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| FAQs on Tap/Source Water Use for Marine Aquariums,
Rationale/Science Related Articles: Treating Tap water for
Marine Aquarium Use, Water Purification
Using Reverse Osmosis,
Related FAQs: Treating Tapwater 1,
Treating Tapwater 2,
Treating Tapwater 3, & FAQs on New Water
Treatment: Chemicals (Chlorine, Chloramines, Trihalomethanes...),
Filtrants, Techniques/Tools,
Testing, Troubleshooting,
Products by Manufacturer/Brand,
DIY Treatment Chemicals/Tools,
& Reverse
Osmosis Filtration, Specific Gravity, Water
Purification Using R.O 1. RO/DI 2, RO/DI
3, Nitrates, Water Changes,
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Water Quality
I've been using an RO system for my water in my reef and everything is fine.
My Question is when setting up or maintaining a reef is bottled water just as
good? What's the difference between the RO I'm using and the bottled Drinking
water some people have delivered to their house?
<Mmm, there is a huge variation in what goes as "bottled water"...
a good deal of these products are reverse osmosis run tap... The biggest
difference to me is cost. Bottled water is hundreds of times more money than
make it yourself RO... not counting gas et al. to get it, the time and trouble
to lug it about. Please read: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/water4maruse.htm
Bob Fenner>
Thanks Dean Mikulla
Re: Water Quality
Thanks for the help. I'm working for a Maintenance company and I'm kind of
the "reef guy". I know how to take care of my own reef ,but it's in
the living room of my own house. Successively Taking care of reefs that I'm only
at twice a month is my newest problem. Thanks again for the advice. Dean M.
<Having done this myself for years (though years back) I can/do empathize...
always a "holiday" to re-visit accounts. We had reef systems on a
minimum of once a week schedules... often two, even three times visits a week.
Bob Fenner>
It's The Water!
A while back I think I remember you advising someone to buy water
labeled "drinking water" from Wal-Mart, etc. to use in
their saltwater aquariums if they were on well water or had otherwise
unacceptable tap water.
<Hmm?>
Does water labeled "drinking water" contain chlorine?
<I'm not sure if there is some FDA standards that water needs to conform with
to be labeled "drinking water", but I'd hazard a guess that most water
bottled for human consumption contains some chlorine, and possibly other things
that are not so good for fishes.>
Would I still have to dechlorinate it?
<I'd err on the side of caution. Frankly, I'd look for a source of reverse
osmosis water, if you can. "Drinking Water" or "Spring
Water" are rather vague descriptions for our purposes. I'm sure that the
water would work if you use a water preparation product, such as Kordon's Amquel,
and maybe run a filter with some activated carbon in the water before it's
use>
Also, is saltwater poured down the drain harmful to septic systems?
<I'd definitely check with your septic system service first on that one>
Thanks very much. Linda from the sticks of South Carolina
<Hope that I was able to clear up a few things, or provoke some more
questions! Take Care, Scott F.>
Water Workings
Hi
<Good Evening! Scott F. here>
I know you get this type of question all the time, please bare with me. I'm
about to begin the process of owning a salt water aquarium. For now, my question
is regarding water. Treating tap water with the products from PetSmart pet store
for the initial setup is a good idea. If so which products should I use? Can you
give an suggestion?
<Really depends upon the type of water that you have, pH, chlorine/chloramine
content, etc. In general, its a good idea to start by testing your tap water for
nitrate, phosphate, and possibly silicate. Concentrations of heavy metals, such
as copper, may be present in tap water in certain areas. If you're going use tap
water, ideally, you should use a commercial dechlorinator product, such as
Kordon's Novaqua or Amquel, and filter the tapwater with activated carbon. See
the link http://wetwebmedia.com/water4maruse.htm for more information on
treating tapwater.>
If not which type of RO filter should I purchase that would be adequate for
keeping reef and fish aquarium. There so many types 1-9 stages filters. It very
confusing.
<There are many possibilities, depending on your pocketbook and the degree to
which your tapwater needs to be treated. Usually, a 3 stage RO/DI system is
sufficient, but there are all sorts of add-ons to remove undesirables like
silica, etc. More expensive, but less wasteful than RO is a deionizer, which
produces great quality water with no waste. best to consult with your local
water department to get an H20 quality report, then decide what system makes the
most sense for you. Check the resources on the wetwebmedia.com site for more
details on RO/DI, and other water pre-treatment methods. Good luck!>
thanks you very much
<You're welcome!>
Tap Water
Thank you for your help with my past questions.
This question concerns Tap water and my 55 gallon reef tank. We have hard water
in our area (Jacksonville, Florida) I have tested our tap water and it turned
out surprisingly good. No nitrate or phosphate. Is it safe to use (once
dechlorinated) in my reef tank? I am trying to encourage coralline algae growth.
Thank you, Andrew
< My pat answer to this question remains the same: Yes, in all cases where
you would drink and cook with the tapwater, it is fine to use in marine/reef
systems. There is more solids, nutrient base, sources of pollution to be had in
salt mixes, foods, decor, ordinary aerosols in the area around the systems than
the incidental possible negative chemical species in tap water. There are some
areas in the U.S. and abroad where I would not use the tap for drinking or
pet-fish... There I would utilize reverse osmosis filtration.
Bob Fenner>
Out of function Water Conditioners, retail in general
Now you have me feeling real guilty. Every time I go to work now, I wonder
what the hell I am doing. I work at the LFS. I just read one of your articles on
De-chlorinators "water conditioners". I know you could not give names
on the web site. But please tell me what the phony brands of conditioners are. I
do not want to sell these any more to my customers.
<Good for you... look for the ones that "only" have sodium
thiosulfate/ sulfite in them... these won't work on chloramines... like the old
Weco products (which we're great in the years of chlorine use as a disinfect of
tapwater>
We have so much **** in my store. I probably suggest and sell 10% of the junk we
sell.
<Ahh! Time to identify and trade out, discount, get rid of anything that
doesn't turn (sell of course) at least four times a year (unless it's more of a
display item... like tanks, stands perhaps)... Free up your working capital,
save space, and your peace of mind!>
You have been most helpful and I have truly learned much for you and the Wet Web
Media crew. And, If you have time could you explain how the so called
"slime coat enhancers" work (or don't work for that matter) in these
dechlorinators? How do they affect and eventually kill the fish?
<Some are "simple coaters", adding a bit to the proteinaceous (non
cellular) coating on fishes (more slime), others spur the fishes to produce a
bit more mucin... they're transient in effect... analogous to a band-aid you
might put on a child's cut... and don't kill the fishes. Bob Fenner>
Thank you so much
Water Prep...Some Things Are Best Done Yourself - 06/21/06
Hi Crew, how's tricks?
<<Hiya Debi!>>
I have been reading a lot to find it and see no specific answer to this question
and am pretty confused at this point so I decided that I should write.
<<Mmm okay, let's see if I can help...>>
First here are the parameters: Six months old 46 gallon Bowfront reef with one
frogspawn, one xenia, one lawnmower blenny and one sand sifting goby (who sifts
his sand onto the live
rock),
<<A big reason I prefer Amblygobius species for this...not so bad with "crop
dusting" the top of the reef>>
one cleaner shrimp, various snails and red- and blue-legged snails
and crabs.
<<Snails with legs, eh? <grin> >>
50 lbs. live rock, Ammonia-0, Ph 8.2, Alk 3.0, Calcium 440, Phos (reads 0)
probably being taken up by algae,
<<Yup>>
Nitrate-0, Nitrite-0, SG 1.023
<<I would raise the specific gravity to natural seawater levels (1.025/1.026)>>
Temp 79-80, Aqua-C Remora skimmer HOB going 24/7, Seio 620 Power Head,
Aqua-Clear Power Filter running Chemi-Pure and Phos-Ban, also has a sponge that
is cleaned every few days. My problem is with my water preparation. I buy my
water from the LFS, both salt and RO/DI for top off. After much reading I am
afraid I am not doing it correctly.
<<Oh?>>
I don't do anything to it before using either one.
<<If the LFS has prepared/stored it correctly you shouldn't have to>>
I just put it in. Sometimes, actually most of the time, I hold the water for
several days before using it, especially the top-off water.
<<Aerated during this time?>>
Am I supposed to be preparing it in some way like aeration or buffering before I
use it?
<<Ahh, okay... Firstly, let me suggest you test this water for
alkalinity/calcium/pH...test it right after purchase, and then again after at
least 24 hours with aeration. This should give you an idea of whether or not
the LFS is "maturing" the water before sale. But anyhoo... Yes, I would aerate
this water for 24 hours before use...and buffer "as needed" based on your test
results>>
I have consistently sort of low Alkalinity even though I add either B-Ionic
2-part or baking soda to try to get it up higher.
<<Odd>>
The calcium is usually around 440 and this is without the addition of the 2-part
of any other type of calcium.
<<Hmm...seems artificially high for freshly mixed seawater. I wonder if the LFS
is boosting (or overdosing, in this case) with a calcium chloride
supplement? Which might also be suppressing your alkalinity>>
My pH is usually about 8.1 to 8.3 or 8.4 toward the evening.
<<All good>>
I would like to keep it around 8.4 at the lowest.
<<Often a difficult endeavor, but dosing Kalkwasser may help here>>
I also have a raging hair algae problem and have no explanation for this.
<<Mmm, let me make an amendment to my earlier suggestion...in addition to the
afore mentioned tests of the water from the LFS, add tests for nitrate and
phosphorus>>
I have tested the LFS water that I use and it shows no phosphates
<<I really should start reading ahead...>>
and since I am not really feeding at this point due to my lack of fish that need
it I don't feel that nutrients are a problem, although I also recently have some
brown on the sand that I assume is diatoms.
<<Likely so>>
I have no idea what can be causing all this algae.
<<Something in the water would be my guess...how do you feel about
filtering/preparing your own?>>
I do 15% water changes weekly, so far as vacuuming the sand, I go back and forth
on that and so have only done it once in the
six months I have had this tank running.
<<Not usually necessary with vigorous water movement...in my opinion>>
I tend to get mixed advice on whether or not I should be vacuuming. The sand
bed I have is only 1 to 1-1/2 inches in most places.
<<With this substrate depth I say "up to you!"...though a bit of vacuuming with
water changes may prove helpful with your current algae situation>>
So I want to know if I should be doing the water differently and do you think it
is making a difference in my alkalinity, calcium and pH?
<<Yes, yes, yes...and yes>>
Also if you have any more suggestions on the algae problem I would love to hear
them.
<<Have you read here (http://www.wetwebmedia.com/avoidingalgaeproblesm.htm),
and among the indices at the top of the page?>>
Thanks,
Debi
<<Quite welcome, EricR>>
Water Prep...Some Things Are Best Done Yourself II - 06/22/06
Thanks for the reply.
<<You're welcome>>
Yes, I think I may have read everything on this site, well, I obviously couldn't
have, but it sure seems like it.
<<Hee!...truly "gads" of information to be found here>>
I have spent many many many hours reading what you guys
<<gals too!>>
have to say and find it most helpful.
<<...but...>>
In answer to your question on my filtering and processing my own water. I
really have no place to do that as I have read that the RO/DI systems are very
slow and I have no faucets I can dedicate to that.
<<Mmm...it is true the RO systems are "pokey" (even my 100gpd system requires
"all day" to fill a 55g drum), but a "dedicated" water source is hardly
required. A simple adapter can be utilized to attach/run the unit from "any"
faucet as/when convenient. Another option is to use a quality Kati-Ani
deionization unit which produces filtered water at a much greater rate than an
RO unit>>
I live in a large metropolis area and have a choice of LFS to choose from and
have used at least two of them in this endeavor.
<<Yet you are still having issues...>>
As you see I have tested their water, both of them, for phosphates, not
nitrates.
<<Might be worth a test for NO3>>
But, I do not aerate their water and did not even know it was something I should
do until now. Yes, I do hold it on a regular basis for several days with no
aeration. So I gather I should not do that?
<<I doubt this is cause for all your water ills, but aeration will be beneficial
for increasing oxygen, better mixing/maturation of "raw" seawater, and blowing
off carbon dioxide (and possibly raising pH as a result)>>
I don't see what that could have to do with the algae though.
<<You stated yourself, you have no fish/don't overfeed...if the source of algae
fuel is not the water, then what?...your rock?...your substrate?>>
So here is my plan based on what you have suggested. I will do several 15%
water changes, say two to three days apart. I will vacuum the sand
substrate. Is it acceptable to scrub the rocks of the hair algae while they are
in the tank?
<<Using the hose to siphon away the algae as you scrub?...sure!>>
The worst ones can't be removed without tearing down the tank and disturbing the
two corals a lot.
<<understood>>
I have given thought to getting a "sea hare", would that help.
<<Genus Aplysiidae? Possibly...and much more so than the more commonly
available Tridachia crispata aka "lettuce nudibranch". Though I have always
found the sea hare to be prone to physical damage and its subsequent demise. A
better biological control might be Turbo fluctuosa, the giant Mexican turbo
snail...or even one of the Salarias or Atrosalarias blennies>>
I recently changed LFS water suppliers thinking that would help, but I swear it
got worse after that, so I am going back to the original.
<<Hmm...>>
This particular one uses Seachem Reef Salt but only keeps it at 1.022.
<<A fine salt brand>>
I was thinking I should add salt to bring it up to 1.025, would that be better?
<<Yes>>
Also, let me make sure I understand. The RO/DI water should be at the correct
pH before it goes in the tank?
<<It should...else the water in your tank has to make up for the deficiency...if
it can>>
What is the best way to bring up the pH and should the alkalinity be brought up
also?
<<BOTH should be adjusted. I like Seachem Reef Buffer...and for economy, I have
found that "cutting" this with 3-parts sodium bicarbonate to 1-part buffer is
quite satisfactory>>
I don't think the LFS is adding anything to their salt mixture other than the
salt itself. The current one uses Seachem Reef Plus I think. The former used
Fritz?.
<<Mmm, not familiar to me>>
I really appreciate your help as I am just about to throw this thing out the
window thinking that would at least get rid of the algae. Maybe you can help me
come up with a better solution.
Thanks again,
Debi
<<I want to help Debi, but you haven't mentioned anything to raise any flags to
me other than I think your water source may be suspect. Are you adding any
liquid coral foods?...other "supplements" you haven't mentioned? After reading
through the data on nuisance algae on our site, what's "your" take on the cause
of the algae problem?...let's discuss further if you wish. Regards, EricR>>
Water Prep...Some Things Are Best Done Yourself III - 06/24/06
Thanks for your patience and willingness to keep at this.
<<Quite welcome>>>>
I have indeed read everything on the algae subject and am truly stumped. I
thought at first, a couple of months ago, that I was getting to much bad stuff
because I was adding the frozen food and its juice when feeding.
<<A small contributor...in my opinion>>
I used to have fish, well I had two clowns, one royal Gramma, one yellow tang
(but he only lasted hours so I think he was sick when I got him), and a
six-lined wrasse.
All died mysteriously and at different times and after being in the tank for
various times from a few days for the Gramma and the wrasse (different times) to
a few weeks for the clowns, (that died at different times after just going
downhill for several days and then keeling over).
<<This is telling...either you have more serious issues with your water,
something in the system is poisoning the system (something in the rock or
substrate maybe), or your source for these fish was/is bad (did all the fish
come from the same LFS?)>>
Several emails to your site and several people trying, but never got an answer
to that.
<<Do consider my previous statement...thinks about any links/correlations to the
dying fish>>
All agreed that my tests were right on target and I was apparently doing
everything right, but obviously something was bad.
<<Have you tried new/different brand test kits to validate your findings?>>
So, I decided not to add any more fish until I had let it sit just the way it is
for several weeks and until I got the algae problem under control.
<<Smart...is best...>>
It has now been about five weeks since the last clown died and the blenny and
the goby and the corals have all been here all along and seem to be doing
perfectly fine.
<Hmm...did the blenny and goby come from the same source?...did they come from
the same source as the fish that died?>>
The only things I could ever come up with is that being new and not thinking I
know I had perfume on my arms at least once when I was messing around in the
tank and decided that maybe I had poisoned somebody,
<<A possibility...>>
and once I cleaned up a Cyano problem and let a lot of get mixed into the water,
again inexperience, and shortly after that my clowns got sick so maybe that was
something.
<<I don't think this killed your fish>>
Otherwise I have not a clue. So, back to the original problem. My suspicion is
that it has to be the water, but when I test it tests fine.
<<Maybe something you haven't/can't test for>>
I take it to the LFSs and they all say it is great.
<<Again, maybe something not tested/can't be tested with hobby kits. Have/can
you confirm that they/you store the water in suitable, clean, chemically inert
containers?>>
I have no temperature fluctuations, I know this because I
have the heaters on a controller. My lights are on for 12 hours total, the
actinics come on one hour before the main lights and go off one hour after the
main lights do, so actually 10 hours of main lights.
<<is fine>>
I have the Coralife 2x96 compact fluorescents w/lunar lights. I do regular 10%
weekly water changes and top-off as needed. It's true I am not feeding anything
to speak of right now. The only extra nutrients are the very occasional (less
than I should I think) addition of 10 ml. DT's for the frogspawn and every few
days a few Mysis shrimps (probably 10 or 15) for the shrimp that
he practically eats out of my hand so maybe 4 or 5 individual Mysis shrimps get
away.
<<I doubt also this is your problem. But an observation here...the DT's is of
little use to the frogspawn. Being a carnivore it will much prefer the
Mysis/diced
meaty foods. I would discontinue dosing the DT's...at least till you have need
of it (clams/gorgonians)>>
So I don't know what to do. I do wonder though, if everything
is normal now and for some reason wasn't before would the hair algae that is
already there go away on its own or would I have to physically remove it?
<<Generally requires a combination of manual removal along with cessation of
excess nutrient/food. Maybe just speculation but I've heard it theorized that
in large quantities, many nuisance alga can generate/manufacture enough
nutrients to sustain themselves...thus where physical removal comes in>>
Oh yeah, I have an Aqua-C Remora Skimmer that seems to be working well.
<<Indeed...a quality/suitably-sized skimmer for this system>>
Also, the calcium does stay high on it's on and I know that's weird too.
<<You have little in the tank to utilize it, and with your aggressive water
change schedule you likely won't see a fall in levels>>
Maybe I should try yet another LFS, like I said, I have many to choose from in
this area.
<<Is worth doing...>>
Thanks,
Debi
<<Work on clearing up the nuisance algae, then we can revisit the fish issues
(this might be as simple as getting your fish from another store). Regards,
EricR>>
Water Prep...Some Things Are Best Done Yourself IV - 06/24/06
Ok, yes the fish that died all came from the same source, but the goby came from
there also. The blenny came from another source. The store I got the dead fish
from has a very good reputation and many many people buy both water and fish
from there with no complaints. I think I would know about unhappy people if
there were many because of our local marine aquarium organization. Surely there
would be something on the site if this store was
a problem.
<<Even the best stores can get a shipment of livestock that has been
mishandled. Please understand this Debi, it's not my intention to malign the
store(s) from which you make your purchases. I'm simply providing
feedback/comments/possibilities based on the information you provide. In the
end it's up to you to use your own good judgment to determine what is wrong and
what plan of action to follow>>
No, I personally haven't tried different test kits, but yes different ones have
been used since the LFS stores, neither one, uses the same test kits and I have
stood there personally many times and watched them test my water with identical
results to mine, unless as you say there could be something we can't test
for. Then how would I know?
<<Likely you wouldn't>>
If that was the case wouldn't the other things have died also?
<<Not necessarily...possible differences in tolerance/sensitivity ...levels of
health at time of exposure...>>
If I don't need the DT's can you tell me how I feed the frogspawn?
<<Can easily be "target" fed when the feeding tentacles are extended>>
Will it eat the Mysis shrimp, whole little ones like the frozen?
<<Yes>>
Where is it's mouth?
<<Lightly "dust" the animal with the Mysis shrimp a couple times a week when it
expresses its feeding tentacles...it will do the rest>>
I know I sound pretty ignorant but I've never seen a mouth on it and so have no
idea how to feed it.
<<The mouth (or mouths) is not readily visible, but you don't need to see it to
feed this animal. And...your knowledge of this animal/husbandry (and most all
else) is easily expanded by a Google search re on our site/the net in
general. Start by reading here and among the indices at the top of the page:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/caryophyllids.htm>>
So far as the storage of the water at my local stores, these are large popular
stores that people use all the time so yes the storage is just as it should
be. Again, the local club would know and not use them and lots do, very large
club covering much area so they shop all around the city.
<<Have you consulted the club on your problems? Asked about any experiences
similar to yours?>>
I got a Sea Hare today, Apsiladae genus or however it is spelled,
<<Genus>>
really ugly.
<<Interesting creatures>>
Hopefully he will help me with the algae.
<<My fingers are crossed>>
So, if you would kindly let me know on the feeding of the frogspawn I will
continue to work on the algae and leave you alone for a while.
<<No bother Debi...this is what we do>>
Thanks so much,
Debi
<<Cheers my friend, EricR>>
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