CA leopard sharks 1/5/07
Mr Fenner,
I'm not
sure how often you are asked about Leopard sharks,
<Too often my
friend... almost never are these animals kept in appropriate
circumstances by hobbyists>
or the areas your readers frequent, but
someone had forwarded me a link to your page, and I saw a few articles
about leopard sharks. I'd be happy to answer any questions regarding
the legality of different things kept as pets in California.
<Would
you mind us... am inferring this here... positing your email address?>
Specifically, fish that are native to California, although I could
attempt to help if there was a question about exotics, as we do restrict
some species.
<Thank you>
I do not want my email address made
public/posted, however you may contact me if you have any questions.
<.... what? By smoke signals?>
Leopard sharks must be 36 inches in
total length to possess in California, regardless of their source.
<Wow, I was unaware of this... is this a new advent? The trade sells
these at much smaller sizes... perhaps they're originating outside the
State>>
The only exception is if someone can show that they have had
it as a pet since 1994, and received written permission from the
Department to keep it. Thank you, LT
Hartman
<Again, thank you
for this input. If there is a further referent, some place to send folks
to re... Please send this address, URL along. Bob Fenner>
Re:
CA leopard sharks 1/5/07
Mr Fenner,
If
persons have questions or want more information they can go to the
Department's website at www.dfg.ca.gov
Most of the information they
would be seeking would be under the Marine Resources area.
<Thank
you for this>
They can also email the Department at
askmarine@dfg.ca.gov Feel free to make that email address available to
your readers.
<Will do so>
As for the regulations on leopard
sharks, the size limit was established in 1994/95. The illegal trade of
undersize leopard sharks is a Black market of sorts,
<Ahhh! As you
will realize, I am not a fan of keeping Triakis, most any other
Selachians in home-size systems... They don't live in such very long or
well>
and resulted in numerous arrests last year by the Department
of Fish and Game and NOAA. There is no exception to the size limit,
even if the sharks are brought in from Mexico of Portland.
<Really?
Good to know>
Possession of a leopard shark under 36 inches in
California is a Misdemeanor, punishable by a fine of $1,000 and or 6
months in jail. The section is Fish and Game Code 8388.5, available on
our website. Hopefully this will help keep some of them out of those
little tanks. Thanks, and feel free to contact me our
askmarine@dfg.ca.gov if you have any questions, LT
Hartman
<Again, thank you for your efforts. Bob Fenner>
Leopard Shark
<Greetings...>
Please, I have just gotten a baby leopard shark, about
eight inches. <Oh boy.> It is in a one hundred gallon long at about
seventy-five degrees. I know this is too warm and too small for him but
for about how long can I keep him? <like this? days, perhaps weeks. Even
if the tank were the perfect shape and size, without a chiller, this
shark is not in optimal conditions.> I have a custom filter with a 700
gallon per hour pump and a Fluval and both with carbon and one with
bioballs. I believe it is sufficient it has not let my down yet. <This
is insufficient going forward.> There is this PVC pipe in which the
water comes out on the top. Now I'm thinking that the leopard wont miss
a large tank so much because the water is being shot directly into its
mouth (moving water so tons of oxygen) and it is swimming into it. <Oh?>
So what I'm thinking is that it is sort of like a spinning wheel like a
mouse runs in. <this is no way to live, even a mouse has other places in
the cage besides the wheel.> It is swimming, not needing to turn around
and ton of air. The thing is it is swimming in one spot. Does that count
for it is always there and seems to be content. It isn't running into
walls except at night when the lights are off and I know its just
looking around. <And this is normal shark behavior... running into the
walls is a good way for your shark to get injured.> when it becomes
larger I plan to get a pond for it outside. <Do you live somewhere where
you won't have to heat and cool this pond? For most people, this type of
pond would be an extravagance - very, very expensive to build and
maintain.> I have a large enough estate so I can have about a five
hundred gallon all surrounded by walls and my parents were planning to
put a pond there anyway. I was thinking, for about two or three years,
will it be ok like that and not die mysteriously? <Too many variables to
predict, but if it dies under the current conditions it would hardly be
a mystery.> I have the tank covered and I am taking care of him. I
constantly watch him and if he is in distress. I am not the rich, so I'm
the guy that sees the temp, oh gosh too high runs to the fridge gets a
whole lot of ice, I mean A LOT and dump it in there. It seems to work.
<It might 'seem' like a good thing but I can assure you, this is not the
correct, or even advised way to keep a saltwater tank cool. If you're
squeezed for cash, you might reconsider your plans to keep this fish.
You must invest in a chiller.> So do you think my leopard shark will be
ok in its "water wheel" or will I have to speed up the creation of my
pond. <I don't think the shark will fare well in your current system,
but I also don't want to endorse your pond idea just yet. I fear perhaps
there is more in the big picture you have not yet seen.> (In order for
me to get it, I have to get straight As YAY) Also will stunting the
growth to it, to only three or four feet kill it extremely fast? <These
are not Bonsai trees - any attempts to 'stunt' the growth of a shark
will result in an unhealthy shark.> Or will it live at least ten years
or so, other words will it reach maturity? <I don't think so.> Or will
it die next month or something? <or something.> What are the facts on
this shark? <They are extensive - start your reading here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/coolh20sharks.htm
and then order the
Scott Michael book, Aquarium Sharks & Rays:
Click here to order! You will find these invaluable to accomplishing
your goals.>
I am fascinated by this shark and it has been my dream
ever since making my first salt tank to have this shark. (originally I
wanted a Blacktip, but lets face it, Leopards are easier and cheaper to
get) I love the way this shark moves and eats <I will quickly interject
here - you might better spend some of this energy to learn to scuba dive
so you can observe these animals where they live.> and I'm not willing
to let it die so quickly. <I'm sorry to say that sheer will alone cannot
keep this animal alive.> I truly do not want to be selfish in this act
and if it comes down to it, I will give it to an aquarium, NOT a fish
story (who knows what they will do to it) with my best regards. <Have
you consulted with an aquarium yet to see if they can even take it?> If
there is anyway I could keep this fish, just for a couple years or so
without shortening its short and valuable life too much, I will do it. I
keep it cool, but I need to keep it a bit warmer just for the idea of my
other fish. <bad plan.> I have a banded shark in there, but I plan to
give it up soon, just for the leopard and hope that it can survive in
the hell hole I have created for it. I know it is cruel and unusual, but
understand I keep this shark with the most love and attention a shark
can receive. <(sigh)... so why do you even have it?> Now that I travel
downstairs to get a drink, I just hope that you can respond soon to this
urgent cry for help. <Start reading.> Please be gentle, my soul only has
the best intensions. <Well... as they say, the truth hurts, and I can't
honestly tell you that you're doing a good thing. You need to do the
research first, then self-examine to make sure you can actually care for
these animals, and then self-examine again and sometimes leave the poor
beast at the store. Fish like these really should be left in the ocean.>
The reason why I bought him was because I had not read that stunting
growth can shorten its life. I thought it was like caffeine, you know
not shorten life, just shorten height. <no matter what, attempts to
stunt a shark are ill-conceived.> So please help, SOS, thank you from
Alvin Chan, and his leopard shark Max (not Max Chan, just Max)
<Alvin, please pick up that book, and please read the URL link I gave
earlier. Much for you to consider... a path will show itself. Cheers, J
-- >
Trade in of a cool water shark for a tropical
Hello
Bob,
Thanks for all the quick replies you have sent me I have the 125
with the leopard shark, stars and stripes puffer, and honeycomb grouper
since you say the shark will probably not last long in my tank I was
thinking trading him for a marbled cat shark or epaulette would one of
these be a better choice but my leopard shark is still doing great he
eats just about anything I put in the tank but I don't really want to
risk it dieing
<I agree with your point of view>
I just added 2
CPR Bak Pak protein skimmers and added 2 more MaxiJet 1200s all my water
perimeters are good ph-8.2-8.3 ammonia and nitrite are at 0 and nitrates
are at 25 so I was wondering after I trade the sharks and every thing is
normal again I would like to add an angel fish or something nice and 1
of my LFS has a 5-6 inch Koran that has been there since 3/5 and it eats
just about anything or I was wanting to purchase a 5 inch specimen from
the marine center what do you think?
<A good idea in my estimation.
Likely to add a great deal of color, interest to your system.>
Also
do the angels ever pick on the sharks <Yes... some species more than
others... of sharks and angels... but not a huge risk, worry> and if it
is not good for an angel I was thinking a Sohal and blonde Naso what
sounds better to you?
<I'd rather the Angel. More intelligent,
interesting behaviorally.>
and thanks for all the help you have given
to me
Pam Reinsmith
<You're welcome. Bob Fenner>
Coldwater Shark out, Majestic Angel in
Hello bob,
Yes I am
finally getting rid of my leopard shark <Mmm, why, may I ask?> and am
trying to find one more fish to put in my tank you suggested that an
angel would be okay in my 125 gallon so I am thinking about getting one
what would you suggest besides an Asfur or maculosus because they do not
get along well with my fish I was thinking an Annularis or emperor
something with a lot of color <These are fine fishes... my coverage of
marine Angels is on the WWM site> my LFS has a friend that has had a
majestic in his sump of his reef tank for about 7 months and he is still
doing great but he would like to get rid of him would a 5 inch specimen
be okay for my tank or is this not a good choice.
<One that has been
around this long is a "keeper"... I would buy/try it. Bob Fenner>
Thanks for any help you can give me and have a good day.
Ughh... leopard sharks
Bob,
<cheers, mate... Anthony Calfo
here while Bob weeps at the thought of another aquarist keeping a
leopard shark <G>
Hi, first I wanted to say that so far you have
helped me a lot with my banded cat shark and egg thus far…I have also
bought Michael's book as well…I just have a few questions not covered in
either …
<glad to hear of Bob/WWM of help as usual... and agreed,
Scott Michael's book is fantastic ("Sharks and Rays" I presume)
1: I
know that my banded cat shark egg is in its 4th quarter …and I was
wondering when will I know my shark is about to hatch
<not sure what
you mean by fourth quarter...month? Such eggs often take around 4 months
to hatch. Please do advise if I have misunderstood. Else, know that the
last several weeks before hatching the shark is packed tight in the egg
and doesn't move... quite natural during final growth spurt before
flexing muscles to spring case open. Please DO NOT open the egg case...
the shark is not dead. Also, please do read our WWM FAQ's on this
topic... covered quite extensively in other queries>
2: This is on
Leopard sharks…I am thinking on getting a 8”-10”
<ughhh! doubly
horrifying... first the though of keeping it captive with an adult size
of 6-9 feet long. Doubly because they hatch at 12-14" long... sometimes
longer which means the 8-10" babies so commonly seen are yet more
products of the abhorrent practice of catching a single pregnant adult
female and gutting her for her babies prematurely. All too common. Your
purchase of this shark would support this practice>
and I was wonder
how fast it would grow…I have a 200 gal aquarium and I was wondering how
long before I would be able to keep it….Thanx
<any discussion of this
animal in a tank under 1000 gallons is moot. Leopard sharks need huge
aquariums to support their fast growth and adult size (6-9 feet). Else,
they will stunt and die prematurely like most in captivity in tanks
under 500 gallons. Many/most will hang in seemingly OK for up to 2 years
before dieing "mysteriously". No mystery... tank is too small. Please do
NOT buy a leopard shark unless you have an aquarium fit for a zoo. Best
regards, Anthony>
Shane Isaacs
You were Right
(self-debasement re Leopard Shark loss)
Dear Bob, you were
totally and utterly correct. Not one week into and the next thing I know
the leopard has jumped out of a tank and into a Garbage Can. You were
right.
<I'd rather been wrong>
I feel awful and hope I can learn
from this. I know Leopards are not for "learning experiences" but I felt
more confident about fish before this and now I feel I know nothing. Why
could I have not predicted this? I am incompetent and all of you who do
not listen to this guy are too. I don't mean to be harsh but who ever is
even remotely thinking about a leopard shark, stop, PLEASE STOP
thinking. Unless you have a gigantic tank, no not a two hundred, not a
three, or even a four. NO DON'T THINK, don't do. Just keep to your
tangs, and triggers, forget this. You may want to have one in your fifty
gallon or your 100. I tried that, look at where I am now. Eighty-five
dollars short and heartbroken. I have had experience too. I have had a
tank for years. And if you think you can do better with a tank of that
degree, you may. But is it fair to the leopard to be forced into such
containment? Is it? No nothing deserves that, no one. If you admire a
leopard enough to buy one, then you admire it enough to leave it in the
ocean. I've learned my lesson the hard way, and I want you to learn it
from my experience. Don't think about what you think in your head. "oh
he's just a failure" or "I can do better" no, you cant. And frankly I
wouldn't approve of it. If you want to see one, get a year round pass to
the aquarium. Let them handle it. Then suddenly the population of
leopard sharks can grow back to its once great era. Then maybe on a
scuba trip out in LA you will see one. And maybe they wont be so timid.
Listen to Bob Fenner, he knows what he's talking about and at least he
has the consideration to let you know what you should do. You should at
least have the consideration to listen. Alvin Chan
P.S. Listen, who
knows how long they will live, if all people were like me.
Please,
don't.
<Use your experience to grow internally, and to help others.
Peace. Bob Fenner>
-Releasing a leopard shark off the coast of
Florida: yay or NAY?-
Bob, <Kevin here tonight> Thanks for all
of your information. First I would like to say I can't believe that
people are even allowed to sell/buy sharks to people without a certain
type of license. <Troubling indeed, and I'm sure the vast majority
receive inappropriate husbandry (namely too small and poorly shaped
aquariums) only to die shortly or lead agonizing lives.> I live on the
water in St Pete Beach Florida. I have sandy bottom 240 gallon tank with
nothing in it but a lion fish. I want to put a Leopard Shark in it. My
dimension are 96X24X24. How big can I keep
him till? And when he
gets to big can I let him go off my dock? <NOOOOOOO! First off, NEVER
EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES release a fish from your aquarium into the
ocean! Have you heard about the problems with lionfish showing up in the
Caribbean lately? Firstly, its a very bad idea to introduce non-native
species into the ocean because they may end up upsetting the ecological
balance. It only takes 2 to tango, and if someone else got the idea to
let their leopard shark go off Florida, they just might meet up.
Additionally, who knows what diseases and parasites from the pacific are
hanging out in and around this shark? Like people, fish can carry many
different diseases w/out being effected by them, the last thing you want
to do is introduce these pathogens into an ocean of fish that don't
carry the same immunity.> What are his chances of survival? <I'd say
about the same in the ocean as in your tank since this is not a fish
from tropical waters. Leopard sharks are caught near Cali in cooler
water, water too cool for your lion to handle. Forcing the shark to
tough out tropical waters will severely shorten its lifespan.> I also
want to put some live rock in a corner with some corals and some
different tropical fish and a snowflake eel. would that be possible?
<That would depend on your lighting and filtration setup, but live rock
is always welcome. Enjoy and PLEASE don't let anything go into the
ocean! :) -Kevin> Thanks, Michael
- Jason do you have a 4000
gal tank.....??? -
Jason according to your last negative and
patronizing response it sounds as if maybe I should have not rescued
these fish from my friends 180 gal tank??? <That's right.> I guess I
should of disposed of them immediately??? <Or perhaps offered to a
public aquarium. When they perish... what will the difference be?> Only
public aquariums are going to have a 4000 gal tank which is required for
Leopard adults! <That is correct, sir. These fish should never be taken
out of the ocean.> Juveniles have been proven to do well in as small as
300 gal enclosures! <And you expect them to stay juveniles for how
long?> I was trying to be a good human being, by taking them out of a
180 gal to a 800 gal tank. <My friend, you were mistaken. This is not
'rescue' - it is just delaying the inevitable. Besides... I was really
more concerned about the temperature of the tank. Again, if these fish
you really 'care' about, please consider studying them a little more -
perhaps go diving where they live - it's not 70 degrees there. So... you
are not doing them any favors.> However, if I was to take your Bull Shit
advice then they would really be better down the toilet!? <Sometimes the
truth hurts, but basically, yes - it's my contention they will end up
there eventually - sadly, most captive leopard sharks do.>
Scott Mc
Kirgan
Naples, FL
<Cheers, J -- >
This is disgusting -
leopard sharks
Hi, I live in California and would like to ask you
a serious question. There is a store in Brea (Southern California)
called Tong's tropical fish, this is one store of the many brother Ton's
fish stores here in southern Cali.
<Yes, I visit the one furthest
south (in Fountain Valley)... near Tommy's (fave chili-burger spot) at
times>
Well last week I went in and since this guy knows me fairly
well he should be what he had in the back in a garbage can. Leopard
Sharks! And what sucks is that they were all 8-10 inches around 15 of
them. I was shocked to read on this site that any fish under 12-15
inches is torn out of the pregnant females stomach! Well anyway the guy
that owns the store is a pretty nice guy, I just wish there was someone
I could report him to so that he would be warned into not selling these
creatures. Is it illegal to sell sharks this small?
<Mmm, no...
there are a few species of fishes that are illegal for fear of getting
loose in the wild... piranhas, splashing tetras... in California and
some at the federal level (the walking catfish for about the same
reason... desert Pupfishes as endangered species, some "State"
fishes...)... but no sharks as far as I'm aware>
Why the hell aren't
people caring at all?
<Some of the public will buy them... is the
reason>
I like to play stupid with this guy, I was told that I could
keep the baby leopards in my 50 gallon tank for two years HAHAHA! Yea
RIGHT, and I even got offered a cheap 30 bucks each for them. The world
is disgusting sometimes, this guy is no exception to a prick looking for
fast cash. Anyway sorry for writing so randomly, let me know what you
think.
<Thank you for your input. Bob Fenner>
Another
Leopard Shark...
I have a 500 gallon fish only and I would like
to keep a Leopard shark in the tank but I don't know where to buy them
can you help me?
<Hi Peas, Not too many people have the luxury of
having a 500 gallon tank. Why would you want to tie this up for one
fish? Sharks are best left in the sea or public aquariums. Most people
get them as a novelty and that soon wears off leading to "where do I
unload the shark. If you're really serious about this try contacting
Live Aquaria.com and inquire as to the availability of a leopard
shark. Good luck, James (Salty Dog)>
Leopard sharks
I
am very interested in purchasing some leopard sharks. However they have
been hard to find. Do you know of any pet shops or dealers?
Thank
you
Sincerely
Joel Clayton
<Not pet shops, but a few of the
online etailers of marine livestock sell Triakis. Please read re this
species captive care here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/leopardsharks.htm
and the Related
FAQs (linked, in blue, at top), and get back to me if you're still
interested, informed and equipped to keep this animal. Bob Fenner>
Re: Leopard sharks
Thank you very much! I had no idea it
required such a large tank!
<Yes>
I had seen them at a pet store
once and they had about 4 or 5 in a tank together. So I had made the
assumption they were able to live in a pretty normal sized tank as well
as sub normal environment. I don't think I will have the proper
equipment for a while. Are there any species you could recommend that do
not require as large an environment.
<The aquarium-suitable species
are covered in materials linked to where you've been reading>
Can
they be kept in slightly smaller tanks when they are smaller?
<Not
really... much better to start with adequate systems>
Also with this
kind of purchase do people usually set up for a buyer for when they
become larger?
<Very rarely... almost all of these animals perish
after short, dismal lives. Am glad you have saved yourselves and them
from such a fate. Bob Fenner>
Thank you
Sincerely
Joel
Clayton
