Urchin Clingfish Advice – 08/31/07
Hi Guys,
<Kirsty>
I got a call from my LFS asking if I would take an Urchin Clingfish from them. I had previously been researching these little fish but could not find much info, apart from females having longer snouts, that juveniles rely more on urchins, but as they grow older, they rely more on commensal shrimp eggs, burrowing bivalves, copepods etc for food, and that generally, these poor fish tend to fade away and disappear in aquarium situations.
<About all I know as well... this and their association with Diadema spp>
I have only had my clingfish for 5 days, but so far, have had to feed him 3 nights in a row in a bag!! I do not net him, but hold the bag under the water line and wait for him to come to the surface and then gently herd him in to the bag. He is a very friendly fellow and has even attached himself to my arm and just sat there, so I sincerely believe I am not stressing him out when I do this. I am offering him lobster eggs and frozen Cyclop, both of which he hoovers up well.
<Neat!>
I decided to feed him in this manner as unfortunately, I believe he was wild caught,
<Assuredly>
and I found out that the place that my LFS got him from tend to keep their livestock in really small holding "tanks" before they are sold on. Because of this, when I previously put food in my nano for him, even with the skimmer turned off, he would miss this food and not appear to feed. Since I have been bagging him, he also appears much more lively and "fatter" - if a clingfish can look fat!
<Good technique>
I am also currently trying to fashion a feeding box for him to see if I can teach him by association to enter this box to feed, and in this box, the food will not get blown away by water movement and always be visible for him to eat.
Can you offer any more advice on these little fish, such as feeding and if they fare better in numbers? (I do not intend to get an urchin due to the small size of my nano and through fear of the toxin release into my tank if it died).
Thanks in advance,
Kirsty
<What little further we have is here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clingfishfaqs.htm
and the linked file above. Am hopeful that you will record your observations, speculations, and share them with others. Bob Fenner>

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice  9/1/07
Hello Bob,
<Kirsty>
thank you so much for your reply as to my questions.
<A pleasure to chat with you>
Well, he was waiting for me to bag him last night when I got home, and therefore, ate well again last night! My feeding box is nearly ready to start the association training as he obviously learns very quickly, I think I will be on to a winner here! I'm going to try other food items, and am trying to source some mussels or such like, that I can leave in the tank for him to take a nibble off from time to time. Would you think this would be a good idea?
<A refugium would likely be better... with a DSB, Macroalgae... for ongoing culture, supply of live food organisms>
I'll definitely keep you posted as to my observations, as if this helps anyone keep these great little fish happy and alive, I'll keep writing! Should I just collect some more info and then email it across?
<I encourage you to consider an actual article... Which I will gladly help you place... Do make photographs to go along with if you can>
Thanks again Bob,
Kirsty
<Again, welcome. BobF>

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice  9/1/07
Thank you so much again Bob.
<Welcome Kirsty>
I got a call from my LFS just before I left work saying they had a female urchin clingfish, and would I like to have her. Of course, I said yes as at least I feel I can keep them well fed now. I asked the caller how he knew it was a female, and he said it was because she had a shorter snout.....having read the information on Wetwebmedia, I would think that this would be a male? It will be interesting to see the difference between the two, if any.
Ah! a refugium! Thanks Bob, a great idea. I'll see what I can make, but don't know how feasible it will be with my type of nano due to the strange rim on it - I'll not give up on the idea anyway as its a great one!
It certainly appears that this little fish notices food on surfaces much more than floating food which has really got me thinking.
Thanks again Bob, I'll try and get photos and an article of sorts going - its been a long time since I did anything like that so wish me luck!
Kirsty
<I sense a long and distinguished "content providing" carrier potential here... BobF>

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice  9/2/07
Hi Bob,
<Kirsty>
sorry, I know I said I'd keep my notes and get back to you, but just wanted to let you know about my further observations today. I'm excited, so had to share it with someone!
<Well, all right!>
New clingfish collected today and whilst acclimatizing in the bag, my first clingfish spotted it in the bag. Straight up to the bag, trying to get in, acting flirtatious and then changed colour!
<Have seen this sort of interaction with coastal species (we live in San Diego) in tide pools...>
The yellow stripes went a browny orange colour. Once the second clingfish had acclimatised enough to release from the bag, my first clingfish was dancing all around it, curving its tail upwards and constantly fanning; I do not know if this was "courting" behaviour or territorial as the other clingfish was having none of it. I also do not know if this then makes my first one appear male or not, as at the moment, apart from a obvious difference in size, (2nd one larger), it is hard for me to see any obvious difference in snout length. The second clingfish also appears much more shy;
?to do with the fact that it is the second clingfish in the tank?
<Likely so...>
?or being hassled by the first?
?or just generally more stressed?
<Who can say?>
This one did not want to eat in the bag whilst acclimatizing.
<Not surprising eh? Must be very traumatic>
Secondly, my feeding box mark 2 is a success! My first clingfish spied it, nosed all around it and then swam straight in through the hole on the floor I created. It fed, then swam out again. 3 more times after this it entered the feeding box and fed.
<Great>
Sorry again for prematurely contacting you, but I am very excited and sincerely hope that the second clingfish will follow suit.
Speak soon Bob!
Kirsty
<Be chatting! Bob Fenner>

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice 9/6/07
Hi Bob,
<Kirsty>
hope you are well and happy?
<Yes, thanks... though the coffee is too caffeinated and music too loud at the S*bucks am using the Net at currently>
Sad today as I had to return the second urchin clingfish to my LFS today, but at least it had a full stomach.... My first would not stop hassling it, and was really quite aggressive, so yesterday I had to separate the two which is not easy in a nano. I made another box to keep it safe over night, and whilst it was in there I introduced some lobster eggs and shredded brine shrimp which it ate with gusto. I kept it in the box overnight and offered more food this morning which again, it ate. I had not at any point seen it take food whilst free in the tank.
<Too bad you don't have another system>
Ok, I know I will have a few photos to send to you re the "feeding boxes" I have prepared etc, and possibly the odd really simple diagram of how to make one, but wanted to impart a little more info on what I have observed as the more available, the more it will help people decide if these fantastic fish are for them, or if hopefully these fish will not be wild caught and maybe, hope against hope, that someone will be able to breed them. If I had more money I would dedicate a tank to these guys and learn more...if only!
<Ah yes>
Observations on Urchin Clingfish so far;
Not stressed by human interaction
Feed from surfaces - actually look and hover around food before deciding to take it. When they take food it is with a stabbing motion. So far, they do not show interest in taking food from mid water.
Their mouths are uniquely shaped, overshot upper jaw, almost pointed at the tip, undershot lower jaw with an obvious gap when mouth closed - assumingly to feed from urchin pedicallariae, commensal shrimp eggs etc. (A quick in, jab and out action!).
These fish, when placed in a suitable feeding box within the tank will eat to their hearts content.
They learn quickly to utilise a simple feeding box, preferring to enter the box from below, and will visit this box several times a day.
They will mouth different food types, but will spit out any types not preferred - as do most fish!
Likes so far; lobster eggs, finely shredded brine shrimp
Not sure so far; Dragon Feeds size 0.5ml, frozen Cyclops which I think is too small to be of interest?
Dislikes; too early to tell
Going to try; live mussels, (once I've sourced some that have not been treated and are hopefully parasite free), frozen shredded mussels and upping my pod cultures.
Semi aggressive to aggressive fish. Query because of same sex?
<Gots me>
And query because of me having a nano and very small territory! Whilst able to observe the 2nd clingfish in its temporary box, the snout shapes were visibly similar although a definite size difference between the two was visible, assumingly down to age.... I could be wrong! I am currently trying to collect as many photos as possible of clingfish to see if I can denote any difference in snout length. So far, I have found appx 2 photos of possible males, (due to the sorter snout length?) out of appx 80 x photos.
I'll send you some photos soon of my clingfish using its feeding box and let you know how cheaply I made it and out of what. Initially, I was being too complicated in my ideas and the simplest ones turned out the best. I will keep observing and keep reporting back on these wonderful fish as and when I think I've got something interesting.
Sorry for being a pest, and please never ever stop what you do with WetWebMedia, you guys are a source of information and inspiration to us all,
Kirsty
<Not a pest... thank you for sharing. BobF>
 

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice   9/12/07 Hi Bob, <Kirsty> I trust you are well and that the coffee is not too bad?! <Java this AM not too bad, thanks> Thought I'd send you a couple of pics of my urchin clingfish using box number one. Prototype number two is tidier looking and only slightly different, but going to make a third with some other changes to see how that goes. This little fish is doing great, and now when he rests on the glass I am happy to say that you can actually see where his abdomen ends and his tail starts! <Ah, yes> It was such a shame I could not keep the second, but due to lack of aquariums, (I only have one!), and space, (no room for another!), it was kinder to take him back to the LFS, otherwise I am sure my first would have eventually killed him, or, through the sheer fact of harassment, he would never have eaten. Although, as I mentioned in my previous email, I am sure this second fish would have learnt as quickly as the first to use a feeding box. If anyone has a larger tank than I have, they can be placed very inconspicuously within, and food placed in them a few times a day in order for them to feed. I've siphoned old food out through a small tube, but would recommend cleaning them thoroughly at least every few days. If you think its worth it, and will help, I will take pics of the 3rd box and submit diagrams, just tip me the nod! <Please do send along> Sorry the pics aren't clearer, and sorry you can't see the food being taken. Speak soon, Kirsty <Be chatting! BobF>

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice, sexing and pix! 10/2/07 Hi Bob, <Kirsty> I trust you are well? <Yes my friend, thank you> Thanks so much for your correspondence and your encouragement, I will definitely have something for you to read through and help me with in the near future. <I look fwd...> I went to my LFS yesterday and they had 2 urchin clingfish in stock. I could have cried; they were so thin. Thin to the point that their abdomens were concave. I wish I could have taken them with me when I left.......I now believe I can visually tell the difference between male and female just by looking at them. I hope this is not just wishful thinking, but I believe the two at the LFS are the same sex as mine, and I believe mine is male. I have attached two photos of what I believe are the opposite sex, the female being the one with the longer snout. I've spent an age trawling through photos and the two I've attached are just a couple showing what I believe to be an obvious difference. I have many more but won't bore you with them! <I am in agreement with your assessment> Thank you again Bob, I wish I could meet you in person! <Likely someday, perhaps soon. Do consider coming out to the pet-fish conventions... "clubs of clubs"... many of us (WWM et al.) convene at these... Do you dive/SCUBA?> Hope the coffee manufacturers are being kind to you, <Or pick coffee? Heeee! An incidental/occupational hazard visiting on the Big Island for every half year. BobF> Kirsty

Re: Urchin Clingfish Advice 07/27/07
Hi Bob,
<Kirsty>
long time no speak!
Many apologies for not being in touch for a while, things have been pretty hectic for me recently.
<No worries>
Re your question about if I scuba; sadly I don't. I'd love to but money stops me from being able to....well, the lack of it anyway!
<Mmm, save up... "attention is narrow perception"... focus on what is more/most important. Something to shoot for in the future...>
I'd love to come out to one of the conventions, but again, due to lack of funds, coming to America is not an issue. Also, who would look after my beloved little reef and of course, my two dogs?!
<Oh... yes... You're in the UK... Well... one never knows>
I have a week off work soon and have a small upgrade planned for my little tank. I'm planning everything thoroughly so as to try and be less stressed on the "big swap over" day. I know its going to be hard work and stressful but at the same time I'm so very much looking forward to it.
<Ah, good>
Back to my urchin clingfish; he's still doing great. He's still extremely healthy and well fed, and I'm still on the lookout for a female.
I'm hoping that on my week off I'll be able to make some headway with the write up, and I'm pleased to say that my boyfriend announced today that he has bought a remote shutter cable release for his camera so we'll be able to get some much better pics of the fish and box etc.
<Ah, very good indeed>
Hope you are well and happy Bob,
Kirsty
<Thank you my friend. BobF>

Clingfish FAQs   7/17/06
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/clingfishfaqs.htm
This is what I have found about the feeding of the Clingfish
I personally feed the inhabitants of my nano tank which now includes a Yellow Striped Clingfish, Brine Shrimp and baby Brine Shrimp
Environmental Biology of Fishes
Publisher: Springer Netherlands
ISSN: 0378-1909 (Paper) 1573-5133 (Online)
DOI: 10.1007/BF00004787
Issue:  Volume 34, Number 1
Date:  May 1992
Pages: 95 - 101
Sexual dimorphism and food habits of the clingfish, Diademichthys lineatus, and its dependence on host sea urchin
Hiroko Sakashita1
(1)
Department of Marine Sciences, University of the Ryukyus, Nishihara,
Okinawa, 903-01, Japan
Received: 16 August 1990  Accepted: 5 March 1991
Synopsis  Stomach contents of the clingfish Diademichthys lineatus, 10–56 mm standard length, revealed changes in food habits with growth and sexual
differences. Soon after settlement, D. lineatus obtained food from their host sea urchin (genus Diadema) and other associated symbionts. They became
less dependent on the host with growth. The juveniles ate pedicellariae and sphaeridia of the host and commensal copepods, whereas the adult fish ate
burrowing bivalves in corals as well as tube feet of their host and eggs of a commensal shrimp. The young fish were transitional in their food habits.
The change in food habits of the fish coincided with behavioral changes; i.e. enlargement of home ranges and less dependency on the host. The adult
females, having a longer snout, ate shrimp eggs and bivalves more frequently than the adult males, which ate tube feet of the host more often than the
females did. Sexual difference in food habits was apparent after the sex of the fish became identifiable by comparing snout shapes. The polygynous
mating system of this species suggests that conspicuous sexual dimorphism might have developed under sexual selection. However, niche partitioning of
food is also likely to be related to this sexual dimorphism.
Key words  Gobiesocidae - Symbiosis - Nutritional dependency on the host - Sexual dimorphism - Niche partitioning  _____
The references of this article are secured to subscribers
Olaf
<Thank you for this. This family is becoming one of the "darlings" of the public aquarium trade. Have you seen the system/demonstration in Monterey? Bob Fenner>

Re: Clingfish FAQs   8/17/06
I still have my Clingfish and it is doing well. Once in a while I notice it picking on a hermit crab.
<Yes... I suspect these fish/es eat these in the wild>
I feed my nano inhabitants brine shrimp and baby brine shrimp (frozen cubes). I also raise Amphipods and Copepods in a 6 g nano. I sometimes take a few out and put them in my 24 g nano.
24 Gallon Nano Stock List:
FISH
Six-Line Wrasse
<Keep your eye on this>
Royal Gramma Basslet
Court Jester Goby
Yellow Stripe Clingfish
Hi Fin Red Banded Goby
Tail Spot Blenny
INVERTS
Scarlet Skunk Cleaner Shrimp
Peppermint Shrimp
Blue Leg Hermit Crab
Scarlet Reef Hermit Crab
Emerald Mithrax Crab (Mithrax sculptus)
Red Mithrax Crab (Mithrax spinosissimus)
Porcelain Crab
other unidentified crabs (3)
Marble Starfish
Sand Sifting Starfish
<I would remove one or both of the above... too infaunal predaceous>
Micro Brittle Starfish
Small Fan Worms (Tan, Striped, & Purple)
Cerith Snail (Cortez & White)
Astrea Conehead Snail
Banded Trochus Snail (Black body and tan body)
Bumble Bee Snail
Pacific Nerite Snail
Limpet
Mexican Turbo Snail
Stomatella Snails
Strombus Snails
Chiton (very small)
Purple Lipped Mussel or clam inside a 1" hole through the live rock.
Lettuce Sea Slug
Majano Anemone, Anemonia majano
Coral Polyps Green & Orange
Pacific Green Spotted Ricordea
Few Unidentified Polyps or Anemones (Discosoma bryoides (?))
Peanut Worms
Reef Bristle Worms
Copepods
Amphipods
MACROALGAE
Caulerpa prolifera (large leaf)
Caulerpa brachypus (small leaf)
Caulerpa bikinensis (cup)
Caulerpa racemosa (grape)
Red Dictyota
Wire Algae
Green Bubble Algae
Sea Lettuce
Neomeris annulata
Ogo
Green Hair Algae
<! That's a lot of life in a small volume! Bob Fenner>

Clingfish questions 
Hey there.... 
<Hello to you> 
God this place is just heavenly!!!!!!!! A place for all keepers to familiar with for sure. I'm proud to be a "reader" here and I hope you guys are more than thrilled being the actual people behind this site. Kudos to each and every one of you. 
<Thank you my friend> 
Now.......My inquiry is in regards to my Yellow Stripe Clingfish, AKA: The Urchin Clingfish-- Diademichthys lineatus. 
<Ahh, an unusual species, family of fishes to be sure> 
I've attained him from ordering him/her from LFS in my area, and was thrilled to get him/her after doing all the reading I could about them, even though mind you, there is close to nothing regarding their care and dwelling in the home aquaria. 
<I have seen some really innovative exhibits... my fave the upstairs "children's" area of the Monterey Bay Aquarium where they had a tall tube tank with a button for draining the water... with the Clingfish holding on to the sides... different species of course> 
He is doing great, active displaying his health and not over- active displaying signs of stress. Such a truly amazing species, one I wish was made available more often as well as reported in home aquaria more often in regards to care, feeding and the likes. 
<Do you have this specimen housed with urchins?> 
Saying all of the above.  To my knowledge, at feeding time, which is twice a day, I never see him/her take anything.  Frozen Cyclop-eeze, PE Mysis, Spirulina Brine and I've even tried blended and mashed Cyclops, yet to my own sightings, still no feeding. 
<May well be eating "miscellaneous organisms" from LR, sand... during the night> 
I know that in the wild they will usually more often than not be found with their host, the long spine urchin....and that they will rely much as clowns seem to with their host anemone. 
<Yes> 
I've read that they can be kept without an urchin, no urchin in my tank.  I've read that they will accept frozen meaty foods as mentioned above. None accepted. It has also been said they, although not too often available for purchase, do fare well in the home aquaria. 
<Unfortunately I have no captive experience with this species.. and Paul Mansur (who has voluntary time in public aquariums) is temporarily "out". As long as you don't think, see that the specimen is overly thin I would not be concerned> 
I was hoping you could lend some more information on this species, as there is NOTHING more with all of my searching and the likes, that enables me to read up more about my little buddy, Velcro! 
<Hee hee! Good name> 
He may just as well, be eating pods, isopods, amphipods and such, but nothing that I have taken notice to. I certainly didn't purchase the clingfish until I read all I could that was made available by me searching for it on the web or what was available in the libraries. I felt secure enough that I was going to house the animal in a realistic and fair fashion and so proceeded to invest in him/her. 
<Good for you and the planet> 
I would appreciate your advices and input on the feeding situation as well as some more information on the species as well. 
In closing my system is 
>29gallon all glass 
>1 fridmani Pseudochromis 
>1 yellow clown goby 
>1 green clown goby 
>1 Banggai cardinal 
<1 urchin/yellow stripe clingfish 
>1 Engineer goby (quickly outgrowing the system, catching him should prove to be stressful for both parties!!!
>Numerous species of shrimp including, skunk cleaners, Sarons, L. wurdemanni, L. rathbunae, a species of anemone cleaner shrimp (unidentified thus far) 
>no sump and no fuge 
> Eheim professional 2 canister model 2028 
> AquaC Remora with maxi12 and pre skimmer box 
> 35 pounds maybe a little over of LR 
> 2.5 inches of LS 
> 130watt PC CSL lighting, all daylights, no actinics running. 
> Macroalgae, "string of pearls" (unidentified). shaving brush, Caulerpa prolifera, species of Codium, two other species of red macroalgae unidentified as well although thought to be species of Gracilaria... 
"Tank" you for your time....I look very forward to hearing from you guys..... be well. Tank on! 
<I would continue the offerings and observations as you have. Bob Fenner>

The Urchin Clingfish
Hi,
<Hi there! Scott F. with you today!>
i recently purchased the clingfish Diademichthys lineatus from liveaquaria.com.  Its mouth was absolutely tiny. I did not see it eat. It flitted about my 125 gallon reef for a week or two then disappeared.
<Unfortunately, this seems to be a rather common occurrence with these fishes!>
I noticed on your website that it is associated with the diadema urchin. Is this a fish that should not be kept? I hate getting anything that is doomed to die in my tank. Of course, I should have researched it before I purchased it. if you have any advice regarding its care, I would consider getting another one. Otherwise, I'll pretend its a Moorish Idol and leave it in the ocean. Thanks,
John Kim
<Well, John, I have a friend who has purchased several of these specimens over the last few months, with similar results to yours. The fish tend to disappear over time. Based on the rather limited hobby information that I have found regarding this fish, I'd have to say that success is a rather hit-or-miss affair. According to the great reference, fishbase.org, this species does consume some copepods, zooplankton, and other benthic animals. However, this may be a specialized feeder that has difficulty making the switch to captivity. Perhaps it's association with the Diadema urchin is a clue- or a requirement for success? I suppose the best results could be achieved by housing the fish in a very well established aquarium, connected to a thriving refugium (for production of natural plankton). Even then, it's possibly a matter of luck! I'd probably defer purchasing this fish, myself- at least until it's dietary needs in captivity can be more thoroughly understood. Since you have the fish, do experiment, and be sure to document your experiences, so that you can add to the limited body of knowledge. Here is the fishbase link with information on the fish that you may find to be a good starting point:
http://fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.cfm?ID=12891&genusname=Diademichthys&speciesname=lineatus
Good luck! Regards, Scott F>