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FAQs about the Pomacanthus Angels: Health

Related Articles: Marine Angelfishes, Pomacanthus, Pomacanthus imperator (Emperor Angel), Pomacanthus paru (French Angel), Pomacanthus semicirculatus (Koran Angel), Pomacanthus maculosus (Yellow-Band Angelfish),

Angelfishes for Marine Aquariums
Diversity, Selection & Care
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by Robert (Bob) Fenner

Emperor Angel with sore mouth 11/6/17
Hi,
<Sagen>
I have an emperor angel who's currently being quarantined in Cupramine.
<Pomacanthids really don't like Cu exposure... Please see (read) on WWM re>
He's on his 6th day and doing well at 0.35ppm. He eats well, no heavy breathing, swims around as usual. However recently he has started to develop some kind of sore on his lower lip.
<I cannot emphasize how DANGEROUS this is. I would remove (use GAC likely) all copper and take great care that this fish is feeding, and having more cover for this fish to hide, feel secure. IF the mouth continues to be infected... this specimen will die>
Attached is a picture of him.
Bit shy of the camera however you can see his lips on the reflection.
Please help me identify what this is, the cause and how to treat while in Cupramine. Any help on this would really be appreciated.
--
Kind Regards,
Sagen George
<And you, Bob Fenner>

Pomacanthus, HLLE 4/26/17
Hello again WetWebMedia,
<Jason>
I really appreciate your site, it has helped me a lot in the past and I hope you guys can help me again with my current problem. I am currently in the possession of a 3 inch Annularis Angel that I purchased at my lfs.
He/She is currently in a 60-70 gallon QT. He/She has been with me for 4 weeks now and some time during the second week he started to develop White spots on his face.
<See this... neuromast destruction... HLLE>
At that time there was activated carbon in the tank to help the cycling.
<Jay Hemdal has recently written that he believes this (carbon use) is a/the principal cause>
The water parameters of the QT are ammonia at 0ppm, nitrite at 0ppm, nitrate at 0ppm, phosphate at .25 ppm and the water temperature is at 28 degrees Celsius. I have been feeding him/her different types of food Ocean Nutrition, Hikari and New Era. It does not recognize any frozen food or nori sheets. Then I left town for 8 days and came back to notice these white spots on this face. Then I noticed the bag of the activated carbon opened and spilled the carbon out in the sump. I immediately removed every thing and did a 20% water change. I am still
doing 20% water change every week. I have no idea what these white spots are if they are the beginning of HLLE, fungal infection or some parasite.
I tried to research on this but I have not seen anything that is similar. I have attached a picture of my Annularis for you to see. Thank you very much for your time.
Jason Bautista
<Please read here and consider the mentioned steps to HLLE reversal:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/HLLEF4.htm
Bob Fenner>

Re: Pomacanthus, HLLE 4/27/17
Thank you very much for your reply. I will read on the link you sent and hopefulily I can get my Annularis back on track
<The sooner you start... the better. I'd move this fish to the main display NOW. Bob Fenner>

Chrysurus angel problem 6/1/16
Hi guys it's been quite awhile since I have been on here...probably a good thing as all has been well with the 400 gallon.
Dilemma, I have had my 3 favorite fish ( clarion angel, queen angel, and chrysurus Angel) together for 2 yrs no problem, but out of nowhere my queen developed some sores on side and died within a week, at the same time my chrysurus has developed the same but is eating well and seems to be hanging in there despite open sores. As seen in the pics, hides a lot but comes out and feeds no problem....
Nitrates were a little high,
Ammonia was at .25 for unknown reasons
<Troubles>
And ph 8.4
All other fish doing well showing no signs of streets whatsoever:
(2 leopard sharks,
<Not compatible... is this Triakis? Cold water... Stegostoma? Get too large>
7" clarion, 3 4" hippos, 1 yellow tang, and bonded pair of yellow band maroon clowns that are 11 yrs old that lay eggs every 20-30 days.
Thank in advance for your time and assistance on this
Kelly
<Well; the blanched flank area... could be due to... bacteria (maybe Myco...) or an opportunistic protozoan, or... just/due to a physical trauma; environmental degradation... I'd move the sharks, boost your bio- and chemical filtration, the fishes immune systems via supplemented food, addition of vitamins, HUFAs and iodide-ate added to the water.... AND
consider having the area sampled and looked at under a 'scope: the only way to assess accurately what the cause might be here. Bob Fenner>

Re: Chrysurus angel problem 6/2/16
Thanku bob, I have had these 2 Triakis leopards for the last 4 years and many more over the past 10 and have had zero problems, I keep the temp at 72, living here in Los Angeles where they were obtained I have swam with these in 68 deg water so 72 isn't really a big jump for them.
once too large they go to my 1000 gallon in garage then to friends 4000 gallon after that.
<Ahh>
I do 90 gallon water changes every week, but missed 2 due to major elbow surg.
<Ouch!>
Water parameters are back to zero and they sides are def not due to injury.
It's on both sides of him.
I will try the suggestions but have no way in sampling to see what it is, do u recommend a certain hufa food?

Should I move to 1000 gallon and let him relax in a larger stress free environment?
<Yes I would!>
Thanku again.
Kelly
<Welcome. BobF>

Please help. Long term copper exposure; fluke trtmt. 6/14/14
Hi,
<Adam>
I am at a loss as I have had a fish tank with a Blueface Angel, Majestic Angel, Emperor Angel, two Ocellaris Clownfish and a Regal Tang. I had been treating for an outbreak of ICH some three months ago which had gone but left the Cupramine at 0.5 for several months
<Detrimental to have fishes exposed for such a long time to copper>
as I was hoping to add another fish. However the Majestic, BlueFace and Emperor became blotchy and twitching from side to side. I therefore did an 80% water change with fresh seawater fearing it might be the long term exposure to the Cupramine
<Yes; at least>
however the fish are getting worse. The Ocellaris and Regal Tang are totally unaffected and it cannot be Ich, flukes etc due to the Copper
<Uh, no... Copper does not effectively kill Trematodes. Read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/vermifugefaqs.htm
I would administer a purposeful Anthelminthic as gone over...>
and I would have thought if it was Ich the Regal Tang would be showing signs.
<Likely so>
I have had the Majestic and Blueface for around 18 months and the Emperor for 6 months so really do not want them to die.
<... sampling, 'scope use... The only means of effectively ascertaining what you're dealing with here. Perhaps pay for a download (on Amazon) of Ed Noga's Fish Treatment book for background and SOPs>
Any ideas please as I am stuck for a reason.
<A bit more reading>
Thank you in advance, Adam.
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>

Chrysurus Anglefish <sic> changing into adult colors. 8/8/12
Hello, I have a 3 and half inch Chrysurus Angle <angel> housed in a 220 gallon aquarium. It has just started its color chaining into adult colors. I have had this fish for 4 months. I is fed exclusively New Life Spectrum marine pellets. A week ago I noticed a dozen or so very very small white specks on both of its sides.
<Perhaps Trematodes... I wouldn't treat for specifically>
Its was purchased from Diver's Den. All my other fish went through quarantine and I have not had any signs of Ich in this system. Just curious if this is part of the changing into adulthood or ma possibly be a parasite?
<Can't tell from the material presented>
Its fins are clear, eyes are clear and breathing seems to be normal. He did have a mild case of lateral line disease two weeks after I got him. It seems to be clearing up though. Thank you for your time.
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>

Blue Ring Angelfish 1/15/11
hi my name is adam
<Adam... where's your grammar!>
i have a every nice blue ring anglefish in my 180 gallon fish only tank.
he got alot
<No such word my young friend>
of rock work and over hangs to hide and that is all he does all day long.
untill he smells food comes out to eat. and then goes back way does this fish not swim at all, and or does it swim at night when im sleeping.
<Summat is not to this fish's liking here... Likely not enough tankmates to break up the environment, and/or the decor doesn't afford it a sense of security. Have you read on WWM re Pomacanthids?
Bob Fenner>

Annularis/Pomacanthus Health 7/13/10
Hello gang, love the website.
<Hello Jamie and thank you.>
Lots of hard work on your end I'm sure, appreciate the diligence. My question is in regards to an Annularis Angel
that I recently purchased. I've had her/him for a week or two now. At first the little fellow hid all day except to eat, which I know is common for them. After a few days it began to swim more and seems to now be fully acclimated to the tank. All signs seem to be good; eating well, feeding, color, etc. Water parameters are all in range with pH being 8.2, no Nitrites or Ammonia, Nitrates in the 10-15 range. However, I just noticed the other day what appears to be a small white spot or growth in the center of the side of the fish. It's about the size of what you'd see with ich, except it's just one spot. I'm thinking it may be a small scrape or wound, but it hasn't gone away for 3 or so days now so I'm wondering if it's something else. Would you recommend doing anything at this point other than observing? Diet has been mixed with seaweed, Formula Two, frozen angel food, Mysis - all enriched with Vita Chem. Thoughts?

Thanks!
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Jamie
Annularis/Pomacanthus Health 7/13/10
Thanks James.
<You're welcome.>
I am working on a picture to send. Was going to with my first post but haven't been able to catch her while she's "still", so to speak.
<No problem. James (Salty Dog)>
Jamie

Annularis Angel with skin problem 4/7/10
Hi WetWebMedia,
<Hi Alex>
I was referred to you concerning a problem with an Annularis Angel (Pomacanthus annularis).
<Ok>
On the end of his body, before the tailfin part.
<Caudal peduncle?>
He has a bump with what seems to be another little bump.
<Mmm>
The best description I could give is, it's look like a wart or a cold sore but without the redness and everything. I received it from the wholesaler 2 weeks ago and he wasn't displaying that. It appeared in the last couple of days.
<Can you provide more info and a couple of photos? Specifically the size of system, it's tank mates and water parameters. There are a few possibilities, including a mechanical injury caused by animal incompatibility or not, a parasite or Lymphocystis. Try here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/lymphfaqs.htm
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/isopoda.htm >
Thank you for you help
<No problem>
Alex B
<Simon>

Ailing Angel: Looks like Lymphocystis 3/2/2010 Lymph ID
Hello Crew,
<Hi Kirby.>
I know you've heard this a lot, but I have to compliment you all on a fantastic site.
I use the information on a very frequent basis, but as is human nature, sometimes I still learn things the hard way, however your advice has saved me from myself more than once. .
<Thank you for the kind words.>
Onto the fishy business: I have an angel that the LFS claimed was a juvenile 6 line angel.
The angel was in a 10 gallon bare quarantine tank for 2 weeks, and all appeared well before I moved it to the main tank. While acclimating it to the water in the main tank I gave it a Methylene blue treatment for about 20 minutes, just as a precaution.
The angel was ok for he first couple of days then I notices some patches on the rear section of it's body. I thought it might have been irritation from rubbing against the numerous Vermetid worms in the tank, the spots on the body seemed to clear up, but now it has several spots that I can only describe as looking like cysts. these look like little egg pouches or something. I have looked at a lot (not all) of the information from the WWM pages, and have not encountered anything that fits this description. I do believe it is some type of parasite, but so far (I don't think it's going to stay this way) none of the other fish are showing any signs of infection.
<The pictures are a little hard to make out, but it looks like Lymphocystis A viral infection similar to warts and seems to be more common on angelfish than others. Have a look here and see if anything looks familiar:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/lymphfaqs.htm >
I've attached some photo's to help identify the ailment, and maybe confirm the fish's identity as well. the fish too. Let me know if any of the pictures need to be clearer, sometimes the picture compression process does things to the image quality.
I know that I probably should get this little one into a hospital tank, but I haven't had time to try to get him out. My experience is that I need to practically tear the tank apart to get a fish out, if there's one piece of live rock left in the tank, all the fish will find a way to hide under it.
By the time a fish is easy to catch it's usually too far gone to be able to be helped. So I'm looking at about a full day to tear down and put back together the tank to get the fish out. The wrasse is the hardest since he hides in the aragonite. Could you help identify what the angel is afflicted with, and how I can treat it?
<If it is truly Lymph it will clear on its own in time.>
I'd really hate to lose this new critter, it looks so nice (when it was healthy) and I also need to know what it is, since it's probably going to happen to all the other fish too.
<Lymph is non contagious.>
The tank parameters are as follows
180 gallon main tank, 75 gallon sump,
SG 1.023
calcium 400
ph 8.3 to 8.4
nitrates, nitrites, ammonia, phosphates all practically not measureable.
Sorry for the long message, but I find its good to provide as much relevant information as I can.
<Detailed information is always appreciated.>
I appreciate your assistance, so will the critters I'm sure.
<My pleasure.>
Thank You,
KP
<MikeV>

Gill growth I wrote to you several days ago about what appeared to be gill inflammation in my juv. Chrysurus Angel. It now appears to be a growth of some kind. <Is this growth asymmetrical, growing out and beyond the fish's gill area? Perhaps some sort of tumorous problem... and difficult to assess or do much with... except optimize conditions and hope for remission...> The growth is reddish and is now extending below the fish's gill. The fish is still eating normally and behaving normally. Should I remove him from the tank? Change his food? Pray for the best? I just don't know what to do. I was wondering what course of treatment would be appropriate. Below is the information that I sent in the first email. As far as diet goes, what exactly is the best diet for the Chrysurus. Information on this species is limited. He likes to eat anything we put in the tank. Ocean Nutrition's Formula One, Prime Reef, Spirulina Formula, Lifeline's green formula for herbivores, brine shrimp, Mysis shrimp, plankton, krill, the dried green seaweed sheets, and his favorite, live ghost shrimp. Should we add or remove anything from his diet? He is a voracious eater, and is not picky. <A mix of all you are offering and more is fine.> All of the other fish are ok now. No signs of Ich at the present time. It is time for a water change, and I would like to know if you think it is alright to remove the copper from the system at this time. It has been about a week and a half since the copper was added. Thanks for the help. Dena Andrews >>

Asfur Angel I have a 5" Asfur angel in a reef. Its anal fin was deteriorating, but has stopped and is getting better. Now I'm dealing with Ich, and cloudy eye. And one of the eyes has a pale ring around it. I'm thinking it might be pop eye? Any help would be appreciated. <This is almost always a very sturdy species... From reading about your specimens condition, I'd closely examine the make-up of the systems water, set-up and maintenance. The root/base problem/cause here is not Ich, not infectious, but the system itself... Bob Fenner>

Question on Blue Ringed Angel I introduced two new fish to my aquarium about a week ago. <Without quarantining?> My Blue Ringed Angel seems to be breathing heavily out of one gill and not the other. He would not eat frozen brine (usually not a problem) but did eat some Spirulina. I am worried about Oodinium which has devastated a previous tank. <That or gill flukes, but considerably rarer.> Would you add maybe a 20 percent dosage of copper or wait for more signs? <If you do decide you need to medicate, you should always follow the manufacture's recommendations. Partial dosages are usually not effective.> All other fish appear to be eating and I do not see much aggression among the other fish. Any recommendations? <Remove infected fish to hospital/quarantine tank for additional treatment/observation. -Steven Pro> Will Cuellar
Question on Blue Ringed Angel II Thanks Robert, this is California so a hospital tank is a nice luxury that would cost a ton. (Power cost) <No need to be run 24/7. Can be drain and put away when not in use. All that is needed is a sponge filter tucked away in your sump or display for transfer to the quarantine/hospital tank when needed.> This being said, I do not think its Oodinium. The fish looks like it has a swollen abdomen and the others are good. I did remove it to another friends tank. <Was his tank empty, or is it now infected with this mysterious ailment?> We are going to try neomycin. However, I am being told that fish usually never make it from the swollen abdomen. This obviously is an internal problem. I have heard this could be because the capture of the fish. Have you seen any fish recover from this, what do you think it could be, and is neomycin the correct medicine? <Neomycin is an antibiotic and would be appropriate for a bacterial infection. Nothing comes to mind for symptoms of a swollen abdomen and gill problems. I have seen a case of a nonsymmetrical swollen abdomen which turned out to be cancerous, no treatment possible, but verified with a postmortem exam. My best advise is to get a copy of Dieter Untergasser's "Handbook of Fish Diseases" and work your way through the easy to follow Q&A/flow chart for diagnosis. -Steven Pro>
Question on Blue Ringed Angel III last question (Friend actually had a hospital tank) <A good thing to have handy, a fish friend and a hospital tank.> where could I get a post mortem? I am curious and wish to know more. thanks for the recommendation on the book. <Here are two more for you. "Diseases in Marine Aquarium Fish" by Bassleer and "Aquariology: Fish Diseases and Water Chemistry" by Gratzek and Matthews. I like Untergasser's better but these two are nice also. -Steven Pro>

Re: Injury to Blue-Ring Angel Thank you for the personal response! I fed him this morning and he's eating just fine. One more question: Should I feed him Anti-Bacterial Flakes from Tetra just to keep him safe? <A good idea. No harm> It was half his lip and a very small portion of flesh below his lip. Do you advocate the use of vitamin C and what do you use on your fish for injuries such as this? I also read that puffers get more aggressive over time, is this true? <In general, yes> The Annularis is the dominant fish. They are the only 2 fish in the tank besides 3 big blue-leg hermits, 2 conchs and 1 Astrea snail which I can't believe the puffer hasn't eaten yet (he is very docile for a puffer) <Most are and remain so in captivity... given foods they enjoy on a regular basis... the Puffer will/would first eat the invertebrates.> Tank Parameters: 75 gal. long tank; pH 8.2; Amm., nitrites and nitrates nil; lights on 11-12 hours a day; protein skimmer runs continuously; dead coral for decoration; minimal algae but tank doesn't look "sterile"; phosphates are less than 10 ppm; <Believe, trust you mean/t nitrates> KH 125 MG/L. That's about all the info I have right now. If you need to know anything else just let me know. Thank You for your valuable time and expertise. P.S. What are your thoughts (if any) on Sano? My LFS. really tries to push this stuff for problems with fish. I've been in this for about 20 years now (I'm 34 now) and it really has advanced especially in collection procedures, for me less interference always seems to work best. Also, I do water changes every 2 weeks. <Have heard good things about this product, but don't use it. Bob Fenner>
Thanks Mr. Fenner, Thank You for helping me out with my Blue-Ring Angel (he had his bottom lip bitten off), He's totally healed up now and looks as great as ever. <Ah, outstanding! Good to hear/read of the recovery. Bob Fenner> Happy Holidays, Gary

Pomacanthus chrysurus Hi Bob, Its been a while since I have needed your advice, I guess that's a good thing. I have a question regarding a new addition to my tank a Pomacanthus chrysurus (from Africa), I got this fish from the Marine Center about 2 mths ago. It was about 2 inches when I received it and has grown about an inch since. While in quarantine, it developed a bad case of Lymphocystis. It's whole body was covered and I was skeptical if it would make it, any way with water changes and vitamin supplements (Selcon and VitaChem), it has recovered quite nicely. My only concern is that disease affected one its eyes, and it appears as though it has Popeye. I am sure its not because I can see signs of the disease still on the eyeball. <This too may well resolve> The eye is swollen, and I am wondering if the fish could be blind in that eye. <Possibly... but as stated... may self-cure> The other signs of the disease have been absent now for the past week and I was wondering if the eye just needs more time since signs of the disease are still present. <Yes. Agreed> Do you think the swelling will go down once the disease is gone or do you think the fish could be blind as a result. Is there any way I can help besides continuing to offer foods with vitamins. <Not really... some folks might suggest adding other adjuncts to boost nutrition (HUFAs for instance) or Epsom Salt treatments... but time going by will likely do> The fish is still in quarantine and I think I will keep it there for until it gets bigger as the stock in my display tank would hassle it (imperator angel in particular). Please advise. Thanks Gill <I'd place in the main system with live rock ASAPractical. Bob Fenner>
Re: Pomacanthus chrysurus Thanks for reply, I hoped as much. The only thing is my imperator angel now changing over to adult colors and gave the chrysurus a hard time the first time I attempted to transition the fish to the main system. <Yes... these two may well need separate quarters or a very large hobby-size system (several hundred gallons) to co-exist> I had read of a similar scenario on WWM and you advised that the fish be put the main system, so I tried this, but felt cruel as the imperator was so hostile to towards the new fish. <Less cruel than permanently being in quarantine... the improved, more consistent water quality afforded in a larger system with live rock will/would likely spur recovery> I took the fish out after about 10 minutes. I figured being of like coloration and species was the problem. Also the imperator is about 6 inches and the chrysurus in about 3 and possibly blind, do you think I should try again. <Not unless this is a very large system (see above)... or you have another system to place it... similar marked/colored Indo-Pacific Angelfishes generally do NOT mix> I could tolerate the new fish begin hassled for a few days, but I don't want the imperator to kill it, since all odds are against the chrysurus. There are plenty of live rock and caves, but the imperator showed signs of aggression I have never seen in it before when I placed the chrysurus in the tank. I was thinking of keeping the chrysurus in quarantine until it got some size, <This will make no difference... unless the system is huge> but would much prefer to have it in the display tank. The bottom line is I didn't do my research and I am having some compatibility issues here. <Yes...> Any hope for these two living together? <Not much. Bob Fenner> Thanks again
Re: Pomacanthus chrysurus The system is a 125 gallons, but I am planning on getting something no smaller than 360 gallon when I move in a year. Could this be a temporary fix to the problem, considering everything else. <Again... unfortunate... not likely. I might try mixing the two Angels together one more time... following this stated protocol: catch out the larger resident specimen, place/exchange it with the Chrysurus... move, enlarge spaces with the live rock to "open" the structure in the Imperator's absence... wait a week and recombine the two in the morning, with the lights off on the system, around the tank... or when you can be around for a few hours to keep watch...> My only other option is to set up my 55gallon and place the fish until I get a bigger tank. My preference is to use the 125 gallon for now. Do you know of instances where these fish have killed each other or is the hostility temporary. Please advise. Thanks <Many instances of damage and death. The aggression never ends, but can settle into tolerant occasional jousting. Bob Fenner>

Daddy's Little Angel... Hello to all of you, I received my early Father's Day gift today, my second Blue Line Angel. <A great gift- and a beautiful fish!> I lost my other about a month ago to a bad case of Ich. I communicated with Anthony during my trying to cure him and found out that I may have contributed to his early death. I noticed early on that he had started to breath rapidly so I gave him two FWD's w/formalin then put him in a hospital tank with copper on day three. He progressively got worse and died shortly thereafter, Anthony indicated that perhaps my error was the administering of the copper. For my clarification, I was under the impression that just pygmy angels were sensitive to copper and the large angels were more tolerant. Can you clarify? <I think what Anthony was referring to was the dosage of copper...This medication must be administered very carefully, and regular testing must be done to assure that you are using a proper therapeutic dosage (not toxic, and not too dilute). If dosed without testing, the copper can have deadly effects...> After a three hour drip acclimation my new 5-6 inch angel is in a 18 gallon quarantine tank. He has a reddish pimple like bump on his front lower lip but does not look like an abrasion or blunt trauma. I didn't want to subject him to a FWD after his long journey thinking I could wait another day after he has settled in. <I understand your reluctance to subject him to another, possibly traumatic, experience. However, why get him settled in for a day, and then subject him to stress again? If it were me, I'd do the dip ASAP, and get this stressful stuff over with sooner, rather than later (assuming that a FW dip is in order for this malady). On the other hand, without a pic, it's hard to visualize what this bump could be...parasitic or something else...? You'll really have to do some research on this on the WWM site to get a positive ID. In fact, before ANY treatment is undertaken, you'll need to really get a feel for what this is that you're dealing with...> I filled his tank with water from my display tank and had the foam filter block in the sump for a week to a week and a half, do you think the foam block was in the sump long enough to be properly "seeded"? <I think so...And, if need be- you can always add a bacteria "culture", such as "Cycle" or "Fritz Zyme", to help supplement or "kick start" the filtration if you are experiencing ammonia or nitrite readings..> Last thought/question, HA. I'm thinking that I should just keep a close eye on him rather than subjecting him to a FWD and or medication. Any thoughts? <We're on the same wavelength, dude! Observe and analyze, then treat, if required. Take it slow and careful, but be prepared to react quickly and decisively if the need arises...> Hey there Anthony, if your listening! Steve Suniga <Here is your shout back from Anthony, channeled through me.."<G>"...Good luck with your new angel! Regards, Scott F>

grey angel with weird growth. Poor English, Lymphocystis 1/3/07 could <Could> you please help me identify and treat my grey angel, <.> i got him from marine depot <Marine Depot> live and have had him in my fish only 75 for 2 months he had no signs of this growth when I got him. the growth seems to be on his fin and lip. thanks <Looks like Lymphocystis to me... Read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/lymphfaqs.htm and the linked FAQs file in the series linked above. Bob Fenner>

Blue Ringed Angel... hlth. - 7/23/07 Hi Again. I Just bought a 3-4 inch Blue Ringed Angel yesterday and have him alone in a 29 gallon QT tank and will be putting him in a 135 once QT is up in a month. He looks good but his left fin he wont use? Besides being damaged by a net what else can cause this? <A type of behavior thought to provide avoidance of predation... "Don't eat me, I'm sick"> I used your search and didn't find anything when I typed in Angel wont use left fin. Also still seems scared and wont eat seaweed or krill yet. Didn't notice this when I bought him. I love the large Angels and would love to get one to thrive. I was told the Blue Ringed are very hardy? <Amongst the generally hardiest> I haven't had much luck with them after trying with a Koran and a Emperor. My girlfriend thinks Im pryraniod. I just cant seem to get these guys to do good. Thanks for the help! Rick <Mmmm... better for you to read re these species... and all others... in advance of trying them. Please see on WWM. Bob Fenner>
Re: Blue Ringed Angel Help -- 07/24/07 Hi Again from Florida I wasn't paranoid after all. The blue ring angel I bought 2 days ago did have something wrong with him. His left fin he wouldn't use and got worse and this morning I gave him a dip in formalin 3 <... toxic> because he looked very weak and was told to try this because it was some sort of fungus. <If someone told you to jump off a bridge...> I read your articles on Angels and you advised not to use formalin as a ongoing treatment but a dip only. <Correct> Mucus came off the fin and parts of the body after the dip. Is this a fungus? <Highly unlikely> I want the fish to make it but don't know if I should treat with antibiotics or copper or both at the same time? <? For what?> I didn't think he was going to live through the dip but did. He's slowly swimming now and stopping and laying against a rock now and then. Im very discouraged. All my water levels are great and have no problems with my Lions, triggers, wrasses, clowns that I raise but as soon as I buy a Angel or Tang they seem to get sick and I never make it past the QT stage. Im not ready to give up and have learned so much from your site.. Thank You <... environment... Compatibility... Read re these and the species you intend to keep. Bob Fenner>

Chrysurus Angel Sick, sel. -- 10/18/07 Hi Crew I need help again please. I bought chrysurus angel about a month ago. He's been great eating well chasing my clown here and there and what have you. The last week his side fins are turning white cloudy and inflamed at the base <Not good> and now he's hiding alot. <No such word> I don't see any signs of Ich or velvet. He did eat 5 minutes ago. He's a big fish 8 inches <Too large to start... a big part of the issue here...> in a 220 gallon tank with few tankmates. 1 clown and a damsel and a Coris wrasse. They all have no interest in him. I paid alot of money for him and it is my dream fish. Was hard to find. Am not sure how to treat and was going to let it run its course but seems a little worse everyday. He does rub on the rocks here and there and also another thing he has like seizures? Like twitching. His body looks good otherwise. I have done searches on your site and have read the angel section but cant quit find what's wrong. Any help or thoughts would be so much appreciated. Thanks In Advance. <Do you know the origin (country) of this fish? As stated, for the genus and species, this specimen should have been left in the ocean... too difficult to ship, adapt at this age, size... What you are seeing is likely "just" resultant from capture, handling... Hopefully this fish will recover on its own here. No treatment is advised but good care. Bob Fenner>

Re: chrysurus Angel Sick 10/19/07 Thanks for the fast response. I'm not sure of the area he was collected from but I thought they only came from off the Kenya coast? He is gorgeous otherwise. He was at the fish store for about 2 months and I guess nobody wanted to spend 160.00 on him <Likely the "freight" for this specimen was more than half this...> but from what I have seen I thought was a bargain. He was great at the fish store and stooped there 4 times in 2 months and always ate and looked great. The only difference is my SG is 1.20-1.21 while there's is kept at 1.15-1.16. <Both too low> Said they use that for parasite control. <Mmm, yes, and to save on salt mix, allow for greater/easier gas diffusion...> I have already taken your advice and will let run its course. He is still eating great and I have increased my water changes to twice a week and not sure what else I can do. My wife is waiting in the background to say I told you not to spend so much on a fish. How long should I wait to take any action do you think? <What action?> It does not effect any other fins. His color is great also. I will try to get a good pic to you today if I can. Do you think its fungal or a bacterial thing? Any knowledge you will share is always appreciated.

Re: chrysurus Angel Sick 10/20/07 The action I mean is if it gets worse under ideal water conditions which are pretty good now? 0 nitrites 0 ammonia 5-10 nitrates 8.2 PH, not sure if I should treat for fungus or bacterial? <...> I think its bacterial. I noticed today after looking close that when he opens his pectoral fins it looks white on his body where the fins lay against. Not sure if that was there but I'm afraid it will spread. Thanks Again <... Please read... on WWM re infectious disease and marine fishes. B>

Re: chrysurus Angel Sick -- 10/20/07 I did read through tons of your site as I stated it still left me somewhat unsure. I'm sure its bacterial or fungus but with the blood spots I would have to lean towards bacterial. I started treatment today with API triple sulfa <... had you read... you would NOT be doing this> in a QT tank and will let you know how it works out. If I read to much more to much time will pass and so will my fish. Thanks <I understand... but isolating this fish, leaving it in a quarantine or treatment tank will not get you toward improving its health. As stated, only time, good care will possibly resolve the white rings around the pectoral fins... NOT an infectious issue... Bob Fenner>

Re: chrysurus Angel Sick -- 10/21/07 Yes I understand but its getting worse everyday and today there's blood showing but he still ate but not with the vigor he once did. <Yes... but this has little to do with a treatable state/infection...> Didn't want to take a chance and I guess I'm desperate and just want to give him a chance. <...> Even though I did get a deal on him its still a ton a money to me. Plus its the 1st one I have seen at a LFS and I have a ton around me in the Tampa FL area. <Still an inappropriate/too large specimen...> While I was browsing your site I read on one of the questions that the Meg <...? Mag?> pumps are over rated on there gallon per hour. Reason I'm asking is I want to improve the water quality as much as I can like you stated and I was looking over my hole system and never really knew what my little giant pumped per GPH so I looked it up. I was surprised to see it pumped only 500 GPH @ 1ft head height. Well overflows are 1200 gallon per hour so I was thinking about getting a Mag 12 or 18. I don't want the 18 to pump so much my sump goes dry because the overflows cant keep up. I have been using the little giant for some time now and have been happy but I want to get the most out of it. <... please see WWM re pump selection. Please look before writing...> I also went and bought a refractometer and was surprised to see how far off my swing arm hydrometer was off. I'm very devoted to my fish and hobby and your site is so helpful I even tell the guys at the LFS about it. So much info you go in there for one thing and get tied up with a ton of different things. If I can get him to pull through I'm going to try a DSB I stumbled upon your site for nitrate control. Thank You Again <A shame we did not chat before your purchasing this specimen. Is the source willing to take it back? There is little chance of it adapting to captive conditions... BobF>

Angelfishes for Marine Aquariums
Diversity, Selection & Care
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by Robert (Bob) Fenner

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