FAQs on Discus Selection Related Articles: Plants + Discus = Wow! by Alesia Benedict, Planted Aquariums: Plants and Discus: What They Need To Thrive  By Alesia Benedict, Discus Divas, Glitz, Glam and Lots of Demands by Alesia Benedict,  Juraparoids, Neotropical Cichlids, African Cichlids, Dwarf South American Cichlids, Asian Cichlids, Cichlid Fishes in General,  Related FAQs: Discus 1, Discus 2, Discus Identification, Discus Compatibility, Discus Behavior, Discus Systems, Discus Feeding, Discus Disease, Discus Reproduction, Cichlids of the World, Cichlid Systems, Cichlid Identification, Cichlid Behavior, Cichlid Compatibility, Cichlid Selection, Cichlid Feeding, Cichlid Disease, Cichlid Reproduction, Purchases should be "bright", feeding... and still quarantined, critically so if they're wild-collected or bred/reared overseas.

Discus... stkg., sys.  9/30/09
Hi, I'm interested in keeping discus in a 45 gallon corner aquarium.
<Not an ideal aquarium for these fish. For a start, they're quite big animals, some 20 cm/8 inches at most, and usually at least 15 cm/6 inches.
You also need *at minimum* six specimens if you want a group, otherwise bullying will very likely occur. For a group of six, you really need at least 55 gallons, and realistically 75 gallons.>
My questions are how many full grown adult discus can I keep?
<You could of course keep a pair, but not a group.>
What are suitable take mates?
<Almost anything peaceful that tolerates the very warm water conditions Discus require. The standard 28-30 C/82-86 F is far too warm for most community fish, including most tetras, Corydoras, barbs, etc. Only
exceptional species will tolerate such conditions permanently, classic examples being Cardinal tetras and Corydoras sterbai. Pearl and Moonlight Gouramis can also work well. In big tanks, Clown Loaches work well, but they get even bigger than the Discus and need to be kept in groups of 5+ specimens to be happy, so they're not ideal. Some dwarf cichlids may work, notably Mikrogeophagus ramirezi, but that's a delicate fish and the quality of the stock in the trade is very variable. I tend to recommend against this species, unless you can secure locally bred specimens. Angelfish should work, but in practise often become bullies, and there also appears to be a problem with Angels introducing certain diseases that Discus succumb to very readily.>
What are the best foods to feed them?
<The usual. A good quality flake or pellet to start with, augmented with wet-frozen bloodworms and mosquito larvae. Occasional offerings of cooked peas, live brine shrimp, and live daphnia will help avoid constipation.
Discus, like all cichlids, are prone to Hexamita infections, and a balanced, vitamin-rich diet seems to be a key to avoiding this.>
Thanks for all the help. Great site by the way.
<Kind of you to say so. Good luck, Neale.>

Discus questions... ID, fdg., beh.... gen.  2/20/09 Hi crew, sorry to bother you again? However, i have 3 discuses, that i got 1 week ago, in a 40 gallon tank and 1 of them (the orange discus) only eats bloodworms. I try feeding flakes and brine shrimp but she/he showed no interest. The other two eats everything. How do i teach the orange discus to eat different types of foods? The dominant discus does bully both of them, but i don't know if it is temporarily because i just got them. Does the bullying effect what they eat, because when i feed bloodworms, the orange one goes crazy. They all seem pretty healthy. Here are some pics of them. And do you know what type they are? thanks http://s724.photobucket.com/albums/ww244/fish111111/?action=view&current=DSC02493.jpg http://s724.photobucket.com/albums/ww244/fish111111/?action=view&current=DSC02486.jpg http://s724.photobucket.com/albums/ww244/fish111111/?action=view&current=DSC02490.jpg the dominant discus is the red and blue one. Thanks for all your help. <Hello Chris. I'm not expert on the types of Discus, and so far as I can tell these are standard Symphysodon hybrids of the type widely sold today. So I can't help you on that topic. As for diet, Discus tend to be finicky, and the golden rule is to feed as many different things as possible. Live daphnia, bloodworms, mosquito larvae, and small earthworms are appreciated by all specimens. I'd avoid freeze-dried foods as much as possible, but good quality flake foods are certainly taken by some Discus. By all means try different brands: many of my fish will eat one brand but ignore another! Hikari foods tend to be the best and most widely accepted. Now, as for social behaviour, Discus are best kept either in matched pairs of groups of 6+. Your trio WILL have problems with bullying, as you're observing. Like Angelfish, Discus are schooling fish when young, but territorial pair-forming fish as adults, so unless they're in a big group, pairs will pick on singletons. So either get rid of one, or buy three more. If you keep six, you'll need a bigger tank. Your move. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: discus questions   2/20/09 Hi Neale, thanks for the reply. Is it possible to keep four discus, will that help at all? <Not really Discus, Angelfish and Festivums all fall into this "either a pair or six" category Of course if you kept four females, they'd be fine, but you can't sex Symphysodon so unless you're able to split mature (i.e., spawning) pairs, getting six females isn't practical.> What is the maximum number of discus i can put in a 40 gallon (adults). <A matched pair.> My discuses don't pair up to bully one of them. <No, perhaps not, but the bully could easily be a dominant male and the bullied fish either another male (or, less probably) an unresponsive female.> There is only one dominant discus that picks on both of them. <Quite.> Will this be permanent or is he just establishing the pecking order? <Impossible to say. The best you can say is that the overwhelming experience of Discus keepers is that 3, 4 or 5 adults don't tend to get along. A single male and three females probably would, but there's no way to guarantee you'd get that ratio. Two males would bicker all the time, and one would end up being bullied. Eventually, it would have to be removed.> How long does it take to establish this in general. <May not do so.> They are also extremely scared whenever i walk by them. <Quite normal. This is why Discus are kept in groups in display tanks. When kept in groups of 6+, they are much more secure and likely to swim about normally. The addition of calm dither fish, such as Silver Hatchetfish, can help, but this assumes your aquarium has sufficient space for all.> I tried to hand feed them to show i am a source of food, but i don't believe that helped much. Last, what is the nutritional value of bloodworms, are they considered healthy or treats? <Healthy.> Can it be used as a staple diet? <A fair staple diet, but do augment with pellets, daphnia, etc., once or twice a week.> I will continue to try to add variety into their diets, but since they aren't eating anything but bloodworms, should i lay off them or continue, as i don't want them to starve. <Variety is central. Experiment, switch between brands, raid the kitchen for small bits of seafood and white fish.> Thanks so much Neale, i appreciate your time. ~Chris <Happy to help, Neale.> re: discus questions thanks for your help, i will upgrade to a 60 gallon soon <Probably very wise. Get six juveniles for now, and once they get about 8 cm/3 inches in length, they'll be ready for a bigger tank. Much written about these very special fish; would highly recommend spending a little time browsing WWM and your local bookstore, library, or online book retailer. Cheers, Neale.>

Discus Tank Stocking   8/14/06
Dear Crew,
<Eric>
Thank you for the wonderful resource you provide, and for answering my questions in the past. I have recently moved into a new apt. and have taken the opportunity to redo my tank.  Previously it was a planted community, but I would like to give a shot to discus. I do have about 10 years of experience with fish and have done much research but I would like to get some outside opinions on my plans.
<Okay>
I donated all of the fish and kept the plants, which are an assortment consisting mostly of various swords, java moss, java fern, and vals. The only other livestock in the tank are some mystery snails, as well as what I believe are small Ramshorn ( though I am not positive ). I don't mind the snails because as long as I feed them once in a while they leave the plants alone.  
<A good technique>
The tank itself is a 72 gallon ( nominal ) bowfront. The filter is an Aquaclear 500 ( though I believe their model numbers have changed ) using a sponge, carbon and zeolite bags. Lighting consists of 220w PC (I don't recall the temperature offhand ). The substrate consists of regular gravel mixed with Eco-Complete ( I don't have it in front of me but that's what I believe it is called ) topped off with a thin layer of Tahitian Black Moon Sand for effect. There is rockwork and bogwood as well. Thankfully NYC tap water is good so I don't have to add much in
terms of chemicals besides fertilizer which is dosed every few days ( I use Seachem Flourish and Flourish tabs ).
Once the plants have taken hold, I am currently planning on stocking the tank as follows ( after proper quarantine ):
3-5 discus bought from a breeder ( who preferably uses tap water so that they are conditioned to my water supply )
<Good>
2 or 3 Bristlenose plecs ( 1 male )
1 or 2 pairs of Rams ( are the German and Bolivian Rams different species or breeds ? )
<Please see here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/dwfsamcichlids.htm
and the FAQs file linked above. Different species unless the common names are getting switched>
I would like to have a group of a small schooling or shoaling dither fish but haven't decided on which. I will probably go for 10 or so cardinal tetras to keep with the biotype.
<Of good starting size>
5 hatchetfish ( I have a cover )
My main concern is the stocking density as I like to keep away from the crowded tank look because I feel it takes away from the natural behavior of the fish.
<You are wise here. It does>
I am very open to suggestions both as to species and stocking numbers. While I am not setting this up with any species breeding in mind, I do like to see the fish interact and behave as naturally as possible under the circumstances which is why I tried to pair certain fish.
Thanks again for your help,
Eric
<Unless you have plans to move out some of them, I would stick with no more than three discus here. Bob Fenner>

Re: Discus/FW (Rams, Pleco...) Tank Stocking   8/16/06
Dear Mr. Fenner,
<Eric>
Thanks for your quick reply. I choose to go with 3-5 discus because I have read that they better in schools
<If not too crowded...>
of at least 5 but I was worried that it would be too many. I think that I will get 5 small discus and wait a few months to see if any pair off, then return or sell the 1 or 2 that are at the bottom of the pecking order.
<A workable plan>
In regards to the rams, I have been told on a yahoo group, and read elsewhere, that the German rams are a breed of rams (I recall it being Bolivian )
<Mmm, no... are the same Microgeophagus... ramirezi, vs. altispinosa... The Bolivian Ram is a different species... http://fishbase.sinica.edu.tw/Summary/speciesSummary.php?ID=15902&genusname=Mikrogeophagus&speciesname=altispinosus>
that were developed in Germany to exhibit the better coloration. If I decide to not go with the rams, would a pair or two of another dwarf cichlid do
well in this tank, or should I stick with the rams?
<Possibly... there are quite a few species... some too shy, easygoing...>
Is the proper stocking of Bristlenose plecs 1 male to 2 females? Should there be any specific order of stocking?
Thanks again,
Eric
<Best to place whatever sex ratio here, and keep an eye out for possible pairing, remove others if they're being beaten. Bob Fenner>

Discus Stocking - 05/07/2006
<<Hi, Karen. Tom with you.>>
I have a 47G column. It is planted, and doing well. I want to put a few 2.5 inch Discus in it. How many may I safely put in?  The dimensions are 31" tall, 20" wide and 18" deep front to back. There are no other fish, save 1 Otocinclus.  I would do a small school of cardinal tetra, but I know I am restricted due to the lack of surface area.
<<Karen, I wouldn't go with more than three of these fish since they won't remain this size. You're already aware of the restricted surface area with this style of aquarium and are almost certainly aware of the need Discus have for exceptional water conditions. They're going to need frequent water changes and strict attention to vacuuming the substrate in your tank. These are wonderful fish but it seems like any parasite within a city block of these guys will find them.>>
Thanks for the expert opinion, for free, YAY!
<<Well, I can't vouch for the "expert-ness" of my opinion but, it is absolutely free! :)>>
Karen
<<Best of luck. Tom>>

Hormoned Discus   12/28/05
Hi crew. Thanks for all your earlier replies. They were fast and helped me a lot. I have a question about discus. How to find the difference between Hormoned discus and those that are not hormoned. Any help in this regard will be greatly appreciated.
< Hormoned discus are usually the little discus sold around 2 inches in diameter that have all kinds of screaming color. In your tanks away from the hormoned foods they then quickly lose much of their color and never regain it. Some breeders are producing fish that actually color up at a very young age without hormones. The best way to find out is to buy from a breeder if you can find one. Asian discus are coming in so cheap that many discus breeders have moved on to other things.-Chuck>

Starting With Discus  12/10/05
Yes, fist of all I just want to say thanks for all of your hard work on putting this page together. It has been a great source of reference for many years.  Ok, on with the question. I just bought a 75 gallon tank with the hopes of raising discus, but I don't know if I have the right set up. I am using a stealth heater two Filstar Rena canister filters xp2 and xp3. I am using medium and small gravel somewhere around 110 pounds in all. And a few fake plants and driftwood. Is this ok please let me know. Current fish in tank, 2 baby green severums, 2 Bala Sharks, 2 catfish Pictus and 1 Black Ghost knife 10 in.
< There are two kinds of discus, wild and tank raised. Wild discus require clean, warm, soft, acidic water. Tank raised fish are much less demanding. Overall you need to keep the pH around 7, and the nitrates as low as possible. Give them good food and they like to be crowded. In the wild they are found in big schools so get a group to make them feel more comfortable.-Chuck>

Looking For Discus Breeders  12/9/05
My name is Tim Burket & I am from Port Clinton, Ohio, 43452. Are there any breeders in my area. Thank you --- Tim
< I think the state of Ohio has more individual fish clubs than any other. Three very large clubs that deal with cichlids may be able to help you. In the Cleveland area you have the Ohio Cichlid Association and the Great Lakes Cichlid Association. Down in Cincinnati you have the Cincinnati Aquarium Society that has a strong cichlid following.-Chuck> 

Adding Discus  11/30/05
Dear Crew, My daughter and I have a 250 litre aquarium where we already keep cardinal tetras, Corydoras spp. and Microgeophagus ramirezi. We have had the aquarium for about a year, and we would now like to buy two discus. Here in Bergen, Norway, the shops do not supply these fish in quantities, so we have to do order. Do you recommend buying small specimens, or should we go for larger ones. If we enjoy having them, and manage to keep them alive, we are going to set up a 600 l tank. We have done a lot of reading, but would be grateful for some advice. Thanks for your time! Best wishes, Oda and Sindre
<If you are adding small tank raised discus then get a group of at least 6. If you are purchasing wild discus then I would recommend adult discus and at least a group of 4.-Chuck> 

Discus setup? 8/6/05
Hey i was choosing between an African cichlid tank or a discus tank, i have chosen the discus tank and i was wondering how many discus i would be able to put in a 55 gallon aquarium along and any other tips on looking after them would be greatly appreciated  thanks
>>You can start with 6-8 small fish in 55 gallons. I would suggest to get yourself a beginner's book on discus because there is so much information. The internet also has a few discus only discussion boards that are very helpful.
Try http://www.simplydiscus.com/forum
Good Luck, Oliver

Getting New Discus
Hi, I am Brijesh from India and am planning to make a discus aquarium for myself. I am very afraid because I have heard that discus die soon. Is it true that they are delicate?
< Discus can be less tolerant of poor aquarium maintenance than many other fish.>
I do regular water changes once a week. Which types of discus do you recommend to start with?
< There are really only two types. Wild and aquarium bred strains. The aquarium bred strains can be easier to keep if they are properly raised. Your choice is simply a matter of personal taste.>
I am planning to buy a 24x12x12 inches tank for it without any gravel. I am getting the fish from a dealer who has agreed to quarantine it for me for a week is it enough?
< I would recommend at least a two week quarantine period. Longer if the fish develop any problems.>
I am sure that if the discus is healthy I will be able to take care of it. I am getting these babes from Bangalore which is 400km from my place. Is it safe? Will they catch any diseases due to stress?
< Shipping fish always puts a strain on them. If you are getting your fish from a professional breeder then they will know how to ship them in a way to minimize the stress. Many discus have been "hormoned" to give the young color so they can be easily sold. These fish soon lose their color in the aquarium and become difficult to breed later on. As the person you are buying the fish from if they have been hormoned. I would stay away from these fish if they have.-Chuck>

Discus, population question
Bob,
In your discus tome you write:
If you are starting with even small fishes in a small system (under twenty gallons per individual), you should buy an odd number (3, 5) so that that the dominant individual (and sub-dominant) will not pick on a single lowest-subordinate conspecific.
<Yep>
I have often heard this odd-number advice, but I have never understood it. Pairs are very bad, yes, but how is 4 worse than 3, and isn't 6 better than 5 for disseminating aggression among several targets?
David.
<Turns out that group dynamics (just seem to) dictate that pairs (even numbers) in small systems (most all hobby size tanks) "gang up" on other pairs... but that having an "odd fish out" dissociates the pairing up so to speak. There are a few human examples of this phenomena as well... I have seen "bullying" in school gyms, bars... that appear to be semi-equivalents. Bob F>

Not trying to be a pain...
><Turns out that group dynamics (just seem to) dictate that pairs
>(even numbers) in small systems (most all hobby size tanks) "gang
>up" on other pairs... but that having an "odd fish out" dissociates
>the pairing up so to speak. There are a few human examples of this
>phenomena as well... I have seen "bullying" in school gyms, bars...
>that appear to be semi-equivalents. Bob F>
I really want to understand this. In my experience, 3 is just about the worst number for bullying, with 2 against 1. Another common scenario is a bully with 2 sidekicks, making it 3 against 1, not 2 against 2. With poultry (some of the meanest animals on the planet), I have never noticed a difference between odd and even numbers, just that the fewer, the worse.
<Can be this way, but more often than not the individuality of fishes wins out (here's a qualifier: in a large enough setting). Surely (not Shirley), in situations with breeding pairs, the third individual/wheel, or even more numbers are going to be harassed.>
As you may know, I have a commitment to not perpetrating aquarium husbandry myths, however reasonable sounding. I therefore probably am too sensitive, but is there any quantitative support for the odd-number argument?
<I understand, and agree totally... The nuances of what I'm trying to state, advocate are REALLY only applicable to the situation mentioned... That is: 1) provision of adequate size/volume systems to accommodate any given number of specimens AT full size, 2) Starting these at a small/er size in an effort to match them up for breeding. Put another way, placing larger animals in odd or even numbers in too small a volume is a recipe for interspecies antagonism. Bob F>
David

RE: not trying to be a pain...
Thanks. This is how I reworked it at the end of the paragraph:
It is also important to have several fish, and two is the worst possible number. With only two, the dominant individual will pick mercilessly on the subordinate conspecific. Several fish give several targets for any one fish’s aggression. Studies also indicate that when there is an odd number of fish, they are less likely to gang up, and it helps to have an odd fish out.
Does this sound all right?
<Yes. Thank you. Bob F>
David

Looking for Symphysodon from the source
Am looking for a exporter of discus in Brazil .thanks Stan
< Go to Belowwater.com and get in contact with him about wild discus. He has been to South America many times and specializes in wild discus.-Chuck>

Discus breeder in Italy. Post on WWM
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<We don't offer or sell livestock. Discus breeder in Italy. Post on WWM. BobF>
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