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FAQs about Elegance Coral Health/Disease & Pests 2

FAQs on Elegance Coral Disease: Elegance Coral Disease/Pests 1, Elegance Coral Health 3, Elegance Coral Health 4,
FAQs on Elegance Disease by Category: Diagnosing, Environmental (Pollution/Poisoning, Lighting...), Nutritional, Social (Allelopathy), Trauma, Pathogenic (Infectious, Parasitic, Viral) Predatory/Pest, Treatments 

Articles on: Coral Pests and Disease; pests, predators, diseases and conditions by Sara Mavinkurve, Catalaphyllia Coral, Caryophylliids, Large Polyp Stony Corals

FAQs on Stony Coral Disease by Category: Diagnosing, Environmental (Pollution/Poisoning, Lighting...), Nutritional, Social (Allelopathy), Trauma, Pathogenic (Infectious, Parasitic, Viral) Predatory/Pest, Treatments 

Elegance Corals, Elegance Corals 2Elegance Coral Identification, Elegance Coral Behavior, Elegance Coral Selection, Elegance Coral Compatibility, Elegance Coral Selection, Elegance Coral Systems, Elegance Coral Feeding, Elegance Coral Reproduction, Caryophyllid ID, Caryophyllid Compatibility, Caryophyllid Systems, Caryophyllid Selection, Caryophyllid Behavior, Caryophyllid Feeding, Caryophyllid Disease, Caryophyllid Propagation/Reproduction,

Re: Elegance and some folks Acting Funny  10/26/07 Oh I get it. You can not explain something, so it MUST be luck. You tell me "good luck" with my attitude, but how about your absolute belief that if it is not done "your way," then it is "dumb luck." <Mmm, not luck> Good luck with THAT. I still think it would be much more interesting for you to take a look at my year-long photo diary and comment on how in the world a tiny elegance and a tiny Zoanthid colony have BOTH exploded to 4-6x their sizes in a year's time inside a bone stock 14 gal BioCube. <I don't discount that some people have better fortune, are better, more diligent aquarists... Do have success with said small systems... Even with Caryophylliids> Don't you think it says something about this particular specimen? Or its keeper's level of care? Aren't there hundreds of elegance enthusiasts who would love to understand what works and what doesn't?? <Oh yes. Do tell> As someone who studies this stuff, isn't this even remotely interesting to you? <Mmm, yes> Maybe it's my level of care, maybe it's the coral, maybe it's luck. But I think if you went through these pages of notes and photos, you might be able to draw conclusions that someone less experienced (me) might be missing... <I strongly encourage you to expand here. Write up your diary notes, provide pix if you can... I will gladly help you get this work into both print and e- media... for pay. Bob Fenner, whose old article on the lack of success with C. jardinei is posted... on WWM>

Re: Elegance Acting Funny  10/26/07 I have had an online diary for months, and so did the previous owner of this tank/corals. I am in the process of trying to acquire all of his files, as the site that he frequented apparently lost its domain name. I'm not interested in $$$. I want to know why these corals are predictably dying off in 500 gallon tanks with optimal flow, skimmers, calc reactors, fuges, sumps, and 5-figure lighting systems, <Those 5-figure lighting systems may actually be the problem.> yet mine is thriving in an acrylic box under weak fluoros on top of an aragonite sub while bathing in Tropic Marin salt water that is barely moving. <This is not at all surprising to me. Recent work done by a guy named Darrell (www.elegancecoral.org) shows that elegance corals coming from the Indo-Pacific in recent years need much lower lighting (and different husbandry) than elegance corals which were collected 10 to 15 years ago. This is because collectors had to move from shallower to deeper waters as the shallower waters were over collected and nearly depleted of the corals.> It doesn't follow logic, which suggests we need to take a closer look at the research upon which this "logic" is based. <It IS based on logic though. It just so happens that it's a logic that has been lost on the hobby until very recently. And that logic is that your coral came from deeper waters and you kept it under weak lighting and fed it at least one live fish (which I'm sure it probably appreciated). What's going on here is that you made a lot of "mistakes" that ended up being right for this particular coral. So, I'm sorry, but in a big way, Bob is right. You got lucky. But please don't be so offended by me (us) saying so. Some of the world's greatest inventions and discoveries (from super glue to Penicillin) were made by careless researchers who just got lucky. It's happened to me too. I once tossed a dying Turbinaria sp. coral I had given up on into a tank I neglected and didn't think a proper habitat for any coral. By sheer LUCK, and for reasons I'm still not entirely sure of, this was exactly the environment the coral apparently needed. It's now healthier than any Turbinaria sp. coral I've ever had and at least as healthy as any I've seen in any aquarium. What I did was not wise and not based on any logic at all. I thought I had condemned the coral to certain death when I actually did the best thing for it (apparently). This only shows how little we actually know/understand about these wonderful animals. We try our best, but to a large extent, they're still quite mysterious, under-studied and sometimes unpredictable. If you really do care, contact Darrell and tell him your story. See if your experience (and excellent records) can't help him support his theory and work. Best, Sara M.>

Re: Elegance Acting Funny  10/27/07 Hi Sarah - <Actually, my mother named me after St. Luke's secret mistress whose name was "Sara" without the 'h.' ;-)> I visit his website often and I have read the deep-water/low light theory. I can tell from my experience that my elegance loves the fluoros at 12-16 hours per day. "Bright But Not Hot." I think that's the key. <Seems likes it.> I am going to be removing 5# of live rock from the display, break it up, and put it in the rear chamber of my tank to allow the elegance to grow more. <good plan> As far as being lucky... I don't buy it. A close observer can tell when something is working and when it is not. I have changed a lot of different things to get the elegance where it is now. <Well, maybe you started out a little lucky and got smart. That happens a lot too. In any case, thank you for writing in and sharing your experience. I'm certainly impressed with your level of commitment and eagerness to share with the rest of the hobby. In my opinion, that counts for far more than luck. I hope you and Darrell get in touch. More people should be aware of what you, he and several others are now discovering about these corals. Good luck and please do keep us updated! Best, Sara M.>

Re: Elegance Acting Funny --avalanche! 11/3/07 I have big problems this morning guys!!!! One of my monster Turbos dislodged a piece of live rock in my tank, and it fell on to the corner of my elegance. It may have been laying on her for hours! <eek!> The skeleton is not cracked, but the coral has receded. Can/Should I do an iodine dip? What is the best way to do it? <I hope Bob will correct me if I'm wrong, but I wouldn't do an iodine dip. This might just stress the coral out at this point. If anything, I'd increase the water flow a little around the coral. Definitely give it some extra TLC (maybe some extra food). If it's otherwise healthy, it should heal in time.> HELP!!! <I wish we could help more. :( Good luck, Sara>
Re: Elegance Acting Funny 11/3/07
It is receding more today. It's just the right side of the coral. Is there any way to cure it? <Have you "cleaned" the wound with a turkey baster? I wish I could tell you there's something more you could do, but I doubt it. :-( I'll send this over to Bob to see if he has any other ideas... Sara M.>

Sick Elegance, Rose Brain health, & possible Lithophyllum sp. ID 10/18/07 Hi Folks, I have been searching your site for answers and with all the information I've read I am less sure than I was before I started. <It happens to all of us. :-)> I have a few questions and I am a recent student of this hobby so please bear with me. I am running a 265 gallon, 32in x 32in x 5ft, with a 29 gallon sump with skimmer, we don't do anything small in this house. Currently, I am in the process of slowly filling my tank, so I have started at one end with a 400W MH and 4-40W fluorescent actinic. I will be adding another 400W MH at the other end when I have life to put under it. First, I have enclosed a few photos of my rose brain, elegance and an unknown. The unknown was a skeleton covered in mushrooms that had a great shape. When I got it in my tank a tiny portion of the skeleton was still alive and started to regrow, recovering the skeleton with life, any idea what this could be? <Very nice recovery. It looks like some kind of Lithophyllum sp.> Under actinic only this glows green, but with MH it looks a tan colour. The other 4 pics are of my formerly healthy elegance and brain and their now sick images. The elegance from what I read on your site looks like the virus that Julian Sprung describes. Over the course of about a week parts of it started to shrivel. Now it's been like this for about 3 weeks. I am hoping for the best and just looking for suggestions. <There's been some recent promising investigation into the cause of (and possibly cure for) Elegance coral disease. Please see here: http://www.elegancecoral.org/Page_4.html> My brain on the other hand had almost tripled in size from this healthy photo(daytime) and now for about 5 days has continued to shrink. The colour is still good but there is no puffiness to it at all. <Actually, it looks a little bleached. You should move it to an area of less intense light or raise your light. For general care of these corals, please see here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/trachyphlliidae.htm> I have done a partial water change and then today I noticed that the little sponges that hitchhike on live rock, the one that look like cotton balls, have all started to die off. I can't figure out what has happened. My ammonia, nitrite and nitrate are all at 0 and the ph is 8.4. <I think you probably have too much light over your tank. Some sponges don't like a lot of light.> Also in this tank, 130lbs live rock, Rhodactis mushrooms, 2 Fungia - green and orange Platygyra, Blastomussa, lg coral covered in Christmas tree worms, a Purple, a blue and a yellow tang, 2 small clownfish, a lg orange and green BTA and a small rose BTA, a sm Xenia, a frogspawn, chili sponge 3 cleaner shrimp, a debelius lobster, multiple mushrooms, candy coral, green star polyp, a red and yellow feather duster, many snails and hermit crabs, and of course anything that hitch hiked in on the live rock. Everything else in this tank appears healthy, eats normally and seems to be thriving. The only thing that has changed since just before the brain started to recede is the addition of 5 lbs of live rock, and the Rhodactis mushrooms and a move of the purple tang in from the QT. Should I just leave it or is there any suggestions about intervention? <I don't think the new additions are causing your coral troubles.> Thanks in advance for your help, us newbies really appreciate your time and consideration. Christine
<De nada,
Sara M.>
Horn coral... Elegance on the way out, bug ID...  -- 10/18/07 Hello again, Mr. Fenner. <Thomas> I have good news and new problem news. Good news first, My clowns are living parasite free for a week now, and the lost tissue is growing back nicely, the quarantine tank 10G worked well to dose the Formalin/Blue, and the fish liked the fake coral better than the real thing.. I have tapered off the dosing of formalin and plan to add back the clowns in a few days after being in just pure saltwater. Should I give them a fresh water bath before? I thought I read this somewhere. The neon gobies have been added as well, but they have not cleaned the fish yet. <Okay> On to my new problem, regarding a Horn coral that is new to my tank and falling apart. <I see this> I have read over the WWM and still am not sure of what to do. I originally placed it low in my tank in the sand substrate, and low flow. The coral looked ok, and there was a low light, but was not coming out of its skeleton. It was a slow one to come out at the LFS too. There is plenty of flow in my tank but on a wave maker using the Nanostream Tunze head and no direct power heads hitting corals. I have 155w PC's in a 30g tank. When the coral began to fall apart, I saw a hermit crab eating it, I am not sure if it was before or after the tissue loss, so I moved it higher to see if it could be saved, I mistakenly placed it vertical with it lodged in live rock under better light, but then read the site and found my mistake to keep it more arched, I am not sure if the base needs to be in substrate or not. <... is this a Catalaphyllia? Horn coral refers to Rugosas (paleo...) and Hydnophoras...> Anyhow, I flushed out a lot of dead tissue with a turkey baster and gave it another day in the rock before moving it back to the sand. <This Euphylliid lives in mud... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/elegance.htm  and the linked files above> I am now not sure what to do, I have about 30% that looks normal, and the rest is very torn or recessed into its skeleton. I can quarantine it, but have only one 10G tank and would have to move the clowns back. (the Blue that stained the silicone sealant wont leach back into the water will it?) <No> will it come back with time and patients. <... maybe> Photos attached to show the coral. Third and final question I have a good colony of small pod bugs now growing, not sure what type they are, some have two antenna and some have only one, but then I am also noticing these small white dots with what looks to be yellow eggs of some sort inside, I am trying to send a photo under 10X magnification so they are relatively small, but bigger than the bugs, so I am not sure how they got there. They are on the live rock and aquarium glass. Thomas Lloyd Cetta <... can't tell from the pic... You might read through the various invert. ID FAQs files. BobF>


Growth on Elegance Coral -- 06/07/07 Hi Crew Hope all is well. Have pics for you to confirm my research. I have a growth on the shell <? Where?> of my Elegance Coral and I am wondering if I should be concerned. Does this look like a sea spike? (good) or jelly? (bad) <I don't make out any such growth... though some of the images show a bleached condition... and this Catalaphyllia is mis-placed... live in the soft substrate (sand/mud) with the apex of their skeleton "pointed" down... Please send your image/s with a "circled" area where you think something is amiss.> Be aware that the pics where you can see the growth are taken the moment the lights come on in the tank, and I sent 2 pics to show how open the elegance becomes about an hour later. Everything looks good, she does not seem to mind the growth, and the emerald crab eats around the growth. By the way, the elegance coral is one year old and other than this is doing wonderful. Ron:>) <... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/elegance.htm  And the linked files above. Bob Fenner>


Re: Growth on/of Elegance Coral (more info) - 6/7/07 Bob Fenner <Yo!> Growth is on the clam shell base, please see pics where I have circled and made notes in photos. By the way, the growth is the same color as the elegance, but it does have a bumpy (pointed) surface and something like a mouth opening where I notated on the side. Keep in mind there are low resolution pics, I can send a full rez image that would be about 500 kb. <These are fine... this is very likely "just" the skeleton of this Catalaphyllia...> as for positioning 1) Placed in horizontal orientation, point down, mouths and tentacles facing upward, This is the orientation this coral has been in since I got it one year ago <... the natural orientation of the species> NOT in vertical settings as they are often arranged in reef systems. They really need to be placed "on their backs" Has never been in this position. 2) Semi-still waters. They come from settings with actually very little water movement, The first 3 months I had this coral the placement in the photo was the placement in the tank, it sits about 12'' under the return from the skimmer and it spread to about 8 to 10 inches in diameter. I read your article and quite a few others about placement around the end of August 2006. So out of concern I moved it to an area of the tank that has very little water flow and point down in the sand, over the next 3 months it began receding until by December it had closed up and receded into its clam shell not opening at all and beginning to separate in the middle. <Interesting> I was scared and thought it was a goner and decided to go back to what worked. I put it right back into the notch in the live rock where it was doing so well in the first place and in 3 weeks it had started to grow and expand again to where it is today, almost back to the same size and shape as last August. The only difference between then and now is when I do feed her, she snatches closed REALLY fast, almost in a heartbeat.( I feed her Coralife Invertebrate Target Food about every 3 weeks or so.) <... also> As to your concern about bleaching... I cannot answer that with certainty because this is the only Catalaphyllia I have ever actually seen. It is the same color it has always been since I have owned it, a really nice tan flesh color with a hint of green hue and nice purple tips as in the photo (Elegant Coral open 1 lz). that I sent you before. Ron:>) PS... I am a newbie, so please don't LOL too hard when I ask what RMF stands for :>? <Heee! Sorry... my initials... Robert Milton Fenner>

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