probably needs to get some other, more nutritious foods for long-term health>
This morning I could not find her and she had jammed herself under an overhang and wouldn't come out. I finally coaxed her out, but she is acting totally lethargic (kind of swimming as if she were a little drunk).  I don't see any other marks on her (yesterday she looked and acted fine except a bit more shy than most days).  The other fish seem fine.  I moved her to my refugium earlier.  It is completely overgrown with all kinds of goodies.  But now she is not nibbling on anything.  
<Not a good sign here. Observe her carefully now.>
The only other real change has been that I added some "Fiji frilly" corallimorphs.
<I doubt that there is any correlation between the addition of the corallimorphs and the behavior that you are witnessing>
I am afraid that she is dying and was wondering if you guys had any advice for emergency action that I might try?  Could the new 'shrooms have poisoned the tank with something that does not show up on the ammonia testing?  Are Centropyge particularly sensitive to this in some way?  
<Always a possibility, but seems unlikely. In my opinion, Centropyge angels do not appear to be any more sensitive to metabolic poisoning than any other fish, but that does not mean that they are invincible! Do re-check water parameters regularly>
If it is lack of nutrition, is it too late?
<Well, it's never too late, if you can get him to eat. You may even want to use some liquid vitamins in the water, such as Vita Chem, which the fish may absorb by drinking...Perhaps this may provide some supplemental nutrition and stimulate the fish to eat>
Sorry if these are silly questions, but I don't know how else to ask.  This is so sudden!  Damn I hate to think of losing this beautiful fish!  Please let me know.  Thanks again for all your help and this incredibly valuable resource. Greg
PS:  I'm not sure where she was collected from.  Could this be cyanide poisoning, or would that have shown itself earlier?
<Well, if it is cyanide poisoning, the fish would have probably died shortly after its first meal, and would have displayed some disoriented behaviors, and unusually bright colors, too. It could, however, be a delayed result of collection trauma, or some type of internal disorder. Check all environmental parameters again, and correct any that need it. I'd suggest removing her back to the quarantine tank for further observation, and possible treatment, if it becomes necessary...Good luck with this fish! Regards, Scott F>

Fallen Angel (Pt. 2)
Scott F. (or whomever for the follow-up):
<Scott F. again today>
Thanks for the response.  Unfortunately, she died sometime last night. I tried adding a bit of vitamins and a little Selcon to her water, but to no avail.
<I'm really sorry to hear that>
I really wish I knew what was wrong for sure and whether the other fish might also be in danger.  I rechecked all the water parameters and they seem good (0 amm. -0 nitrite -5 nitrate).  She had no outward sign of illness (at least nothing overt that I have encountered or read about). I think that her overall body color (aside from her markings) may have been a bit darker gray than usual yesterday, if that tells you anything. I feel terrible because I believe that she probably starved to death, but I tried to get her to eat everything that my experience/reading told me she might like.  (With/without garlic...with/without Selcon.)  She would never do more than eat a bite or so.  More often, she would "sniff" the food and turn away.  (Except that she did munch on the live rock/detritus.)
<So many possibilities...really hard to ascertain exactly what the cause was. Many times, as mentioned previously, delayed traumas resulting from the rigors of transport and acclimation to captivity result in the fish refusing food...You did your best, which, although unsuccessful, is the most that anyone could have done>
Anyway, the reason that I went through all that is to ask whether there is anything that you guys would recommend for me to try in the future that I did not do this time.  Or, whether this may be some illness that I missed the signs on...?  I know that last one is hard to answer, but...?  
<Well, it sounds to me like you did a good job on this one. Just remember to quarantine for at least 3 weeks, provide a good mix of foods, and a stable environment, and your fish should be fine. You may want to verify where the specimen was collected from, to ascertain that it was not collected from a region where drugs or chemicals may be common. You may want to try Marine Center, which offers fishes from collectors who use proper techniques to assure healthy specimens>
At a minimum, I think that I will let my tank grow in a lot more before I try the angels again.  Losing them is like losing a work of art...that was alive! Thanks for trying to help!!  Take care, Greg.
<Good idea to wait for the tank to "mature" a bit more. Hopefully, this unfortunate occurrence is an experience that you will learn a lot from. Good luck!  Chin up! Regards, Scott F.>

Emperor angel not eating - Don's Answer
<Hi Joe, Don here>
recently purchased a juvenile emperor angel, I have a 200 g FOWLR system. It is constantly picking at the rock and glass yet won't eat any of the brine shrimp or Nori I put in.  Is the rock enough to sustain the fish <most likely no> or is there something else I should be doing <Drop the brine shrimp, 90% plus water, nearly no nutritional value. Use an assortment of fresh/frozen meaty treats. Frozen Mysis shrimp, etc. Keep the list varied. Use different kinds of macro algae to see it will take that. Don>
thanks
Joe

Feeding Imperator Angel - Phil's Answer
Good morning,<Hey there!>
A quick question for you.<Shoot>  I purchased a juvenile Imperator angel on the weekend but have had no luck having eat any of the brine shrimp, Nori, or blood worms I feed the other fish.  None of its tankmates are picking on him.  The angel though does constantly seem to pick at my live rock and the glass walls.  Is this enough to satisfy him?<Nope> is there anything you could suggest? thanks
Joe
<Joe, try feeding Mysid shrimp, Spirulina, and Formula 1 angel food.  This should help!  Keep trying to feed the angel.  Some angels take a few days till they settle in.  Hope this helps!  Phil>

Angel At The Start
Beginner. 90 gal tank 90lbs Kaelini rock cycling for four weeks. Also 1.5 inches fine sand bed. 2 VHO actinic 2mh 175 10000k lights first turned on 2 days ago for 6 hrs per day. water: s.g.-1.023..amon- 0...nitrites- <0.3..nitrates- 10ppm...ph- 8.5(too high?)
<The nitrite should be undetectable ("zero" for our purposes) on a hobbyist grade test kit...do recheck, okay?>
Should I be testing for other parameters?
<If you are running a reef system, I'd also check for phosphates and alkalinity>
Should I be adding any supplements...changing 5% H20 weekly.
<Great habit!>
I really have a very sketchy plan for fish for this tank. I wanted 2-3 damsels to start...
<Just remember, if you start with damsels, they will tend to become the dominant fishes in the tank until new fishes establish themselves...Frankly, I like to start with the more docile, shy fishes, let them establish themselves, and then add the more active, potentially aggressive fishes>
I have been buying on line but since shipping is high I figured I would go local...after stopping into 5 stores I found one where the owner seemed well-versed. store was clean and the tanks are kept up nicely.
<A good LFS is a great ally to have!>
After talking to him and 3 customers that were there the damsel idea due to there territorial attitudes went out the window.
<Good thought>
The owner suggested only getting 1 fish and he had a few that he highly recommended for my situation. We bought a coral beauty dwarf angel which he said should do well for us. Upon looking closer at this fish.. esp. with Mr. Fenner's book, CMA. I am worried about his survival...since my lights have only been on 2 days is there sufficient material for him to eat?
<Well, a couple of things here....First, I'd take exception with the advice to purchase a Centropyge angelfish for a newly-established tank. A great fish, yes, but these fishes do like to forage on growths of macroalgae and detritus on the live rock and substrate...There are not usually sufficient algal growths to accommodate this feeding habit in a new aquarium. Established tanks are usually a better "venue" for these fish, IMO. Also- I'm surprised that the owner recommended any fish when you have detectible nitrite in he water! Please re-check it again...This fish, and any new addition, for that matter, should be quarantined for a minimum of 3 weeks before being placed in the tank. With that being said, let's look at what we can do to keep this fish happy and healthy..>
I give him flakes every 2 days. Can you give me some handling/feeding advice that may increase his survival rate? Thanks again
<Okay- let's get him on a better diet. This species needs to have a substantial amount of microalgae in it's diet. There are many "green" frozen preparations, such as Ocean Nutrition's "Formula Two" and "Angel Formula" foods, which can provide this. If you are using flakes, do get some that are Spirulina algae based as well. Frozen Mysis is another great food! Just keep a close eye on this guy, provide a good diet, stable conditions, and he should be a fine specimen for many years! Good luck-Regards, Scott F>

Angel At The Start (Pt. 2)
TO SCOTT F..
<Hey!>
Thanks for your advice. I will get the frozen food you recommend...Amount and frequency to feed him?
<I'd try 2 or three small feedings per day. If this is your only fish at the present, I'd start with 1/3 or 1/2a cube of the food (thawed in water) to save on waste...>
I have a Tetratest Laborett test kit so on their nitrite scale the lowest reading is <0.3..which i take as 0. if this is not correct what kit gives 0>..Thanks again.
<Ahh, now I see why you indicated that...Essentially, for hobby purposes, we are shooting for "undetectable". For peace of mind, why don't you take a sample to the LFS just to verify that it is at that "undetectable" threshold? Should be okay...Good luck! Regards, Scott F>

Large Angel health issue
Bob, Anthony, please I need help and your expert guidance!
I have a 160 FOWL (you guys I am sure remember it), I have a show Queen that has been in perfect health for quite some time, but the other day it started acting disinterested in food (I was feeding raw oysters and have for quite some time with the addition of romaine and some marine dried veggies), it actually started hiding and acted as if it was stunned, when it would come out it would swim in to rocks etc., I changed 60 gal worth of water over several days, none of the other fish have a problem, there are no external signs of disease on the queen, I hit the tank with Maracyn 2 yesterday at the recommended dose, I am seeing more movement and you can tell the fish must be feeling somewhat better, but it still acts as if it cant see at least very well (its eyes are not cloudy), I am wondering if it would benefit from the addition of any type of supplement which contains vitamin A since vitamin is so crucial to a mammals capacity to see, I will continue with the recommended cycle of Maracyn treatment, but wanted to know your thoughts on the vitamin A or anything else you might propose, as always thanks
<I would definitely soak this fish's foods in a vitamin, iodide and HUFA supplement. Hopefully this is "nothing" or a passing nutritional deficiency syndrome. Bob Fenner>

Blue Angel
David,
Thanks for your reply. I have taken the wrasse & Dottyback out & back to the store, which leaves me with the blue angel & damsel & 60 lbs. of LR.
<Okay>
I agree this tank will be too small,( two stores said it could take 2 - 3 years before I would need a larger system - good sales pitch) If I notice problem's I WILL take action. He eats very well, I did throw some algae plants which he seems to enjoy as well as the usual Nori strip.
<He needs the macro algae and sponge>
He almost seem to want to eat from my hand when I put the algae in, a very curious fish, Swims all day so hopefully that is a good sign to come. I will continue to feed the sponge formula along with others each day( 2 - 3 x ). My only questions are do these fish enjoy a strong current which I believe I have ( cycles 9 times an hour with an additional head near the bottom in back ) ?
<I would not consider your current strong. Angels, like most marines, like a brisk current. Your turnover at 9 times an hour is adequate>
I have purchased Vita-chem to use instead of garlic, as you
mentioned, what is your take on this product?  
<Sounds okay. I would rotate these vitamins also. Maybe when the Vita-chem runs out you can try some Selcon>
I will do my best to maintain the water quality ( 10 gal. wk. ) & give proper nutrition & keep your last reply handy !
<Glad to be of assistance. The less crowded this fish is the more it will feel that it has open space. This fish, of course, is a showcase fish and will look gorgeous even if it is the only one in the tank! David Dowless>

Re: Blue Angel info.
David,
Thanks for your reply. I have taken the wrasse & Dottyback out & back to the store, which leaves me with the blue angel & damsel & 60 lbs. of LR. I agree this tank will be to small,( two stores said it could take 2 - 3 years before I would need a larger system - good sales pitch)
<Remember...These guys are selling fish and equipment...I ain't>
If I notice problem's I WILL take action. He eats very well, I did throw some algae plants which he seems to enjoy as well as the usual Nori strip. He almost seem to want to eat from my hand when I put the algae in, a very curious fish, Swims all day so hopefully that is a good sign to come. I will continue to feed the sponge formula along with others each day( 2 - 3 x ). My only questions are do these fish enjoy a strong current which I believe I
have (cycles 9 times an hour with an additional head near the bottom in back)?
<Angels, like most all marines, like a brisk current. Your current should be adequate but it would not be considered a strong current by any means>
I have purchased Vita-chem to use instead of garlic, as you
mentioned, what is your take on this product?  
<It will work. I suggest rotating the vitamins also. After you finish the Vita-chem try some Selcon or other vitamin supplement>
I will do my best to maintain the water quality ( 10 gal. wk. ) & give proper nutrition & keep your last reply handy !
<Sounds like a winner! Even if the angel is the only fish in your tank, it will be show-stopping beautiful! David Dowless>

Angel On The Rocks? (Or In The Rocks?)
We have a  small bicolor angel in our tank with live rock.  We have had it for two weeks.  I never see it eat except for when it is nipping at the rocks.  It is pretty shy and stays in the rock area.
<This is fairly common behavior for Centropyge species, especially when new to captive life. They tend to hide and are very wary of disturbances in their immediate surroundings. In time, the fish will probably become more and more bold>
We feed the rest of the fish in the tank pellets, Spirulina, and krill. Is it possibly getting some of that even though I don't see it eating?
<Possible...As these fish tend to forage and pick at detritus and other items, they may get what the other guys miss. However, you may want to try to target feed this fish if possible>
We have a 125 gallon tank with various kinds of fish ......... one of the damsels was bugging it the first few days, but seems to have laid off the past week after a time out or two in a separate container:)
<It's amazing what the "time out" can do, huh?>
Thanks
<and thank you for stopping by! Regards, Scott F>

- Big Macs all the Time -
Hello WWM, <Hi, JasonC here...> I was hoping you can help me out again, your previous advice proved to be useful! I have had a flame angelfish for about 2 weeks now, he is in a 55 gallon with a small percula clown and blue fin damsel. They all get along fine but I never see the angelfish eat! When I feed them the angel swims out to the food but at most only eats a very small piece of flake and swims away. He seems fine, good color and he hasn't lost any weight as far as I can tell but I don't really have that much algae growing in my aquarium, just some purple and green stuff on the live rock. I feed them formula 2 flake, any ideas on this guy? thanks! <I would at least start by trying some other foods, and non-flake ones at that. Try the frozen Formula One in addition to Pygmy Angel Formula and Mysis Shrimp. There are two secrets to success with these fish. One is a varied diet... this is key for a number of reasons, most importantly that no one food is good for you if it's the only thing one eats. Second, in the wild these fish constantly pick at micro and macro algae growing on the rock. Your best bet is to try an simulate this with a healthy crop of live rock. You can read up more on pygmy angels here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/centropyge/index.htm
Cheers, J -- >

Asfur Angel
This message is for Bob Fenner if possible.  
Bob, I spoke to you a little over a week ago about getting my Asfur Angel to eat (what I want him to eat).  I have tried every kind of frozen food (Formula 1, 2, angel formula, Blood Worms, Mysis shrimp, Prime Reef, fresh fish, shrimp and the like.   He is doing/acting great.  He is quite territorial also.   He loves live brine shrimp (which I have tried to not give him) but refuses to all but nibble anything else (If I did not know better I would say he is doing this intentionally!!!)  He wont really even touch Seaweed.  He does constantly nibble on the macro algae (unidentified red brushy, and Caulerpa) and the live rock.
Any idea on what I can do to get this guy to see things my way?  I am worried now as it has been a few weeks of this.   He still looks great though and is not loosing weight (as best I can tell).
<Not to worry... very likely this fish will soon start eating all hungrily. Do try soaking the assorted foods in a vitamin and HUFA mix (variously sold as appetite stimulants in our interest) for several minutes ahead of offering>
His new big tank is on order so he should be happy (my daughter loves this fish and calls him "The King of the Red Sea", cute for only being 5 years old).
Thanks again for your help and Happy Holidays!!!
Andrew
<And to you and yours. Bob Fenner>

- Bicolor Angel Woes -
I first want to thank you in advance for your help!!!!! <Well... let's both hope that I actually can help then...>
My Bicolor Angel has not eaten in a week. I just bought him a week ago and he is so shy and will not eat. I am trying to feed him flake food and Brine Shrimp and he will not eat?? What can I do to get him to eat? Its one of the most beautiful fish I have ever seen! <First, I would suggest you read up on these fish here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marine/fishes/angels/centropyge/index.htm
Then, I will just quickly paraphrase and say that these fish are among the more difficult of the pygmy angels to keep. You've picked yourself a good challenge. Your best bet would be to obtain [if you don't have it already] some really healthy live rock with a good crop of micro- and macro algae that this fish can pick at. Most all pygmy angels constantly pick at these food-stuffs in the wild, and bringing in similar fauna will promote your success. If things don't turn around very soon, or if you can't get the live rock, try taking a frozen food like Pygmy Angel Formula - thaw it out, and then press small chunks of it into a piece of rock or smooth [dead] coral. This will simulate their natural food source and likewise their natural method for feeding. You can prepare several rocks in one sitting and re-freeze the ones you don't use immediately. Cheers, J -- >

- Re: Bicolor Angel Woes -
Thanks for the quick response! <My pleasure.> I will go out tomorrow and get some healthy live rock. When you say "similar fauna" what do you mean... <Micro and macro algae> I'm sorry for asking so many questions. <No worries.> In the mean time I could do as you said and get the frozen food and put it in some of the rock that I have. You are a life saver and thank you for your time!!!!! Merry Xmas to you and yours!!!!
<And you as well. Cheers, J -- >

Angel On A Hunger Strike
Hi! This is Bhaskar from Alaska again.
<Hello there! Scott F. with you today!>
I need some help with feeding a French Angel.
I have a 1200 Gal tank. 15'x4' foot print. I have had it up for a year. It had 3 6" angels in it. A Mac, majestic and a Blue face. The Blue face is the boss. They are all doing great. I have a total of about ten medium and ten small sized fish in the tank.
I purchased a 8" French angel two weeks ago. Well the other angels chased him for a bit but now only bother him if they are face to face.
<A common occurrence when introducing a new angel into a tank with other angels who have already established their territories>
Otherwise the French swims where ever he wants. He picks at live Rock but has not eaten anything I have offered him. Other than sponge which I do not have access to, I have given him everything possible. How do I get him to eat?
<Well, it definitely can be a challenge. Once the fish has reached the size of your specimen, it will be difficult to wean it to a captive diet. I'd try using some fresh chopped seafoods (clams, squid, etc.), and utilize a lot of vegetable matter, such as Caulerpa, Gracilaria, or other macroalgae (or sushi Nori, if none of the above are available). You may want to try a frozen food containing sponges, such as Ocean Nutrition's "Angel Formula". Another idea that often works for finicky butterflyfishes, is to cut open a fresh clam and drop it in the tank. Many finicky feeders will go nuts over this! Be sure to remove any uneaten portions of the clam when the fishes appear to be finished feeding>
How long can he survive not eating? Will he come around? Thanks, Bhaskar
<It's hard to say, really. Hopefully, the foods that we are discussing will stimulate this fish to eat. If all else fails, you may need to remove him back to the quarantine tank and really keep food in front of him, maybe try some marine vitamin preparations in the water in the quarantine tank... Don't give up...keep trying. Good luck! Regards, Scott F.>

Re: Asfur Angel
This message is to Bob Fenner if possible.   It is a continuation from a prior message.   
Bob, the Asfur is doing well.  He is actually turning out to not be very shy.  He loves to eat the different organisms off the live rock (Caulerpa, and I guess red colored sponge or macro algae) and chase the other fish.  He is not eating the prepared food I am offering (Formula 2, Angel Formula, Flake, Sea Weed on a clip, and even Julian Sprung's veggie flakes).  To try and get him started, I got some live Brine (I know not good nutritionally but only live LFS had) and he loves this stuff.
<No problems feeding Artemia occasionally... analogous to you and I "healthy" candy bars>
What should I do to try and get him to eat?   He is not skinny at all thanks to my 5 + year old live rock but I got to get him to eat for the long-term.
<Keep trying the prepared foods... or to save time, money, consider making your own... blended meaty seafoods and a binder, frozen into cubes, or into flat sheets that are easy to break chunks off of. Bob Fenner>
Thanks for the help

Thin Blueline Angel
Steve thanks for the information on the blue line angel. He is rather uninterested in food at this point and getting skinnier. I have tried frozen Mysis, and even a fresh clam on half shell. I know it has only been two days, but do you have any suggestions on what may induce a feeding response?
Nori/Seaweed Selects, various live macroalgae, or even a live sponge if you get desperate.>
Even if I was to move him this would be his quarantine quarters and he should feed in it should he not?
<You would like to see him feeding in QT, yes.>
Also how long can this go on before I should become very alarmed?
<A week or more would start to concern me.>
Thank you guys as always...
Dismayed, Brian
<Best of luck to you! -Steven Pro>

Coral Beauty Chow...?
Hey guys,
<Scott F. da guy tonight!>
I was wondering what to feed my coral beauty. He picks off the rocks all day and gobbles up brine but won't touch the frozen pygmy angel formula I bought for him. I know angels require a special diet and I was wondering if you have any suggestions as to what to try? Thanks, Rob
<Well, Rob- like most Centropyge angels, the Coral Beauty derives a good percentage of its nutrition from algae material. As you have observed, the fish will spend a good part of its day picking detritus and algae from the live rock in your system. You may want to try a variety of foods, such as Mysis shrimp, finely chopped seafoods (squid, clams, etc), and an algae based frozen food, such as Ocean Nutrition's Formula II, or perhaps Nori sheets or other macroalgae, such as Gracilaria. Another thing that you can do is place some small live rocks in a brightly lit aquarium, where you can encourage green algae growth. Then, place the rocks in your tank for the fish to pick at. If you keep trying a variety of foods, you should have no problems keeping this fish in prime condition. Good luck!  Scott F.>

Feeding Planktivores
Thanks for your reply. I decided to go with the Centropyge ferrugata and
the Cirrhilabrus scottorum. In fact they are in their new home. Of course
the wrasse is in the back hiding. Since I do not have an upstream refugium
at this time, what would be your suggestions on feeding my wrasse and
Sunburst?
<thawed frozen mysids, Gammarus and Pacifica plankton can be the staple. Supplement with any dry food possibly/taken. Also offer Sweetwater Plankton (incredible jar food for Anthiines).>
Doug
<best regards, Anthony>

Queen angel not eating
Greetings Bob and Anthony, I have a real quick question,
<<Hello, it's JasonC this time...>>
I have a 160 fowl, setup for several years, I have 5 fish total, the
largest is a show queen, a beautiful and curious fish. Everything has been perfect for the past 7 months, no disease and more importantly no ICK!!!
I try to feed these guys an assortment of foods, however they seemingly
have gotten spoiled on fresh oysters to the point they wont eat frozen food (who could blame them??). Approximately two weeks, I changed 20 gallons of water, with a new salt I had never used (Crystal Sea), prior to I had always used Instant Ocean. I use RO water only, and let it mix for 24 hours (heated), all of a sudden my queen started hiding, and refused to eat oysters, further, some of the other fish followed the same course of action. I changed more water, assumed that it could be a bad batch of oysters, and bought more with seemingly the same result. The only food I have been able to get this fish to eat is romaine, but it eats a quarter of what it did before. When its feeding time it will come out and stare at me waiting for food, but it seems no matter what I feed it its not interested, tonight not even the romaine. Color is still good, but I fear if I cant get it eating voraciously again as it did in the past, I may lose it.
Is it possible that it hates the new salt? <<That's a very easy theory to test, just go back to the Instant Ocean salts. Depending on the age/health of this individual, I would think you have enough time to test this out. Also a note on the romaine lettuce - you and your angel would be much better off with a dried seaweed product... Nori, Sea Veggies, Seaweed Selects or otherwise... terrestrial vegetables just aren't the proper source of nutrition for these fish.>> Or, could it be internal bacterial infections from bad oysters? <<Also a possibility, but very hard to test - probably need a microscope and tissue samples from the food you have been feeding.>> I have changed no other variables
other than those stated. What do you think? <<Start with the salts... easiest thing to test/prove out.>>
Thanks, Tom Griffith
<<Cheers and good luck. J -- >>

Koran Angel
Hi WWM crew,
<<And hello to you.>>
Recently I purchased a Koran angel which is about 8 inches. I have quarantine the fish for 2 weeks with frequent freshwater+ Methylene blue dips .It looks in good health and seems to be swimming around fine.
<<Good stuff.>>
But it doesn't seem to be eating the food pellets which I feed it. <<Time to try some other foods.>> Also, I have introduced the fish to the main tank and almost immediately it started chasing a 6 inch Naso tang and subsequently other fish. Luckily there is enough live rock to provide cover for the other fishes.
<<Luckily...>>
I had a smaller Koran before about 4.5 inches and it seems very calm and just grazed around the live rock looking for food. But the current Koran doesn't seems to exhibit this behavior. <<Well... such a large fish [read as older] would be well-set in its ways.>>
What can be done about its appetite and do you think it will stop chasing the other fish once it has settled down? <<Try any/everything you can get your hands on, perhaps try to tempt it with live brine and once it is eating, switch to other foods. As for the end of the chasing, is very hard to predict, but I would say no, it won't settle down, or at least not very much - large angels need to be the boss.>>
Regards, / Ragu
<<Cheers, J -- >>

Question about Imperator's diet
Hi. I was wondering if I could get some expert help on feeding an Imperator Angel. I purchased a smaller size adult imperator angel. He is about 6 1/2 inches with full adult colors. I have had him for about 3 - 4 weeks now. He will not accept any frozen foods and I have tried feeding everything...
Mysis, angel formulas, fresh clams, frozen shrimp, plankton etc. He devours all types of algae's though... green, red, brown, Nori and sometimes some broccoli and spinach but he is real picky. 
<please stick with marine greens (Spirulina, Nori, seaweed, etc). Terrestrial plants like broccoli and spinach are polluted with phosphates used to grow such plants from fertilizer>
Just recently he looks weaker and has developed a little ick due to a recent water change and additional stress put on by presence of large Auriga butterfly. 
<the water change should not instigate ich unless the water was accidentally cooler... do consider>
The cleaner gobies seem to be keeping his parasite level down in combo with UV, hopefully when
I get home he will be cleaned up again. None of the other fish are experiencing ick or problems and all eat fine. I am concerned that the Algae alone will not be enough for his diet. Can he survive on just eating algae w/ Zoecon Zoe vitamins? 
<Not at all... needs a much more varied diet. Please keep trying the above listed foods (without brine shrimp). Also consider trying Sweetwater Plankton (jar brand)... very enticing for most fishes. Also some fresh live rock to encourage grazing>
How do I get him to eat other meaty foods? Any suggestions would be great and thanks again.
<best regards, Anthony>

Re: Frayed Fins and Regal Angel
Hi Anthony,
Thanks for your reply. Mine is a Red Sea regal angel and a feed the variety pack of frozen foods. 
<good to hear it!>
Formula I, II, Brine shrimp, Reef formula etc... you know the rest better than I do. Occasionally I offer live mussels as a treat. I really think it's getting a fair mixture of foods, as the frozen variety package offers a couple, I try to feed different types each feeding, 
<overall sounds very good>
but in any case is their a specific type of food you recommend for this species, even a home made formula. 
<no definitive recipe out there that I know of... do keep up with the variety and look over the thread on favorite homemade recipes in the forum as well as in Bobs book CMA and archives on this site. Homemade foods can be superior!>
Also any specific vitamins besides Zoë and Zoecon that you recommend.
<I do not favor/disfavor either of the above. I have been very satisfied to use Selcon for many years>
The only other thing I can thing of is about 5 mths ago this fish had flukes which I treated and have shown no signs in recent times besides the frayed fins. Since my last email it has not gotten any worst but no better. Again it's not bad at all, but I pay close attention to any visible changes and act accordingly. I hoping I can save this fish without having to catch him out of the 125 gallon reef, to quarantine. For past experiences, it doesn't eat without having live rocks or familiar surroundings, so I am trying to avoid this. The fish still eats very well I feed once per day and it grazes an algae and other critters from the live rock. 
<you might try Metronidazole in the foods then (Seachem sells it in dry powder to add to food)>
Some mornings I offer pellets, Kent has a new brand for herbivores and carnivores, I mix those two, but he doesn't care for pellets. 
<Nor do I for the brand/type>
My tank has been set up for about 18mths and I have had this fish for a little over a year. Hope this better helps analyze my situation. Thanks a bunch. Gillian
<indeed... our very best regards... and do use the Quarantine tank if you must... really a very direct and appropriate method of treatment. Anthony>

Feeding Angels of all Sizes, Stocking Angels of all Sizes
<<JasonC here, Bob has gone diving>>
My flame angel was not accepting the brine shrimp I offered today, is this a cause for concern, or since he was just added yesterday, is it normal for them to not accept certain foods at first? <<or sometimes ever, but certainly not a cause for concern if the angel is eating other foods>> He did eat the angelfish formula two algae stuff though. <<you might want to try some "pygmy" angel formula as these angels eat a large amount of algae, and not so much the sponges like their larger cousins, the full-sized angels - like a Rock Beauty>>
What is, in your opinion, the principal food that a Rock Beauty should be fed in an aquarium set up. I read your article on the Rock Beauty which was very helpful and you listed a variety of foods, and was wondering what would be good to try and give him or grow in the aquarium for a 29 gallon tank. <<and the actual answer is "a variety of foods", there is no "principle" food. To keep your specimens looking good, you should always offer a well-mixed diet, you'll find these fish are open minded about different foods, just make sure they get some of the angel-specific [sponge loaded] foods mixed in>> (In about 6-7 months I will be increasing tank size to a 38 gallon or 55 gallon tank) <<As far as "growing" a fish, as long as you feed, they will grow. If you overfeed, they may grow too fast for these plans. Certainly a Rock Beauty will out-grow a 55. Cheers, J -- >>

More on Feeding Angels, Stocking Angels
Should I try to get live sponges? What kind of sponges should I ask for, is there a specific kind I need to ask for? How many sponges per week/day? Are there any formulas that or sponge loaded or do sponges come frozen? I must say I do not know anything about sponges, except that angels love them. <<don't bother/worry with live sponges. There are plenty of prepared, frozen foods specifically for Marine Angels which contain a good amount of marine sponge - Ocean Nutrition Angel Formula and Hikari Mega-Marine Angel are two that come to mind.>>
Do you think the 55 gallon would be good for 3 or 4 years for the rock beauty? <<probably not much more than a year, but will mostly depend on your feeding habits>>
[I plan to get one about the same size as the pictured individual (the picture from bob's article on rock beauty that he said was an "about perfect" specimen to start off with) <<perhaps perfect for an aquarium of appropriate size, not always perfect for you...>> or there is one that hasn't taken on its colors and is similar to the one bob said was "Only a little better, a two inch total length individual at a Los Angeles wholesalers. Still, a better, fuller, brighter specimen." Would it be better if I started off with the bigger individual in terms of it being easier to keep alive? or since I am going to have a 55 for a while should I go for the little one?] Thank you for your opinion.
<<if you read further in the same article it also says that a 55 is the bare minimum for the smallest specimens and that a 3-4" individual would require 100g or more. Do consider carefully whether or not you have to right facilities for this fish.>>

P.S. Jason, both angels were much more docile today, no rubbing against each other, the blue angel seems to have given his new tank mate some respect. <<for now perhaps. Were you planning to put a third angel in this tank? Again, please consider carefully your next move - you will soon have two angels which require 100g per fish... Good luck, J -- >>

Advice on Feeding
<<JasonC here. Very glad to see you made it to the forum...>>
How should I feed my angels using angel formula. I have the Flame Angel and I have Pygmy Angel Formula. I have been cutting half a cube and then putting it in a bag with a small amount of warm water from the sink faucet, and breaking it up inside the bag and then dumping the contents into my tank. Is this correct? <<Is one way and certainly not incorrect. I usually [in fact, I'm going to go through this as soon as I send this email] put out the frozen foods I am going to feed on a small dish, add vitamins that I am going to add, and then let it thaw open-air. In the warmer seasons I put it in the kitchen window, these days I make some toast and put the dish next to the toaster [radiates heat, right...] and then go walk the dog. Thirty minutes later, it's good to go. I then slice/crush the blocks like angel and p-angel formula into large bite-sized bits and feed some of this to the various fish, and then either save the remainder or give it to the dog [she likes this]. Anyway - I feed a small amount of this mix, once a day.
While I'm on this trail, I should also let you know that my Majestic Angel eats almost everything I dump in the tank - angel formula, pygmy angel formula, trigger formula, Mysis, brine, prime reef, sea veggies, Spirulina formula, etc, etc. The trick there is to provide a mix - which is really not hard - look at the ingredients on pygmy angel formula - it's a well mixed food. All my fish like pygmy angel formula, meaning you don't need to be a pygmy angel to eat it. 
With the Angel formula, you have read already that in the wild Large Angels eat a lot of sponges. Some more than others, but many of them survive on sponges. If you want a healthy angel, this means you have to make sure they get something with sponge in it every so often - but not so critical that it be the only thing they get. They will be happy to eat pygmy angel formula, Mysis, etc. and it won't be bad for them.
Flip side is true for big predators - meat eaters. They like meaty foods, but if you want them to look excellent and live long and happy, make sure they get something with algae in there once in a while. Mix it up!! Hope that helps/covers it. Cheers, J -- >>

Question: Bob, my wife and I have an adolescent Imperator who is suffering lesions induced from poor water quality. We were using a source which contained some metals for about 6 months. We've since switched to a cleaner source and have been using in for the past three to four months. However, over the time we were using the poor water our Imperator developed some severe lesions on and around is facial area. What is the best treatment to help him heal these wounds? We are currently using vitamin supplements with feeding. Also, he has stopped scratching completely since the change to the cleaner water.

Bob's Answer: Do check out that supplement packet and make sure it has boodles of A, C, D vitamins AND useable/assimilable iodine. Additionally, want to give a big plug for TMC (Tropic Marine Center, UK) new carbon product. This stuff is amazing and well worth utilizing for removing phenols, scatols and short chain fatty acids associated with HLLE (Head & Lateral Line Erosion) and general water quality lesions...