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FAQs on Supplementing Synthetic Seawater
Related Articles: Synthetic or Natural
Seawater,
Saltwater Impressions (Synthetics Review) By Steven Pro,
Specific Gravity, Water Changes/Changing, pH,
Alkalinity,
Marine Alkalinity Related FAQs:
Seawater 1, Seawater 2,
Seawater 3, Seawater 4,
Seawater 5,
Seawater 6, & FAQs on Mixing,
Storing, Moving,
Physical/Chemical Troubleshooting/Fixing... By
Make/Manufacturer: Natural Seawater.
Synthetics: Aquarium Systems (Instant
Ocean, Reef Crystals), Aquacraft
(Marine Environments, BioSea...),
Central Garden (Oceanic), Kent Marine
(SeaSalt), Red Sea (Red Sea Salt, Coral
Pro Salt), SeaChem Marine (Marine
Salt, Reef Salt), Energy Savers
(Coralife), Tropic Marin,
Other Brands... About Buying Pre-mixed
Seawater, About Synthetics
Manufacturers Advertising Claims...
Spg 1,
Treating Tapwater For Marine Aquarium Use,
Reverse Osmosis Filtration | .JPG)
Many invertebrates are sensitive to quick or large changes in water
chemistry... change outside the system, add/change slowly... |
Buffers/Marine...Cloudy Water 10/17/07 <Hi Alan> After leaving
the water for 24 hours with a power head in a 45 gallon rubber bucket, I
added 2 tablespoons of Seachem buffer. Then approximately 2 hours later
I added the Instant Ocean salt. When I went to view the newly mixed
water, it was very cloudy and milky in appearance. Will I have to junk
this newly mixed water, or can I add to the tank and the filter system
will take care of this problem. I am scared to do a water change and
then find out my tank will be cloudy and not become clear. <The Sea
Chem buffer is normally dosed at one level teaspoon per 40 gallons and
it is recommended to mix with at least one cup of freshwater before
adding to the tank. Your dosing of two tablespoons would cloud the water
more than the normal dose. You mention a 45 gallon bucket but not the
amount of water you were mixing. I do not see any problems adding this
water to the tank, and once mixed with the existing tank water, the
clarity should return within 24 hours.> Regards <You're welcome.
James (Salty Dog)> Alan
2 part solution: getting in balance 10/16/07 Hello, need some
more expertly advise. I have a tank and refugium totaling about 65
gallons. Ca=340ppm Alk=3mEq/l and ph is about 8.8 <... I hope it is
NOT this high...> (hard to match color for Aquarium Pharmaceuticals
test. I have choose <chosen> to use Kent cb 2 part solution. I
have heard that you need your system to be in balance in order for the 2
part solution to work. <Should be close to start, yes> Is it in
balance enough to just add until both Alk and Ca increase as I would
like? <Yes> I have a frogspawn and thought my calcium should be
above 400ppm I have heard that you should do a big water change to help
get system in balance before using the 2 part solution. For 65 gallons
total water how many gallon water change would you suggest? <...
maybe twenty gallons> Also, I have an r/o unit that I use for my
water. I mix 20 gallons of salt water each month into a container for
water changes and 20 gallons of fresh each month into another container
for make-up water. Should I buffer these even with the use of the 2 part
solution? <Yes, a good idea... use one of the two... wait a day,
test... use the other> Also on another note, I heard that when using
r/o water you should add buffer then salt? <Mmm, not necessary
generally> The last batch of water I made I added salt and then the
buffer. When I tested it had Ca=340 Alk=4.5mEq/l and ph about 7.8 I
thought the Ca would be would be around 400 using instant ocean sea
salt. Is the low Ca due to improper buffering application?
<Shouldn't be... I'd check your test kits... and aerate the RO water
before mixing...> Thanks for all your help! Without all of your help
I would just have to accept looking at pictures of aquariums in
magazines and on TV :) <Welcome. Bob Fenner> pH and
fresh water; books, web-sites of use, mixing salt mix... adding buffers
to same 3/30/07 Dear Mr. Fenner, <Karen> I am new
to the world of salt water aquariums. I have really enjoyed reading your
book The Conscientious Marine Aquarist ( Hopefully that was you who
wrote this book because if not I will be embarrassed). <Was I>
Your book had a lot of information that I have just not been able to get
my hands on anywhere else. I think you and the crew at Wet Web Media are
excellent. I would like to know if you have put out any new books out in
the last year or so. <Mmm, the last was with friend Anthony Calfo,
back in 2003... Reef Invertebrates... Another friend, Jason Chodakowski
and I may finish this series (with two fish books, one on the cnidaria)
some year soon> I like having books to refer back to and I also read
information on the internet but I keep reading the same things on the
internet. Are there any web sites that you like to go to and research
information on Marine Aquariums? <I don't generally visit the
various BB's in our interest other than to "get an idea" of what gear
folks are using, favor... and general trends in what the hobbyists are
seeing... Too much chit chat, disorganized subjective garbage to
interest me... I do use fishbase.org almost daily, the Seaslugforum.com,
the krib... Many other informational sites... And DO think that a "guide
to indexing" such resources would be a worthy column... for an online
zine (yes, this is an instruction)> I also have a question for you.
When you buffer you top off water (Freshwater), can you also take that
same water that is buffered as freshwater and mix it with your salt (my
salt is Instant Ocean)? <Mmmm, in general, yes> I am wondering
because I was thinking if you did that I thought it might raise the PH
even more. <Yes, can... depending on the make-up of the source
water...> Because when I mix my R/O water with the salt it comes out
at around 8.2 PH. <This is fine. I would buffer, add other materials
to the mixed-up synthetic... After the RO had been aerated for a while,
the salt mix dissolved... it too aerated/circulated... tested...>
Thank you for reading my E-mail and if possible please let me know what
my water/ PH would do. <Welcome. Bob Fenner>
Water Change... Alk./Biomineral balance, manipulation
1/10/07 Hi Bob, q here! I hope you had a great holiday!
<Thank you Q... I trust yours was as well> A question regarding
water changes (please see below for tank specs). I was preparing
water for a change in a 5 gal bucket (I typically change 5 gal of water
every week). Added salt to RO water, aerated for 3 days. Yesterday, I
began testing certain WQ parameters in the 5 gal bucket (pH, Ca, Alk,
sal). I noticed the pH of the water was a little low (7.95) so I did a
quick calculation to determine how much powdered SeaChem Buffer product
to add, based on product info on the label. About halfway through
adding the chemical I realized I had done the calculation incorrectly
and was adding way too much Buffer. The pH of the water is 8.3 (of
course) but the alk is through the roof. <How far?> Shortly
after adding the Buffer, I noticed the water went almost completely
opaque (I'm assuming a CaCO3 precipitate is being formed). <Yes,
likely so> Before the water went cloudy I tested the Alk =
8.25meq/L. The Ca in the bucket was low to begin with so I added a
little Ca++ solution to try to drive down the alk. <Mmm,
a slippery slide... Reminds me of a nation that invaded another country
(more than once) and decided to try and "fix" the "imbalance" by
throwing in more military, then "peace" keepers and money, then
military... Doesn't work> I decided to let things stabilize
overnight. I didn't have time to test WQ this morning before work but I
noticed the water had cleared completely. My question is, should I
toss this water and start again? <Yes, I would... Likely I also
would have just used the water with the too-high alkalinity... how much
of the total volume would this represent? That is, how large a volume is
your system?> Have I done anything to the water that I will not be
able to correct, even if I manage to get the alk/ca++ back into balance?
(affected other aspects of the WQ by having the alk so high?). <Mmm,
the particulates might be trouble... not worth risking, or suggesting
you risk> Also, my original intent was to raise the alk of the water
change water above normal to help elevate the alk in my tank. <Mmm,
then the addition of the original mis-mixed water would have been a
route to go> Despite my almost daily additions of SeaChem Reef
Carbonate, <Mmm, would not add this directly to your main system>
I've watched alk in my display tank go from 3.5 to 2.75. <Still not
a bad value...> Constantly adding Alk has depressed Ca from 400 to
330 (I've also been adding Ca supplement approx twice per week on days I
don't add alk). <...> I add all chemicals with fresh, top-up
water. How high can I safely raise the alk of the water change water to
help boost the alk in my tank? <Mmm... there are other factors that
one must keep in mind... test for> I understand some of my tank
inhabitants (Fromia) are sensitive to drastic changes. What is
considered drastic? <Variable... by species, age/size, health...
other factors...> I hope I've clearly explained the situation!
Thanks q Some tank info background: Tank: 40 gal FOWLR
(approx 50lbs LR) Compact fluorescent lighting AquaC Remora PS
(working incredibly well) 3 powerheads HOT filter Bought
tank from a co-worker approx 6 months ago (they had it running for
about 4 years) WQ: PH: 8.1 Alk: 2.75 meq/l Ca: 330
NH3: 0 NO2: 0 N03: <10 ppm (IO powder test kit can't read below
10) Temp: 79 Sal: 1.023 <I'd raise this to 1.025>
Residents: 2 - a. ocellaris 1 – Coral beauty angel 1 –
cleaner shrimp 1 - Red Fromia (in tank for approx 2 weeks) blue
legged hermit crabs (5) snails (5) misc mushrooms and yellow
polyps that came with tank. <Please read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/calcalkmar.htm and the linked files
above... With just a bit more knowledge will come adequate
understanding... of your situation, options. Bob Fenner>
pH &
Alkalinity/Salt Mixes & Buffering - 08/22/06 Hello crew, thanks
for taking the time to provide valuable experience and information.
<<Is my pleasure to assist when/where I can>> I use Oceanic salt for
my FOWLR system. The pH is generally 7.9 to 8.0, I don't monitor
alkalinity but have read through your site that Oceanic brand sea salt
mix does not have adequate alkalinity and a slightly lower pH than sea
water. <<Mmm, indeed...better (proven) brands to be had (Instant
Ocean, Tropic Marin)...but you can improve on this a bit with some
buffering of your make-up water>> I haven't had any issues using
Oceanic in my FOWLR systems for the last few years. <<Ok>>
Should I be more concerned about this or is it not a concern as I am not
trying to maintain a reef system which will require more control of
these water parameters? <<The reef system is more demanding, true,
but you should still strive to maintain natural saltwater chemistry for
any marine system. If the alkalinity of your salt mix is below NSW
levels you can try buffering with simple sodium bicarbonate (baking
soda). This "may" also give an increase of a tenth of a point or so to
your pH (aerate for 24 hours after adding to drive off the carbon
dioxide used in the manufacture of the baking soda). You might also
want to consider replacing/adding some new live rock to add fresh
buffers/earth elements to your system>> Thanks again for your help.
<<Always welcome. EricR>>
Falling Out Of Solution? (Powdery Stuff In Prepared Water)
Hello Crew, <Hi there! Scott F. with you today!> I submitted
this question almost a week ago and had no response, so I am trying
again. <Yikes! Sorry your query fell through the
cracks...Happens now and then, unfortunately.> Twice now I have
added 1 tsp. of Sea Chem Reef Builder to my 10 gallon tank of "Water
Change Water" after I aerated and added salt. After a day the tank
gets cloudy with a fine white powder. The fresh water consists of RO
and I use Coralife Salt, I added nothing else. Is this a
"snowstorm" I have read about? I tested the Alkalinity at 4.5 meq/L
after this happened. Can temperature change affect this? The tank
went from 77 to 84 degrees during the day and when it got warm, I
noticed the powder. Thanks for your time. Michael
<Interesting thought, Michael- but I don't think that Reef builder
would cause the "snowstorm" effect at this dosage. The cloudiness is
apparently something in the buffer falling out of solution. Water
can only hold so many dissolved substances. I have noticed this sort
of phenomenon myself when using buffer products, and the water has
cleared after a day or two. If the water tests okay, I would not be
overly concerned about it. Sorry I could not give you a more
specific answer, but it seems like it may not something that is very
detrimental. Regards, Scott F.> |
Re: Too Much Buffer Crewmates: I noticed today's
question by Michael about adding Reef Builder to his make up
water and getting precipitates in the tank water. I don't know
why he did not get my response, which is posted at:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marsupfaq3.htm I would like to
point out that he is adding a teaspoon of Reef Builder to 10
gallons of water. The recommended dose for this product is 1
teaspoon per 40 gallons, so he is overdosing by 4 times, which
may explain his problem. Steve Allen. <Ahh, thank you for
this Steve. Bob F> |
Aging
synthetic saltwater and Calcium additions Hi, Crew! <Alfred>
The internet is full of information and misinformation. I like browsing
through several reef/marine sites, and opinions vary from "XXX is great"
to "XXX is the worst thing for an aquarium"... When I want good
information, it's WWM that I go to!!! This place has the BEST
information for things aquaria, and the BEST advice -- I'm not saying
that to flatter you guys; just saying it matter-of-factly. <Heee! Am
taking your affidavit with me to St. Peter... Wait, I'd miss all my
friends> To my question: I mix my synthetic saltwater, and follow
the "Water4MarUse". But this is what I do: Aerate FRESHwater for
a couple of days... Add salt and mix/aerate for another couple of days.
In my tank, I dose Kalkwasser via drip (to replace evaporation). But
what if my new saltwater mix is lower in calcium levels, and I do a
major water change (say close to 100%)? <I would not change out this
much water unless there was a real emergency> I know that adding lots
of calcium to a tank will raise the ph too high, but what about if I add
calcium directly to the aerating mix? This may raise the ph too high,
but there's nothing there anyway... <A good plan> If this is
possible (adding, say, a teaspoon of calcium hydroxide to a 20 gallon
mixing container), when should I add it? While aerating the freshwater
mix, or after I've added the salt? <I would add it after... adding
before will work, but can/will create precipitation problems> I
figured (and please correct me if I'm wrong) that if I aerate it (I
normally aerate it for 3-7 days), the ph would "normalize" anyway. Then
my saltwater mix for water changes would have higher calcium. Thanks,
crew! --Alfred <There are a few ways to augment calcium and pH...
These and their rationale are covered, archived on WWM. I applaud your
efforts at pre-mixing, storing water... a very good idea. Bob Fenner>
Salt Mixes 1/25/06 Good morning Bob, <James
this morning.> I was wondering if you had a particular salt mix that
you prefer. <I've been using Instant Ocean for 30 years.> The reason
for the question is that I tend to add a lot of supplements to the mix
that I am presently using. I am using the Red Sea salt right now & I am
always low in Mg, <I use SeaChem's Reef Advantage Calcium which contains
both strontium and magnesium.> therefore I am always trying to work with
the Alk & pH. I have read about Marine Environment Salt but I wanted to
ask the expert first. <There are several good mixes out there. I'd feel
comfortable with SeaChem, Kent, Marine Environment and Tropic Marin. Red
Sea is OK, I just don't like the way it mixes up. James (Salty Dog)>
Cheers from Florida! <And no cheers from crappy Michigan.> Rick
Waibel Jr. - Mixing Saltwater - Hey guys! Oh!
I forgot I also have a question regarding mixing up saltwater for the
first time for my new tank. Can I just use pure ro/di water with the
instant ocean sea salt as directed? Or do I need to add something to the
ro/di water? <I'd add some buffer - baking soda will work - just to
bring the water's pH close to where you need it, before you add the
salts. Cheers, J -- > - Adding Buffers... Preparing New
Saltwater - Was wondering if there might be a link on the site
you could direct me to for step by step instructions for making salt
water. I currently have a Kent Maxxima RO/DI 50gpd, and I only mix
about 10 gal. at a time. I was needing to find out the sequence I
should follow as far as aerating, adding buffers, salt, etc. I'm using
Seachem Marine Buffer and Kent OsmoPrep before adding the salt, so I
wasn't sure about what to do in between. <No worries... get your RO/DI
water ready, add buffers, add a powerhead and heater... circulate water
for a day or more if you can. Then use.> I figure this question has
probably been asked of you before, but I couldn't find anything on the
site. <I'm sure it is somewhere too but am feeling too sleepy to look -
do the Search Feature button that is on the left margin of all Wet Web
Media links.> Any info would be greatly appreciated. Awesome site, btw.
Thanks. Jim <Cheers, J -- > Sea Salt and Calcium
Questions Anthony, What brand of salt did you use in your coral
propagation facility? <I used to use Instant Ocean primarily. Changes
in the company recently have led me back to Tropic Marin with great
pleasure> I know that you don't recommend the long-term use of
calcium chloride, <absolutely not... it is a temporary supplement at
best> and I understand why, but do you think it is appropriate to use it
to set your salt mix to desired levels? <nope... not needed. The
aspiration of an unrealistic high level of calcium presumes the need for
all of that calcium and the precarious water chemistry that goes with
it. Corals grow as well or better tapping 20ppm calcium off of a safe
400 ppm level as they do off of an unsafe 500 ppm level. Its still more
calcium than most systems will ever come close to using/depleting
between water changes and/or proper supplementation. This is a common
mistake by aquarists (pushing Calcium unnecessarily high> I have used
Instant Ocean and Tropic Marin in the past, which both mix up low in
calcium. <not low mate... stable and safe. It is deliberate. rest
assured> If you have used Instant Ocean in the past, did you add any
magnesium supplements to set the salt mix to higher levels? <nope...
large weekly water changes (or replacement of large volumes of water
exported with sales from the pools)> I have also read that you
recommend the use of Seachem's Reef Calcium in certain situations.
<just really for boosting coralline algae the first 4-6 months if
desired> Have you had any experience using this product on an
aquarium where an ozonizer is employed? If so, is it safe to do so?
<hmmm... good question. I've used so much ozone in the past (still do)
that I surely must have. I do not recall any problems with it... but
suggest you play it safe and take this one up with the techs at Seachem>
Thank you for your time, Nick <best regards! Anthony>
Adding buffer, and ridding algae. Hi, Hope all is going well for
all of you there. I have several questions please. First, I have read
on your website that when preparing saltwater in a container for water
changes the ph buffer should be added before the salt mix. Why is
this? It seems it should be just the opposite as the buffer is for
saltwater. << I don't add buffer to my mixed salt water. But if I did,
I would be like you and add it after mixing the salt mix. I'm unsure of
why someone told you otherwise, they may have a good reason but I
haven't heard that before. Maybe they meant you add the buffer to your
freshwater, before you add the freshwater to your tank as top off
water. That I agree with. >> Also, I have read a couple of articles
about people using hydrogen peroxide to treat algae in freshwater
aquariums. Do you know if this if feasible in saltwater and if so what
would be the dosage? << No I wouldn't do that. First, because I don't
think you should be trying to kill algae... it is the greatest! Plus,
if you do have an algal problem, I think there are many "natural" ways
to take care of it. >> What about barley straw extract in
saltwater? << It would be better to describe what kind of algae problems
you have, and then let us go from there to think of ideas. >> Thanks
for your help, James << Blundell >>
Hard Water 9/7/04 I have some updates and more questions. I
decided to leave my tank alone and setup a 10gallon that I had as a
spare. I used fresh water, not RO, mixed the salt, heated and aerated
for a days or so. Tested the water and found the alk to be through the
roof at over 15 meg/L. <indeed... it underscores how
important it is to buffer RO/DI water before salting it... as the
manufacturers presume a certain mineral hardness of average tap water
among the many users of their products to get the alkalinity needed>
I noticed that the water began to cloud and then everything got coated
with a hard white film. I can hardly scrape it off my glass or
heater. I got suspicious and I measured my tanks alk and it was also
high at 5 meq/L and PH at 8.1. So I thought since I'm not using RO
water I would try the 10gallon again with RO to see if my water was
bunk. So got RO water, aerated it and added instant ocean salt
mix. Heated it for 4 hour or so to the right temperature and measured
the stats. PH at 8.1 +/- .1 and alk was again over 10 meq/L. I left it
and after 12hrs I got the white coating and white stuff precipitated to
the bottom of the tank. <that's bizarre for having used RO water
(demineralized)> Did I just happen to get a bad batch of Instant
Ocean salt? <possibly... and easy enough to test for>
I'm not using any additives or buffer so is there another explanation?
<do you do drugs? Hmmm... just checking> I think I'm packing it in
for a while since I can't find the source of my problem.
<before you give up from this rather minor problem... would you consider
using a different brand of sea salt and/or a different brand of test
kit? Anthony> I appreciate your help guys.
Supplements and new seawater Hey Guys. I have a quick question
about the old no matter how much ca you add, nothing happens. After
reading much in the archives, (still reading) I am going with old
dilution solution. My question is should I stop all additions (buffers,
Kalk, calcium Marin plus) until things are back in balance. I'm still
trying to perfect treating my RO water and think adding buffers to soon
(before aeration) or to much may have been the beginning of the problem.
Before I just added tons of buffer and calcium to the tank to keep
balanced and Kalk made with untreated ro water. Anyway, thanks for all
of your time. Mark <Hi Mark, If your ionic balance is shot, you need
to perform water changes and test your water (pH, Calcium, alkalinity,
magnesium) to see where you stand. You shouldn't buffer RO/DI water
until after adding your salt mix and aerating for at least 12 - 24 hours
before testing to see what, if anything, is needed. It is very risky
just adding calcium, buffer and Kalk without testing to see how much is
actually needed. Be careful, and test first! Craig> New
water pH (marine) Hi, <Anthony Calfo here in your service
while Bob makes his way to the Outback...where the men are men and the
sheep are nervous> I have a question about ph of new salt water. I
am making my new water with Coralife salt mix. the bag says it should
make water with a ph of 8.3 of so. <a minimum pH in my opinion...
natural seawater is 8.45 and pH naturally falls fast enough in aquaria>
I am making it using R.O. water (which tests at about 25ppm total
dissolved solids -pretty good I'd say) <agreed but still needs to be
aerated and re-mineralized before any marine use else it will waste
buffers in salt mix and system water> after I make the new water,
making it as close to 1.023 sg as I can get, I test the ph and I am
measuring between 8.0 and 8.1 I use 2 different ph kits and get very
similar results. these ph values seem too low to me, any thoughts on
what is going on ? <above... aerate R/O for 12 hours first, then add
SeaBuffer (carbonate, borate, bicarbonate) and mix for another few hours
before use as evap top off or salt mixing. Yours is low because the raw
R/O water has consumed alkalinity> thanks for all your great articles
and info. Brian <a pleasure...best regards, Anthony> Buffers
WWM Guys, I am topping off and doing changes with RO water. Also, I
use B-Ionic two-part mix for calcium supplementation and Instant Ocean
to keep SG at 1.025, pH is 8.4. How would you recommend I buffer my RO
water? I tried using baking soda and it precipitated out when I added
Instant Ocean. Why did this occur? <You added too much buffer. The
salt mix has buffering compounds, too, and with what you put in first,
the pH got too high and drove the calcium to precipitate out of
solution. I prefer to buffer my water after adding the salt. I aerate
and heat the water first for a day. The add the salt mix and mix for
another day. Lastly, I test the salt water for salinity, pH, and
alkalinity and buffer according to the results of my tests. If you wish
to buffer before adding the salt, only add enough buffering compounds to
bring your raw RO water to a neutral pH.> I am interested in raising
my calcium to 450 from 350 ppm. I have good coralline growth and
tolerable slow growth in my SPS/LPS corals. Perhaps I could cut back on
the Bionic I use if I buffered my water? <Perhaps, on use a calcium
reactor to really accelerate growth. That is, if you have a large enough
tank. I would find it hard to justify the expense if you told me you had
a 29 gallon mini-reef. If 75 gallons or more, the money you save on
supplements will outweigh the initial cost in a few years.> What
should I use for this? <I think Seachem products, Marine Buffer and
Reef Builder, but there are other fine products. Aquarium Systems
SeaBuffer is also nice. -Steven Pro> Salt Water Hi
Anthony, just making another batch to try to complete the turn over my
whole 125g tank. This time I thought I would try your buffer suggestion.
I let the R/O water aerate with a power head for two days, added some
buffer to bring the DKH up to 7, let that sit for a few hours, then
started to add salt. When I was nearing 1.020 I noticed the salt was not
clearing as fast a usual (usually takes 3-5 min to clear, as I add in 1
cup at a time) but did not think anything about this and continued to
add up to 1.023. The water stayed cloudy for all last night, and this
morning it is still not clear but not as bad as before. I also noticed a
white precipitate sticking to the sides of my Rubbermaid container that
comes off easily when rubbed. <excess carbonates> Have I just
precipitated all the good stuff out and now have a bunch of garbage
water? <nope... but do a ALK test to confirm> Why did this
happen, was a buffer value of 7 too high for the freshwater before
adding salt? <hard to say but possibly... just because water passes
through a RO doesn't mean it is always and forever pure. Do check the
quality of the effluent for minerals (another ALK test to see if it is
pure or just very low...hence, some minerals still getting through and
less buffer needed)> I used Tropic Marin salt, <a very fine salt>
my last bit before going to Instant Ocean. <my preference> I also
used my last bit of Kent SuperBuffer before opening my new Seachem
buffer. Thanks Larry <best regards, Anthony> Re: Salt Water
Test done DKH 11, 400 mg/l calcium water tests O.K. so on to
changing...thanks for the quick response. <ahhh...yes> BTW I did
purchase an ORP meter, and PH from Pinpoint, <excellent!> my old
Corning PH pen style meter needed daily calibration. <indeed
not built to last...alas> After beginning changes of 15 gallons of
water my ORP was at 235!! Seems like I have been getting lazy over the
years, and have been changing less and less water creating more and more
pollution... I do love to feed my fish. <a common problem for many
kind hearted aquarists> At least after all the water changes I'll be
able to monitor better with the Redox meter. (another great suggestion
from your book...yes I am reading some on vacation... not just while in
the bathroom) <it is great to hear that not everyone reads my book
with their pants around their ankles. A warm and fuzzy moment :)>
Larry <best regards, Anthony> Make up water Hi
Anthony, I was testing some more new make up water and found the
following. R/O water buffered to DKH 4 after aeration. Add salt,
wait 24 hours and check Calcium 420 mg/l, DKH 12, temp 78. <very
fine!> All looks good but I thought I should verify the PH.... it's
8.0? <not surprising for new seawater... even more mixing/time will
raise pH> With a new mix I thought I should get at least 8.2.?? Is
this O.K. for new water or do I need more Kalk or buffer? <just see
if regular Kalk doses in the tank get it up high enough (should). I'm
afraid at these levels If I add anything I'll precipitate out the
carbonates as I did early this week. Thanks Larry <good heavens no!
they really are nicely in the ballpark already! don't believe all of the
SPS reefer hype of max Alk and Ca levels...only serves... not needed for
all> Re: Acronym, Water Change Chemistry Hello again, I
was just reading your web page Q&A's again. Great content. I have a few
more Q's for you. What is FOWLR? <It stands for Fish Only With Live
Rock.> Also, after adding buffer to my RO/DI makeup water to get it
to 8.4 or higher do I use this buffered water for my Kalk slurry or do I
use fresh RO/DI? <Aerated water but not buffer for the Kalkwasser.>
To make water changes do I add the salt first and then the buffer or
vice versa? <I prefer to add the salt first, Anthony the other way
around. It probably does not matter much either way.> I've been using
tap water for the Kalk doses because my RO/DI is tied up with the buffer
and I figured it would be best to ask first. This has brought my PH up
to 8.2 but still drops down to 8.02 but I am not giving up. Do I do this
daily? <I does Kalkwasser just about every night.> I am adding one
tablespoon of Kalk powder to a half gallon milk jug and then shaking for
5 minutes, letting sit for about 5 minutes and then sucking up through
my protein skimmer inlet to mix well before going into the 60 gallon
acrylic sump. <One tablespoon is an awful lot of Kalkwasser for a 60
gallon tank. I only use about 1/2 teaspoon nightly. Please get calcium
and alkalinity test kits, if you do not already have them, to confirm
your dosing regimen.> Thanks again for all of your A's, Jeff Reed
<You are welcome. -Steven Pro> Re: Water Changes Bob,
Carried out a "full" test last night - here goes: PH 8.6 - 9.0 (more
like 8.7, 8.8 - use the Dry Tab Wide Range test kit and the color chart
only indicates 8.6 then 9.0!) <Yikes... this is dangerously high...>
Ammonia 0.0 (NH3/NH+4) - Dry Tab Test kit Nitrite 0.0 (NO-2) - Dry
Tab Test kit Nitrate 20 (NO-3) - Dry Tab Test kit Phosphate 2.0
(PO-3 4) - Dry Tab Test kit Specific Gravity 1.022 DKH 14.08 -
Salifert Test kit Alkalinity 5.0248meq/l - Salifert Test kit
Calcium 425ppm - Salifert Test kit Carry out a 10% water change every
2 weeks - de-ionized water mixed with Instant Ocean salt and Re-Mineral
"M" supplement (will now not add this). <Good idea> Feed brine
shrimp/mix and flakes everyday. Lights on from 11am - 11pm everyday.
Replace Activated carbon in Fluval 203 every 6 - 8 weeks. <I'd do
this monthly> UV in-line with Fluval 203 filter. Fluval 203 also
includes some mechanical filtration and polishing mat. Biological
filtration carried out by external Eheim wet & dry filter (2/3rds
cleaned in old tank water every 4-6 months depending on test results and
fish behaviour). Protein skimmer - TurboFlotor 1000. Lighting by
2No 30W fluorescent tubes. Only require to clean glass lightly once a
week and no algae problems to speak of. Now we have established that
the dKH and alkalinity is way over - what is required to reduce this.
<Hmm, a few possibilities... Time just going by (reductive events in
your system will trend it down), adding some live macro-algae, maybe
some new live rock...> I have read a lot about buffering it up, but
not down!! <Yes, works both ways... "buffer" implies "keeping" a
measure about some value... i.e. not allowing it to move/much "up or
down".> Is it a case of "clean" water changes and more regular
maintenance? <Perhaps...> Is there something I can add/remove in
order to help? <Difficult/good questions... once again, maybe...>
Would the introduction of a calcium reactor now bring the tank back
inline? <Ah, finally, a definite yes... is this a worthwhile
investment for you?> I know patience is required to avoid any pH
shock etc and that this must be done slowly, but any help would be
appreciated. <Well-stated my friend. The changes you describe,
obvious caring in your messages bode well for improved conditions here.
Bob Fenner, WetWebMedia.com> Thanks for your help so far, Scott.
Re: Water Changes, supplements... Bob, Once again thanks for
the clear advice. <You're welcome> I have read the web site
details on pH and alkalinity and now have a much better understanding of
this. Also re-read your Conscientious Marine Aquarist book on the
subject (some similarities there!!). <Yes... consistency may be the
"hob-goblin of little minds" in some fields, aspects of life... the
keeping of living things, no> With respect to the calcium reactor - I
have a FO set-up with one hermit crab (who did a terrific job in keeping
the tank clean) - all from what I have read is that the calcium reactors
are really there for invert/reef set-ups due to the need for essential
minerals etc that these types of creatures require. Are you saying that
we FO people should also use this equipment as well now (I say now as I
have not previously read anywhere stating that this is a required piece
of equipment for a FO marine set-up)? <Yes... all benefit from "good
water quality"... high, consistent (here's that word again), pH,
biomineral content, alkaline reserve.> If so I take it it is to
replace supplementing completely or has time and investigation
experienced the fact that our swimming friends now benefit from this?
<As a replacement of almost all types, kinds of supplementing... as the
three qualities listed above are most all that folks need tend to... but
some organisms benefit from Iodide/Iodine, others from periodic addition
of sugars (ala this and that "vital" et al. products), many other
materials...> If this is now the "case" I take it that this is a sign
of changing times (and more expenditure!!)? <Actually, much less
expenditure... I make the analogy (for this example) with changing car
engine oil... Yes, upgrading to a better brand or even just replacing
same is an expense... But compared with poor performance otherwise and
the specter of replacing your entire engine much more frequently? I'm
not a mechanic... what I'm trying to state is that the alternative
"supplement madness" is NO CHEAPER in that a few tens of dollars a month
over a few years time is more money than purchasing, operating a calcium
reactor... And the "SM" is far more unreliable, outright toxic to all...
> I will test for the alkalinity etc tonight and advise tomorrow.
Thanks again, Scott <Be discussing my intelligent friend. Bob Fenner>
Salt mix ? I know you're a busy guy, but I have a question and
value your opinions. I have just started a 72 gallon salt tank. I
finished filling it yesterday with RO/DI water from a Kent Maxxima
Hi-s 6o gpd unit. I have not added my substrate yet, as I wanted to mix
the Instant Ocean in the tank and get the specific gravity right
first. So, I filled it, brought it up to 78 degrees, and started 4
maxi-jet 1200's for circulation. I added Sea Chem Marine Buffer at the
direction of a local pet store to reconstitute the RO water. I then
added 15 pounds of Instant Ocean. The tank clouded up bad, which I
expected, but it has been nearly 14 hours and it is still cloudy. I
still need to add another 7 or so pounds yet to get the SG up, but want
to know if the cloudiness will disappear first. Did I do something
wrong or is this normal? Thanks so much for taking the time to help
me, Collin Romanick <Normal, yes, for the order of operation you
detail... The Buffer should have been waited on... and blended outside
of the tank... or placed in a setting (like a canister, outside power
filter between other media or in a Dacron bag...) where it could/would
dissolve slowly with water passing by it... But no worries (as you don't
have live rock, other life present), "this too will clear"... Be
chatting my friend. Bob Fenner>
Sea H2O Bob--I'm
thinking now that my brilliant idea on the reason I was having so much
trouble with the calcium level may not be related to my RO/DI unit,
although it seemed to make sense at the time. I'm thinking now it may
have been caused by mixing the Tropic-Marin Bio-Calcium with fresh
top-off water. Here's why. I've been buying RO/DI from the LFS since
then. The LFS tested their RO/DI with a FW test kit at the shop and it
showed a pH of 5.0 or 5.5. I tested theirs with my pH probe at home, and
it showed 9.2! (The pH probe showed my own RO/DI at 9.4.) <What?
This isn't right... your probe is out of whack...> So I decided to
test with one of my pool test dip strips, to compare results. The
results were that my RO/DI water, on those tests, indicated a pH LOWER
than the water from the LFS. Hmmmm. So now I have to wonder why I was
getting such a reduction in Ca on water change days. I think a
conductivity test of my own RO/DI water is in order. . . And I'm also
thinking that my Ca reductions may also have been as a result of the
Tropic-Marin not dissolving properly. <Hmm, doubtful here...> I
can't explain it chemically--all I know is that I would typically do
water tests on water change days--which would prompt me to add more
bio-calcium. So it's possible the relation is there. It did seem that
whenever I added the BioCalcium, it depressed my Ca level. Perhaps
adding it too quickly can lead to that result??? <Not unless there
are other anomalies...> In retrospect, I didn't seem to have problems
with Ca/alk when I would add the calcium product directly to the tank.
Since it seemed to be "burning" my corals, that's when I started trying
to add it to the prefilter area, and also to the top-off water. That
seems to be when I started having serious Ca problems. . . Do you
have any other ideas? Based on these tests (and my having a conductivity
test done), I'm thinking of going back to using my own RO/DI unit.
<I would... the water should not be not be this low in pH to start
with...> (I'm thinking I'll also have a conductivity test of the LFS
water to compare quality of theirs with mine, just to have a point of
reference.) With the increased surface area of the new tank, a more open
canopy, the MH lighting and an array of fans for cooling, my evaporation
rate I'm estimating will be around 3-4 GPD. So my water needs will about
double, and water changes will also be doubled in volume. So I'm now
incentivized to really find out if my RO/DI unit was the culprit, or if
it rather was caused by my supplementation practices. I'd really like to
stop having to make those weekly water runs to the LFS. BTW--I owe
you an update--after using the Ca reactor for a couple of months, I've
got Ca at 460 and alk at 4.12 meq/L! <Ah, this is about right...
much better> I have had to supplement with Kalk periodically to
support pH, but I'm hoping the new system features will allow me to
avoid the need for that. Another question on the new system. I added
Southdown sand yesterday, and didn't wash it first. :( I've heard from
both camps--some say wash, other not to wash. <Yikes, definitely
needs to be washed...> Needless to say, the water is like milk, and I
spent several hours last night removing the thick foam from the surface.
(Next time, I'll definitely wash it first. . .) I've been told it won't
clear up until I add the LR. Is that indeed the case? <No...not
necessarily.> Also, I tested the water params in the new tank tonight
to see what I have. Ca was 440. Alk was really high at 7.2 meq/L! I
think that's because of all the crud floating around in the water from
adding the sand. pH was 7.85. No cycle yet, as all I've added is dry
sand--ammonia tested zero, so there apparently was little to no dead
organic matter in the sand. <Yes and yes...> My LR is arriving
tomorrow--are these water params OK to add the LR? Will the pH come up
on its own as the cycle starts and it has lights on it? <Yes and sort
of yes... do add more of whatever you trust... to bolster the pH... just
baking soda and water changes would be my choice...> Thanks again for
your thoughts. I'm really hoping that I'll be able to see into the new
tank again soon. . . <Gravel vacuum the substrate every chance you
get during water changes... good luck. Bob Fenner> More
questions (seawater making) Hi Bob, (I'm getting to be a real
regular around here) <Careful, you may end up answering queries...>
A few questions: 1: As I mentioned before, I'm moving. If the house
we purchase has copper piping for it's water supply, will the leeching
that occurs contain enough copper to poison the tank for reef
animals? <Generally inconsequential... not much concentration comes
through to matter... but this is one of the myriad reasons I strongly
suggest pre-mixing and storing synthetic seawater... per the rationale,
protocol of the same name on the www.WetWebMedia.com site> 2: I'm
going to get a Rubbermaid Brute (tm) for holding my water (thanks for
pointing those out), would a couple of inches of aragonite (sp?) sand in
the bottom be a good idea? <Mmm, not really... more trouble to
pump/move water...> I was thinking it could help buffer the water and
lead to less of a ph shift when adding it. <Minimally... adding a bit
of baking soda, like a teaspoon per ten gallons, would be much better>
3: I'll be living near (roughly 40 miles) from the Oregon coast, would
obtaining a few gallons of sea water and using it to inoculate the tank
be a good idea, or should I not bother since the local biome is so
different than a tropical reef? <Not so much the difference in living
component of this water, but the issues of potential pests, parasites
and pollution would dissuade me from such usage.> thanks again! Mike
<Be chatting. Bob Fenner> Seawater stress I have a 40 gal.
tank and three weeks ago I added three fish and another live rock.. My
ph has dropped to 7.8. I use RO water change 15-20 % a week. I just
tested my RO water, without the salt added and the ph is 7.0. Does the
salt raise the ph level ??? <Yes, it does, and should... in fact you
need to add more, another source of alkalinity to sustain your pH, even
elevate it. Please read: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marphalk.htm>
when I used to test the RO water it was always 8.2....but I had mixed in
the salt already. I also use c-balance. <The RO only has a tiny
amount of alkaline reserve... once "used up" at that pH level, the pH
drops quickly to the next one of "reserve"> Also, I have had a yellow
tang for 6 months and he always seems to get ick...( then goes to the
cleaner shrimp ) every time I change water. I keep the temp. the same
as the tank water. why would he seemed to be stressed when he is getting
clean water ? <The "clean water" is too much different than what it
has become "accustomed" to. Do study here... get in the habit of
pre-making your new seawater... providing enough buffering capacity to
keep pH in the 8.2-8.4 range. Please read:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/water4maruse.htm You will know soon, how
to easily make-up, store and maintain higher seawater quality. Bob
Fenner> Thanks, Cheryl
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