Elegance coral question for Bob Fenner 5/10/09
Hi Bob,
I have a pair of elegance corals.
<Mmm, Catalaphyllias are near the top in terms of physical stingy-ness...
And don't mix well often with other specimens that they're "unfamiliar with"... Have you read on WWM re...?>
I have a pink tip frag from a 19 year old colony that's been with me for about 6 months and is growing rapidly.
Currently he is the lone inhabitant of my tank with a 3.5" DSB established for almost 2 years and about 14 blades of seagrass- shoal grass I think. I picked up a frag of an Australian purple tipped elegance at MAX '09 in Costa Mesa about 5 weeks ago and has been in QT since. He is eating well and looks 'happy.'
a) I'm not sure about the length of QT required for ECS to manifest itself.
<...Elegance Coral Syndrome? See WWM re the health of this species period>
b) Will there be a problem if the pink tip elegance and purple tip elegance touch each other?
<Yes. Very likely>
They expand so much! The pink tip appears to have a stronger sting than the purple tip when food is presented.
<They should expand and contract somewhat... That one/both are doing this a great deal is symptomatic of "warring">
c) As I mentioned I have 14 blades of seagrass that have been there since Jan '09. As new ones grow, old ones die -a turn over of about 3-4 leaves a week. I was hoping for more blades of grass!!!
<What do you think are the limiting factors here? Light, some nutrient/s?>
I started using FW plant fertilizer tabs buried 2" below the DSB by the roots per Eric Borneman's advice at MAX '09, but I see no change.
<Does take time... Could be summat else>
Thank You,
Narayan
<Be chatting, Bob Fenner>
Re: Elegance coral question for Bob Fenner 5/10/09
Hi Bob,
Thank you very much for your reply.
a) The purple tip elegance coral is still in QT. The pink tip and purple tip elegance have not been in contact yet. The expansion and contraction is based on light. The pink tip reduced it's size by 50% at night. The purple tip basically withdraws completely in to its skeleton at night -from being 6" across down to about 1"!
<Mmm, vigorous... again, I would not likely "mix" the two specimens in the same system/water>
b) I don't know how long to QT the purple tip to ensure that it doesn't suffer from ECS. Is 6 weeks enough?
<See WWM re... I don't "believe" in such a syndrome... there are ways to strengthen this and other Scleractinian, Cnidarian species re too-easy mortality. These are adequately covered/archived on our site>
c) As for the shoal grass, they grow fast enough. The old leaves just die off just as fast as new growth! That's what I need to stop. Currently I get 3-4 new leaves a week, same as the death rate! So I guess I have a stable population of shoal grass leaves. They are planted in a mature 2 year old 3.5" DSB, in 12" of water under a 20K 70W metal halide bulb. They only problem I see is that since I'm also fishless, and have been so for 2 years, there are ton of different pods left over from my live rock days that now hang out on the grass blades. I wonder if they are my problem!
Thanks a lot!
Narayan
<Couldn't say... but I do think both you and I could devise an experimental method to test this hypothesis... Mmmm? Bob Fenner>
Re: Elegance coral question for Bob Fenner 5/11/09
Hi Bob!
I'm just recovering from Multiple Tank Syndrome... I guess I need a separate setup to house the two elegance corals properly as I like them both and want to keep them both... This will also allow me to try a different species of seagrass in the other tank as a bonus!!
<Ahh! Have you seen my Waikiki Aq. pix of their biotope for this species? Posted on... WWM>
Okay! Where do I start debugging my problem! My goal is to have a tank with a DSB covered in seagrass with a lone elegance coral in the middle -I'm okay if the coral is half hidden by the seagrass... Here's the setup.
- 16" cube tank with a 14 gallon sump.
<Really too small a volume>
Estimated water volume is around
22 gallons.
- 70W 20K MH. The coral and grass are under <12" of water. The coral is directly under the bulb. The grass is 4" from the center of the bulb, along the axis of the bulb as the light intensity along the axis of the bulb is not that different from just under the bulb...
- Fishless & Skimmer less. The tank used to house 17 lbs of live rock and a Duncan coral for 1.5 years as the DSB was maturing. The coral grew from 1 polyp to 40+ polyps in that time period.
- About 3-5 lbs of live rock in the sump.
- 3.5" DSB -Grain size about 0.5mm.
- Top off (2 cups a day) contains Calcium Hydroxide.
- Specific gravity is set at 1.025 -1.026.
- Temp is between 77.5F and 78.5F as the heater cycles.
- Moderate to low flow as the Elegance seems to be happiest with that...
- I feed the coral Mysis or Arctic pods once a week.
- The tank gets 20 drops of Reef Nutrition Phytoplankton once a week for all the pods and one lone Featherduster worm.
Thanks a lot for your time!
Narayan
<Please (re?)read the Catalaphyllia mat.s archived on WWM. B>

Help! regarding Elegance coral Hi there,         I was looking for more info about Elegance coral when I come across the very informative discussion that you put up on the web .     I would need some advice from you. I just bought a elegance coral today.    I need to know where is the recommended placement in the tank. << Most people put them on their sand, right in the front bottom portion of their tank. >> When you mentioned horizontal placement , does it mean that the coral is to be lie flat on its cone skeleton.<< Well, it depends on what you think looks good, <<NO; Blunder-all>> but I like them facing up towards the light. >> Does this mean that if I place it on the substrate , it rest horizontally downward and its mouth is facing the front of tank? or is it supposed to be tilted at an angle?  << I've seen them in the wild and in tanks facing right up to the light.  This doesn't mean they need that, but I think that allows for the best photosynthesis.  Either way feeding it every week or so will also help out. >>    Also , is it true that elegance should not be placed near to Live rock ? << I don't believe that.  They do live in sandy areas, but to me live rock is good for everything. >> For your advice pls. Thanks and Best Regards. Alex <<  Adam Blundell  >>

Elegance corals Dear Bob I have a 200 gal reef tank that has been running for over a year. For light I am using 4 6 ft VHO's and two 250w 10000k halides. Filtration is 4inches of live sand with plenum, the best possible protein skimmer, and 57w U.V. Temp is 80F and I use calcium reactor. My question is; Why can't I keep a elegant coral alive. When I put one in the tank, no matter where, it comes out the first few days maybe 2 weeks but it then begins to slowly waste away staying withdrawn into the skeleton the just rotting apart. I am keeping Acroporas, clams, frogspawn, hammers, torch corals, Blastomussa and even a Pectinia but a elegant will die every time. No one has been able to answer this question even people who are very knowledgeable and have seen the tank. Some of these elegance corals have been doing well in other tanks for weeks but of course die in mine. James Lewis >> James, you are the "consumer" who broke the writer's back... and I thank you. Am going to move way-up my schedule for writing about Catalaphyllia (Elegance corals).      Seems like only yesterday (because it was) that I was taking pictures at the Waikiki Aquarium of their specialized "Elegance Coral Tank". Let me describe this set-up for you (all).     It had a few inches of fine sand, a bunch (really too many, I'd clear some so you could see the coral specimen) "grass" (in their case Thalassia hemprichii) a few fishes (a Phalaena goby, gorgeous green filefish, unid'ed rockfish of some sort), not much circulation, no added aeration, but bright light (the plants and algae were giving off obvious gas bubbles from the halides and sunlight (the roof is "missing")... and the specimen? It was alone, by itself, lying in the "mud/sand" horizontal on the bottom.     Now, let me assure you, I've collected this (and other) Caryophyllid (the family of this, the Euphyllias like Frogspawn, hammer...) corals in the wild, and this is how all Elegance corals I've seen live: Horizontal, in relatively stagnant, grassy areas, with bright light, low circulation, with no other stinging celled animals around, in probably "high nutrient" settings.     And how do aquarists by and large try to keep Catalaphyllias? In vertical orientations, with brisk, constant circulation, in almost nutrient-free water, with other aggressive stinging-celled animals...     Now, does all this make more/better/any sense? These animals are being kept in barely to un-tolerable conditions. They don't live in environments like your other corals at all. The places where I've seen them live are more like wild conditions... Bob Fenner

Elegance Coral decline Bob, I read your q/a in FFExpress, sporadically. But, I always learn something. My question is concerning the elegance coral (Catalaphyllia jardinei). I have one that looked great coming from the store and continued to look that way for about 2 weeks in my 75 gal. tank. After feeding it some frozen brine and silversides (the second time I fed it in the 2 weeks) it started to decline. It seemed to collapse then swell up around the edges and it hasn't extended it's tentacles much in a couple of weeks now. There is one area where it has pulled away from the skeleton. I checked today for an odor and it still smells healthy. Total of 4 weeks in tank. I subscribe to a couple of bulletin boards and posted a question concerning the elegance and almost immediately got a number of responses... all of them commenting that they either were, or had experienced this same problem. The elegance is supposed to be an easy coral, what is going on? Why are so many experienced aquarist having problems with this "easy" coral? Tank parameters: 75 gal 9 months old 0 nitrite 0 ammonia 8.1 - 8.2 ph <5 nitrate 140 lb Live Rock (Fiji and Old Florida) 85 lb Live sand (gulf of Mexico/ keys) Tank inhabitants Open brain coral -- doing great Torch coral -- doing great Flowerpot -- brought back from the brink of death Devil's hand -- doing great elegance -- mentioned above Green star polyps -- doing great Yellow polyps -- doing great Regular assortment of snails and hermits Skunk cleaner shrimp coral banded shrimp sally lightfoot crab Foxface Rabbitfish Naso Tang (I know he will outgrow this tank, by that time I'll have a 180 ready for him) Psychedelic Mandarin -- fat and sassy any idea's? Thank you, Wayne Pierce >> Hey Wayne, thanks for writing. Yours may be the final goosing I need to finally get my family Caryophylliidae, Stony Corals We love and hate article finished. Catalaphyllias/Elegance corals are NOT easy to keep. One more time on their requirements:1) Not clean water. They live mostly in inner lagoons and reef flats with high nutrient levels... in the mud...2) Horizontal orientation... Not vertical or on an angle as in NOT on an incline of live rock. They live in the mud.3) Not endlessly blasted by current coming from one (linear) direction. Where do they live in the wild? In the mud, where it's pretty calm. There's more, but you get my point. What's more I'm amazed that more folks in the trade and hobby don't 'fess up about these gorgeous corals. Historically they don't do much better than the notorious Poritid family genus Goniopora... But you did by your own admission, bring one of these (flowerpot) corals back from the brink. Maybe you can have the same success with the Elegance. Do you have another system or even a sump you can make into an algae or turtle grass and elegance habitat? Do you mind a few tens of ppm nitrate there? Bob Fenner

Elegance corals  Dear Bob  I have a 200 gal reef tank that has been running for over a year. For light I am using 4 6 ft VHO's and two 250w 10000k halides. Filtration is 4inches of live sand with plenum, the best possible protein skimmer, and 57w U.V. Temp is 80F and I use calcium reactor. My question is; Why cant I keep a elegant coral alive. When I put one in the tank, no matter where, it comes out the first few days maybe 2 weeks but it then begins to slowly waste away staying withdrawn into the skeleton the just rotting apart. I am keeping Acroporas, clams, frogspawn, hammers, torch corals, Blastomussa and even a Pectinia but a elegant will die every time. No one has been able to answer this question even people who are very knowledgeable and have seen the tank. Some of these elegance corals have been doing well in other tanks for weeks but of course die in mine. James Lewis  >> James, you are the "consumer" who broke the writer's back... and I thank you. Am going to move way-up my schedule for writing about Catalaphyllia (Elegance corals). Seems like only yesterday (because it was) that I was taking pictures at the Waikiki Aquarium of their specialized "Elegance Coral Tank". Let me describe this set-up for you (all). It had a few inches of fine sand, a bunch (really too many, I'd clear some so you could see the coral specimen) "grass" (in their case Thalassia hemprichii) a few fishes (a Phalaena goby, gorgeous green filefish, unid'ed rockfish of some sort), not much circulation, no added aeration, but bright light (the plants and algae were giving off obvious gas bubbles from the halides and sunlight (the roof is "missing")... and the specimen? It was alone, by itself, lying in the "mud/sand" horizontal on the bottom. Now, let me assure you, I've collected this (and other) Caryophyllid (the family of this, the Euphyllias like Frogspawn, hammer...) corals in the wild, and this is how all Elegance corals I've seen live: Horizontal, in relatively stagnant, grassy areas, with bright light, low circulation, with no other stinging celled animals around, in probably "high nutrient" settings. And how do aquarists by and large try to keep Catalaphyllias? In vertical orientations, with brisk, constant circulation, in almost nutrient-free water, with other aggressive stinging-celled animals...  Now, does all this make more/better/any sense? These animals are being kept in barely to un-tolerable conditions. They don't live in environments like your other corals at all. The places where I've seen them live are more like wild conditions... Bob Fenner