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FAQs on Red Sea (Red Sea Salt, Coral Pro Salt) Synthetic Seawater
Related Articles: Synthetic or Natural
Seawater,
Saltwater Impressions (Synthetics Review) By Steven Pro,
Specific Gravity, Water Changes/Changing, pH,
Alkalinity,
Marine Alkalinity Related FAQs:
Seawater 1, Seawater 2,
Seawater 3, Seawater 4,
Seawater 5,
Seawater 6, & FAQs on Mixing,
Supplementing, Storing,
Moving, Physical/Chemical
Troubleshooting/Fixing... By Make/Manufacturer:
Natural Seawater. Synthetics: Aquarium
Systems (Instant Ocean, Reef Crystals),
Aquacraft (Marine Environments, BioSea...),
Central Garden (Oceanic), Kent Marine
(SeaSalt), SeaChem Marine (Marine
Salt, Reef Salt), Energy Savers
(Coralife), Tropic Marin,
Other Brands... About Buying Pre-mixed
Seawater, About Synthetics
Manufacturers Advertising Claims...
Spg 1,
Treating Tapwater For Marine Aquarium Use,
Reverse Osmosis Filtration |
Email "Pinky" here: redseainfo@redseafish.com
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premixed saltwater storage 10/5/09
Good afternoon,
<Good evening, Keith! JustinN here!>
I have a question regarding the storage of premixed saltwater. I
currently use Red Sea Coral Pro salt and RO water. I use a Maxijet and a
heater in a 6 gallon bucket. I mix the salt and let it mix with a
powerhead and a heater and test ph, ca and Alk after 24 hours and the
results are pH of 8.3, Ca of 440 and dKH of 8. I then cover the bucket
with a lid and leave the heater and Maxijet on.
<Sounds good.>
When I remove the lid several days later I have noticed that my dKH goes
up and my
Ca drops to about 360-380. I imagine this is kind of the same result as
the night-day ph swing and that the Alk and Ca are working to stabilize
pH?
<Mmm, more likely the stabilization of all things chemical in your water
over time..>
Anyway, when it comes to water changes with this premixed water, what is
the procedure? How long should I leave the water with the lid off before
attempting a change?
<If you're circulating the air for 24+ hours with an air pump, you
should be ready to go. Just perform a water change as normal.>
Should I add an airstone a couple of hours before the water change or
does this sound like an unstable salt mix?
<More air never hurts, but I doubt its necessity. No personal experience
with Red Sea's salt, but I doubt that the mix is a problem.>
I had just recently noticed coralline die off and lower Ca or more than
usual ca consumption in my display tank that had been dead on for well
over a year as well as lower pH overall (8.1) during the day.
<Coralline die-off and higher Ca usage would seem to be somewhat in
conflict -- are there corals/clams that could be sapping the Ca from the
water at a greater rate over time?>
This salt brand had been pretty much consistent for me since I started
my tank, with no new livestock additions or equipment but to be quite
honest I had never tested the bucket after the initial tests were
satisfied after the mixing and aerating 24 hours later.
<Worthwhile to chart out results for a few sets of make-up water here,
make sure there's not a trend of instability.>
Any insight or help would be greatly appreciated.
<On paper, I would say you appear to have everything right as needed.
Have a look at my article on exactly this topic:
http://wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_4/V4I2/Water_Makeup/makeup_water.htm --
you will find that your overall strategy fits the concepts laid out
there pretty well to a T. Let us know if you have any more questions!
-JustinN>
Re: premixed saltwater storage... & disc. of mixes, IO and
Red Sea
Thanks Justin.
I read the water change article, and it looked familiar, so it might
have been where I initially got some of the practices I use now. I
always do let the water age for at least a day, so stuff can become
known before it's in the tank and too late.
<Absolutely.>
I usually test too but so many buckets of the Red Sea had been dead on I
kind of slacked on this last one until a WC had been done.
<Understandable -- when you get that rhythm, sometimes the lackadaisical
attitude sets in... I know I'm guilty more than once!>
While I was waiting for your reply, I mixed up 2 other buckets of water,
another of Red Sea Coral Pro and one of good ol' Instant Ocean just to
make sure my test kits weren't out of whack. The Instant Ocean at SG of
1.026 was right on, Alk of 10, calcium of 380 and ph of 8.2-8.3. The
second batch of Red Sea had an Alk of well over 14, but I stopped there
because those drop tests run out pretty quick and I was yet unsure where
the salt was going to be reading the next day. The Ca was at 440 and ph
of 8.3 <I never trust my initial readings when mixing salt, and tend to
only go on Salinity personally -- until the water has had some time to
mix and stabilize.>
Like I said in my last email, I had used this brand of salt for over a
year without issue, switching from Instant Ocean on the "advice" of
other reefers when I started adding corals because of the low Ca in IO.
<Understood -- plenty of reefers have great success with this salt -- I
doubt the salt itself is really an issue.>
A little background on my tank. I have a 20 gal long tank. It has 24 lbs
of aragonite sand, about 20 lbs of liverock and has 2 150 gal powerheads
on opposite sides. I also use an Aquaclear 70 that is 300 gph for flow
and occasionally Chemipure since my skimmer started to leak and it had
to be removed about 6 months ago.
<Sounds good -- do make sure to clean out any filter media in the
Aquaclear regularly here.>
I do 2 5% WCs weekly or at least 1 10%. The tank is lit by 130 watts of
PC, 1 1000k and 1 actinic. I have 2 false Perculas, a watchman and his
pistol shrimp buddy, a cleaner shrimp, 4 blue leg hermits and 4 Astrea
snails. For corals I have Xenia, mushrooms, zoos and 2 LPS corals: a
torch coral and a candy cane.
<Sounds very nice.>
I have had these corals doing well and growing now since Feb of this
year (that is when the final ones were
added) I have great coralline too, but everywhere I read that to sustain
coralline you needed a higher Ca, like in the 400-450 range in a captive
system...which with the addition of the LPs is why I opted to try out a
"reef" salt in the first place....but as you can see, other than the
coralline I don't really have a lot of Ca/Alk
hungry animals...at least I don't think I do, I might be wrong.
<Disagreed -- Torch corals and Candy Cane's are both hard stonies, and
use a good amount of Ca/Alk... would very likely account for any lacks
here.>
Since I added the "bad batch" of salt on my last WC I have seen my Alk
drop, my Ca drop and my Ph fluctuate more than normal as well as the
coralline looking flaky in places and some on the walls with white
rings starting to form around them.
<This does seem odd -- I'd continue forward with testing a few buckets
of mix, see if there's a trend towards imbalance with the Red Sea
salt..>
I was always happy with the consistency of the IO salt, but didn't want
to add say liquid calcium often over fear of the eventual chloride
problem.
<Must say, I'm not aware of a chloride problem here -- as long as your
dosing accurately and measuring, there shouldn't be an issue. Also, do
look into solutions such as B-Ionic, they take a lot of the complication
out of Ca/Alk dosing.>
Is there a way to use IO without a drip system, reactor whatever with a
safer calcium additive, for a tank my size or is the 380 I get at 1.026
actually pretty good for my tank?
<Is about average, for non-supplemented water.>
I do use Seachem reef builder from time to time as well for Alk with the
Red Sea Pro when it would mix the way it usually did: ph 8.3 Alk 7 and
Ca 440. This bucket of Red Sea also leaves a noticeable amount of
deposit and "shiny" particles at the bottom of my bucket...so I fear I
might have a quality issue with this batch.
<Hmm.. I'm beginning to fear this too, the more I read.. it does happen
from time to time.>
Before I realized this was occurring I had done a 10% WC Friday which is
when I noticed the parameters of my tank were starting to swing. From
now on I will test EACH batch of mix, and at the very least every new
bucket and a couple of batches.
<I would agree with this approach.>
I see a lot of different trends and guerilla techniques so to speak in
these nanos but what I really want is a consistent stable and enjoyable
tank, which I have been able to do pretty well before this last batch of
salt got me worried.
<Smaller volumes of water are always problematic to keep at a stable
chemistry -- which is why those in the know typically don't recommend
them as a starter.>
Effort and maintenance is no problem, I just don't want to start out
with numbers that aren't going to do my tank any good, especially in a
small system such as mine. I appreciate your help, and I am so sorry if
this is long winded, but my only other support is a fellow nano friend
of mine who has sunk so much money and equipment into is tank he could
have a 180 gallon reef with a sump! He's an engineer of course :-)
<Ah, always good people to know! Do look into/reach out to various BB's
and forums around the net -- such as the one provided here at WWM! These
forums are full of people willing to help and discuss their similar
issues, successes, and failures.>
BTW, what would you do to iron this out? scrap the red sea batch and try
to return the unused? mix the IO with the red sea (fear of a less than
desirable effect with possible precipitation), or go back to IO and add
something for the possible Ca issue if it is needed and if so what would
you recommend?. If the consumption isn't too bad, will the coralline
adjust to a balanced system with lower Ca?
<Personally, I would likely test 2-3 batches worth of the red sea at
once (allowing them to circulate for 24-48 hours first). If I continued
to get off/varied readings here, I would probably move forward with
trying to get a credit on the unused portion. If you still have the
Instant Ocean available, and its still testing accurately, I would use
this for the time being in your tank.>
Again, sorry this probably simple and common problem is so long
Keith
<The proof is in the details, as they say -- this thorough description
has allowed me to get a bit more of a view into the overall process
that's going on, and I'm now more inclined to think it could be a
problematic batch of salt. Let us know if you have any further
questions! -JustinN>
Re: Premixed Saltwater Storage, Problematic Salt Mix -
10/06/2009
Hi Justin,
<Hey Keith!>
Well I do think I have a bad batch of Red Sea this time, like it is void
of Mag or something. Today after adding my venturi to the powerhead in
bucket 1 for over an hour testing resulted in a dKH of 18 ca of 280.
Bucket 2 which was mixed later is a dKH of 16 Ca of 320 and finally the
3rd bucket with instant ocean dKH of 10 calcium of 380 still all at SG
of 1.026.
<Mmm, does sound that way.>
Both batches of Red Sea are particulate
and hazy (even the mix from 48 hours ago!)
<Definitely not right>
My LFS has a good return policy and Reef Crystals from Instant Ocean is
on sale by chance this week and will only run about $2 more than regular
IO for the bag of mix that does 55 gals, so I'm thinking that might be
my better bet as it seems I bought the last bucket in stock of Red Sea
from them.
<Sounds like a plan to me. Reef Crystals is a quality product with a
proven record.>
I know all salt mixes can have a bad batch, which is why it is important
to test but the Instant Ocean has been pretty consistent....
<Agreed. Some have a better track record than others, but everyone has
incidents -- it happens.>
its what I have used in my brackish tanks for years so I am hoping Reef
Crystals will be just as consistent with a little better mag and Ca.
Should I do small 5% water changes or should there be no harm in ionic
balance to do a 10% weekly until my levels are more consistent?
<No harm that I would see -- the balance shouldn't be enough off either
way to cause a precipitous event.>
Should I use a 2 part Alk/ca additive in the mean time like C-Balance or
Kent A&B?
<Certainly, these are easy to apply and work well -- I like B-Ionic
myself, but the above are fine too.>
Thank you for the help and the quick response.
Keith
<Glad to be of service! -JustinN>
Marine Salt Question, "Red Sea Coral Pro Salt" 3/23/07
Hi
WW Crew:
<Bonnie>
I was wondering if anyone had experience or an
opinion on the new product "Red Sea Coral Pro Salt"?
<Mmm, nope>
The company states it is specifically formulated for use with reverse
osmosis water.
<Mmm...>
They also give some stats such as:
With a salinity of 1.025 the Calcium level is 480ppm at 75 degrees. I
use R/O water and was wondering if it might be good for me to use.
<Worth trying... though am a stead user of the two long-standing best
brands in the trade...>
I have been using Instant Ocean Reef
Crystals. Was rather surprised that the calcium level would be that
high (480ppm). What do you think?
<Is artificially boosted
(relative to NSW...) but not a big deal (all good synthetics are). Do
take a read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/seawater.htm
and the linked files
above>
Thanks for your opinion. Bonnie
<Thanks for asking. Bob
Fenner> Salt Mix Opinion - 5/18/2006
Hey guy and gals!
<Hello Christine>
I was wondering what you
guys thought about 'Red Sea Pro Coral Salt'. It is supposed to be for
use with RO water. Here is the description:
"With the increasing
popularity of Reverse Osmosis water filtration systems Red Sea addressed
the special needs of this advanced hobbyist with the development of
Coral Pro Salt. Unlike traditional water filtration systems Reverse
Osmosis filtration strips the water of several essential elements, which
were never factored into the salt formulas available today. Since the
reverse osmosis process strip virtually 100% of the calcium from the
“tap water” the hobbyist is left with a seawater mixture that is
significantly low in calcium from the start. In addition to calcium
there are a few other natural minerals and chemicals left at inadequate
levels such as magnesium.
Coral Pro salt when mixed with Reverse
Osmosis water faithfully replicates natural seawater and has the desired
calcium and magnesium content to support delicate reef life. Chemically
balanced formula to support the most delicate corals and other marine
life. Free of nitrates and phosphates."
Does this eliminate the need
for RO right/other buffers?
<Not familiar with this new
product. Why don't you talk to the horse at Red Sea. Email "Pinky"
here: redseainfo@redseafish.com>
Thanks!
<You're
welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Christine
Re: Salt Mix Opinion - anyone but salty dog - 05/19/2006
Thanks for the email address, but I was really hoping to get an
objective opinion on the salt mix. My previous email is repeated below:
Hey guy and gals!
I was wondering what you guys thought about 'Red
Sea Pro Coral Salt'. It is supposed to be for use with RO water. Here
is the description:
"With the increasing popularity of Reverse
Osmosis water filtration systems Red Sea addressed the special needs of
this advanced hobbyist with the development of Coral Pro Salt. Unlike
traditional water filtration systems Reverse Osmosis filtration strips
the water of several essential elements, which were never factored into
the salt formulas available today. Since the reverse osmosis process
strip virtually 100% of the calcium from the “tap water” the hobbyist is
left with a seawater mixture that is significantly low in calcium from
the start. In addition to calcium there are a few other natural minerals
and chemicals left at inadequate levels such as magnesium.
Coral Pro
salt when mixed with Reverse Osmosis water faithfully replicates natural
seawater and has the desired calcium and magnesium content to support
delicate reef life. Chemically balanced formula to support the most
delicate corals and other marine life. Free of nitrates and phosphates."
Have any of you tried this product? Does this eliminate the need for RO
right/other buffers?
Thanks!
Christine
<Mmm, did see the
original response (and query). For my part I have not used this product
(is relatively new), but am familiar with the company's main brand and
this has proven inconsistent and inferior. I would post your query on
some of the various specialty BB's (ReefFrontiers, ReefCentral...) for a
broader, user-based response here. Bob Fenner>
Salt Mix Opinion Query - 05/19/2006
Another irritating
querier. I gave her my answer stating I'm not familiar with the
product and even gave her an addy to Red Sea. How can I give an
"objective opinion" when I never used the product or am familiar with
it. She doesn't want me to respond and I won't, already gave her
all she should need. ARRGGHHH.
James
<Thought
about this as well... I'd've given about the same response... I have no
experience with this salt... but their main brand is inconsistent,
inferior... I would next, perhaps will refer this person to the
specialty BB's for a wider net of experience, input. BobF> Salt
Brand Change 8/5/03
Sorry to trouble you once again, but I have a
quick question as I am about to run out of salt. I have been using Red
Sea since starting my tank 9 months ago because I got several buckets
for $30 each at Petco. I have been somewhat dissatisfied with it's
performance, especially since one ff the buckets kept mixing up with an
ammonia level of 0.5 using ammonia-free RO water.
<I will tell you
that for some time I have heard complaints monthly or better with this
salt... not so much quality issues... but consistency>
Anyway, I am
considering a switch. I gather that most of the crew prefer Tropic Main
or IO over Red Sea. Is this correct?
<for me at least... Bob is
agreed too I'm fairly certain><<Yes. RMF>>
Might I ask why?
<long-standing QC... Tropic Marin is arguably a better salt... IO is
perhaps a better value. Both are extremely reliable and consistent>
I've tried to read up on some of the issues, including the famous
article by Ron Shimek in Reefkeeping Online.
<ughhh... for neither
love or money, I - nor many other industry professionals I know - can
explain why he made this statement or how the heck he came to those
conclusions. The backlash on it is already coming back. Sorry to see it
for all>
He seems to strongly favor Crystal Sea Marinemix.
<do
read the message boards and our archives re: issues with this salt in
particular from less than pleased folks that made the switch. Seems to
be some concern for gastropods and echinoderms in particular as I recall
(stunned snails and starfish). I personally would not take it for free.>
If I do change, should I just start using the new brand for water
changes (say 5% per week)? Thanks, Steve Allen.
<do opt for 10-20%
weekly water changes minimum please... and you will not go wrong with
TM, IO or Omega salts IMO. Best regards, Anthony> Salt Mix
Quality Questions
Dear Sir,
<No "sir"- just Scott F. here
today!>
I have used Tropic Marin, HW Marinemix, Instant Ocean and
Sera Meersaltz for my marine fish hobby over 5 years.
<All good
salts; I'm a Tropic Marin fan, myself>
Recently, I tried Red Sea salt
because it was cheaper which unfortunately resulted in the death of many
of my fishes in my aquarium!
<Sorry to hear that...Are you sure that
it was the salt mix?>
I went back to the shop and found out that the
shop owner himself uses Sera Meersaltz for his magnificent showcase
tanks. What about the Red Sea then? He said he is aware of blending
quality problems last year but thought the problem had been rectified.
<Perhaps if this was the problem, maybe you purchased a leftover bag
from one of the troubled batches?>
He is no longer stocking Red Sea
salt mix after my complaint and says Instant Ocean would be the
replacement for the budget conscious (Sera Meersaltz for the serious
high-end fishkeeper) as he had some similar complaints from others as
well. My question is why has there been a lack of emphasis on the
quality of many brands of seawater mix available especially where
blending of the formula matters so much?
<Well, I suppose that there
has been a lot more placed into marketing and packaging in recent years
than into research and development by many companies. Some formulas have
been established so long that little, if any expense has been put into
refining them. The SF15 report, while appearing biased towards
Aquacraft products and somewhat understandable (their products did
better in the tests after all is said and done) is about the only thing
I have seen so far.
<Agreed...there are not too many independent
tests out there. However, a number of advanced hobbyists and authors
have done some limited research into salt mix over the past couple of
years, and have published this information on the 'net. Just requires a
bit of research on your part. Some of the findings might be interesting,
others seem to be a bit unusual, but it's always worth looking at. I
think the real problem is that it is rather expensive to perform a
completely unbiased, accurate, and thorough analysis of al of the salt
mixes on the market today. I suppose the best bet for the hobbyist is to
see what your fellow successful hobbyists have found to be effective,
and try the salt in your own system. If the salt works for you- stick
with the brand. Consistency in all things, including salt mix- is very
vital for marine systems, IMO. Hang in there! Regards, Scott F>
Seawater Mix Product Issues 4/9/04
Dear Sir,
<Wow! No need
for such formality. We are a very laid back bunch!<g>.>
I have used
Tropic Marin, HW Marinemix, Instant Ocean and Sera Meersaltz for my
marine fish hobby over 5 years. Recently, I tried Red Sea salt because
it was cheaper which unfortunately resulted in the death of many of my
fishes in my aquarium!
<Very bad news indeed!>
I went back to
the shop and found out that the shop owner himself uses Sera Meersaltz
for his magnificent showcase tanks. What about the Red Sea then? He said
he is aware of blending quality problems last year but thought the
problem had been rectified. He is no longer stocking Red Sea salt mix
after my complaint and says Instant Ocean would be the replacement for
as he had some similar complaints from others as well.
<I have not
heard of this problem. Perhaps it is limited to certain areas. Tropic
Marin and Sera are very highly regarded salts (which unfortunately are
not widely available in the US) and Instant Ocean is so widely used that
serious problems with it would be well known.>
My question is why
has there been a lack of emphasis on the quality of many brands of
seawater mix available especially where blending of the formula matters
so much? The SF15 report while appearing biased towards Aquacraft
products and somewhat
understandable (their products did better in
the tests after all is said and done) is about the only thing I have
seen so far.
<The results of the S-15 report is widely considered to
be very questionable. Your observation that one brand of salts vastly
outperformed others is very keen. You might have also noted that the
criteria used to judge the salts seemed a bit odd and obviously favored
the same brands of salt produced by the folks who performed the
testing.
Dr. Ron Shimek performed some testing of salt mixes using
sea urchin larvae. Although his results were quite dramatic, it is my
strong opinion that not many useful conclusions can be drawn from his
results and that much more testing is required.
I think the biggest
reason for lack of testing of salts is primarily cost. No one has any
way of recovering their testing cost, let alone profiting from
performing unbiased testing. Another important reason is that it is only
in the last couple of years that husbandry has advanced so far that the
life expectancy of our animals may be limited by the quality of salt mix
rather than poor husbandry.
Lastly, very pure chemicals are very
expensive. To give a very crude example, a 95% pure chemical may cost
$1.00 per kilo, the same chemical 99% pure may be $3.00 per kilo, the
same chemical 99.99% pure may cost $15.00 per kilo. So, the cost goes up
very rapidly to achieve the very highest level of purity. I hope this
information is useful to you. Adam> Questions (salt mix brands,
spg, sponge diet)
Hi Bob !! If you're given a choice of salt mix,
which one would you go for:
Instant ocean or Red Sea ?
<Instant
Ocean by a few percent... with Tropic Marin a few points ahead of
them...>
Secondly, for a fish only tank with live rocks, can I
maintain the SG level of 1.017 permanently?
<Actually, not a good
idea... more "stressful" than it's worth/gain IMO/E... would re-raise to
NSW (near seawater), 1.025 over time>
Lastly, my 6 inch queen angel
which refuse to eat for 2 weeks, now begins to feed on sponge which I
bought specially for her.
<Yes, a major component of Holacanthus of
many species in the wild>
Is it ok for her to feed only on sponge or
will she suffer from malnutrition from consuming sponge only? Please
advice. Thanks.
<Best to add other foodstuffs to this animals diet.
Bob Fenner>
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