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Blonde Naso Tang problem
9/2/06 Hello, I hope you can give me some advice. I have a blonde
Naso tang that I've cared for since April 2000. He is about 25 cm
long, full-bodied, and up until this morning, healthy.
"Blondie" usually eats from my hand, however today will not
eat anything. He has a bulge about half way down his right side.
<One sided I'll take it> There is no outward ulceration,
however he does have several little nips on his underbelly, I presume
from the engineer gobies at feeding time. These little markings have
been around for quite some time. He has no outward signs of disease (no
redness on gills, no torn fins, his eyes seem clear, etc.), except
he's acting different. Instead of eating, he swims up to the glass
with his bulge towards me and works his mouth, almost as if he is
gasping. Blondie shares a 75 gal. <Too small> tank with a brown
Sailfin tang, 2 engineer gobies (about 20cm each), 2 clown fish, 2
cleaner shrimp and a brittle star fish. Everyone else seems fine. Thank
you for your time; I really hope you can help me. Best regards, Sue
Kavelman <Mmm... it may be that this Naso has "just"
swallowed too much gravel (they do this, analogous to the
"crop" of chickens) and is suffering some sort of gut
blockage... Perhaps addition of Epsom Salt (see WWM re) will help move
this. Otherwise, offering of algae (on a feeding clip is best, so you
can monitor, keep it from the Pholodichthys...). In the longer term (if
there is one), this fish needs much larger quarters... at least a six
foot length run/world. Bob Fenner> Re: Naso Tang ... dis. 3/16/06 I just have a question about the Quick Cure product I'm using. You stated I needed to treat the tank for 20 more days to ensure that all the cysts have hatched and are killed. Do I treat for 20 consecutive days or should I alternate days? How long can I treat with this product without harming my fish? <Donna, first off, 20 days would be the minimum duration of treatment. To be effective, a copper test kit should be used to ensure a copper level of 0.20 is maintained on a daily basis for the duration of the treatment. Do read here. http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ichartmar.htm James (Salty Dog)> <<James... QuickCure has no copper in it... RMF>> Naso Tang ... selection? - 2/11/2006 I bought a Blonde Naso Tang last week. I bought him because the "expert" at the LFS said these were hardy fish and not particularly disease prone. <He's also a comedian too?> He also tested my water and told me it was fine, but I didn't ask the specific parameters. He told me that he had been quarantining using a UV sterilizer for approximately 1 month. The Naso has been in my tank for 4.5 days. I noticed two days ago that he has white spots on his fins. The same "expert" at the LFS advised me to give him a bath in 2.5 gals of fresh water and 11 drops of formalin with an antibiotic in the water. Is this the way to treat that? <I'd like to ask you a question first. Why didn't you quarantine the fish before placing it in your tank? This makes an effective treatment much easier. Freshwater dips are usually the first stage in treatment. Do Google search our Wet Web site, keyword "freshwater dip". You will find your info there. I'm also hoping you have at least a 70 gallon tank for that guy for starters as they can attain a length of up to 8 inches and do require plenty of swimming room. James (Salty Dog)> Donna Torn Between two tangs 10-12-05 Dear Crew, <<Hello>> I have a 180 g FOWLR that had been a closed system for quite some time until this summer when after a 4 wk quarantine I added an adult emperor angel. <<QT should always be a minimum of 4 weeks and I personally suggest a minimum of 6 weeks on tangs and angels as they like to harbor "nasties".>> The 180 had a powder blue and a Naso tang, both beautiful fish. A purple tang and Foxface that I have had for 8-9 years were looking like they were on their last leg ( probably old age , I guess ) and I decided to open the system to new inhabitants. Unfortunately, despite using a QT the tangs look like they came down with crypt. I pulled all fish from the system, treated then in QT's with copper for 3 weeks and let the display lie fallow for 5 weeks. <<Again as a general rule, a tank should be left fallow for 6-8 weeks and temp. should be raised as high as tolerable for current inhabitants to increase the rate of the parasite life cycle.>> I have since re-introduced all of the fish except for the tangs. For 4 weeks since the 180 has been with fish the system looks great. My tangs are also doing well while still in the QT except for some HLLE that they acquired while copper treated. The Naso has a few scattered papules on the face and head and body that copper had no effect on ( ? HLLE ) but is otherwise doing great. The Naso and powder blue are in a 55 g tank together. The papules on the Naso are whitish and much 4-5 times larger than what is seen with crypt, this has been a chronic condition for this fish but it has not been that noticeable nor has it affected the fish's activity eating etc. Now I am faced with a dilemma : Should I dare re-introduce the tangs into the display. I fear that tangs are very "parasite prone" Currently the 180 has an adult emperor 6". a majestic 4-5" Foxface 5" Heniochus 4" a couple of clowns and one damsel, 250lbs of LR with plenty of hiding places. Probably no good answer to this question, but I thought I would try asking. <<The best answer I can give is; if you don't feel comfortable doing it, then don't do it. You are correct in your thinking that tangs are prone to infection. My advice would be to pick one and give the other to a friend or set up the 55 for the outsider.>> Jimmy <<TravisM>><<<I actually am going to make a comment... both species listed here are unsuitable for a four foot long system (should be in six foot minimum)... the mucus marks on the Naso are likely "just" resultant from stress... RMF>>> Sourcing a blonde Naso Do you know where a good place to purchase a healthy blonde Naso tang? <Likely the big etailers of marine livestock... Drs. Foster & Smith, Marine Center...> I thought Hawaii would be the best place if I could order direct. <Can't as far as I know... and I am there very often> To spare the fish from being transported to more than one place. <Good thought> We also have a 10 gal QT tank and wanted to place him in it. We would cover the side of the tank to reduce stress. Is this a big enough tank? and how long should he be in it? Thank you for any help. <Only if this is a very small specimen... Naso species should be quarantined in no smaller than a two foot by one foot long/wide tank... and kept in no smaller than twice this. Bob Fenner> Lopez tang with Popeye Hi, <Hi Cindy, MacL here with you
tonight. Sorry about the delay I just got this.> We have a Lopez
Tang that has what seems to be Popeye in one eye for 3 weeks now.
<Poor guy> It is very large and full of bubbles. We have treated
him with Epsom salts one time. <Epsom salts work great on Popeye
when its from an injury and sometimes will sooth the eye when its a
parasite or infection but generally its not going to cure it. After a
week of treatment with no response its time to try other things.> He
is currently in a 10 gallon quarantine tank. He is getting Maracyn and
copper. <You might consider Maracyn two. Of course, ideally if you
could get medicated flakes and he would eat them that would be the
best.> He is on his fourth day and the eye doesn't seem to be
looking any better. Since in the quarantine tank he won't eat which
he was acting fine before moving him into the QT tank. <Understood,
he's probably not happy about the move!> What else can we do to
try and help his eye. The other fish in the home tank are all fine and
aren't showing any signs of Popeye. <So many things that could
have caused it, but right now the best thing is to get him healthy and
try to get him back into his groove. I know people who have had great
success with Maracyn two in these situations. Also, Cindy, is he
showing signs of parasites? Because if not you really want to dilute
that copper as much as you can. It can really effect the internal
systems of tangs. Copper can be harsh stuff! How's he doing at this
point? Are you seeing anything on him? MacL> Thanks, Cindy Naso tang fin disease First,,,, I wish I had found this site sooner, truly a wonderful source of expert opinion. <Our intention> I have a juvenile Naso tang (lituratus) about 5-6 inches in length who for the past 3 months has had a frayed tail and ventral fins (fins look like they were partially eaten away and have a little bit of a rough white exudate on them). <Mmmm, should have "grown back" over this time... if suitable environment (size, tankmates...), nutrition available> He looks great otherwise and eats like a champ. <Eating what? "Breakfast of Champions?"... hopefully substantial amounts of brown, red, green algae...> My local fish store here in Hawaii recommended Melafix for the fin issue. I had stepped up water changes without any change in the fin prior to trying the Melafix. I currently am on day 5 of the MelaFix treatment and wonder if I should finish out the 7 days or stop. Does this sound like Ich and if so what treatment if any would you recommend? <This homeopathic remedy I am NOT a fan of... has a mild anti-microbial effect... NOT useful on protozoan complaints> I have a 125 gallon SW tank, which has been running for 5 months with great water quality. Fish load is light with only a white spotted puffer, squirrel fish, blue damsel, and flame angel. Everyone else looks great. Thanks, Eric <Try bolstering the Nasos diet with soaking it in a vitamin prep. (e.g. Selcon), offering soaked/dried algae with a clip at the water's surface. Bob Fenner> <<Mmm, should have suggested he go collect his own Limu, living in Hawai'i... RMF>>
Naso Tang with cloudy eyes (more: antibiotic use) Hello all,
I have a customer with a Naso Tang that has stopped feeding and has
cloudy eyes. All of their water parameters look good and this
particular customer is very diligent in maintenance and feeding. I have
never experienced this type of problem and honestly have rarely had to
use antibiotics with any saltwater fish so I would be very appreciative
if you could recommend any antibiotic or other course of treatment.
<May well be that this animal (especially if it is the only one thus
affected in the system) just mechanically injured itself (ran into the
sides, rock)... this happens with Naso tang species (need room)... and
that there is no specific treatment advised, advisable... other than
good maintenance practices, self-healing> Also, if you could
recommend particular antibiotics for treatment of various
"common" bacterial type infections in saltwater fish I would
be grateful. <There are none. Most all infectious diseases of
ornamental aquatics are secondary, tertiary... opportunistic due to
deficiencies in water quality, nutrition, battering by tankmates, the
odd genetic anomaly... some antimicrobials like Furan compounds are
efficacious as adjuncts to improving ones chances in improving
conditions overall... in some cases dips/baths, feeding, injection
(intramuscularly mainly) of antibiotics is something to be suggested...
but the cases are few, specific> In my years of keeping saltwater
fish both as a hobbyist and now an LFS owner I really can't recall
needing to use antibiotics so I feel a bit inept when asked how to
treat these types of problems. <Oh, agreed. This has been my
experience, recollection as well. Bob Fenner> Thanks, Richard Naso Tangs have a couple of fish that have white spots on there body. I have a 110 gal reef tank. I set up a 6 gal hospital tank to treat the 2 fish that showed signs of these spots "Ick" 1 Blue Hippo Tang and 1 Naso Tang. The Naso Tang didn't have as many spots as the Blue Hippo but when I put them both in the tank after about 1 hour the Naso started to fling everywhere in the tank and just croaked. This was very upsetting. My Local fish store told me to set up the hospital tank and treat it with copper and place the fish in the hospital tank. They told me to do the follow. 1/Take water out of main tank to fill the hospital tank 2/Add copper to hospital tank and bring to level .20 ppm (after some reading I was a little unsure about the ppm level so I put it at .10-.13 ppm just to be safe) The blue hippo has been in the hospital tank for 24 hours now and doing ok. I also have 3 Percula true clowns now showing the white spots on there body as well as gasping very quickly for air. I am unsure whether I am missing something here as to I am very new to Marine Aquariums and never dealt with any diseases. I am afraid to put these little guys in the hospital tank because I don't want them to die just like the Naso did. I know that Ick is 2-3 week moving parasite on the host so I wanted to wait and get a response from you on how to proceed, or what I need to change. These guys normal diet is frozen-live brine shrimp, romaine lettuce (for tangs) and Marine Flake Food. My system uses a Wet/Dry Trickle filtration system and as a SeaClone Skimmer also. Any help as soon as possible would be appreciated, as to I don't like to see these poor things pass away. Its just really sad. <<Who can say why the Naso reacted so negatively to the procedure... these species do not enjoy small systems... a six gallon is very tiny to them... I would have suggested a higher initial concentration of free copper... more like .35ppm and never letting the residual drop below .20... I would move the damsels, all other fishes and treat them together... Do read over the "ich" pieces on the site: Home Page regarding what to do with your main system going forward... And do develop and adhere to an acclimation protocol going forward to prevent having these problems. Bob Fenner>> Re: pls tell me your are online... (Naso demise) So far he is
still alive.... 5 and a half hours after the move.... I also moved the
cleaner wrasse into the hospital with him. The cleaner has been picking
at Naso almost none stop. Naso even has ich inside his mouth.... He
opens his mouth really wide... I guess wanting wrasse to clean inside
there. <Hopefully> I am doing the SeaChem Cupramine treatment...
I did a test and it is at 0.15 for now.... I will continue to test and
adjust as needed (hopefully) <Good> THE PLAN: I will not buy more
fish for the rest of the year..... <Let's not go that far> I
will however get a Neon Goby and maybe a fourth cleaner shrimp. I am
considering dropping the Salinity if another fish shows symptoms. <I
would do this pre-emptively. Like starting NOW> If not should I drop
it anyway? <Yes> If I can afford it should I get another tank for
fish only and move all the fish over there for treatment or just to
simply let the tank fallow for a few months? <The former is
better> Would a 55 gallon be enough for a purple tang, yellow tang,
6 line wrasse, Percula clown, scooter blenny and a Naso I hope?
<Yes> Does a FO tank require more than natural light? <No, not
for treatment purposes. No photosynthetic life, no need for extra
lighting> Or is that not necessary if no other fish show symptoms?
<The system and its occupants do have the disease, whether they are
currently showing symptoms or no... your situation is "in-between
stages of infestation"... study the life history of
Cryptocaryon... as time goes by (just a few days) you will start to
evidence "multi-generational stages"...> The ich would
then be considered in check with the current cleaner crew?
<Possibly... but if/when "balance" shifts to the worsening
of conditions for your fish livestock/hosts... Bob Fenner> Ich cure??? or not?? What do you think about this product? I never heard of it.... found it by Google of course.... It would be a dream if it worked.... http://user.aol.com/pattiric/aquarium/fishvet3.htm <My opinions about this and other ich remedies are posted on our site. Bob Fenner> Re: Naso Tangs. . . (more to fish health, knowing and the nature
of the human experience) One more question if you don't mind. .
. how will I know when it's time to move the Naso to a larger tank?
Will he start acting unhappy? Signs of limited swimming, loss of
appetite, etc.? <These behavioral changes are hard to discern, but
yes, all the above> Also, off the current subject, I am just very
frustrated and don't know where to turn. I love your website but
frankly, I'm very new to this hobby (only about 9 months) and I
don't know a lot about what I read. . .some of it is very confusing
and hard to understand. So, where can I go to get some basic knowledge
to help me understand and grow into learning this hobby? <Though it
is supposedly shame-faced to do so, I will plug a worthwhile general
(beginner-oriented) book on marine aquarium keeping of which I am the
author: The Conscientious Marine Aquarist. Available from e-tailers,
the large book-sellers, fish shops. Very worthwhile> Frustration
also exists in the fact that there are so many conflicting opinions.
For instance, last night I noticed a small spot on my maroon
clown's fin that looked like fin rot. I went to your website and
found basically conflicting opinions (in the chat room) regarding
Melafix and Maracyn. These are the only two medicines that I know of at
all. I decided to use Melafix (because it seemed to be a safer, more
natural product and the fin rot is minimal) but then this morning
searched the WetWebMedia and found where you say you don't
recommend it so now I feel like I've done something horrible.
<Mmm, not horrible... Understand the nature of our sites as mere
extensions of related human experience... There are many (different)
humans, hence opinions... And that "Aquariology" is not
altogether a "science", but art and "voodoo" as
well... Embrace and revel in these differences (really).> What
should I have done for the maroon clown (have I hurt the other fish in
the tank that are not showing signs of fin rot?) <I would
likely have "done nothing" if just the one fish affected, one
spot...> and where can I go to get GOOD, solid information on
treatment of diseases? <There are books on the subject (see Ed
Noga's name on the Google Search), but with some general
understanding of what diseases are ("The Three Sets of
Factors..."), and good practice at picking out proper species,
good specimens, some simple dip/bath and quarantine procedures, decent
nutrition, regular aquarium maintenance, you are unlikely to need to
know much or anything about "disease"> I trust you, Mr.
Fenner, from all of the things I've heard and the books that
you've written you are one of the few that I would trust. I just
wish you could give out your phone number! :) When it's 10:00 p.m.
and you don't know what to do for your fish it's frustrating!
Please help and give me some guidance if possible. I apologize for
being so longwinded but I just am at my wit's end. I love my fish
and want to take the best care of them but I can't find a solid
guideline to help me. Is there a book that you've written
that's kind of a catch all for everything? <Ah, yes. TCMA>
Thanks for your help! I appreciate you so much. <Glad to help my
friend. Try to "step back" and enjoy your experience, even
the apparent frustration, un-knowing... all will become clearer with
time, experience, study, reflection, you'll see. Bob Fenner> Brown/Black spots on tang I have a problem with the tank and
am not sure what to do. My LFS recommends using Greenex but I have read
of awful "happenings" using this stuff on your website. It
doesn't sound like you recommend it. <cure or kill solution...
usually the latter> I went home for lunch today and my Naso Tang has
very light brown/black spots all over him. It does not resemble black
ich. They are not round spots. It's hard to explain. . . never seen
anything like it before. I tested the water and it is perfect. He is
acting fine -- eating well and swimming. What should I do? Do you
recommend anything to try or just watch it for a day or so? No other
fish show these signs. . . I'm at a loss. Please help. . . .
<sounds like Turbellid worms. Hard to cure but slow to kill fish. A
bare QT tank for 2-4 weeks with formalin and occasional freshwater dips
would be best for this before it spreads to other fish (mostly tangs,
butterflies and angels)> Thanks! <quite welcome. Anthony>
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