Leather Coral- Victim of Chemical Warfare? 05/10/08
Hi,
<Hey there! Scott F. in today!>
I bought a Toadstool Leather coral a few weeks ago, at first it looked fine out and happy. It's on a piece of rock with 2 mushrooms and polyp colony been that way it's whole life. When we put it in our 40 gal. tank it might of touch the mushrooms, because after a few days it got 2 (I would say burn) spots on the edge near the mushrooms. So we moved the rock so it wouldn't be touching, now at that time the coral was still coming out just not where the spots were. Well now it won't come out at all and it keeps excreting and looks alittle shrunken. I did take it out and smell it, it doesn't smell bad.(been reading) Everything else in tank looks great, Xenia, Mushrooms, Frog Spawn, polyps, hermit crabs,Purple Tang, Clownfish, Damsels, Sandsifting Star. Any idea on what could be hurting this leather coral? And if it does die how or should I take it out. Thank You, Kristy
<Hmm.. hard to say, but you did indicate that you have Frogspawn coal in there. This is a very aggressive coral, and doesn't even need to be touching the Leather to affect it in a negative way. I'd consider removing the Leather or the Frogspawn. May be as simple as that! Once removed from the source of irritation (well, really chemical "warfare" called allelopathy), your Leather should start to open once again, bigger and better than ever, unless it was seriously damaged. Sounds to me like it was not, so you've got a good chance of getting the coral to fully recover. If it does die, however, you'd be best advised to excise the coral from the rock by slicing it carefully with a sharp razor blade or knife. Best of luck to you! Regards, Scott F.>

Expert opinion . . . and suggestions - coral stocking/compatibility 5/10/08 Hello crew, <Greetings Charlie> I need a little bit of help again. By the way, give Mr. Fenner a great big thanx for me. <will pass that on> My previously 'severely obese goby' has managed to slim down just a bit. At least no longer looks like he will explode.  At any rate, I'd like to add more coral to my tank and need a little guidance. I've included a picture of the one and only coral I currently have. It's about 3" high, 4" wide, and moves quite nicely in the currents. I think it's a capnella. I was hoping you could confirm, and potentially add even more, if there is more (not sure exactly how this whole Latin scientific naming thing works). <Cladiella, Capnella, Lemnalia, and many other Octocorals are difficult to ID by a picture> I've read on your site how many corals are toxic to one another. I want to make sure I don't get anything incompatible with what I already have. If this is a capnella (or whatever it is), are there any corals that I must avoid? My most favored corals are in the LPS group (elegance, torch, galaxea, etc). These are all listed as having sweeper tentacles but nothing mentions chemical warfare. A few of the polyps also interest me - clove, starburst, anthelia. Most of these are listed as peaceful. <Faithful use of Granular Activated Carbon and water changes will solve chemical warfare issues> In time I want to add several more to the tank but it's a slow go - maybe 1 or 2 per year. For reference, we are speaking of a 155 gallon with about 180 lbs of LR. Spacing (sweeper tentacles taken into consideration) shouldn't be an issue since the tank is 6 ft long. I guess my main concern is the potential for chemical warfare. <See above. While we recommend stocking slowly, you can go faster than that if you choose.> Your site has mentioned numerous times that it's often best to stick with one type of coral, LPS, SPS, softs, etc. Though the ones I've mentioned above are from different groups, are they generally compatible? <LPS, SPS, and Softs are hobbyist terms. They don't exist in the scientific realm. As a general rule, it's best to not mix them. However, since you are taking into account sweepers and chemical warfare, I see no obvious problem with your favorites.> Your opinions and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, as always. Thanx, Charlie <You are more than welcome.> <<Thanks Curt -Sara M.>>

Disappearing Mushroom and Ricordea Polyps – 04/14/08
I awoke this morning, looked into my tank, and to my horror I saw that all my coral polyps had been eaten.
<<…!>>
I had just put in my tank a red mushroom, a green Ricordea, and a blue/purple Ricordea within the past week. The livestock in my tank is as follows:
1 Yellow Tang
1 Tomato Clownfish
1 Lawn mower Blenny
3 Damsels
1 Neon Goby
! Coral Beauty Angelfish
10 Blue Leg Hermit Crabs
2 Turbo Snails
25 Cerith Snails
5 Scarlet Leg Hermit Crab
1 Condy Anemone
I thought all theses critters were reef safe.
<<Depends on your definition re…is a relative term, very few organisms are totally so>>
Checked again today on the internet to confirm my belief. Any ideas who the culprit could be?
<<Are you certain the Corallimorphs were eaten? Nothing you have listed comes to mind as being “fond” of the noxious organisms that you say are missing>>
I must also mention that the tank is 45 gallons.
<<Yeeikes!…much too small for the Tang and the Angel. If the polyps were truly eaten, then perhaps this was a manifestation of behavioral retardation by the Tang or Angel due to the too-small confines of the tank>>
I know a bit overstocked.
<<More than “a bit”>>
I have been trying to downsize by sacrificing the Damsels but they are hard to catch.
<<A better start would be to find a new home for the Tang>>
Could the overcrowding be a culprit as well?
<<Indeed>>
There appears plenty of stuff (algae, diatoms, etc.) for the inverts. I must also mention that I received a shipment (10 of the Cerith Snails and the Scarlet Leg Hermit Crabs) 36 hours ago from a reputable on-line source that I have used many times with no problems. Could be coincidental but the shipment may be the problem but I can't be sure.
<<The Cerith Snails are not the issue here. The Hermit Crabs are quite opportunistic, and if not well fed before/after acquisition……>>
I don't want to make this mistake again that's for sure. Any ideas?
<<A stated… But another thought…perhaps you have a nocturnal hitchhiker/predator. A Mollusk of some sort with a taste for Corallimorphs maybe. Seems strange the Polyps would disappear overnight without you noticing anything if the fishes were at fault>>
Thanks
<<Regards, EricR>>

Re: Disappearing Mushroom and Ricordea Polyps – 04/14/08
Thanks for the response and your insight.
<<Very happy to share…>>
Overstocking of tank due to impulse buying wife.
<<Mmm, a dilemma indeed. You don’t want to dampen the enthusiasm/lose the buying power, yet……>>
I've tried to find an anti-wife alarm for my tank, haven't found one yet. Considering cutting her hands off!
<<Seems a bit drastic [grin]…perhaps some “shared” buying excursions (and some educating) instead. EricR>>

Cnid. compatibility with butterflies  3/30/08
Hi,
I went through the FAQs and articles in the website.
Not able to get a clear picture so asking you folks by email (Sorry for the trouble).
Can I keep the following inverts with butterflies?
1. Leather coral
2. Mushrooms
3. Sea Fan
4. Palythoa
5. cucumber
6. Xenia
7. Anything else I can keep?
<Sure, an ocean full>
I do know that LPS will be totally out but what of SPS like Acropora?
How many butterfly types can I mix in a 120 gal tank?
<Depends on the species... two-three>
Cheers
Ranjith
<And you! B>

Micromussa… Thoughts on Combating Allelopathy – 03/07/08
Hi Crew,
<Hi Sam, Mich here.>
I tried to get a picture but my Kodak just does not get it clear even when I use the setting that says it is for less than 27 inches away.
<Look for a "Macro" setting, the symbol often looks like a daisy or a flower.>
Anyway, I want to know if what I bought is in fact a Micromussa.
<Hard to say with out a photo.>
The person who sold it to me sent me a picture first
<How about this picture? Does it look more like this:
http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&q=Micromussa&btnG=Search+Images
or more like this:
http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&q=blastomussa&btnG=Search+Images >
but what I got does not look like the picture.
<Often the case, but does not necessarily mean deception is involved.>
But I do like it and just want to know.
<Is responsible to know the animal you are caring for.>
The polyps are smaller than a dime and are an orangey (no such word)
<Nope, but I understand what you are saying!>
tan color with the centers a brighter orange.
<OK.>
The tell tale sign of what this is, is what I saw this morning. I could see some tiny tentacles that I would not notice except that I was looking for it. And the mouth was not just a dot in the center as it usually is but was elongated like it had a nose shaped like a funnel sticking out about 1/8 of an inch (O>).
<Sounds like the tin man!>
On another topic, most tanks with corals have this chemical warfare going on.
<Mmm, I'd go as far as saying most tanks with coral have allelopathic issues!>
It would be nice if someone came up with a test to show it
<I suspect it would be similar to allergy testing, could be done, but doing it repeatedly isn't terrible helpful or informative. We are aware that many corals kept in captivity produce toxic compounds, and that these compounds are present in our systems.>
and an antidote to equalize it.
<We have the "antidote". The simplest, easiest, most cost effective way to limit the effects of these toxins is frequent water changes. For example, why would you test your hands for potential infective agents and then cover your hands with multiple expensive antibiotics when simple hand washing is more effective, easier and most economical? I should also mention that activated carbon can be useful. More here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/chemFiltrMar.htm >
Thanks
Sam
<Welcome, Mich>

About corals and anemones in a two month old tank... Not a joke? A mis-mix w/ no pix, useful info...    2/19/08
I have been trying to figure out if it is a soft coral or an anemone. It looks exactly like a brown colt coral, that is as close as I can get to finding a soft coral that looks like this. It is in my friends tank, but she says that the pet store told her it was an anemone.
<... do you have an image?>
I have looked at many different types of anemones but none that look or resemble this, that is what led me to believe it was a colt coral. She said that she can touch it and move it around, which leads me to believe it is a soft coral as well. Though it looks and flows like it is floppy and it has edged itself underneath a rock, so it is very hard to get picture of it. There is a damsel and a royal Gramma that swim extremely close to it as well and doesn't seem bothered by it at all.
There is also an anemone is her tank that is off white at the base and the tentacles are a deep purple, I have not been able to indentify it either.
<... you have read on WWM re Anemones, their identification?>
I have come close to matching it with a purple Condy. However at the ends of the tentacles, there are tiny hook like tentacles, and sometimes the tentacles look a bit shriveled. I have searched and the Condy is the closest match, any ideas on that one?
<... Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/marine/inverts/cnidaria/anthozoa/anemones.htm
and peruse the above linked ID FAQs files>
And, she just purchased a tube anemone,
<...?! I hope not a Cerianthid... very incompatible... see WWM re...>
But this one is very bright almost fluorescent pink in color. Could this be natural or do you think it has been dyed?
<... My friend, what is this? A guessing game? Send photos>
Two more questions, she said she saw a 4 inch white fuzzy thing come out of the live rock that she has never seen before, any ideas to what that could be? And she is going on vacation for a week, is it safe to leave the tank that long without them being fed or should she have someone come over to feed? She feeds the tube anemone every other day and the purple one about every three days. She also puts some type of liquid food in for the colt coral look a like thing about every three days.
Thank you so much for tolerating my questions, I am more of a novice in this as she is and I just want to help her out as well as educate myself.
<Have just skipped down... your answers and much more that needs to be made known is posted/archived on WWM. Do yourself, your friend and esp. the livestock in both your care the giant favor of learning to/using the indices, search tool... Bob Fenner>

Re: Coral eater  2/4/08
Hi,
I have Halichoeres chrysus. Could the fire fish be eating my corals?
<Microdesmids rarely chew on Cnidarians>
Also can the hermit crabs be a predator?
<Oh yes. B>
Regards,
PraKash

SW questions, Cnid. comp. and NO3 reduction  – 1/26/08
Hi Crew,
My first question is about lighting. I have a 10 gallon which is almost 5 years old. It has 4 different candy canes with a total of about 40 heads.
Also four hairy mushrooms (browns with blue lines) that are from one original.
<Would be very big trouble if introduced all at once...>
All my other mushrooms (reds, greens and blues) have shrunk and just disappeared.
<To be expected>
In fact there always seems to be one that does great and the others either just hang in or start shrinking.
<Bingo>
I have 65w PC's. The bulb I currently have is 10k and it will need to be replaced soon. Should I continue with this or can I go with a 50/50.
<I would not change>
I plan on staying with
candy canes and mushrooms.
<And not add any more/other Cnidarians>
I have lots of coralline on the glass and very little on the rock although it has started to increase on the rock lately.
My second question relates to nitrates. I am under the impression that it takes a DSB to have bacteria to process nitrates and if I do not have a DSB then water changes and/or a skimmer will help reduce it, water by dilution and a skimmer by eliminating the source pollutants.
<Actually, not so... for biological conversion (denitrification) requires some/any sort of hypo- to an-aerobic setting/media, very low flow rate through, thereabouts... Doesn't have to be... a DSB>
The first 3 years that I had my tank my nitrates were usually around .20. But for the last 2 years it is zero and I do not have a skimmer and I change 1 gallon every week. Does that mean I do have some nitrate eating bacteria or is my test kit on the blink. I use one of the cheap test kits (AP's master kit).
Thanks
<Likely there is no appreciable NO3... Bob Fenner>

Chemical warfare - 1/24/08
Dear Crew,
<Wesley>
Thanks for the great site. I wish I had spent more time reading before I bought my corals!
First I'll give you my tank specs: 50g, 2 x 150 watt MH (20k), protein skimmer, 60 lb live rock, 40 lb sand. 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 0 nitrate, <0.01 ppm Phos, 1280 Mg, 8.3 pH when measured toward the end of my 10 hr light cycle. One maroon clown, 1 sand- sifting goby and no plans for anymore fish.
<Sounds good and nicely under stocked>
I think there's a war going on in my tank, here's why:
9 months ago I upgraded to metal halides so I could start keeping clams and Acros. I sold all my corals except a rock with Zoanthids, some pulsing xenias and a Hydnophora. Added a clam, 3 across and 2 Montipora to the tank over the span of three months. Then I added a RBTA...
<Boom, problem solved, too many corals of different Class in a space too small!>
This set up lasted for about 3 months with no problems, then the Montipora started to bleach. My phosphates were high so I bought a RO/DI system, started thoroughly washing frozen food, and attributed this to the Montipora deaths. Then two weeks ago about half of my snails died and now some of the across are bleaching. The only thing that has changed since adding the RBTA is the number of Zoanthids. Started at about 30 and is now closer to 200, maybe more. A chemical war between the Zoanthids and the RBTA is my guess. The xenias are nearest the bleaching corals, could that be a problem too?
<Xenia in an SPS tank is never a good idea if long-term success is planned, I’d take it all out and swap it for credit, has a nasty habit of taking over! The same goes for the Zoanthids, which are notoriously toxic, and in a comparatively small space they can wreak havoc. If you want SPS success then I would remove all other corals and also the RBTA which will either injure itself or your other inhabitants, most likely both from its untimely demise from the above. With only SPS in the tank it will allow you to build back up your stock levels and get a real feel for how to run an SPS tank and then attempt if you wish a few other less chemically-intrusive corals, namely LPS appropriately distanced of course>
What do I need to do to save my tank?
<As above, remove all corals other than SPS and focus on the care requirements of these alone for a while. Credit the rest of the stock in, but if you cant bare to let it all go, the Xenia should be your primary concern along with the RBTA. Also some Polyfilter and PO4 remover will help>
I'm going to do a water change and remove the Zoanthids while awaiting your reply.
<Perfect start, but Xenia!!>
Thanks,
Wesley
<Hope this helps, you were obviously off to a good start as SPS healthy for months initially shows a good grasp to build on! Olly>

Re: chemical warfare, Cnid.s   1/25/08
Dear Crew,
<Hi again Wesley>
Thank you so much for the quick reply. Just a few more questions: You said remove everything but the SPS corals, does this include the clams? I don't have another tank which I can remove them to other than a five gallon bucket I use for mixing / aerating salt water - currently in use by the Zoanthids. And about the Hydnophora / horn coral; is this ok to leave in the tank? The horn coral and Acros next to it have all faired well, granted they were at the other end of the tank and near their own power head.
<The clams can stay in the tank as their interaction with the SPS will be negligible and the Hydnophora can also remain>
Maintenance: I do have some ROWA ready to use that I can put in. The reason its not in is because the phosphates are low right now. Do I understand you correctly that this may also help with other chemicals/toxins in the water?
<A Polyfilter would be more useful in that capacity but you can run PO$, especially ROWA, constantly without negative effect to withdrawn any phosphate that does and will occur>
Also my lights; I'm using USHIO 20k 150 watt HQI's, they are about 9 months old now. Do these need to be changed? I haven't experienced any increased algae growth, but I've read this doesn't necessarily mean the lights haven't 'shifted' to a less beneficial spectrum. I know 14k or 10K would be better but I don't have room to add actinics, and find the 20k pleasing.
<I don’t recall the depth of your tank and it is possible to maintain SPS perfectly well with 20k bulbs but the PAR output as you probably know is quite low. As this is your first venture into keeping these coral then I would change to 10k or 14k, I imported the Phoenix 14k DE and have been very very pleased with that and the colour it gives will please you so that would be my recommendation. At this early stage whilst you are getting to grips with how an SPS tank works I feel more help from your lights in terms of coral nutrition will leave you more time to concentrate on the other critical elements>
While healthy SPS is my priority, eventually you said LPS might be ok. Really the only thing I would care to risk is a brain coral. Would this be ok?
<Definitely. I run an SPS system and the only other coral that I have in it are my collection of Trachyphyllia and as long as their tentacles aren’t within reach you should be fine here>
Finally, removing the xenias and Zoanthids means removing about 1/3 of the live rock. Any concerns about bioload? As I indicated in the previous email I'm on essentially a Berlin system; just sand, rocks, Eheim canister filter, and a protein skimmer.
<Is it not possible to chisel the inhabited areas off the rock, of course taking care not to leave any metal deposits? The bioload should cope as long as you don’t add anything else for a while, increase flow if possible and keep running the ROWA as this will take care of the phosphate that is released when you start shifting rock structures around – detritus agitation>
End of questions, I know that was a lot hah. Thank you for the advice and quick response. On my way to the LFS with a bucket of Zoanthids and xenia right now!
<Good to hear it, hope all this is helping and I think we’re almost sorted>
Best regards,
Wesley
<Olly>
 

Silent Killer In My Tank... just Cnid. allelo...   12/23/07 Hi Crew, <Jon> I was referred to you by the Foster's & Smith Tech Team. <Many fine folks there> I have been corresponding with them regarding my tank problems for about a week (to no avail). Here is the problem, for a little over a month, some of my coral and invertebrates are dying off, while others are thriving. The following livestock are effected: Brain Coral (looks as if the soft individual polyps have receded and what's left is just the skeleton), Plate Coral (the mouth remains wide open and starting to tear, while the tentacles no longer come out), Frog Spawn (have detached from the branches of rock it was on and floated away behind the live rock), Bulb Tip Anemone (Its shrinking every day, the tentacles are almost non existent) Fancy Tiger Striped Star Fish (is missing two of it's legs). Parameters get checked weekly. I do a 10% water change weekly. I sense a virus. <Mmm, not me...> The history, equipment, parameters, livestock and pictures are as follows: History: The tank has been running for approximately two years. No major setbacks until now. The two newest additions were the halide lighting and the nitrate filter. Both have been running about six weeks. The Anemone and Frog Spawn are about 9 months in the tank. The Plate and Brain Coral have been in the tank about two years and have never had a problem, until about a month ago. I have not had any new livestock in the tank for at least six months. Equipment: 70 gallon tank 4 wave makers Sump Tank Biological Filter (biospheres) Protein Skimmer 10 W UV light Nitrate Filter (running about 6 weeks now) 314W Halide/Blue Actinic Lighting 1 Lunar Light Chiller Phosphate filter bag Parameters: Alk- 300 Ca- 450 Mg- >1280 Nitrate- 20 (down from 40 a month ago) Nitrites- 0 Ph- 8.0 Phosphate- .1 Specific Gravity- 1.024 Temperature- 71-73 degrees Specimens: 2-Blue Damsels 2- Four Stripe Damsels 1- Maroon Clownfish 1- Tomato Clownfish 1- Yellow Tang 1- Brain Coral Bullseye Mushrooms Button Polyps Candy Cane Coral Yellow Colony Polyps Frog Spawn (pretty much doomed at this point) Hairy Mushroom 1- Plate Coral 1- Blood Red Fire Shrimp 1- Bulb Anemone 1- Zebra Moray Eel 1- Black Longspine Urchin 1- Fancy Sea Star 1- Fancy Tiger Striped Several Dwarf Red Tip Hermit Crabs Some Flat worms Several Margarita Snails Several Scarlet Reef Hermit Crabs Tubiculous Polychaete Worms 50 lbs.-Fiji Premium Live Rock 50 lbs. Tonga Ridge Shelf Live Rock Fiji Mud Crushed Coral Substrate (2") Chaetomorpha Algae Pictures Enclosed: #2152- Frog Spawn floating around the tank #2148- Anemone shrinking #2149- Brain Coral receding #2150- Plate Coral w/ mouth wide open and torn #2151- Branches of rock where the Frog Spawn removed themselves I thank you for your time with this situation. I just hope that if this is a virus, the whole tank doesn't get infested. Please advise. Thanks again, Jon Hess <It is highly likely you have a classical allelopathological situation here... Most likely triggered by the Entacmaea presence... Please start reading here: http://wetwebmedia.com/cnidcompppt.htm and the linked file above. This is such a common situation of induced problems, am making the topic my annual/08 pitch routine. Bob Fenner> Re: Silent Killer In My Tank, using WWM - 12/23/07 Hi Bob, Thanks for the valuable information. You raise an interesting point, which leads me to ask, should I look to eliminate the BTA? Can I eventually stock the tank with more coral or am I at my limit? Jon <Keep reading Jon... Onto Entacmaea compatibility. BobF>

Re: Calcium vs. Alkalinity, now Cnid. incomp. - 12/12/07
Thanks for your previous feedback.
<<My pleasure>>
I have noticed both in the WWM site as well as your response to my posting, that soft corals and anemones are not considered compatible.
<<I don’t recommend them be mixed with “any” sessile inverts due to the anemone’s tendency to “wander” and come in physical contact re...but additionally, most soft corals also prove to be very noxious to the anemone>>
I am a bit surprised that I have not been under this impression previously and I know at least a couple of fellow aquarists that also have been keeping such co-inhabitants.
<<Mmm, yes...I know more then a “few”...even did it myself in my younger days. And have even witnessed such displays at public aquariums.>>
Are there different degrees of compatibility?
<<Compatibility?...no Tolerance?...probably>>
Am I causing harm to either of these creatures?
<<To some degree...most assuredly. These creatures are all aware of each others presence...and likely in constant combat-mode. The soft corals exude noxious chemicals...the anemones release stinging-cells in to the water column...all of which is made worse by the confines of a closed system>>
They seem rather successful.
<<Maybe... But consider that these creatures are expending energies on attack and defense that could be going toward increased health and vigor, growth, even reproduction>>
In actuality, I am keeping many mushrooms, 3 medium sized leathers along with the one (hard?) acropora which has been unintentionally fragmented into several pieces. My anemones are 3 rose's and one very large sebae (white w/lavender tips).
<<Yikes, not a good idea to mix anemone species either... Even a group of conspecifics can be a problem unless they are clones>>
What would you recommend for the future of my creatures? I am not in this to cause harm.
<<Ideally, the anemones would be housed in species specific systems designed for their “long-term” health>>
It seems strange that we get attached to aquarium creatures!!
<<Indeed...though maybe not to the same extent as that for a beloved dog or cat. But I do believe aquarists should at least have compassion for the creatures they keep>>
Gratefully,
Wes J
<<Happy to share my opinions. EricR>>

Re: Unintentionally Kill New Finger Leather? Shroom incomp.  11/23/07
Hello again, WWM!
<Daryl>
Unfortunately, the finger leather coral we chatted about earlier didn't make it. However, I now know about the seriousness of allelopathy!
<Ah, good>
Now, I would like to add a new coral or two to my established tank.
However, I still have mushrooms everywhere! Do I have to remove these mushrooms to have any chance of successfully introducing a new coral?
<Mmm, there are techniques for gradually/getting used to such established settings... in another tank... with some water moved from the existing... perhaps a few of the Corallimorphs...>
The mushrooms are everywhere, like I said. Do you have any suggestions as to how I can move these mushrooms to several loose rocks so I can sell/give some of them away?
<Mmm, likely the existing rock can be cut/broken... with polyps on parts... or a chisel type tool can be employed to sheer part of the rock and bases off...>
After looking in the tank, there has to be at least 50 2-3" mushrooms in this 75 gal tank!
Also, I've successfully fragged two more heads from my toadstool leather.
One of them is nearly 3" tall after only a couple months! Perhaps I should see if the local LFS would like some mushrooms and a toadstool for some new coral?!?
<A very good idea. BobF>
Thanks for all your help!
Daryl

Re: moving and improving... and sugg.s for the Cnid. incomp. art./ppt  11/23/07
Hey Bob,
Sorry it has taken me so long to reply and take a look at your presentation, we are finally at the coast now getting ready to move the tank now. We have been VERY busy. I would love to show you the changes. We have been having some great luck with the aquarium lately. While we are out of town I have someone feeding the tank every day for me with frozen prepared foods I set up in an ice tray. I thawed brine shrimp, Cyclop eeze, and Mysid shrimp added garlic extreme, Zoe and Selcon, let that all soak for an hour then froze them so all that needs to be done is to pop them out, thaw and feed.
<Good technique>
My fiancé was so excited the other day to see a few Chitons in the tank 2 of them had some really cool color to them, our starfish (Fromia sp.) is doing quite well in our tank, it has been 3 months now and it seems happy as can be, I am looking forward to watching it grow and hopefully continue to thrive in this tank. I have some really interesting photos of unidentified critters to show you as well, once I get my computer set back up. I am taking a look at your ppt presentation and I like the direction you are taking with this, great information! One thing I am having trouble with is reading the black type against that blue background.
<I think I will change the rest to the off-light-green then>
In general the page layouts are nice. I like the photos you picked, very good demonstrations. The layering effect is nice as well. Overall a wonderful presentation, all I can think of here is more contrast between the type and the background, and a nice dark background to compliment the photos rather than compete with them, the blue "steals the spotlight", and makes the type hard to focus on, black backgrounds work well for that, perhaps with white type? Maybe use bold font as well? On page 2 I noticed some size variation in the photos, have you thought of balancing the bottom two photos height wise? That may make a difference in the flow of the page. I think the whole thing is great! So are you working on any new projects (books) or planning on such?
<Always a few>
I would love to have more of your works, they have been like bibles to me while learning about my aquatic pets, and teaching my fiancé how to care for them as well. I have gotten the whole family into this stuff now, we often go tide pooling out here, tomorrow is a -1.8 should be nice. We go out and capture critters such as octopus, eels, shrimps, crabs, snails, starfish, urchins etc and take good looks at them, discuss differences in certain animals / species being careful not to harm them and always return them safely to exactly where we got them, sometimes we save a few unfortunate critters from certain doom as well. I look forward to sharing my moving experience with you soon, have a great thanks giving! Sincerely, Brian Crenshaw
<Thank you for sharing and your input Bri. BobF>

Cnid. incomp., crowding... refugium use  11/19/07
hello again
Hi all!
Two purposes to this email, one as an update, in case it helps others, and two, to ask a couple of questions:
Background info:
Main tank - 65 gal, with 4X96 watt lights, one 6700, one 10000, one 460 nm, and one 420 nm. I use a Hydor ETH 300 external heater (I love this unit, very reliable and constant heat input to tank). Lots of live rock, two Phosban reactors used for activated carbon (I switch between them every month - very firm believer in the benefits of activated carbon). Protein skimmer - skimmer, carbon etc. in wet dry sump.
Refugium is a 37 gal. glass tank that I installed acrylic baffles into (acrylic didn't bond well to silicon- it holds well and is strong, but water passes by silicon).
<Right, silicone shouldn't be used to bond acrylic to glass.)
In the main tank I have two rapidly expanding star polyp colonies, lots of pulsating Xenia (started from one colony, now I'm up to about 10), Pavona cactus, hammer coral (one fragment, now expanded to 6 separate clusters), branching Montipora (started from a 1" fragment rubber banded to a rock, now about 3" in diameter and growing, two colonies of Nephthea (or Capnella, not sure), two Sarcophyton elegans, and some mushrooms (on a cluster of rock).
<Ugh, why would you put a Sarcophyton in with a Euphyllia? Sarcophytons are notoriously toxic to a lot of large polyp stony corals.>
Finally two very small Zoanthid polyp rocks, that seem to hold their own, with some small expansion. Buying fragments works out well for me, they're cheaper, and they seem to me to be very hardy.
<...and more "environmentally friendly." :-)>
As for other organisms, have three serpent stars, one Echinometra matthei (hitchhiker who's growing up), multiple hermit crabs, one blue-green Chromis, one Sebae clown, one coral beauty and one keyhole angel (have had these angels for years, seem to leave corals alone), one yellow clown goby, one lawnmower blenny, and one pearly Jawfish.
<All these in a 65g tank? It's going to get crowded as these fish grow (I'm assuming the angel and Sebae haven't reached full size yet).>
Also have a large Featherduster at the base of my rock (have had for over two years), within the last year, the Sebae clown has started a symbiotic relationship with this feather duster.
<Yeah, these clowns will apparently try to bond with anything.>
1) Update - I've been running a fishless refugium now for a year and a half (thanks to Eric R. for some good advice). What I noticed is that there is way more stability in my display tank, and everything is hardy and growing well. The refugium is really neat to look at as well, lots of life in there in the form of worms, micro stars, copepods, Mysids, feather dusters, Sycon sponges, etc.
<Cool. Refugiums are great.>
I run a DSB section in my refugium, with live rock and I try to harvest out algae at some frequency (lots of green hair algae, though I've added Chaetomorpha and am not sure how to make this catch on better).
<Maybe this will help: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/greenalg.htm>
Does Chaeto grow quickly or do I need to really stock up a larger quantity to get started?
<It just depends on how much light you put on it, availability of nutrients, etc. Most people report that it grows pretty fast.>
Even if my phosphates are low (near zero) and I try to reduce the time the lights are on in the refugium, I seem to get the hair algae (very bright green, long, dense).
<Your phosphates might be zero (or near zero) BECAUSE you have hair algae growing. Also, phosphate test kits only measure inorganic phosphates. Growing macroalgae in the refugium should help.>
I've recently noticed a near explosion of white limpets in my refugium, with some making their way over into my display tank. From what I've read, I don't *think* I should be concerned, but I wanted to mention it in case you disagree. The only livestock I've ever added to the refugium are three small turbo snails, some small micro stars, and a green sea hare. (maybe Elysia?)
I drain water off of my display tank, with a suction pump in the charge side of the refugium, and then pump back to my main tank with a pump from the discharge side. I have some safeties in the form of level switches to make sure I don't overflow anywhere, so far have had no problems.
I cannot stress enough what a positive experience the refugium has been.
<Excellent... please spread the word.>
I chart my tank chemistry in MS Excel, and I can see exactly where my nitrates dropped to zero once I brought the refugium on-line.
<cool>
I also just recently got up enough courage to remove my bio-balls from my main tank wet-dry sump, I will update if anything changes, though I don't expect it to. I have stopped almost all tank supplements, other than Kalkwasser (with a 3 mL vinegar boost to one liter of Kalk solution from an Aquadoser per Julian Sprung's Reef Aquarium Vol. 3), occasional Lugol's sol'n for iodine and once in a while an HBH Balance block (probably not necessary?) - I've given up on all pollution in a bottle!
<fabulous>
I really feel that I get a large portion of phyto and zooplankton from my refugium.
I run RDP on the refugium, probably a little overpowered on lights, 96 watt dual daylight/actinic on about 37 gal. tank, but I re-used these lights from my main tank when I upgraded it. I enjoyed building the refugium, the family likes it, and the livestock in my display tank certainly like it. I also enjoy looking for new and never before seen microorganisms in this tank as time goes on. I've never had this healthy a system before. Those out there considering, please give it a try, using this site as a reference, as well as the Calfo/Fenner Marine Invertebrates book - they have a great section on all the different types of refugiums you can build.
<yep>
My tattered book is currently on loan to my brother/sister-in-law, as I think they've decided to give a refugium a try after keeping an eye on mine.
<Great!>
2) Now some questions. I've always had my corals pretty well spread out, and have taken care to relocate some (figured out my Nephthea were probably attacking my Zoanthids). So I had pretty good spacing. And everything is growing very well.
However, two areas concern me. My hammer coral is expanding heartily toward my Pavona and my xenia. I've noticed that the xenia are moving away from the hammer. I just noticed the hammer is now touching the Pavona. Perhaps the carbon helps reduce the chemical warfare, but I'm assuming I need to cut back a couple of stalks to give away, or else move the hammer?
<You can do either. But the Euphyllia will hurt the Pavona if it touches it.>
My star polyps expand in a thick mat everywhere. They've surrounded the base of the Sarcophyton elegans and the mat has moved some way up the stalks. Other than that the elegans both look ok, but will there be a problem here?
<Possibly, star polyps can get to be a nuisance.>
Do I need to pull that mat back away, or do you think they will find equilibrium somewhere? It looks like the mat never makes it up the shafts, but maybe the elegans are expending valuable energy growing upwards to try and get away from the star polyps?
<They're competing for space. I doubt either is enjoying it. Are you asking me who will win? I don't know. If it were me, I'd remove the Sarcophyton (b/c they are often toxic to stony corals).>
Sorry for the long email - thanks again for all the great info, hope this helps somebody else, and if you're reading this and on the fence about refugiums.......go build one!!! You won't regret it!
<Haha... definitely.
Best,
Sara M.>