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FAQs about Bubble Trouble and Aquarium Systems 2

El Sapo sez: "Me no like bubbles, no no."

Microbubbles -- 10/28/2009
Hi Crew,
<Jill>
I'm emailing from my home address so I'll try to refresh on my system.
I have a 125 gallon FOWLR, wet/dry with 2 BioWheels, 20gal sump, protein skimmer. Sorry, it all came from my LFS through Marineland so I am not sure the makes/models. This is what I have below:
I have 80 lbs of live rock along
with about 3" of live sand. I'm having trouble with tons of microbubbles. <Mmm, how long has this system been set-up, running?>
From what I have read on the FAQs, Anthony Calfo suggested using Vaseline to try to locate where the bubbles are coming from and once that is narrowed down, sealing it. He also mentioned in another person's
query that a person can put bioballs in the overflows to help decrease the flow.
<Or a filter bag on the discharge/s to help coalesce bubbles, reduce splashing>
I have to shut off my pumps during feeding as the majority of the food gets sucked into the overflow too quick.
<This/these can likely be easily modified... directed downward... with plumbing... to prevent such>
One overflow keeps gurgling and it trickles too fast and runs over the back of the mechanical filtration unit
<Ugggghh! No fun... this too can be fixed. Please read here:
http://wetwebmedia.com/pbnoisef5.htm>
down into my sump. Is there a way I can slow that down on one side and will this help with the gurgling
noise?
<Yes... but likely better to aspirate this/these... see the link>
Sorry, I don't know technical terms. Wish I had a quick class in plumbing before I started this.
<Heeeee!>
My porcupine puffer got popeye last weekend ending in his demise. It came on quick and by the time my LFS started antibiotic treatment in one of their spare tanks (I didn't have a hospital tank set up at home), it was two late.
Could the microbubbles have caused this?
<Could be a contributing cause>
All my other fish are well. Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10 ppm.
Another thing I noticed is the clamps that clamp the hose onto the pumps in my sump are metal and rusting.
<Mmm, I would replace these with plastic>
I imagine this can't be good so when i shut my pumps off, I take them out of the water so the metal isn't touching it. Do they make plastic clamps?
<Yes. See the larger etailers (Fosters & Smith, Custom Aquatic...)>
Maybe a dumb question but hey....What do I know? Thanks so much guys and gals!!
Regards, Jill
<Please do write back if this isn't clear, complete to you Jill. Bob Fenner>

Re: Microbubbles 10/29/09
Hi again Bob and Crew ,
<Evening Jill>
Bob, thank you so much for your always timely and quick response. I found that it is my skimmer that is causing all the microbubbles. I currently have it shut off tonight and will remove it tomorrow for a thorough cleaning. My LFS guy suggested attaching a piece of sponge or filter material to the intake and trying that out. Any thoughts?
<Yes... on the discharge side... not the intake>
I haven't addressed the gurgling noise yet but I see that it is coming from below in the sump area. Still lots more reading for me to do yet.
<Mmm, yes... again "Emperor Aquatics" bag/s may be your salvation here... and cutting/terminating the discharge/s slightly above water if you can't aspirate the line/s properly>
Seems air is getting in there or something. Like everyone else....I wish I had read this site thoroughly before starting on this mission. Anyway, everything that I've read about wet/dry filters seems to be true. My nitrate's went up from a normal (for my tank) 10ppm to 80ppm. I did a 40 gallon water change 1 1/2 weeks ago. I brought my water in to have it double checked and it's still showing high nitrates. Phosphate is almost undetectable. Being as my system runs with two BioWheels, would it be possible to remove one of them and just keep the filter material there instead?
<Yes>
I am slowly increasing my live sand bed with CaribSea live sand.
<Good>
When I get my 180 gallon, I would like to eventually convert my 125 to a reef tank. I can definitely see why a newbie should start off with just a FO or FOWLR.
<Agreed>
My freshwater aquarium is loaded with plants and I never have an algae issue or anything. Could I just grow some macroalgae down in the sump to help with nitrate reduction?
<Ah yes... one of a few approaches>
My heater is currently housed there but I'm sure I could find someplace else to put that. I have a spare 10 gallon...would that even be worth converting into a refugium for a 125 or is it way to small?
<Even this helps. Just make sure to rig it where it won't overflow>
By the way...last month my LFS suggested I use de-nitrate from Seachem for my nitrate issue. You
see, 10 was even too much for me. Even though I don't have a reef system yet, I still want the best
for these critters. Anyway, I put this in and now today, approximately a month later, my nitrates shot
up to 80. Could this be a case of too much of a good thing??
<Is about "par for the course">
My system is still relatively new....4 months old and I'm wishing like heck that I put it together myself
instead of letting my LFS do it. At least then, I would know how everything works!!
Stay safe and happy diving to all of you!!
<And you. BobF>

Re: Micro Bubbles – 10/31/09
I've attached pics of my sump/refug set up. I can't put a sock on the overflow since the two PVC tubes are connected to the side of the sump. I do, however, use a filter pad -- and as you'll see, I added one more to
minimize the splash (I've never needed it in the past).

It appears to me (and the pic of the refug macro algae seems to confirm) that the bubbles could be coming from this source.

However, as the water spills into the baffles before being returned to the display tank, the bubbles don't appear to be present. The bubbles in the refug were my initial concern -- but since they seem to dissipate before getting into the return lines -- I concluded they were not a problem.
<Not likely so if not too numerous>
The pics don't show it well but the there are 2 PVC inside the sump; one for the skimmer (shown in the front) and the other just like it toward the back that feeds the return lines, the chiller, and the refug.

Thanks so much for your time to coach me along with this issue.
-gene
<Welcome Gene. There are other approaches to reducing bubbly-ness... Do you utilize chemical filtration media? Have you investigated ORP/RedOx? The use of Ozone here will likely be of great benefit all the way around. BobF>

Re: Micro Bubbles
Thank you, Bob.
<Welcome Gene>
I don't know what ORP/RedOx is actually. I'll do some research on the topic.
<Is a very useful "window" to water quality, and it's supplementation, manipulation a sure means of reducing organics... likely the source of "bubbles" here>
What I have in the sump at this moment is a bag of something designed to reduce phosphates (mine are at about 0.5). I also have one other small bag of carbon only.
<Worthwhile>
I have ordered from BRS their GFO kit and media. It should arrive in a day or 2.
<Also worth trying>
What do you mean by "rapid photosynthesis is occurring there"? I have been running the lights on the refug 24/7 to prevent the macro algae from going "asexual"
<Actually sexual>
-- as I've read this could be dangerous and constant lighting and thinning help prevent this. Should I change the lighting scheme to reduce the rapid photosynthesis?
-gene


Re: Micro Bubbles – 11/1/09
Thanks again!
Can I safely assume that these micro bubbles are NOT causing any harm at this time to my fish or corals?
<Mmm, no>
I will continue to work at removing the bubbles but don't want to become overly concerned unless necessary.
Regards,
-gene
<... no way to tell from where I am. B>

Tiny Bubbles (Not in the Wine) 4/24/09
Hi Folks
<Brian.>
I got "Thee a Fuge"
<Great!>
I have a 130 gal reef tank which has been running 1 year, I took out all the bio balls slowly over a period of 3 months and filled that compartment with live rock, so in total I have about 260 Lbs of rock between the tank, sump & Fuge.
<Wow!>
I recently set up a 30 gal tank beside my main tank which I had drilled for inlet & outlet to act as my fuge. I ran a small pump from the sump to the fuge & a siphon hose back into the fuge which runs at a small water flow back into the sump, tried pumping from the main tank but because of the height of the fuge, even when I turn off the pump the water still siphons (obviously not high enough) so I was worried about power outage & you got it major flood, so ran the siphon back into the sump.
<Uh oh.>
The siphon hose just goes into the sump was not plumbed into existing lines. So I am getting tiny bubbles coming out of the sump pump into my tank, will plumbing the hose into the return line to the sump help?
<I do hope we have just a difference in terms here. The drain from your refugium is not a actual siphon line is it? If so you will be in for another flood soon, the siphon will fail sooner or later. You could indeed tie this into your tank drain line to the sump, but the extra water in the line will reduce the capacity to drain the tank. Run the line over to the same chamber in your sump, get filter foam or creative with baffles if you need to. Just make the bubbles' path to your return pump as long and difficult as possible.>
Thanks
Brian Macdonald
<Welcome, Scott V.>
P.S.
I have lots of Chaeto in the fuge & pods are going wild, I had to put a Blue Spiny Lobster into the fuge as he has grown quite large since I got him he is about 5" long, I hand feed him frozen krill & squid.
What other critters can I put in the fuge as a clean up crew?
<See: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marscavart.htm and the linked files above.
All the answers are there.>
Would really love to get a couple mango's
Thanks Everybody You guys are awesome!!!

Re: Tiny Bubbles (Not in the Wine) 4/26/09
Thanks Scott
<Welcome Brian.>
Actually my fuge is not siphon fed it is gravity fed so no chance of flood as soon as I turn power off the fuge pump it drains to the level of the fuge outlet.
<Ah, good, I just wanted to be sure.>
Also thanks for the info on my bubbles used some filter media and it stopped the bubbles.
<Great!>
Thank you so much Scott.
Brian Macdonald
<Welcome, have fun!>

Micro Bubble Problem 3/17/09
<Hi Jayne>
I have a newly set up marine tank. It is freshly plumbed but I have tons of micro bubbles. I've checked (1) water level in the sump (2) water level in the overflow (3) blockage of the intake port in the submerged
pump (4) my vision. I can't find a source for all of the air and wonder if pumps can have a problem on their own and maybe I need to replace the pump? It is not new and I've used it for about 5 years but not for the
past 2 years. It previously had been attached to a protein skimmer so I had no reason to notice any previous issues.
<A few things to check; is the pump completely submerged, the return line from tank is not near the pump intake, no bubbles in the sump, and, no vortex present near the pump intake.
Check your overflow, generally many bubbles are produced here and will find their way back into the sump and will be inhaled by the pump. These are the most common causes of micro bubbles. Let's see if one of the above may be the problem.>
Thanks for your help,
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Jayne
Tucson, AZ

Re Micro Bubble Problem 3/17/09
James,
<Jayne>
Thanks for your reply.
<Welcome.>
The pump is completely submerged, the return line is not near the pump intake and there are no bubbles in the built-in overflow. I guess I have bubbles in the sump because I have a refugium system and the "waterfall" into the final portion of the sump where the pump is located is pretty vigorous but not to the
point of a vortex.
<What I meant by vortex is a whirlpool effect near the pump intake created by the suction of the pump.>
I tried to move the pump further from the waterfall and the plumbing came apart and I got an early shower.
<Sweet.>
I've turned everything off while waiting for some help from a local enthusiast. Since the system is only days old I have only live rock, some algae and copepods in the water. I assume all of that will be fine until this problem is resolved.
<If you have circulation in the tank by means of a powerhead, you should be fine. Is it possible for you to take a pic of the sump and send to me?
May lead to an idea or two.>
Thanks again,
<You're welcome, Jayne. James (Salty Dog)>
Jayne

Definitive Cause of Microbubbles....? 3/12/09
Hello to the WWM crew,
<Hello Steve>
We have been designing and installing large aquariums throughout the Northern California Bay Area for a number of years (even with the current economy we are managing to stay busy.... fingers always crossed!), As we serve largely upscale clients, one of the most common requests is that the system be QUIET (and I mean QUIET!). We have adopted Red Dragon pumps as they are extremely energy-efficient, move a LOT of water, and are almost 100% silent. Amazing beasts these; A problem that comes up seemingly randomly are microbubbles. I have done a TON of research on your site (and just about everywhere else) and find a whole slew of testimonials about fixes but no definitive information about what REALLY causes them.
As they are not buoyant, any baffle system is useless (I have observed this personally over many painful hours). I have heard about the possibility of a pinhole leak but in my experience, when one observes a very fine, barely visible stream of whitish "stuff" coming from all the returns, a pinhole leak seems very unlikely. I have used filter
socks (which help) and leads me to believe they are formed somehow and somewhere between the overflow into the sump. It also seems that if they are coming into the sump, any mechanical attempt to get rid of
them is futile. It seems it would be far smarter to stop them before they form but I cannot understand how this happens. I have a friend who is a civil engineer and very experienced with water flow and is convinced the problem is due to "super-critical" flow, where the water, as it flows vertically via gravity, mixes with air and the
chaos of vertical flow (as opposed to a "sloped" flow) creates the problem.
We have used Durso's, Gurgle-busters, and it's really quiet but still microbubbles.......AIIIYYYYEEEE!!!! If I had any hair left, I would pull it out!
<You are balding:)>
Any input?
<My thoughts would be...are the Red Dragon pumps submerged in your systems?
If not, you may want to remove the end cap and apply silicone lube to the entire "O" ring and also ensure
no debris is present on the inner side of the end cap which could cause a pin hole leak in the intake. If they are installed submerged, then this possible fix could be eliminated. I have had a problem such as yours with a new Little Giant pump and lubing the "O" ring cured the problem.
More than likely, the problem is coming from the intake somewhere. If a protein skimmer's outlet is near the pump's intake, the pump may be drawing bubbles exiting from the skimmer's return.
Are the tank's returns to the sump a good distance away from the pump's intake?
Low water level in the sump can create a vortex near the pump's intake causing micro bubble problems, but I'm sure you are well aware of this. Other than what you have read on our site, I can't offer any more
suggestions. Hopefully this may be of some help to you. James (Salty
Dog)>
Steve
Steve Bicker, Designer & Owner
Nemo Marine Systems, LLC: "Exquisite Aquarium Design"

Another Noise Issue In 90 gallon, and bubbles, addended 2/9/09
Good morning!
<Hello Heidi>
I have been reading all last night and this morning trying to find the answers for my problem. Same issue as many others in that the water coming into my sump sounds like Niagara Falls. The water is so turbulent that it's causing
millions of micro bubbles.
I bought the tank used. It's a 90 AGA RR with 3/4" return bulkhead and 1" overflow. Yep....the dreaded 1 inch overflow. I have an acrylic sump/fuge that I believe is 30 gallons with baffles and bubble trap.
I have read all the tips to quiet this baby down and nothing has worked.
I am wondering if my issue is that my tank is being powered by a Mag 12 pump.
And since I only have a 1 inch drain it's being overwhelmed.
I use flex tubing on both return and overflow so I have no way of restricting the pump at this time. So IS it that my pump is too strong?
<Yes, a 1 inch drain cannot keep up with the Mag 12 pump.>
And if that is the case I could either buy a new pump or somehow rework the plumbing so I can add a gate valve into the return line.
<Cheaper to add a valve. Regardless of what pump you use, the valve allows you to set the optimum flow rate for your drain size.><<... Umm, on the discharge side of the pump... NOT the return from the tank... The much better advice here IS to add more drains, drainage. RMF>>
I know more flow is better but how do I calculate adequate gph for my tank?
<Is generally recommended to provide a 10X tank volume flow rate. In your case, about 900gph. This can be accumulative and can be supplemented with the use of power heads. It's not necessary to provide the entire 900gph through your sump.>
Right now the Mag 12 provides 1130 gph at 4 feet.
Or am I completely going down the wrong path here and should be looking at ways to disperse the water going into the sump? Overflow is draining into 1" PVC that is 2-3 inches below water surface. I was also contemplating
bringing the PVC farther down (almost to the bottom of sump) and using an elbow.
Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated. I have to admit if it stays like this I think I would end up taking it down. That is how loud it is!
<You need to control the flow from the pump. Do install a gate or ball valve.
Right now, I'm sure your pump is cavitating, and that is what is causing the noise.><<Lowering, submerging the discharge is a good idea. RMF>>
Thank you!
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Heidi

Strange Microbubbles...11/20/08
Hello, a friend of mine is having a problem with his tank producing micro bubbles. It only happens during the daylight hours...
<Likely only noticed during daylight hours.>
The tank is located in a dark room with NO natural light. The problem began when he moved his supply pipe from behind the tank to over the tank "under the lights", he is running about 1100-1200 watts MH and T5... First I am a plumber I checked all of the fittings and they are good.
<Great, big concern solved!>
He said that the pipe is lined with sponge, so my thought is that during the night hours the sponge picks up the "normal" every day micro bubbles and collects them, they get stuck in pockets and what not.

Then when the lights come on and heat up the pipes it causes them to release the bubbles.
<Would be released at nigh too with buildup in the pipe, if this were the case.>
That is all I can think of, it is none of the normal problems, we are very experienced keepers, so if you can think of anything off the wall that might be causing this please explain.
<Do inspect the sump very closely, with a flashlight. There is a good possibility the bubbles are not dissipated completely as the water travels through. The baffles/sponges may need a bit of tweaking to prevent this. Otherwise, do make sure there is no restriction on the pump intake, can be a factor.>
Thank you very much, Luke Hines "FishworksAK"
<Welcome, good luck, Scott V.>

New tank plumbing questions 9/19/08
To WWM,
First off, thank you for all of the information you provide.
<Great to hear, thank you Ed.>
It has been a big help. Now some details, I have just finished an upgrade from a 60 gal. reef tank to a 125 gal. reef tank. The new tank has two 1.5 inch drains and four 3/4 inch returns. I am using a Sequence Dart for the return pump with about 18 feet of head pressure when you account for all of the tees and elbows. Both returns are fitted with Durso standpipes.
Now for my problems, when I tested the system there were no issues with micro bubbles. Then salt water was introduced, the bubbles appeared.
<This happens, you can never tell about bubbles until the salt is added! You can experiment with different baffle configurations, make the path of the water to the return pump as long as possible. This can be tough with a Dart return, this is quite a bit of water to have to manage through a sump. Even filter socks on the overflow drain lines can make a huge difference here.>
I am currently adding u-shaped pipe to the bottom of each return to try to diminish the bubbles. Secondly, and more of a concern at this point, I am still getting a bit of gurgling noise from the air hole at the top of the Durso. When I throttle down the pump, the noise diminishes as well as the bubbles. Obviously I want to maximize flow to the tank so throttling down the pump would not be my first option. The air inlet on the Durso is 3/16 in. If I increase the size of the air intake, will that decrease the gurgling sound?
<If it is 3/16” inner diameter this should be enough. If the outer diameter is 3/16, I would increase the size. Two 1.5” bulkheads will struggle to keep up with the flow from a Dart, even with all the plumbing. Do increase the size of the airline, but the amount of flow is likely the culprit here. Even if the airline does solve the issue, realize that these drains will be running at their absolute maximum with no margin for safety. 750 gph is about the safe maximum for a 1.5” bulkhead without siphoning (the source of the noise). If you are just now setting up this tank, I strongly encourage you to take it down now and drill for another drain or even two.>
If so, to what diameter?
<1/4” inner diameter or so.>
Thank you for your help. I look forward to your response.
Ed
<Welcome, congratulations on the upsize! Scott V.>

Bubbles and Silicone Grease 9/15/08
Hello,
<Cheri>
Thanks for taking your time to answer my questions.
<Not a problem.>
I read through the questions regarding micro bubbles in the aquarium and got a bit confused regarding the use of Silicone Grease and Aquarium O-Ring sealant (are they the same thing?).
<Yes, there are other specialized silicone greases out there, but the types used for plumbing, diving, cameras, o rings in general are fine to use.>
In my case the bubbles are not a constant stream, they pump out a very short , light burst every 10 seconds or so. The pump is a Mag 7. I am so paranoid about using any type of chemical around my tanks....so here goes. To start, there are no bubbles in the return area of the sump. So, I want to try and see if the bubbles are coming from air getting in around the unions and/or the pump face, so would it be OK to use the silicon grease on the O-Ring in each, or is there a specific type of product I should use?
<Any silicone o ring grease will work for this, the variety found in the plumbing sections in hardware stores is generally the cheapest.>
Also, I plan on putting some of the grease around each joint in my return system to see if one of them may be the problem. Is there anything else you might suggest I try?
<Hmmm, I would use plumber’s putty, clay, or even just regular old silicone for this. Using the grease to diagnose a leaky joint is going to get messy and the stuff is virtually impossible to clean off.>
Again, thank you for all of the information you provide. You are a great help.
Cheri
<Welcome Cheri, thank you. Scott V.>

Microbubbles in Sump 7/24/08
Greetings and salutations WWM crew,
<Hello.>
It’s an honor to speak with such experience. I am having a serious problem with micro bubbles in my sump flowing to my display. I know this is covered many times in the FAQs, but I think I have tried most if not all solutions to no avail.
<Microbubbles can be very frustrating at times.>
I have a 90 AGA RR mixed reef with a 29 gallon DIY sump that has been running for over a year. I have redesigned the sump a few times by changing the gap of the bubble traps to adding more, adding LR, trying different media, even running the sump w/o the skimmer (Urchin Pro). The micro bubbles all come from the inlet/skimmer section. It seems that with the water/air flowing into the sump from the display creates most of the bubbles, then the skimmer adds to that. Closing the valve on the return is only effective if I turn it to a point where it is barely pumping. I installed an elbow on the return pump pointing down, but that was ineffective and has been removed. I have attached a crude drawing of my current setup, the flow to the sump is ½”-1” below the sump water line.

All the lines between the display and sump are PVC hard plumbed with valves and unions everywhere for easy maintenance. I have had this problem since the tank was setup, but have found no leaks. I know some would say a Mag 9 is too much for the current overflows, but I know of others who run Mag 12’s w/o issues, I have followed their sump designs, but still no favorable results.
<It is not so much that the overflows won’t handle the pump as a return (once plumbing and head pressure is accounted for), it is that you will be pushing the limits of these overflows with no redundancy/safety factor with this.>
The Mag 9 return is split off and feeds my display refugium as well, there are bubbles in there too. I know for fact that the bubbles are coming from the sump as I can see them passing through the bubble traps. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance for your valuable time.
<If you have tried everything in the FAQ’s, then you experimented with the most tried and true solutions. I would move your refugium overflow line as far away from the Mag 9 as you can. I understand wanting to keep it away from the skimmer pump, but a drain line next to the return baffles will be an issue re microbubbles. Filter socks on your drain lines can make all the difference weeding these bubbles out. You can also fabricate baffles of a sort for either the overflow lines, the return pump, or both. For the overflow lines you will want something as simple as a cup. Have the overflow pour into the cup with the top of the cup 3/4” or so below the water level in the sump. This will force the bubbles to the surface, eliminating many of them before the water even transits the sump. With a pump baffle, it is the same basic principle, just in reverse. You will want something the pump can fit into such as a cheapy Gladware or something similar (I used a plastic tea pitcher with a Mag 7). You will want the top of the container to be out of the water with the bottom sitting on the bottom of the sump. Then, you will need to drill several 1” or so holes in one side of this container near the bottom. You do not a high water flow through any one hole. Now you can place the pump in the container and rotate the container until the holes are in a position that takes in the fewest bubbles possible. These both seem like hokey solutions, but they do work and work well! If either of these “baffles” work out, by all means, find something nicer if you wish to use. Acrylic is easy enough to fabricate and make your own manufactured looking baffles. The name of the game here is to make the bubble work hard to get to your pump. Just get creative! Welcome, I hope this helps out, Scott V.>

Re: Microbubbles in Sump 7/26/08
Thanks for the quick reply, hope this follow-up finds you bright eyed.
<2:30 a.m., can’t sleep, so sure!>
You are correct in that a sock helped reduce the amount of bubbles, but elsewhere on WWM I read not to filter the water before the skimmer, as it effects the skimmers efficiency and also adds to the PO4 and nitrates.
<Really of no consequence if you clean the socks frequently. I recommend buying a dozen or so (relatively cheap compared to other equipment). This way you can change them out every day or two and then just wash the whole lot at once. If the socks do the trick or even just help, by all means use them! They will keep your sump a bit more tidy also.>
I adjusted the drain everywhere from about 1" from the bottom of the sump to about 1/2 way to the surface, not much change. I added a pitcher to the drain in the sump, this had a limited effect.
<Every little move you do adds up/has a cumulative affect. If you have such a big bubble issue with the baffles you already have, no one thing will likely solve it, it will take a combination.>
I am working on finding a suitable container for the pump. I also moved the refugium drain to just after the skimmer pump. I am seeing about 1/2 the amount of bubbles now.
<Half way there!>
Do you think a different sump design with taller/lower baffles would be more helpful?
<Your design is sound, but you could perhaps add another baffle or two to make a longer path for the bubbles if you have the room.>
I have looked at the designs of the off-the-shelf sumps, and they seem inferior to what I have now, by having smaller and less baffles, so why am I having this issue?
<The X factor! I just helped an LFS setup a 40 gallon sump with 2000 gph+ flow through. There are no baffles in the sump, a large (10” diameter, 26” tall) skimmer and no bubble issues. Some have high flows through small volumes with no bubbles, whilst others have low flow through large sumps with major issues.>
What could possibly be different in my system that causes me to have these bubbles while others can basically run w/o baffles and not see a single bubble?
<For good measure do check your return line for any small leaks. These can introduce air into the line rather than leaking out water. Also, do realize that certain additives, foods and/or vitamins can increase the suspension of microbubbles much in the same way they make a skimmer go crazy.>
Water quality is great, and 10% water changes are done every 10-12 days using RO. Could a certain coral be causing this?
<No.>
I dare not list what I have for there are 50+ pieces, none seem affected by this, but for esthetics I would like clear water.
Thank you in advance
<I understand my friend. Short of finding anything that may actually cause the bubble issue, back to the creativity part of it. Make as long and brutal path you can for the bubbles to reach your return pump. It is a challenge and will be rewarding once you accomplish your goal here. Do let us know how it all comes out, very welcome, Scott V.>

Gas Bubble Disease? Exophthalmia f' also – 6/17/08
Hi crew,
I recently purchased a flame angel and placed him my 20 gallon quarantine tank. I was using two Whisper 10 filters. The next morning i discovered what i initially thought to be popeye. However after reading your site i found that if it occurred only in one eye it was likely the result of trauma.
<Actually... can be bilateral... one-sided is often mechanical/damage in origin, both-sides from environmental, pathogenic causes>
Therefore i added some Epsom salt and hoped for the swelling to go down.
However, the next day, i found the flame angel to have a clear (air bubble) right above his eye (not on the eye, but more like the eyelid), It seems to
be gas bubble disease. However, I'm not sure what may have caused this and what I need to do as far as treatment.
<Very likely this bubble is derived from collecting damage... being brought to the surface too quickly...>
I replaced my two whisper 10 filters with a Emperor 280 hoping that the GBD was a result of lack of aeration.
(Please note my emperor is a 280 gph and adds lots of surface agitation-not sure if its too much because i am getting air bubbles-is this also harmful?
<Not likely at all>
I read about microbubbles causing bends in the fish-but not sure if this can be caused by a hang on the back filter)
<Again... not the cause here>
Please let me know what i can do to help the little guy?
<Really, just time going by, good care. The area around fishes (and our) eyes is highly-vascularized... The "trapped air" will be re-solubilized in time.>
Also please let me know if the Emperor 280 microbubbles will cause problems?
<Have... Not a problem. Microbubbles are much smaller, produced by mixing air and water tog. at high/er pressures>
not sure if surface agitation bubbles from a hang on the back filter are dangerous or that that microbubbles only apply to canister and return
pumps?
<No>
Thank you.
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>

Noise Level and "Micro" Bubbles 4/29/08
Thanks for your guidance in the past in setup.
<You’re welcome.>
I have two questions about my still lifeless tank. I have a used Dutch AS 75 G flat back hex tank which I restained and varnished, drilled for two 1.5 bulkheads in the top corners. 90 pounds of very cured Live Fiji rock. I have installed it with two overflow PVC 1.5 pipes running from L’s at the bulkhead. Each L has a 1/4 inch John Guest Air valve to allow air suction into the 90s and prevent "burping".
<Is the airline run down into the drain line?>
The pipes run down to a 30 gallon 30X18X12 sump/refugium, which is turning out to be too tall. One pipe goes directly to the 12 inch ASM G2 skimmer chamber (right side of sump); one passes the 9 inch refugium (left side of sump) with a teed 3/4 inch ball valve dropping a few gph into the fuge, and then continues to the skimmer chamber. Middle chamber is a 6 inch pump chamber housing an OR6500 pump. Bubble trap baffles between the skimmer and the pump chamber, although I made these too narrow and may be promoting too rapid flow.
<This can be a problem with not enough dwell time through the baffles to allow the bubbles to escape. Foam between two of the baffles can make a huge difference.>
Exhaust enters the sump below the waterline from the 2 1.5 drain lines but is dropping a lot of bubbles.
<They will, this needs to be managed.>
Some appear to be making it past the trap and back into the tank. I did not build a bubble chamber for the skimmer section, and I have not employed socks, because the sump is so tall I would have a hard time accessing/changing them, and would turn them into nitrate sources.
<This too can be a big help for you. You will need either a filter sock (even if it is a pain to change) or to fabricate something your drains can dump into forcing the water and air to come back up before transiting the rest of the sump. I used to have my overflow dump into a 1 liter bottle with the top cut off for this purpose!>
OR6500 pumps 1.25 line out through 6 inches of flex, threaded connection, union, ball valve, 2 45s, 3 foot rise, tees at the top of the tank into two 1s and drops water into the tank about an inch below the surface. Both sides are blasting microbubbles.
<Frustrating.>
In order to reduce bubbles I have tried vaselining pressure-side joints to check for any venturi above the sump waterline and found none. I have damped flow down from the refugium and seen minimal impact. I suspect the problem is with the volume speed through the baffles.
<It is sounding that way.>
So much for background:
1) Short of reengineering my sump, which may be inevitable, what other suggestions can you offer to reduce bubbles ?2) I have not seen much foam or skimmate in my ASM. I only have a few hermits and snails aside from the LR so there is not much to skim. Is it true that fresh salt water takes some time to "ripen" and reduce surface tension and that the skimmer and bubbles will improve over time?
<Yes, more of the components in the tank being new with manufacturing residues floating about.>
3) I don't have overflow boxes, just two 90s acting as drains which are currently level with the waterline. They are loud. Is there any trick to minimize their noise level?
<First, be sure the open end of the elbow is pointing down into the water. This will keep the inside of the line from being exposed to the atmosphere and your ears. Next you may need to experiment a bit with the air inlets on the elbows. John Guest fittings are nice, but you will need to be able to run the airline down into the elbow a bit. How far down for your case it the experimental part, you will need to play with this distance until the overflow is quiet. Generally 4” down in from the top of the elbow will get you fairly close for this amount of flow. Your drains are sized well for this pump, you can get these quiet.>
Thanks, as always, John.
<Welcome John. You have a bit of playing to do, but this flow can be managed through a sump this size. It is just all about directing it, making the bubbles work around obstacles to get into the return pump. Keep with it, good luck, Scott V.>

Re: Noise Level and "Micro" Bubbles 5/6/08
Thanks for your guidance in the past in setup.
<You're welcome.>
I have two questions about my still lifeless tank. I have a used Dutch AS 75 G flat back hex tank which I restained and varnished, drilled for two 1.5 bulkheads in the top corners. 90 pounds of very cured Live Fiji
rock. I have installed it with two overflow PVC 1.5 pipes running from L's at the bulkhead. Each L has a 1/4 inch John Guest Air valve to allow air suction into the 90s and prevent "burping".
<Is the airline run down into the drain line?>
{no, just a gate valve on the ell. I will extend the line down into the pipe 4 inches}
<<This will make a big difference.>>
The pipes run down to a 30 gallon 30X18X12 sump/refugium, which is turning out to be too tall. One pipe goes directly to the 12 inch ASM G2 skimmer chamber (right side of sump); one passes the 9 inch refugium (left side of sump) with a teed 3/4 inch ball valve dropping a few gph into the fuge, and then continues to the skimmer chamber. Middle chamber is a 6 inch pump chamber housing an OR6500 pump. Bubble trap baffles between the skimmer and the pump chamber, although I made these too narrow and may be promoting too rapid flow.
<This can be a problem with not enough dwell time through the baffles to allow the bubbles to escape. Foam between two of the baffles can make a difference.>
{Wouldn't foam slow flow further? }
<<No, it will just serve the purpose to trap bubbles. Use the coarser filter type foams.>>
Exhaust enters the sump below the waterline from the 2 1.5 drain lines but is dropping a lot of bubbles.
<They will, this needs to be managed.>
{OK..........}
Some appear to be making it past the trap and back into the tank. I did not build a bubble chamber for the skimmer section, and I have not employed socks, because the sump is so tall I would have a hard time accessing/changing them, and would turn them into nitrate sources.
<This too can be a big help for you. You will need either a filter sock (even if it is a pain to change) or to fabricate something your drains
can dump into forcing the water and air to come back up before transiting the rest of the sump. I used to have my overflow dump into a 1 liter bottle with the top cut off for this purpose!>
{My space is cramped with a gate valve modded G2 but I will see if I can squeeze something in. }
<<Even a small cup that forces the air back up before the water is allowed to flow through the sump can have an impact.>>
OR6500 pumps 1.25 line out through 6 inches of flex, threaded connection, union, ball valve, 2 45s, 3 foot rise, tees at the top of the tank into two 1s and drops water into the tank about an inch below the surface. Both sides are blasting microbubbles.
<Frustrating.>
{Yup}
In order to reduce bubbles I have tried vaselining pressure-side joints to check for any venturi above the sump waterline and found none. I have damped flow down from the refugium and seen minimal impact. I suspect the problem is with the volume speed through the baffles.
<It is sounding that way.>
{Yup.}
So much for background:
1) Short of reengineering my sump, which may be inevitable, what other suggestions can you offer to reduce bubbles ?2) I have not seen much
foam or skimmate in my ASM. I only have a few hermits and snails aside from the LR so there is not much to skim. Is it true that fresh salt water takes some time to "ripen" and reduce surface tension and that the skimmer and bubbles will improve over time?
<Yes, more of the components in the tank being new with manufacturing residues floating about.>
{Actually only the Sedra is new. Everything else including the g2 body is used.}
<<Even that can impact skimmer performance, or you just don’t have much to skim as you mentioned. You’re water tests will tell you which.>>
3) I don't have overflow boxes, just two 90s acting as drains which are currently level with the waterline. They are loud. Is there any trick to minimize their noise level?
<First, be sure the open end of the elbow is pointing down into the water. This will keep the inside of the line from being exposed to the atmosphere and your ears. >
{Are you saying facing the tank bottom? Thant would place my overflows 8 inches below the waterline? Or are you simply saying 45 degrees from vertical like 10:30 and 1:30? }
<<However far you need to rotate them so the open end is underwater. Without boxes you may have to construct a little standpipe to get the desired water level. Be creative!>>
<Next you may need to experiment a bit with the air inlets on the elbows. John Guest fittings are nice, but you will need to be able to run the airline down into the elbow a bit. How far down for your case it the experimental part, you will need to play with this distance until the overflow is quiet. Generally 4" down in from the top of the elbow will get you fairly close for this amount of flow. Your drains are sized well for this pump, you can get these quiet.> Thanks, as always, John.
<Welcome John. You have a bit of playing to do, but this flow can be managed through a sump this size. It is just all about directing it, making the bubbles work around obstacles to get into the return pump.
Keep with it, good luck, Scott V.>
Thanks for your help.
{Thanks. I will try these suggestions.}
<<Welcome, good luck, Scott V.>>

Plumbing/Battling Micro Bubbles 4/10/08
Hello to the crew,
<And good day to you, Jeff>
I was hoping someone could help me with a closed loop issue. I am using the design from Melve's reef site where the water is drawn out of the overflow chamber in the tank. I have a 72 gal bow front with the standard overflow kit probably about 2 to 3 gallons (the tank is drilled for overflow 2 holes on bottom of tank, but not for closed loop). I have a Durso in the over flow so the chamber stays pretty full. I have a 20 gallon long sump with 3 chambers. I am using a Gen x mak-4 external (3/4" in/output) pump located under the tank. The loop is plumbed with ¾" PVC and the outputs are ½". I currently have 3 outputs set up for the closed loop. I can get the pump primed and it works well aside micro bubbles.
My issue is with micro bubbles. There are so many it is hard to see the back of the tank. I had 4 outputs, I went to three and I still have micro bubbles. I went back and made sure I had all the plumbing sealed that is not underwater. I used airline tubing to listen for leaks and could not find any. I wrapped filter media around the intake pipe on the system and placed filter media on the inside of the overflow so the water entering the overflow is not splashing but I am still getting tons of micro bubbles. They seemed to get worse when I resealed the plumbing. I am out of ideas and can not figure out where the bubbles are coming from. I was wondering if you had any other suggestions to get rid of the bubbles. If not I guess I will have to settle for power heads and sue the pump as a fancy door stop. Thanks for all your help and again great site!!!
<Your sump is more than likely full of bubbles from the overflow. I would isolate the section where the pump intake is located with a piece of foam whereby all water must pass through the foam to get to the pump intake. See if that doesn't help the matter. Also ensure the sump water level is high enough so a vortex isn't created above the pump intake.>
Kind Regards
<Thank you, James (Salty Dog)>
Jeff

Re: Plumbing/Battling Micro Bubbles 4/11/08
Hello again,
<Hi Jeff>
I think there was some miss understanding on my set up. The intake for the closed loop is located in the overflow chamber in the main tank. The intake is a 6 inch section of PVC with many holes drilled in it. It pulls water out of the overflow box in the tank, down to the pump and back into the main tank. The sump is not involved.
<Will be difficult here to completely eliminate the micro bubbles. Are any of the holes in the 6 inch section exposed to air? All holes need to be completely submerged.>
As I mentioned I have wrapped the loop intake with filter media, it is blue on one side and white on the other, so all water entering the loop has to pass through the filter media. I have also placed some filter media along the inside of the overflow box so there is no splashing as the water enters the overflow. You mentioned using foam, would this be any different then using the filter media? Would the foam be denser and stop more bubbles? Any special foam or will home depot have the right stuff?
<There are round foam sleeves available that slide directly over the intake tube will should reduce the micro bubbles a great deal. The availability will depend on the diameter/size of your intake tube. Example here.
http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=PM-F46B&Category_Code=GFI In your particular set up, I believe it will be difficult to completely eliminate the micro bubbles. You may also want to try throttling down the return from the pump. You may be trying to pump out more water than is available to the pump. This will cause pump cavitation which will cause this problem. Try the foam sleeve for sure, will help.>
Thanks again for all your help.
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Jeff Amato

Bubbles, Bubbles, Bubbles. 2/28/08
Good Morning WWM Crew!
<Hello Mike.>
I have a filtration issue I was hoping to get some input on.
<OK>
In my 125g FOWLR tank I am currently using two Aquaclear 110 filters along with two Hydor Koralia 4 powerheads for circulation. The issue is with the Aquaclear 110s. The water return, being the "waterfall" type of return, is creating massive amounts of bubbles from both filters upon return into the tank, which are then sent shooting all over the tank by the two powerheads.
<Not a good thing to have.>
It's really just an aesthetic issue really (I hope), and the tank just doesn't "look right" to me. Also, is there any issues for the fish and/or my inverts (hermits, peppermint shrimp, starfish) with these bubbles?
<It can be, see http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm and the other related FAQ’s for more info on this.>
I have raised the water level to the limit (just slightly under the return flow), and it has helped a little, but it is still a big issue.
<Can you raise it up to the return flow to prevent the drop/splashing?>
I was wondering if there was any way to modify the filters to change the return water flow and cut down (or in a perfect world eliminate) the bubbles? I was hoping to not have to go to a new filter, and be able to make the existing filters work somehow (with less bubbles).
<Some hang on the back skimmers use boxes inside the tank to prevent these bubbles and they are fairly effective. You just find a small plastic container that will capture the water coming out of the filter and cut the bottom out. Then replace the bottom of the container with some filter foam. This will drastically help your bubble issues. Do be sure the top of this box is lower than the top of your tank, giving the water somewhere to go should the box overflow.>
I would appreciate any help and suggestions you could provide.
As always, thank you for the help and your time.
Mike P.
<Welcome, do try raising the water level a bit more first, this should really do the trick. Good luck, Scott V.>

AquaC EV240 Producing Microbubbles 2/16/08
Hello Gents - and thanks again for the fantastic resource. If only we all followed all the advice you give us!
<Heee…and if gas were back to $1 a gallon!>
Here's my dilemma - I have a 150XH fish only tank with a large wet dry and a Living Color coral insert.
I run an Aqua C EV 240 on my reef and have one for this tank as well.
I installed a new wet dry this week. Problem is that the skimmer is putting a tone of micro bubbles back into the display.
<Was it doing this before the new wet/dry? The same manufacturing residues/oils that can cause a new skimmer to spit out microbubbles are present in the new sump. You may just need some time.>
The sump is as follows - 40" long. From right to left, the tank drains into a 26" area of bio balls. I don’t have enough room in the cabinet, so I use a submersible Mag9 as the return pump. Due to the fact that the last area of the sump is the only 'open' area, it’s crowded. I have the Mag 9 tank return pump, the Ev240 and the Mag 18 that feeds the 240.
<According to the AquaC website this pump overdrives this skimmer and may need to be throttled down a bit. This could be playing a factor in bubble return.>
The skimmer water returns right to the area where the tank return pump is.
<Tough situation, even the slightest amount of bubbles will be returned to the tank.>
Unfortunately, I have VERY little space in that open area so I'm hoping to solve this problem.
Any ideas? I can call Jason Kim on Monday as well.
Thanks
J
<I would definitely contact Jason Kim for his input. In the meantime, you may want to try either some filter foam or filter sock types of materials between the skimmer output and the return pump to help catch the bubbles. Welcome and good luck, Scott V.>

Micro-bubbles/gas-bubble disease 2/15/08
Hi,
<Hello Ryan>
I've been breeding marines for a while and I recently set-up a 10 x 55g system to house the majority of my common broodstock (clowns, Dottybacks etc.) and I have been having a bit of a problem with micro-bubbles. I have tried many things to try and rectify this problem and am starting to suspect that I purely have too much flow going through the system. I have 30,000 lph at 2m head height, coming from a large Onga (aussie brand pool pump) magnetic drive pump.
<Mmm... I would use something else... you don't need the pressure this device produces, nor to pay for it>
I am going to order another smaller (23,000 lph)
<Again, I'd look into something with a different flow/pressure profile... see an outfit that sells pumps for other purposes than pools>
to see if this fixes the problem but in the meantime I am concerned about the broodstock I have already added to this system. How serious is gas-bubble disease for marine fish
<Very>
and what kind of exposure to micro-bubbles over what kind of period of time causes this?
<Just a small exposure in a period of minutes can be deadly>
Are can't seem to find a definitive answer. Even on your 'bubble trouble' FAQ's one person is told that micro-bubbles really are anything to be concerned about where another is told that they could kill your fish.
<Have seen the latter on a few occasions... There are papers written on the topic, gear devised to out-gas water...>
I can't see any obvious physical problems with my fish. The micro-bubbles seem to come out different returns depending on what I fiddle with and while it doesn't seem to bother some fish in others it seems to really disturb the fish, decreasing their appetite and causing them to withdraw into their tanks/decor.
Thanks in advance,
Ryan.
<Do look for "college level" general texts on aquaculture... both the issues of gas embolism/disease and aeration/gas saturation. Bob Fenner>

Re: Micro-bubbles/gas-bubble disease, ScottV, your input as well please re Pump sel., pb 2/17/08
Hello Bob, Thanks for your time, it's much appreciated. I have turned this system off for the moment and just added a few hang-ons filters/skimmers to the occupied tanks to keep them running and added smaller pumps to keep the systems filters alive. I know it wasn't an great idea to put fish in before I had all the kinks worked out but as some of my original tanks were originally in the area where the new system is now located I had to play 'musical tanks', setting the system up around the old tanks etc, moving broodstock into the new systems tanks while I plumbed and completed the system around it. So far only one fish (of course a wild-caught spawning black ocellaris female :() is still 'sulking' from this bubble problem, I'm hoping she improves, any advise on this front?
<Really, only time going by... unfortunately. Stable, optimized conditions... hope>
To be honest picking a pump for this system was the hardest thing I have had to do in that set-up. It's not something I have had personal experience with and was not something I had any luck researching in the usual places. The Onga pump I did purchase is one recommended by one of the biggest aquaculture companies in Aus and seemed comparable to a pump used in a similar system in a LFS I frequent.
<Mmm... much to state here. Perhaps the gist of what I'd like to made known is posted here: http://wetwebmedia.com/PondSubWebIndex/pdpumps.htm
and the Related FAQs link re above>
<<This pump can work, but is unnecessarily expensive to run. I have walked into many the LFS that could save upwards of $400+ per month in my estimation solely by choosing different pump than the use.>>
I am having a hard time understanding the difference between some of the flow rates of these large pumps, one persons 30,000 lph at 2m head height seems very different to someone else's, is the best way to compare them purely by the power consumption of a particular style of pump?
<Mmm, no my friend... Am wondering where we should start in this discussion. "Power curves" are available for most all pumps... But generally just knowing the approximate volume of flow at a given/stated total dynamic head suffices... My concerns are that you get good value in terms of what pressure you really need (likely little, and are paying a premium for much higher pressure) along with the usual need for chemical inactivity, long-life/service... The higher pressure coefficient too often figures into induced air-entraining issues (e.g. microbubbles) as well... Do read the above citation... and we'll chat further>
<>
Would something like a ReeFlo Hammerhead pump of 335w rated at 22,040 lph at 0 head height be more what I am looking for, that brand is the only one I found reasonable info on but I thought they size was too small.
<Mmm, for what application/s?>
<<I would encourage you to invest in two smaller pumps for redundancy’s sake. If one goes out you will still have one up and running while it is repaired. You will also likely manage to get more flow for less power consumed this way.>>
The system is set-up on two levels with the top level being around 7ft off the ground and the bottom about 3ft. I am using 40mm pipe for the incoming lines and 25mm-50mm for the of the outgoing. Other pumps available to me are the Lifeguard Seahorse's, RK2's,
<Ahhh! These I am very familiar with... re-packaged Baldor's... from some friends/associates from many years back... I do strongly encourage your looking into this line. VERY reliable, quiet, energy-efficient (this last is extremely important)>
<<The Baldor based pumps are hands down my favorite for high flow vs. power input (very quiet and reliable to boot). Also consider looking at the Dolphin line of pumps, they do offer a great variety of flow biased pumps. Keep in mind what you have going on is not what would be considered a high pressure application from a pump’s point of view. You will want to look toward the more flow biased offerings rather than pressure biased. As Bob stated, you will just waste power and money using the pressure rated versions here.>>
and LINK's, none of which I was able to find much info on, if any. I had hope to put a reasonable amount of flow through this system, I plumbed it to take it
<Mmm, actually, some of the returns/drains, at 25mm, are not all that large>
<<A 25mm (inner diameter) drain will only accommodate around 1150 lph safely. The larger 50mm up to about 4600 lph, there is a huge difference. You will want to cut your cumulative flow down to about 12000 lph or drill more/larger drains.>>
but even in a system like this is it better to follow the general rule of reef tanks and have the majority of the flow in the tank coming from internal pumps and the like?
<Mmm, no... definitely not. Commercial concerns almost never rely on these secondary systems>
<<This brings my attention back to where all this flow is being processed. How large is your sump/filtration tank? Regardless of how much flow you run through it you should be able to set it up to not return micro bubbles to your tanks. If it is simply too small to disperse the bubbles, cutting the flow back roughly 25% will likely not do the trick. You may need a larger sump area or need to rework whatever you have to keep bubbles out of your return. Something as simple as a filter sock over the drain lines can work wonders in getting these bubbles out. Also be sure that the end of each line is submerged, if it is draining into the sump above the water level it is just adding to the problem. Also be sure that all your plumbing connections are actually watertight. A return can appear watertight (not leaking) because it is actually introducing air into the line rather than leaking water out of it. The closer to the pump, the more likely this scenario is to be playing out, at the pvc/pump joint in particular. Do also be sure that any pump’s intake is unrestricted. If you need to control flow from the pump, do so from the output end.>>
Thanks again for the help, I was so tempted to ask a few of these questions while I was doing this but they seemed like things I should have known.
<An excellent idea to check ones assumptions/understandings with others of similar background, interest... who can/will help. I do hope our Scott Vallembois will chime in here, as he and Eric Russell are most up to date in terms of these issues>
On another note, I'm not sure if you remember but a while ago I sent some pics of my Mccullochi Clownfish to include in the clownfish section,
<Ah, yes>
I think you replied at the time. Since then I have had some small success and raised some offspring, if pictures of the first tank-bred Mccullochi's are of any interest I would be happy to send a few over.
<Thank you for this kind offer. Unfortunately, due to so much travel, I only keep freshwater nowadays>
I could also replace the original pic with a nicer one with a nice anemone backdrop:), I sent a couple of examples, maybe not the best ID shots but a couple of my personal favourites. Kind Regards, Ryan Dwyer.
<Am going to run this as our pic of the day. Cheers, Bob Fenner>
<<I hope this helps out, the links below should help also, there is much good information regarding pump flow and how to choose/apply on the Reeflo site in particular. The RK2 offerings are very similar to these. Good luck, Scott V.>><Thank you Scott. RMF<
http://www.reeflopumps.com/flowbiasedpumps.html
http://www.azponds.com/new%20sequence.htm#Dolphin
http://www.reefaquarium.com.au/index.php?p=productMore&iProduct=112

Re: Micro-bubbles/gas-bubble disease/Pumps and Plumbing 2/18/08
Hello Bob, Scott,
<Scott with you again.>
Thank you both for your help, and your quick response, it’s not every day you get two experts helping you out.
<Very welcome Ryan.>
My black ocellaris female I mentioned seems to becoming more outgoing but still hasn’t got her appetite back, I’m just hoping an unrelated problem isn’t the cause of this behavior and that I should be treating her with something.
<It does sound as though she is improving, give it time.>
Out of my options for pumps it seems as though the RK2 range seems the best one, it’s just trying to work out which one is the best for this situation.
<OK, these are good pumps.>
I should have been more detailed in my description on my system but felt like my reply was too long as it was. When I said my outgoing plumbing is 25-50mm I meant that it came out of 25mm bulkheads into 50mm pipes, as seen in pic 1.

This pic shows one side of the system, the 6 other 55g tanks run along the wall to the left. One thing I am going to change to the plumbing in that pic is to add a ‘breather’ to each side which can apparently help with my issues.
<It will prevent the drain lines from siphoning. I would also drill put a siphon break on each individual drain. Looking at your setup it would be easy enough to drill through the top of each screen just tight enough for a small piece of tubing. Run that 3-4” down (you may need to slide it up and down to find just the right spot) into the drain line and it will break the siphon in the line. This is not necessary at low flows through the drains, your setup will aspirate itself to some extent since the drains are exposed to the atmosphere.>
The incoming pipes run in a similar way, through 40mm then to 25mm with a ball valve on each tank to regulate the flow. I had also plumbed a couple of lines to supply a couple of bio-ball chambers in the sump, a DSB and an extra output to bleed any extra flow back to the sump if the flow was too much.
<OK>
My sump was originally 6ft by 3ft in size; its main draw-back was it was only 14 inches high. I had a real hard time tracking down anything in the dimensions I was looking for. I had a spare 6ft by 2ft tank and I kind of wish I had used that now, but it was a little too tall for my liking. I am going to be setting up a number of systems like this one (once I get this one working well) and for them I think I’ll have to get something custom made, just wish I had been patient enough to do that for this system. When I started to suspect the size of the sump was the cause of my bubble problems I plumbed another 3ft by 2ft by 20inches tall tub into the 6ft one and ran my outgoing plumbing through this first, to hopefully baffle the problem. Each line running into the sump is submerged. I do have a lot of pre-filter baffling the flow but if I still see bubbles after downsizing the pump I’ll try and attach filter socks. I originally was a little concerned about trying to block so much force directly. With both of the tubs joined together is this still considered on the small size for the amount of flow?
<No, we are dealing with a fair amount of flow, but the bubbles should be able to be dispersed over this run through the sump. I would skip the filter socks, bad communication on my part. I threw that out there as a fix for most home aquarists. In your case I would consider something mechanical such as foam on the return end of your sump to catch any bubbles that make it through the run of the sump. Of course a thorough bubble trap towards the return end helps too!>
One of the first things I tried to do to solve the problem was to find a possible air holes drawing water into the incoming lines, concentrating around the pump. I very carefully plumbed the incoming lines with high pressure pvc glue so I couldn’t see how any air could get sucked in around such a seal so I suspected the pump itself, or the bulkhead from the sump where this glue wasn’t used. From what I could tell this wasn’t the problem, I even sealed these fittings with silicone and saw no difference.
<All are possible causes and were worth mentioning, it sounds like we are on the same page.>
With all this in mind would you think a RK2 2120 (23,100 lph) would be too powerful?
<No, not when head pressure/plumbing runs are accounted for. These pumps also do well with throttling back if need be (on the output side); they will even use a little less power this way.>
Is the RK2 214C (13,500) a better option? Any other major problems with my design?
<Do drill the siphon breaks/install the “breathers’’ . This will help your situation. You may also consider replumbing the drains. The way the four tanks appear to be configured in the picture you are going to be limited to 4600lph through them, the flow capacity of the 50mm line gravity fed, likely less with the run and fittings. You will want either a larger line to combine the drains coming off the tanks into or limit each 50mm line to input from four 25mm drains. This will double the flow capacity in these four tanks, follow the same principles in the other six.>
Thanks again for your help.
Kind Regards
Ryan Dwyer.
<Welcome, do keep us posted on how things go, Scott V.>

Re: Micro-bubbles/gas-bubble disease/Pumps and Plumbing 2/20/08
Hi Scott,
<Hello again Ryan.>
Things seem to be improving here. My female black ocellaris is now eating hungrily again, which I am very happy about. I got extremely lucky getting a wild-caught black ocellaris pair in the first place and I certainly can’t replace them. This has seemed to have put this pair off spawning, but at least they are alive.
<Great to hear the situation has improved.>
Thanks for your input on my system design, I was concerned I may have made some major stuff ups but it seems I didn’t do too badly. Makes it much easier to plan for my future set-ups with your advice on board. I have added one ‘breather’ to each arm/stand of the system, should I have added one to each side of each arm/stand?
<You will want to aspirate the line in some way anywhere the gravity fed lines travel down any significant amount to keep the system draining consistently.>
This has improved things considerably, I started the system back-up just to see what difference it made and for the first day I got minimal bubbles, like what you would see if you added a new hang-on skimmer to a tank. Today after running for a day the amount of bubbles are increasing, I think it must be an accumulative affect. I have ordered the RK2 23,100 so I am figuring with this drop in flow I should see the last of these nasty bubbles.
<Can you throttle your current pump back to test this first?>
Thanks for the advice on the siphon breaks, I saw it mentioned in the faq’s and tried to just cable tie the hose to the side of the screen, you way works a lot better. I think I might have to re-plumb the drains, I am getting a bit of water bubbling up through the bottom standpipes if the total flow through that line is too great. I’m not sure if I should wait to see how the new pump goes, or just re-plumb it while I swap the pumps over.
<Either way, replumbing is not the most fun thing in the world, but at least it is not too difficult.>
Thanks again for your input.
Kind Regards,
Ryan Dwyer.
<Welcome, do let us know how it all sorts out, Scott V.>

Re: Micro-bubbles/gas-bubble disease/Pumps and Plumbing... and some C. tricinctus pix 3/15/08
Hi Scott, Sorry for the slow reply, my bubble problem has only completely cleared in the last couple of days.
<Great! I must apologize for my slow response also, it has been one of those weeks.>
Once I added the new RK2 pump things immediately improved. Bubbles reduced to practically nothing, and the noise was cut in half.
<Yes, the typical story with these pumps.>
Like last time when I added the breather's some bubbles did come back after a few days, and the same happened after adding the new pump. There weren't a lot of bubbles and I believed they weren't at dangerous levels. Over the last couple of weeks I have fiddled with a few things with little change. It wasn't until I re-arranged the area around the intake of the pump that I found my problem. A couple of bio-balls had somehow gotten lose and got stuck in the intake pipe.
<That will sure make a difference.>
Once removed, flow increased, and the bubbles stopped (insert big sigh of relief).
<Yes.>
In rare good timing, since I did this a few days ago my black Ocellaris pair I had been concerned about has laid another nest. So it seems I got through this with no great issues.
<Awesome!>
As I was writing this I remembered that I was going to try and take some pics of my Chaetodon tricinctus for your Unknown Chaetodons page. I recently moved my Tricinctus Butterfly into a different tank and am able to get some better shots of him so I thought I would include a couple with this e-mail. I left them their original size, so you can reduce them the way you like.
<Thank you, these will be passed along to Bob.>
Thanks again for your advice. Kind Regards, Ryan Dwyer
<Ryan, thank you for updating us on your situation, I am glad to hear it all worked out well. Welcome, have fun, Scott V.>

Very nice. RMF

Vortex XL Diatom Filter, op., bubbles – 1/28/08
I have a Vortex XL diatom filter which I use weekly to polish the water in my 75 gallon freshwater tank. Sometimes the filter pumps out masses of very fine bubbles into the tank. The bubbles don't appear to interfere with the quality of the filtering operation. At times the bubbles are intermittent, and at other times are produced steadily. Is this normal? If not, any recommendation on how to eliminate the production of the bubbles?
Mike C.
<Yes... there is some place where air is being entrained here... Likely at either of the too-simple attachment points for the tubing going to/from the pump unit (the black nipples)... Either get/use new bands here, replace the tubing, and/or "lube up" a bit with some Silicone based material to prevent air from being pulled in. Bob Fenner>

Air bubbles, SW... - 1/24/08
Hi WWM Crew,
<Paul>
Thank You for this site. It has saved me many times and put my mind at ease during times of panic. (Which have mostly been unnecessary). I hope to make this a short and quick email.
<Pleasure, made all the more easier by well crafted and accurate emails such as yours so Thank you. Now lets see…>
My problem is air bubbles. I have searched the site regarding air bubbles but haven't found quite what I am looking for. I have a 55g (1.5 years old) with a 29g sump and a 29g refugium (currently disconnected). To make it short the whole set up wasn't working. I was pumping out of the display into the uphill sump and refugium. I was having worries about overflow and the return getting plugged etc.
<Shouldn’t be a worry and should be simple to implement with a little planning and “fail-safeing” >
In the end I had to dismantle the sump and fuge (I know it was a mistake but I had no choice) and go back to the way the tank was originally set up - Hang on. Aqua C Remora Pro and a canister filter for activated carbon. The problem was that I had a massive outbreak of hair algae and Valonia before the dismantling. I have been fighting it for months with water changes, etc. I use RO/DI water and the TDS meter shows 0. I removed half (30lbs) of the LR and scrubbed it and I then put it in the sump and refugium because I had the room. I got rid of the algae problem for a while but when I dismantled the fuge and sump I returned all of the LR back to the display. No Valonia but the hair algae is back in full force. Here is my question. I now have air bubbles all over the glass and the LR when I come home from work. Not micro bubbles but big bubbles. I blow the glass with a turkey baster as well as the LR to get rid of detritus but the bubbles keep coming back. Is this a photosynthetic reaction to the hair algae? Is it because I removed the LR, which sat under no lighting for weeks? Did I kill part of the LR and this is some cycling reoccurring? I have leathers and zoo's and a small hammer coral with 5 fish. They all seem fine. I detect no nitrites or nitrates when testing. I haven't tested for phosphates but that seems to be the obvious answer for the hair algae. I want to make sure these bubbles will eventually go away. I am ready with water changes if necessary. I have a tub full in case of emergency water changes. Thanks for all of your help.
<Water changes are always helpful and if done slowly and methodically then should go a long way to addressing the problem. The bubbles are probably a combination of oxygen given off as you say, from photosynthesis occurring in the algae cells. Also the previously high levels of nutrients that fuelled your algae outbreak are probably locked up in the rock and now it is leaching back into the water and as it is being de-nitrified back into N2 (nitrogen gas) it is appearing from the rocks as bubbles. I would continue to monitor and this should stop once levels in the water and rock have reached equilibrium. Water changes, PO4 remover and careful diligence are the best things you can do right now. Hope this helps>
Paul
<Olly>

Aqua C Urchin troubles 12/18/07
Let me thank you first for being a great source of info. But let me get right into my problem. I have a 65gal moderately stocked coral tank with a few small fish, 50# LR and a 20gal sump. After going through your site and the rave reviews I bought an Aqua C Urchin Pro with the Mag3.
<Yes, nice skimmer.>
The tank has been setup for about 2 years and the skimmer was installed about 2 months ago. The problem I am having is even with an under/over/under bubble trap in my sump, the tank is constantly being flooded with micro bubbles from the skimmer. I do not add any additives such as stress coat, and I rarely put my hands in the water. The sump is plumbed with sch 40 pvc. The sump flows about 400gph. I spoke with Steve at Aqua C, and he said it is normal for this to happen. It is very unsightly to see this in a show tank. Any suggestions? Thank you in advance for your help.
<A simple piece of filtration foam cut to fit between the baffles (I would put it where the water comes over and back under) will keep most, if not all, bubbles from reaching your display. Welcome, good luck, Scott V.>
Nitrate: undetectable
pH: 8.1
Ammonia: undetectable
Phosphate: undetectable
SG: 1.025
Calcium: 480
Alkalinity: 3 <meq/L I assume.>
Temp: 82 day/78 night

HELP.... refugium looks like a bubble bath 11/26/07
Hello again,
<Hello Bill>
I had this refugium built by a local guy who builds tanks and also services them.
Looking at the pictures I sent you, my 1st question to you is: Why is the sock completely
under water? Shouldn't it be sitting on that bracket like most wet/dry systems?
<Not really, the sock should be somewhat submerged. It looks as though the bracket was built into the sump rather than needing to hang one off the side.>
Is there a design flaw here? Shouldn't there be another baffle so that the water level isn't so
high where the sock is?
<The second baffle from the sock would have to be cut lower to lower the water level here (unless there is an even higher baffle on the return pump chamber). From the pictures it looks like you could lower another inch or so. It looks like the sump was designed this way to give you as much volume as possible in the middle chamber, is this intended for a refugium?>
And why is it bubbling so much? Took the sock off and it's even worse...
<Is your overflow input on the sump under the water level? If it is not and it is constantly splashing that will explain the foam on top and why it would get worse with the sock removed.>
The tank is a 300 gallon circular tank, the refugium is 72"x 20"x 20" and I'm using an Iwaki 100.
There is also a closed looped mechanical filter using a Sequence 1/3 hp pump. Do you think the water flow is too high?
<No.>
Also, I'm getting micro bubbles in the return line, I can actually see it getting spit out into the tank even though I barely see any micro bubbles in the water after the last baffle/sponge. Could it be the loc-line fittings that I'm using? But the entire loc-line assembly is under water and all my plumbing is pvc or flexible pvc and most of them are glued except where the Iwaki pump.
Thanks,
Bill
<I would first look to the pvc connections as the source, especially any joint with flexible pvc. The flexible can be tough to join, make sure you used a glue specifically for flexible pvc. You may want to actually silicone (make sure no mildewcides) the threads leading to the pump and let it cure 24 hours. This will assure a good seal here. Also make sure your pump intake is not restricted. Welcome, good luck, Scott V.>

Curious Pump Issue – 11/22/07
Hello All,
<<Greetings Jackie>>
I hope you and your families have a wonderful Thanksgiving.
<<Thank you>>
I have a question related to my return pump which is a Mag Drive 9.5.
<<Okay>>
The pump has been in use for approximately 1 year. A couple of days ago I noticed it is expelling a large amount of tiny bubbles into my main tank. Do you know what would cause this to happen?
<<Mmm, I’ve used this brand of pump for many years with good reliability (though I recently made a switch to the Ocean Runner line of pumps for some applications)…if the pump is “submerged” this is likely due to air intrusion somewhere along the plumbing line, rather than any particular fault in the pump itself. A joint/junction somewhere may have worked loose and is “sucking air” much like a venturi functions (only takes a very small pin-hole). It will take a bit of investigative work on your part to find the fault. One tactic for finding the air leak is to smear a bit of silicone grease around each joint “one-at-a-time” to see if the bubbles stop>>
Also, should I be concerned about the health of my inhabitants?
<<In my experience, unless the bubbles are very small and very profuse they are likely more of a nuisance to you, than anything else>>
Thanks,
Jackie
<<Happy to assist. EricR>>

Tiny Bubbles, No Wine 10/31/07
Hi Robert,
<Hi Josh, James today for Bob.>
I love your book, The Conscientious Marine Aquarist. Most valuable.
<Bob thanks you for this.>
I have read thru the posts on ?micro? and ?tiny? bubbles.
My question has to do with the ?flow rate? and what this has to do with generating those tiny bubbles.
I have a 70 gallon Oceanic tank with a built in overflow. It came with a Megaflow overflow. This appears to be their version of a Durso. (correct me if I am wrong, please).
The connection off the overflow feeding the sump is the supplied 1" hose that looks like a vacuum hose. The return to the tank is ¾? tubing. I have valves on both line that are Teflon taped. I don't believe that there are any air leaks. Can you explain to me why these tanks are plumbed with two different size pipes?
<The larger hose is gravity feed to the tank, no pressure forcing the water to the sump is used, whereas the 3/4" line is pressure fed and a larger volume of water can be pumped through the hose in this regard.>
I have wrestled the setup to control the gurgling noises. I want to increase the flow rate but at some point of opening the valve(s) I start to get those pesky microbubbles.
Am I to assume that the point short of those bubbles is optimal? That would be about ¾ open on my valves. I thought that I would be able to max out the ¾? return and adjust the 1"? inlet. In reality I have found this won't work due to the noise and the bubbles it creates.
Most importantly Can you explain where/how the bubbles are generated from?
Why do they start to form when I open the valves past a certain point?
<Based on what you are telling me, I'm thinking that when you open the 3/4" return line past 3/4, your pump is pumping out water faster than it is coming in. If the water level in the sump gets low enough, the intake will suck surface air into the lines thus creating the micro-bubbles. The term for this is called cavitation.>
Thank you for your help.
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Josh

Protein Skimmer and stress? Adding a Skimmer 8/7/07
Hello from Tennessee WWM crew!
<Hello>
I have a two year old system (36g) and have finally bought a protein skimmer (AquaC remora)!

I connected it to my tank today and of course I have some microbubbles. However my fishes seem to be freaking out and hiding. Will this stress them out and cause a death?
<Doubtful, they will get use to it.>
If so, what do you think should be done?
<Nothing, give them a little time.>
My other question is....probably an obvious no but...Can I alternate the skimmer between that tank and my 125g? The specs are for 20-80 gallons for the skimmer but hopefully you will grant me permission to alternate them???
<You could, although it will be underpowered for the 125, but I'm not sure why you would want to. Really both tanks would benefit from their own full time skimmer.>
<Chris>

I have a micro-bubble problem that just won't quit and wonder if you can help. – 07/03/07
Hi Crew!
I have a 125 gallon AGA tank with dual overflows that is piped to a 100 gallon
sump/refugium behind the wall its sitting in front of.
I am using two Genx pcx70 pumps.
One pump line goes directly; back to the tank.
One has a tee to feed the refugium.
The strange thing here is only one side has the bubble problem.
<A plumbing leak...>
My right side return looks great, the left side looks awful.
So I think this rules out the problem being in the sump.
I checked all the connections to the Left side and can't find any leaks.
<There is at least one there somewhere>
I pulled out the return pipe and cleaned all the loc-line fittings.
I noticed at one point when fooling with the loc-line that the bubbles stopped temporarily.
Do you have any ideas?
I was wondering if maybe the loc-line pieces could suck in air and maybe they need to be replaced?
<Yes... or at least switched with the other side to confirm the source of the leak...>
Thank you for any help you can give me.
Great site, I use it all the time.
David Matza
<Try switching out the Loc fittings... replacing the hard plumbing in turn if this doesn't disclose the source of entrained air. Bob Fenner>

Micro bubbles from my protein skimmer... Chemical Algicide use... 6/30/07
Good evening, all.
<Yawnnnn! AM here now>
I have a 100 gallon, fish only tank with about 50 pounds of live rock.
<Okay>
I turned off my protein skimmer on Thursday afternoon to treat a red slime algae problem in my tank. I used ChemiClean.
<... not advised...>
I've just turned my protein skimmer back on after being unplugged for 36 hours and it is producing an exorbitant amount of micro-bubbles that are getting pushed up into the tank.
<Good... you need to remove as much of the products, by-products of using this "algicide" as quickly as possible>
I've unplugged the skimmer to stop the micro-bubble flow for now, but I have no idea why the skimmer is causing them, or what else I can do to prevent it.
Any suggestions?
Trapped in bubbles,
Scott
<The Boyd product Scott... not a good idea... I'd do a few largish water changes... one a day over the next few days... leave the skimmer going, place some Polyfilter, Activated Carbon... and hope your system doesn't crash... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/maralgcidefaqs.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

Protein skimmers & bubbles in my new tank 4/15/07
What is the correct way to set it all up?
<Mmm, depends on the make/model...>
Will a lot of bubbles hurt my fish?
<Could, yes... see the term "emphysematosis" on WWM, elsewhere>
My nephew bought a set up like the tank (it's a ten gallon saltwater tank)
<Hard to keep such small volumes stable enough...>
, from the movie finding Nemo and doesn't know anything about fish, neither do I so here I am trying to keep my new fish healthy. thank you in advance for your help.......
<Mmm... much more to relate... that is... related... I encourage you to choose to either "get involved" sufficiently to be successful here... or make this an easier freshwater system... Give it to someone who... Perhaps a book... at least a cursory reading of WWM: http://wetwebmedia.com/marine/index.htm
Bob Fenner>

Over flow box: air bubbles break siphon 4/5/07
<Hi Brian, Mich with you today.>
Please help!
<Will try!>
I can't find any specific solution to the tiny bubbles which break my siphon.
<I think I may know what the problem is, but I have a couple of questions first. Are you using a U tubes or do you have a continuous siphon overflow box? Do you know where the air bubbles are coming from? Do you know why you are getting air bubbles? The attachment is not coming through. Could you resend the photo? It may be helpful in trouble shooting your problems.>
I've looked at the provided links for hours and have also done many of my own searches, and still nothing. Thanks for your time,
<Welcome! -Mich>

Re: over flow box: air bubbles break siphon - 04/05/07
Sorry I don't know how to resize the attachment.
<Still not getting the photo. It is very strange. The email is showing there is an attachment but there is no way to open the attachment.>
To answer your questions so you can answer mine.
<A question for a question if you will...>
I am using a continuous overflow box.

The bubbles are created when the water first enters the overflow box from the aquarium only when the water level of the water reservoir of the overflow box is lower than the level 1 which I marked on my attachment. While the water level of the reservoir box is kept higher than the level 1 mark, the bubbles are not created. The problem is keeping the water level of the reservoir of the overflow box higher than the level 1 mark using my ball valve and without overflowing my aquarium. I can usually get the water level of the reservoir to stay at the level 1 mark for about a day, and then it slowly decreases. I'm not sure why it doesn't seem that many people have the same problem as me because when I l search for "bubbles and overflow box" the problems others have are different. Maybe I am doing something wrong. Well obviously not right!
<I think so. I'm not totally clear on how you have things set up, but I think I understand enough to offer some suggestions. A couple of options. You can get an "Air Lifter" pump and attach it via airline tubing to the knob. This will continuously remove any air which gets stuck in the top of the overflow. The pump sits on the top of the overflow and does not get submerged. Or you can use a power head which has a venturi feature. Again connect it to the knob via airline tubing but the powerhead will need to be submerged in you tank. Either of these will continuously remove any air build up and you should allow you to complete open you ball valve. Does this make sense? I have used the air lifter and have found them to last about a year. I always kept a back up on hand. When you start having a problem with circulation that you can't figure out, check the air lifter. It might need to be replaced. It may acts as if it is working, but I have found over time it looses suctioning ability.>
Thanks again for all the help,
<Welcome! Hope this helps! -Mich>

Re: over flow box: air bubbles break siphon - 04/05/07
<Hello again Brian, Mich here.>
Awesome! You have cured my headache thank you.
<You are most welcome!>
I did have a venturi powerhead so I tried to mess with it and couldn't figure out how to incorporate it with the overflow box, so I did a search online. I came across a forum that said instead of using a venturi powerhead or an "air lifter" you can just attach airline tube to the top of the overflow box and start directly siphoning this to your sump/my refugium. I did this and it works. The air bubbles are forced to siphon down to my refugium. I think this is great, but I'm wondering if this is safe (over fill proof). As long as my tank is safe from loss of power, reverse siphoning from return pump line, and loss of siphoning from overflow box It should be safe right? Is there any concerns that you might have about this vs. the "air lifter" or venturi powerhead.
<My biggest concern was the airline coming out of the sump and siphoning several gallons of water onto the floor. Also complicating the matter for me, was airline tubing looks way too much like a kitty toy. In my house this was way too tempting. You may be OK if there are no four-legged critters or little two-legged ones!>
Thanks again,
<Welcome! -Mich>
Brian

Air bubbles in plumbing discharge 2/22/07
Hello Bob,
I had a question for you regarding my 90 gallon reef aquarium. My return for this tank is spitting air into the aquarium and I can't figure out where it
is coming from, I have checked the plumbing to make sure its secure and not leaking, and the filters water level is not low. The tank dimensions are 48"x 18"x 24" the pump running the system is a blue line 40 HDX The tank sits about 4 feet in up on its stand and the sump is located below the tank on the floor. The bubbles coming from the return are very tiny and there are tons of them. Any suggestions on what to look for to fix this?
Thank you,
Brian
<Almost assuredly there is a "pin-hole" leak somewhere... very likely in the discharge side... of your plumbing... You might get lucky and just detect this with a spray bottle of water, or systematically covering each solvented and threaded joint with a very wet paper towel... but if the tank has no livestock in it as yet... I myself might "skip ahead" and daub a bit of solvent over these areas... to seal up the leak where the air is being entrained. Going forward, do you use clear or purple primer before solventing? I would... and a smear of Silastic (rather than Teflon tape or pipe dope, or...) on all thread to thread connections... can/will "come off" if the need arises... Bob Fenner>

Thank you... Found! Source of air entrainment/bubbles, Not-Caulerpa control/biol. 2/23/07
Bob, thank you for the advice, I found out that the bulkhead to the return nozzle was the culprit for the air pouring into my tank!
No more air!!
<Ahh! Congrats!>
I also found a way to manage the algae problem I mentioned in a previous email. It turned out to not be Caulerpa, but I am guessing hair algae, I didn't know hair algae could be feathery in appearance, but the Trochus, and Nerite snails, along with the red tip "equal handed" hermit crabs I added seem to be really doing the trick working as a team on it, I stocked the tank sparsely with them so they would have enough to eat and hopefully wont run completely out of food. I will be putting 10 Nassarius snails in the tank soon also. The Trochus snails are really going at the diatoms in the aquarium as well, I have been seeing a lot more coralline on the rocks. The tank does have animals in it now, three crocea clams, the smallest 2 are three inches, and the larger is 3.5 inches. There is a yellow tang, about 4.5" in body length, a coral beauty that is about 2.5 inches in body length, a mandarin dragonet, a large six line wrasse, a yasha haze (white ray) shrimp goby, a young Banggai cardinal fish, and a group of squamipinnis Anthias 1 male, and 4 young females. I also plan on getting a lineatus wrasse in a couple of weeks. This is all in a 90 gallon reef, no corals yet, but it is looking to be possible soon. The fish and clams have been in for almost a week now and no signs of stress, illness, or anything to a negative effect. I check the water every few days for calcium levels, dKH, PH, Nitrate, Nitrite, and Ammonia, haven't had any readings on ammonia or nitrite since I set the tank up, I cured all the live rock in dark vats before hand for 5 weeks with vigorous water flow and protein skimming, and left lots of area for water flow when I set up the aquascape. The readings have all been great, calcium just above 420, dKH at a constant 12, PH at 8.3, Nitrates at 0, Phosphates at 0. The temperature in the aquarium is 80 degrees F. around 12 PM to 8 or 9 PM then it slowly cools down later to no lower than 76 degrees F.
<Mmmm, would raise the settings on your heater/s to about 78 F.... four degrees in a day can be a bit much>
 The tang still hasn't become fond of prepared foods, but seems to prefer the algae growing in the aquarium, I feed the tank small portions 3 times a day with Cyclop eeze, brine shrimp, krill, oyster eggs, and blood worms. I use Kent's garlic extreme, and Selcon in their food. I also use Kent's marine C. to boost their vitamin C. Thank you for your help, I really appreciate it, and my animals do too!
Thanks again,
Brian
<Thank you for this follow-up, insights. Bob Fenner>

More On Micro-bubbles And Their... "Origin?" - 02/12/07
Hello Crew,
<<Jeremy>>
I am having the same problems as the person of the post I copied below this one is having.
<<Ok>>
I have two sets of over-under baffles and also my flow into my refugium is going through a 200-micron filter sock. I have a Mag-5 submersed for my return. My return line is 3/4" and my bulkheads are threaded 1". I have an adaptive nipple that is 1" female to 3/4" male. Inside my overflow I have 1" hose going into a "t", 3/4" hose coming off of the "t" back into my tank. All the hose is flexible clear hose.
<<Hmm...perhaps replumbing with hard-pipe will make a difference here>>
I feel that somehow my return hose is causing the bubbles, I can't see any bubbles entering my pump in my refugium.
<<This is not uncommon. Even the smallest pin-hole leak can cause air to be drawn in to the return line>>
I also have the sponge that comes with the pump covering the inlet. You say that this person's problem is air entrainment.
<<Sounds like it may be your issue as well>>
Could you explain this more to me?
<<Quite simple really...is the "inclusion of tiny air bubbles" and is most often described as relating to making concrete more "workable" without adding excess water. But for our purposes, when speaking of air entrainment in the hobby/on these pages we are referring to air that becomes introduced/trapped in the water flow path. This can be air that gets "gulped" down the water intake on the way to the sump...or it can be as already mentioned...air that is "drawn" in to the flow path as in a venturi, or a loose fitting, etc.>>
How does this happen?
<<It is often the result of faulty "joints" in the plumbing lines. One way to avoid these is to use well cemented PVC pipe as much as possible to reduce the number of "clamped" joints or use "continuous" runs of flex pipe to eliminate joints altogether>>
I have seriously been losing sleep over this and my wife says if it is causing me so much stress she is going to make me sell the whole set up, and I have only had it running for one month! Help!!
<<Try sealing the joints on the output side of the pump one-at-a-time (with silicone grease) until you find the offending joint/joints>>
Thanks,
Jeremy
<<Happy to share. EricR>>
Micro bubbles in my tank 9/21/06
I have been going in circles with my 120 gallon tank for 5 months now to no avail. There are bubbles everywhere in my tank. Well first I spent 200
dollars on sump with baffles and visibly there are no bubbles in the pump chamber it looks completely clear. I am using a mag 9.5 submerged). The
return is made with flexible tubing split half way up with a tee to the return pipes.
<Likely air entrainment... very likely at one of these junctions...>
everything was working perfectly except for the bubbles. So I thought just the other day could the bubbles be coming from my pump. So I unplugged it
put it in the main display and there was the culprit bubbles coming out in short burst. so my question to you guys which have helped me so much
already. Is there a submersible pump with a 3/4 inch outlet that will not cause these problems because this is not the first time this has happened to me. Thank you.
<... how did bubbles come from a submersed pump? This is assuredly not the source... but one of the lines distal from the discharge. For one, I'd
replace the flexible tubing with solid... If you're set on using a submersible pump, you can... but they have downsides... Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_3/cav3i1/Powerhead_test/powerhead_comp.htm
and the linked files at the bottom. RMF>

Belching Return Pump, Possible Air Leak 2/11/07
Hi Crew,
<Hi Jason, Mich with you tonight.>
I'm having a problem with my Quiet One 6000 return pump. Once every few minutes, it will spew a stream of bubbles into the display tank. This is preceded by a "shhhh" noise from the pump, like the sound of opening a soda.
<Sounds like an air leak.>
The pump is external, connected to the sump by about 14" of PVC plumbing as follows: (all 1") bulkhead -> threaded connector -> ball valve -> connector -> union -> pump. All slip connections are PVC bonded, and all of the threaded connections have silicone except the union->pump connector. The bulkhead intake is 12" below the water level of the sump, and it is not drawing air from the surface. On the return end, I have pump -> union -> connector -> ball valve ->
nipple -> vinyl tubing -> nipple -> elbow -> bulkhead.
<First place I'd check would be the vinyl tubing.>
Any thoughts on what is happening?
<Sounds like you're drawing air somewhere.>
My particular confusion comes from the intermittent nature of the problem... there's some sort of buildup followed by release of these bubbles from the pump. Would a simple loose connection or small air leak cause this?
<That would be my thought. Have you tried checking for water leaks while the pump isn't running? It may require the water to rest in the plumbing for a while before revealing itself. The pumps may need to be turned off for more than a few minutes, maybe a hour or so. Obviously make sure all the exposed plumbing is dry initially.>
Thanks for any advice!
<Hope that helps! -Mich>
Jason

Bubble question
Hello,
Thank you in advance for you help.
I have a 1" hose running into my refugium under my main display tank from my built in overflow. The problem is that I am getting a lot of bubbles coming into my refugium from this hose. I am using a stockman down pipe that I bought from his web site and I made sure that the hose is going down into my refugium at a gradual down sloping angle. I have read on your web site to put in a "T" or "L" in the inlet hose somewhere to help reduce bubbles, is that right?
<Mmm, might... but I would add a "sock" here... as well. Look at the mighty fine ones offered by Emperor Aquatics...>
Could you explain to me where to put a "T" or "L" into the hose to help reduce bubbles.
<At the distal end... under water, in the refugium...>
 To help keep the bubbles from getting back into my tank I am using the filter foam that goes over the intake of the Mag 5 pump that I bought for my return,
<Good>
I also put a filter sock over the foam of the intake of the Mag 5 pump.
<Mmm... no, not a good idea... this is a centrifugal type pump... pushes... doesn't pull... need to have some screen on the intake side, but the real restriction should be on the discharge... the end>
 However I am still getting little bubbles into my main tank. If there was a way I could limit the bubbles getting into my refugium I think this would help greatly.
Thank you very much.
Jeremy
<Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
and the linked files above. RMF>

Re: Colt Coral and new question re bubbles 1/17/06
Thank you for your prompt response to my question.
<Prev. corr.?>
 My colt coral opened back up today and seems to be okay (he is not back to normal size yet). I also moved the cabbage to give him a little more current.
<Good>
 When I woke up this morning he had a clear slime releasing from his middle but as the day went on he opened up and seemed okay. I am now having another problem and after researching most of the day on the Internet I have not made a conclusion. I am having a problem with tiny bubbles in my tank. I have a 30 gallon tank with what was about 3 inches of live sand all the way around. Now I have hardly any sand under my live rock and mounds in the front thanks to my 2 engineer gobies.
I have noticed some bubbles covering the corners of my tank and some of the rock. I thought it was my protein skimmer at first because I can not seem to get it tweaked. However, I turned the skimmer off yesterday and the bubbles are still appearing even after I fan the water to release them. I added 5 Nassarius and 3 Cerith snails about a week ago could they be causing a release?
<Mmm... might re related... but not for sure>
I have had this tank set up for about five or six years now and did move it to my new home over a year ago with no problems. I read some articles today on old tank syndrome what are your thought on that?
<Does occur>
 I also did a water change a week and a half ago and again today about 25%. Also the new light with the two 96 watts dual bulbs was added a week ago. Thank you for your help ahead of time.
Tiaa
<More likely an effect of the new lighting... boosted photosynthesis in these areas... gas accumulation... I would re-direct your circulation toward the corners and not worry at this point. Bob Fenner>

Bubbles in Main Tank, cavitation? 1/13/07
<Ken, Graham T. with you tonight.>
I have a 180 gallon tank plumbed into the basement which dumps into a 300 gallon sump.
<Big sump. Good.>
The return line is 2" pvc to a hammerhead pump which pumps a head of about 12' in 1.5" pvc to the tank. I am circulating about 3,500 gallons per hour from the sump.

I also have a closed loop moving additional water within the tank with four returns. My issue is that I am having tiny bubbles returning from the sump to the main tank. The sump is very calm , tiny bubbles not visible and I have tried a return box with sponges to trap possible bubbles and multiple inlets to decrease the intake draw of water, nothing seems to decrease the bubbles. Can my powerful pump be chopping the water and creating air bubbles.
<That would be my guess. The large differences in pressure associated with pumping volume at that head with induce cavitation. Cavitation, simply put, is just water boiling because of the extreme low-pressure on the input side of your pump. Remember, it is not just heat that makes water boil, but pressure differential. Adding more lines to feed the tank will do little or nothing since the low pressure is found at the impeller-housing, after the 2" restriction. The real change must be made at the out-put stage. Unfortunately, if you do have the pump I spec'd out (Dart), then you may be undersized to boot. Either way, utilizing a low-speed pump, using multiple pumps, or enlarging the inlet-size of your current pump are all ways to reduce the unsightly bubbles you generate. HTH,
-Graham T.>
Thanks Ken

Solution - Turboflotor 1000 and bubbles in sump/tank
I was able to get rid of 90% of the bubbles. I "invented" a device. Maybe I should market it! Since my overflows use 1" PVC and output from Turboflotor are 5/8", I made a bubble trap with a 2" piece of PVC with cap on bottom. I made it about an inch higher than normal sump level. I then inserted this into a Marineland filter material (filter in outside). I then flow water from overflows and from skimmer into top of the PVC traps (overflow and skimmer returns extend about 2/3 of the way down into the traps). The water flows in, cascades out of top (which dissipates some bubbles) and then flows through filter material. The filter material removes most of the remaining bubbles. This has
eliminated 90% of the bubbles - the only one that remain are extremely fine and evidently pass through the filter material. There are still bubbles but they are greatly reduced. If I could find a finer filter material I am sure I would eliminate almost all of them (something like a sponge-type filter with a 2"-2.25" opening in middle to fit 2" PVC trap).
<Emperor Aquatics makes micron filter bags that maybe just what you are looking for. They are extremely efficient at trapping debris, but must be rinsed out almost daily, for fear of becoming a home for nitrifying bacteria.>
Will the remaining 10% bubbles and of very fine/smaller nature pose much of a danger now?
<Probably not much>
They are hard to see anymore and most evident under the 2 x 96 compact fluorescent lights. You can't see them coming out of the return anymore - before it looked tons of dust blowing out into the water. They are very very fine and smaller now and don't seem to stick to everything anymore. - Mark
<Do look at the micron bags as another option. If you clean them regularly, they are very effective at removing large amounts of detritus. -Steven Pro>

Protein Skimmers...Tiny Bubbles Do Not Make Me Happy 12/8/06
I'm hoping that someone there can help out with a question in regards to protein skimmers. I have an Aqua C Urchin Pro driven by a Mag 3 pump. When I turn it on it fills the top <of the> tank with micro bubbles within minutes. I have tried turning it on with different water levels in the sump, I tried all possible cup placements, no luck. I contacted Aqua C and went back and forth with them a few times and they feel it is something in the water.

It's a 75 gal. tank with a 37 gal. sump. I moved the water from my 50 gal. tank into this setup and filled the remainder with saltwater that I mixed from an R/O.
The tank has been running for approximately 4 weeks. I can not run the skimmer because it fills the tank with micro bubbles.
<Ahh, did you put any Stress Coat or similar product in the water on initial set-up?>
At this point I would like to consider replacing the unit out of frustration. I have been on your site and have become very confused, some people swear by the ETSS, then others say it's too loud and cumbersome to clean because of the bio balls. Others say that Euro Reef with an Eheim motor and not the proprietary motor from the manufacturer is the way to go.
<All good skimmers, and the Euro Reef/Eheim combo is a good choice. The Eheim pumps seem to last forever. I like skimmers that offer the least amount of adjusting/tuning, etc.
I'm using a Tunze and find this skimmer to fall into that category very much.>
Based on what I have described can you offer any suggestions which would make this decision easier?
<I wouldn't throw the towel in yet. Get yourself two units of Chemi-Pure and place in the sump where some water flow will go through the bags. If there is anything in your tank that could cause the micro bubble problem, this will remove it. I feel the Aqua C skimmers are a very good and hear very few complaints about them.>
Thank you very much in advance for your help,
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Ron Kennedy

Re: Protein Skimmers...Tiny Bubbles Do Not Make Me Happy 12/11/06
Sorry I just noticed a typo, I meant to say that I did use stress coat <Stress Coat> when I made up the water.
<This will definitely cause your bubble problem.>
On 12/8/06, Ron Kennedy wrote:
>> Thank you for the quick response, I did use Chemi pure <Chemi-Pure> when I made up the
> water. I actually have two new <units of> Chemi pures <Chemi-Pure> in the container. My sump is a 37
> gal. tank with a glass divider about two thirds of the way over, will it
> work if I get a specimen container drill holes in the bottom and hang it
> over the divider with the Chemi pure <Chemi-Pure> in it. Do <Does> the Chemi pure <Chemi-Pure> need to be
> fully submerged. Also, how long do you think it will take for the Chemi pure <Chemi-Pure>
> to work.
><Does need to be submerged or have water flowing through it. The Chemi-Pure, depending on the flow rate through it, should take a couple days to remove the Stress Coat. Please check your caps and grammar before sending so we do not have to do it. Our time per day is very limited.>
> Thank you so much for your honesty!!!!!!!
><You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>

Air Bubbles in MegaFlow Return - 12/08/06
Hello,
<<Howdy>>
You have a great website!
<<Thank you>>
Q: I bought a 95-Wave Aquarium from All-Glass Aquarium. The system came with the All-Glass Aquariums MegaFlow Overflow Accessory Kit. After I start the system everything is working fine but I noticed that the system was pumping small air bubbles into the tank. After a while I realize that the "3/4" elbow" has a little hole that is placed on purpose.
<<To stop back-siphoning when the pump/power is off, yes>>
This small hole is an anti-siphon feature in the event of a power outage.
<<Ah...I should read ahead *grin*>>
When I close (using my finger) the little hole the bubbles will stop.
<<Try positioning the outlet pipe such that the "hole" is "just below" the surface of the water. This should stop it from entraining air with the water stream>>
I have seen these systems working in other aquariums and it seems to work fine, (no air bubbles).
<<Likely the outflow pipe was positioned as I described>>
Can you help me realize what is wrong with the ¾ elbow?
<<Give my suggestion a try. If it is not possible to position the "hole" below the water line, then block the hole and position the pipe outlet shallow enough that the sump can handle the transient water in the event of a power outage>>
Best regards,
Luis Miguel Ferrero
<<Cheers mate, Eric Russell>>

Re: Air Bubbles in MegaFlow Return - 12/11/06
Howdy Eric,
<<Hello Luis>>
I did what you recommended me and everything is working fine.
<<Ahh, very good to hear>>
Thanks!
<<You're quite welcome>>
Nevertheless, the weekend I reviewed other systems that utilize the same Overflow and notice that although the water level did not cover the small orifice it wasn't throwing air bubbles into the tank. (?)
<<Hmm...perhaps those systems are utilizing smaller pumps/less powerful flow...or maybe the holes were "plugged">>
Rgds.
Luis Miguel Ferrero
<<Cheers, EricR>>

Tiny Bubbles (In The Wine??) 11/23/06
Crew,
<Adam>
Happy Thanksgiving to you all. Lets all take a second and think about the great things we are blessed with.....OK, lets go!
<Yes it was. I was blessed with a very good paying job.>
It's been awhile since my last major fiasco, but sure enough I am in a pickle again.
You are all the experts and with your advice I have defeated Ick, developed a quarantine system and have had excellent results with my tanks..... SO I UPGRADED!
I got a new house and a new 120 Gallon "all glass" Aquarium with 2 drilled in overflows that move 1200 GPH (all glass specs). I also have a clear pro wet/dry sump that is rated for a 120 gallon tank, so it is like 8 gallons (I KNOW I KNOW, my Local fish store was off the base recommending this one and I now regret it.) I also have a mag 7 return pump that is connected to flex tube into a T, then one goes to a 3/4 PVC return and the other side is 1/2 flex tube to a return water shooter deal (name??)
My problem is I am getting a undesirable amount of micro bubbles.
 1.My hypothesis is that my Mag7 is not flat in my sump it is sitting slanted due to not long enough flex tube. This may be causing this?
<Unlikely. Are you seeing a water vortex just above the intake of the pump? If so, your problem lies here, and a higher level of water
will need to be maintained in the sump.>
 2. My return GPH is too much for my sump?
<No, the Mag 7 is rated at 700gph at the nozzle, and with your "T" in the system, plus hose length, you are probably pumping closer to 600gph at most.>
 3. On my PVC return the elbow is a 90 and I didn't flex the return top that shoots the water into the fish tank?
<Would be better to put the "T" at the pump outlet and flex hose from there to your outlets, but would have nothing to do with the bubbles.>
 4. Instead of having a T return, should I have just 1 main return and fore-go the double return??!?
<I'd stay with the dual return. If the pump is brand new, you will experience some micro bubbles until the plastic components get seasoned, but the bubbles should only appear occasionally. If they are constant, you are sucking air somewhere in the intake. Another point...Is the sump water bubble
free to start with?>
I don't think my problem is a venturi type issue because 98% of the tubing is flex tube which couldn't have a hole or it would shoot water out like a cannon?
<It is the joints where the problem will lie. Good idea to apply some Lifeguard or other brand of silicone grease on the fitting before putting the hose on to it,
and be sure it is clamped securely.>
Any other ideas from you would be appreciated. I cannot solve this mess and this is the first I have ever dealt with an overflow system and I am getting stressed out. I have read 5 hours worth of the info on here and I really would like a personalized answer.
I appreciate all you guys do and as soon as my tank gets up I am putting a advertisement for your site on it..
<Mmm, you are putting an advertisement on your tank??>
Thank you all!!!!
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
 -Adam

180 gallon tank ... bubble city 11/10/06
Bob, I have a 180gal with two corner overflows boxes with one 1 1/2 Durso drains in each one. My returns are 1." until you get to the 3/4 bulk heads in the bottom of the tank, I have one exit on each of the over flow boxes, so I have 2 - 3/4 outlets powered by a Turbo sea 1190. I have one Turbo Sea 780 with 3/4 return, which goes through my chiller and returns to my main tank via sea swirl. Both of these pumps draw water from my sump and return to my main tank. My sump is 34 X 20 X 16. My problem is breaking down the micro bubbles from the 1 1/2 returns. I have one set of baffles, which may or may not be good enough for this high flow system.
<Apparently not>
I have put socks around each return still have micro bubbles,
<Good try... you may need a "foam" dissipation area...>
I have replumbed and triple checked each fitting no leaks. Do you have any suggestions. I have done just about everything to figure out if I have an air leak or is the return flow just to much.
<May just be the turbulence, mixing of water here... most likely... could add another sump area to receive water, or the media area alluded to above to allow coalescing>
Fortunately the tank has only been operational for about 5 months, have live rock, sand bottom , refugium (which is incorporated into my sump) and three fish. I don't want to go any further until I have solved the problem, by the way I have taken the skimmer out to eliminate that problem if there was one. If I take the micron bags of the returns, I have so many bubbles it is hard to see,
<Yes>
with micron bags on bubble situation is better, but still to
<too>
many bubbles for corals.
Any input would be greatly appreciated,
Thanks,
Frank
<Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
and the linked file in the series above. Bob Fenner>

Small Bubbles from Sump Return Pipe – 11/01/06
Hi Eric,
<<Hey Ken>>
I have an annoying dilemma.
<<Uh-oh>>
Would you have an opinion as to what is causing small bubbles coming out of my return pipe into my tank?
<<Sure...I have opinions on most anything <grin>. It is likely you either have a very small plumbing leak that is “sucking” air...or the return pump is pulling bubbles from somewhere in the sump>>
It has been like this since the first day.
<<A very common issue>>
I was told last week by someone that it was probably because it was new sea water in the tank.
<<...!? I don’t think so>>
However it is still occurring. As you know my tank is a 90-gallon AGA mega-flow tank which has the internal skimmer box.
<<Yes>>
I put saltwater in it 8 days ago. 6 days ago I added about 120 lbs of live rock. I have a 48” MTC Beckett style skimmer coming off the other side of my sump which has two baffles.
<<Have you checked to ensure the baffles are keeping bubbles away from the return pump?>>
When I look closely at the return to tank side of the sump, I really don’t see any bubbles to speak of so I do not think that this is the reason.
<<Ah...ok>>
Also when I shut the pump off and turn it back on, a lot of large bubbles come out of the pipe going into the tank.
<<When the pump is off the return line drains, yes? The “large bubbles” would be the air that is pushed back out the pipe when the pump is turned back on>>
Is there air in the system?
<<Possibly from a small (pinhole) leak at a connection/union>>
The water flow from my sump to my tank is as follows:
¾” pvc flex tubing into ¾” union >>> Blueline 40 pump >>> 3/4” flex tubing >>> bushing to increase to 1”>>> 1” ball valve >>> 1” union >>>1” ball valve >>> Bushing to decrease to ¾” >>> ¾” PVC >>> two 90 degree ell’s into my chiller >>> two 90 degree ell’s from my chiller >>> ¾” flex PVC into the bottom of the tank for the return.
<<Lots of joints...you need to check each one of these (that is “out of water”) to determine if one is “leaking” air in to the system. You can smear Vaseline around each joint, though this must be “cleaned carefully” to keep the petroleum component from deteriorating the plastic (Bob does not recommend this method), or you can get a silicone grease for doing this. Seal each joint one at a time, waiting a few minutes each time to see if the bubbles stop>>
The other problem (and maybe related) is that when I put my hand in front of the return line into the tank, I hardly feel any flow. The Blueline pump is rated at 790 gph @ 5’ head. I used a head loss calculator and I should have at least 560 gph.
<<Did you also take in to account the turns/valves in the plumbing? Each 90-degree ell adds a foot to the head height, and I would also add a foot for each ball valve in the line...the unions and the chiller will be adding some additional resistance to flow as well All in all, you will likely find the pump is less adequate than you thought for this installation>>
I am not sure what that feels like against my hand, but it has to be more than what it seems.
<<Only way to know for sure is to direct the output in to a container of known capacity and time how long it takes to fill>>
I appreciate at any idea someone may have.
<<Hope I’ve given you a few>>
Thanks,
Ken
<<Regards, EricR>>

Re: Small Bubbles from Sump Return Pipe – 11/01/06
Hi Eric,
<<Hello Ken>>
Thanks for the quick reply.
<<Welcome>>
When I get home tonight I am going to shut-off the skimmer and see if that is the culprit or not.
<<cool>>
With regards to your other idea (pin hole leaks etc), I need to re-do some of the plumbing as I exchanged my chiller and I will have the new skimmer on Friday. I think I will just re-do all the piping instead of playing detective.
<<Okay>>
Is there any problem with gluing PVC and then running the system with the live rock? Any toxicity issues?
<<Give the solvent an hour to cure and you’ll be fine>>
I used a head-loss calculator when I came up with my numbers.
<<So you mentioned...>>
It asks how many feet vertical/horizontal. Number of valves, unions, 90's, 45's, etc. It also lists all of the pumps that are used. Pretty neat calculator.
<<Sounds like it...if it is accurate <grin> >>
I guess I have to get out my 3 gallon bucket, and see how long it takes to fill, and then multiply by 20.
<<Mmm, not sure I follow... I would time how long it takes to fill the bucket, divide that number in to 60 (minutes in an hour), and multiply that number by 3 (capacity of the bucket). The result should be the GPH of the pump with the current plumbing configuration>>
By the way, I ended up with an H&S A150 - 2001. I heard H&S is supposed to be good.
<<As have I. I have seen this make of skimmer in action and it was impressive...it also looked to be well made/engineered>>
It is similar to the Deltec AP-600 but rated a little larger than the Deltec. In your opinion do you think this should be more than enough for a 90 reef?
<<Should be more than adequate>>
Thanks,
Ken
<<Cheers, EricR>>

Major Micro-Bubbles in the Sump – 10/23/06
I have a micro-bubble problem that has kept me up late at night for the past two weeks trying to solve! I have narrowed down my source of the bubbles to the water draining into my sump.
<<Not uncommon...often caused by trying to “maximize” flow>>
My system is a 215G aquarium which I purchased with just the factory drain holes. I'm only trying to push about 700GPH combined through these holes with the use of two submersed Mag-Drive 7's.
<>
My sump consists of two 30G Rubbermaid containers joined a few inches from the top by two bulkheads. I have four other containers cut out at the bottoms and tops to act as baffles. Water enters from the drains by two separate pipes (1 pipe for each overflow drain) and into the skimmer container on one side of the first 30G container, and exits by the pumps from the totally opposite end of the 2nd 30G container, this is a good 4 1/2 ft of travel.
<<Hmm...makes me think bubbles generated from the tank drains is not the issue here>>
I have managed to cut out 97% of the bubbles that appear to be in the first container from reaching the pump intakes. However that extra 3% is a good number of bubbles that I would love stop reaching my display, and I can see them just being pushed along the baffles and getting drawn down into the pump intakes.
<<Interesting...I would think with a good baffle system; and considering the distance of travel/the relatively slow water flow, that the bubbles would be easily dispersed. I wonder if there is any other equipment along the way that could be generating more bubbles? Maybe the skimmer?>>
I'm thinking that I need to reduce the number of bubbles that escape the very first container, it is approximately 12”x14” and 12" deep and I can hardly see the bottom due to the number of bubbles.
<<Ahh, okay...wow...that is a LOT of bubbles! Sounds like you have a major air entrainment problem>>
I have a plan to perhaps take out this container so that water is entering into the next container which is a good bit larger.
<<From what you describe I don’t think this is the best plan of attack>>
I'm thinking I would have room to build a manifold system similar to those built for aquarium returns but have the water drain into it where it can be slowly released from a number of smaller exits as opposed to just the two 1" pipes.
<<Not sure I follow this...but a series of “over-under” baffles in the first container should have been able to deal with many of the bubbles>>
Do you see any potential problems with doing this?
<<Not “problems”...just don’t see it resolving your issue if you have as many bubbles as indicated>
Do you suppose it would work?
<<Dunno>>
I can't figure out why it wouldn't but I don't want to build this thing if someone else can quickly tell me why it would fail.
<<Can’t do that without better “detail” of what you plan. But try this...throttle back the flow from the pumps and see if the bubbles decrease significantly. Measure your true flow to the tank (time the filling of a container of known size) and adjust to about 300 gph per each 1” drain (175 gph for ¾” drains). Most drain calculators/schedules will tell you these drains can handle twice this flow, but it is my opinion/experience that reducing by half is much more practical/less problematic to deal with and the flow will still be quite ample for the sump. Also, make sure your drains are all absolutely at the same height. If one is a bit lower than the other the flow through this can be significantly higher; causing the excessive bubbles. If flow is not the issue, then look in to aspirating the drain lines and/or adding an ell to the termination point of the line in the sump. The former will help release entrained air in the drain lines while the latter helps to guide bubbles away so they don’t rise back in to the line blocking flow/creating more turbulence>>
Thanks, Kevin
<<Happy to assist. Eric Russell>>

Micro-Bubbles/Drain Line Plumbing - 10/14/06
I have a 215G Oceanic Reef-Ready that came as is from the factory. I thought I did my homework and then some when ordering this tank, but I have since learned that the drains are inadequate for this size tank.
<<A common enough opinion/fact that you'd think the manufacturer would eventually "get it">>
Redrilling this thing really is not an option at this point so I need to make best with the situation that I have.
<<Can be done, yes>>
I'm running 2 Mag-Drive 7's for my returns, I'm figuring that I'm pushing about 700-800gph combined with the 2 pumps after figuring in head pressure.
<<This should pretty much "max out" the 1" drains>>
I have two Vortec pumps to provide additional circulation within the aquarium.
<<Excellent>>
The two 1" drains are handling this with no real noise issues.
<<Good...often this is not the case>>
The problem I'm having is with micro-bubbles, I'm not sure if this would be related at all to the inadequate drains.
<<Could be/probably is...nowhere for the entrained air to go...>>
I'm doing a container with a container sump system using Rubbermaid Totes. I figured that my problem was the result of not enough baffling, but I have since read the opinion of one of your crew members that micro-bubbles are not the result of the water returning from the drain, instead they are only formed in pressurized situations.
<<Hmm...>>
Is this fact, or just his opinion?
<<I have no wish to second-guess others of the Crew (especially without knowing the reasoning), but I suspect both (opinion based on some fact). But that said, I don't agree that micro-bubbles would only be present in "pressurized situations." As with the case of venturi-style skimmers, the bubbles can be the result of trapped air and water turbulence...in "my" opinion. Maybe it comes down to the individual interpretations for "micro-bubbles," but I have witnessed some very fine bubbles emitting from drain lines over the years>>
I poured a glass of water in my tank and saw large bubbles near the surface and very fine bubbles deeper in the tank, similar to the micro-bubbles that I have.
<<Indeed...much the same as what is happening in your drain lines>>
If it is true then my problem must lie within my plumbing work or the pumps themselves.
<<Bingo!>>
I don't want to reconfigure my baffling setup if I'm not getting rid of the source.
<<Hmm...well...supposedly the "baffling" should handle any bubble issues (is why it is there), but excessive quantities of very small bubbles can be very difficult to "baffle out." I agree with your stance to attach the source of the bubbles>>
I did the Vaseline test on all plumbing connections and that didn't seem to help.
<<Do be sure to clean the joints of any residual Vaseline to preclude possible deterioration of the plastic from the petroleum elements (Bob "cringes" at the use of this product). It's likely the problem stems from the fact you have the drains pretty much at their maximum potential. "Noise" isn't the only problem associated with overloaded drains. I think your problem is entrained air due to the amount of water you're pushing through these 1" drains...aspirating the drains may provide relief. This involves inserting small-diameter tubing at the highest point in the line to allow trapped air a route of escape. The exact diameter and length of insertion requires a bit of experimentation>>
I have two 30G totes as my main sumps, linked together through bulkheads. One was going to be a refugium. I'm now thinking that perhaps I should now use the refugium tote to provide additional room for dealing with the micro-bubbles so I can have more containers and hence more baffling.
<<Mmm, I like the idea of the refugium. I would look to aspirating the drain lines...you could also try using just one return pump to reduce flow in the drains (would still be plenty of flow through the sump/refugium in my opinion>>
I also seem to have what appears to be a bunch of fine particles in my saltwater, like dust in the air, only seen when turning the lights off and shining a light through the tank from one side and viewing from another.
<<Hmm, do you have a fine substrate? Bioturbators? I wouldn't be concerned>>
I'm sure after all the work I have been doing in an attempt to rid myself of the bubbles I have introduced a good bit of dust into the tank. The tank was filled with purified water, so the source is not my source water. But I'm not sure if this can be related in anyway to micro-bubble formation, or if everyone who did the same thing would see it in their tanks as well. Can you tell me what would be the best way in using a sump system such as this to filter out these fine particles?
<<Some folks use filter socks on their returns. I am not a fan of these as they trap detritus (obviously) and require constant maintenance/attention to keep them clean/become a source of decaying organics. Personally, I wouldn't bother/worry about some particulates in the water>>
I have already drained this tank once, and it would take a lot to have to do so again.
<>
Please let me know any input you can provide for my situation.
<<Have done so...>>
I hope this post is coherent; I have been up late trying to work this thing out. but I'm determined to do so.
<<No doubt you will>>
Thanks,
Kevin
<<Regards, EricR>>

Micro bubbles in my tank 9/21/06
I have been going in circles with my 120 gallon tank for 5 months now to no avail. There are bubbles everywhere in my tank. Well first I spent 200 dollars on sump with baffles and visibly there are no bubbles in the pump chamber it looks completely clear. I am using a mag 9.5 submerged). The return is made with flexible tubing split half way up with a tee to the return pipes.
<Likely air entrainment... very likely at one of these junctions...>
everything was working perfectly except for the bubbles. So I thought just the other day could the bubbles be coming from my pump. So I unplugged it put it in the main display and there was the culprit bubbles coming out in short burst. so my question to you guys which have helped me so much already. Is there a submersible pump with a 3/4 inch outlet that will not cause these problems because this is not the first time this has happened to me. Thank you.
<... how did bubbles come from a submersed pump? This is assuredly not the source... but one of the lines distal from the discharge. For one, I'd replace the flexible tubing with solid... If you're set on using a submersible pump, you can... but they have downsides... Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_3/cav3i1/Powerhead_test/powerhead_comp.htm
and the linked files at the bottom. RMF>

Re: Micro bubbles in my tank... drilling acrylic 9/22/06
The pump is cavitating that is the only logical explanation.
<?>
I saw it with my own eyes I put the pump in the display and it produced bubbles. It filled the entire display with them.
<Keep reading, please>
Can an acrylic sump be drilled for a bulkhead.
<Yes, easily. RMF>

Re: Micro bubbles in my tank
Thank you for continuing to help this newbie.
<Mmm, I appreciate the chance/opportunity to help you solve... have met with many such situations... Can be extremely flummoxing>
I cleaned out the o-ring and wiped every thing else down. But that did not work. Bubbles still shot out. There is not very much you can get to inside this pump. This is the first time I opened the pump it was actually very clean hardly anything at all came off of the O-ring. I cant figure this out. My sump has baffles one set of them could my bubbles be coming through there. It has a section to fit a bubble diffusing sponge which is placed between the baffles. I don't really like this because it collects a lot of detritus and gets clogged. But when I take it out even more bubbles come in to my tank.
<This is telling...>
So if it cant be the pump and it cant be the pvc that is the only explanation. The only thing is the pump area looks clear.
<And you have tried smearing silicone lube over all other connections... especially distal to the pump? Is there someone, another marine aquarium keeper who could come by, maybe someone from a store or service company, to give this all an extra look/see? BobF>

Re: Micro bubbles in my tank
I took your advice and ran all my lines with pvc exactly as the diagram showed and I turned my pump on and the bubbles were still there.
<Mmm...>
I really don't know what to do here. I'm getting fed up with this thing I have had micro bubbles ever since the first day. I just need some advice. Please help.
<I do know what I would, have (had to) do/ne before... Please don't lose patience... we can solve this... Drain the water from the line/s going to and from the pump, remove the volute (the cover over the impeller) (screwed on)... take a close look at the O-ring that fits twixt the pump and the volute. Clean this (clean towel) and the race (Q-tip) and re-lube with silicone... and replace/fit all... Does this do it? Bob Fenner>

Re: Micro bubbles in my tank 9/26/06
Thank you for sticking with me. I raised the water level in my sump about 5 inches. I thought if I raised the water level, some of the bubbles would not reach the baffles.
<Good thought>
I thought bringing the incoming water in at a higher level the splash would reduce and the bubbles would have more room to escape before they reached my baffles.
<Yes... better to make the flow "over/under" with two baffles placed adjacent.....>
This I would say reduced the bubbles in my tank by half.
<An important clue, eh?>
If you think this sump is not cutting it I was very interested in the pressure locking sump baffles article. What I was wondering is can you make that with an acrylic tank and if so is this a realistic project for a newbie like me. I really want to thank you for your time. I know you have to be answering tons of questions each day. Thank you.
<Yes... either this, or draining, drying, and installing adjustable or permanent panels/baffles... BobF>

Too many bubbles in protein skimmer... SeaClone 9/19/06
I have a 55 gal marine tank with 1 yellow tang, 2 clowns, 1 royal Gramma and 2 cleaner shrimp. All water tests are in the zero range.
<?>
My question: this past weekend I added a Coralife Turbo Twist UV Sterilizer running thru a Fluval 205 canister filter. Ever since all of this has been up and running I am getting mass of small micro bubbles coming out of the Seaclone Protein Skimmer - no amount of cleaning or adjusting seems to remedy this, also not a lot of gunk in the skimmer cup. Am wondering if all this added equipment has somehow caused this. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, DiAnn
<This skimmer is hard to adjust... and really more a toy than functional. Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/seacloneskimfaqs.htm
Bob Fenner>

Microbubbles 8/25/06
Hello...
I have a sudden issue with micro-bubles. I have an AquaC Remora protein skimmer, an emperor 900 bio-wheel filter, and about 30lbs of live rock. The protein skimmer has a sponge on the output and I don't think the bubles are coming from there, but I've never had an issue with micro-bubbles from the emperor filter before either. The foam in the protein skimmer is minimal, rarely even spilling into the collecting cup. There are also larger bubles frequently escaping from the substrate, which I haven't seen before. My ammonia and nitrite are 0ppm, nitrate is 10ppm, and pH is 8.4. Should I be concerned?
-Mike
<Mmm, if there are a bunch of these bubbles (like soda-pop), of small-size... like a mm. or less in diameter... Could turn off one mechanical at a time for a look/see... Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
and (here comes that jingle) "the linked files above" (don't you love that spiel? I do. Bob Fenner>

Bubble/Cyano Issues - 08/22/06
Greetings from Grayslake, IL
<<Back at you from Columbia, SC>>
I've read a lot (I won't say all) of the FAQs regarding bubbles but I am still running across an issue.
<<Ok>>
Here is my set up:
- 29 gallon reef tank up and running for about 8 months now
- CPR Bak Pak
- Magnum 350 Canister Filter
- 2x96 Watt 10k PC (On for 7 hours)
- 2 actinic bulbs PC (On for 10 hours)
- 40(+-) lb live rock
- 2-inch live sand
- RO/DI 4-stage system
Here is my problem. I still get bursts of air bubbles from the canister filter.
<<Hmm, air intrusion from somewhere...builds up to the point where the bubble is large enough to "escape" to the outflow/impeller chamber of the filter pump...thus the "bursts" of bubbles>>
I have broken down the system and have replaced the o-rings and have added metal clamps on the all of the hoses to try to tighten it all down. Can't really find any leaks in the system.
<<Have you tried "sealing" all the joints one-at-a-time with Vaseline?
<Mmm, would not use a Petroleum-based material... too likely to act as a solvent... soften the tubing in the long/er run. Perhaps a Silicone-based lube. RMF>
 Have you checked to see if bubbles are being generated/pulled in to the filter through the intake from the intake water chamber (sump?)?>>
In addition to the bursts of air bubbles, when the lights are on I get a small amount of bubbles constantly.
<<Check the placement of the filter intake/the possibility of bubbles in the surrounding water being pulled in to the filter>>
Suggestions? Replace it?
<<Might be worth a try>>
What would you guys/gals recommend for a replacement?
<<I've always had good luck with the Fluval line of canister filters...and if you have the bucks, Eheim is a good choice>>
I am also getting some muck on the top of the sand when the lights are on but it is gone when the lights are off?
<<Cyanobacteria...possibly>>
Some of my live rock has turned red on the tips, don't think that it is coralline algae. Some form of algae was wondering if I need to be concerned here or not.
<<Hard to say...likely not. But do have a look through our FAQs/articles re "Cyanobacteria" and "blue-green algae">>
Thank you for your time.
<<A pleasure to assist>>
Like everybody else...Love the site! Very very informative.
<<Always good to hear...thank you>>
Sincerely,
Richard Hunt
<<Regards, Eric Russell>>

Re: Bubble/Cyano Issues 8/22/06
Thanks for the reply.
<<Welcome>>
I am not running a sump, just the CPR Bak-Pak and the Magnum Filter. Regarding the Vaseline...how is that done? Do I pull out the connections and add it to the connection or to the hose?
<<No need to pull apart the connections...just smear some around the "above water" connections to seal them temporarily. Do this one at a time watching each for a bit to see if the bubbles stop>>
The intake is behind a piece of live rock, so I don't really have any air coming from there I don't believe.
<<The steady stream of air bubbles while the lights are on could be nitrogen bubbles from your rock/substrate being sucked in to the filter intake>>
Again, Thank you
Richard Hunt
<<Regards, Eric Russell>>

Re: Bubble/Cyano Issues - 08/22/06
Now that’s interesting. I do have tiny bubbles all over the red stuff on the rocks that I spoke about in my original post. Could that be what is getting into the filter?
<<Ah, most assuredly Cyanobacteria then...and yes, the filter intake could be pulling-in these bubbles>>
If so...how do I get rid of the bubbles from the live rock?
<<Increased water movement often helps when battling this blue-green algae. Do have a read here and among the links in blue for much more information: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bluegralgae.htm >>
Thanks,
Richard
<<Quite welcome, EricR>>

- Peppermint Shrimp 8/21/06 -
Hi Crew,
<Hi.>
Thanks for the great site. I have a 20g High with 30lbs of live rock. The water quality reads fine in all areas. (Two Percula clowns, hermit crab, and domino and yellow damsel) I recently acquired a SeaClone 100 protein skimmer for free (which is about what it is worth) and had problems with micro bubbles. A few days after installing the protein skimmer my peppermint shrimp died and I was wondering if it was caused by the micro bubbles or if in all likely hood it was just a coincidence. <Likely coincidence... skimmers all make lots of bubbles when they are breaking in, and these bubbles are introduced at low pressures, not like the "micro bubble" of concern.> Also, is there a star fish that would co-habitat well in my aquarium? <Probably a chocolate chip.> I have read through the FAQs, but have found little on the easier (if there even is) starfish to keep. <Most are likely to pass for reasons not well understood - can be frustrating.> Thank you for any help you may provide.
-John
<Cheers, J -- >

Beyond the obvious... Watch out Lawrence Welk, it's the new Bubble King! 7/18/06
Quick question for you guys. I have a problem with my 75 reef, Any flow that is introduced into the tank produces microbubbles.
<Ho buoy!>
Forget the venturi idea for that is not the problem let me briefly tell you what I have tried.
1. Maxxi jet 1200, 8 inches down produces microbubbles.
2. Rena xp3 canister filter produces microbubbles, all air purged.
3. Rio 600, 200, 90, all produces microbubbles.
4. Mag 7 (return) produces microbubbles.
5. Magnum 350 Canister filter ..all air purged.. microbubbles.
6. Seio, 620 powerhead,, microbubbles.
7. Ehime 1260. produced bubbles.
8. Fluval 405 produced bubbles.
<Yeeikes!>
There are several more filters and pumps that I have tried, but you get the idea, again any flow introduced into the tank causes microbubbles.To clarify when I say bubbles I mean tiny microbubbles in the tank thousands of them, I been in the hobby for 7 years and never ever had this problem before. I fail to belief all of these pumps and or filters have venturi air leaks. The only problem with my water is low PH 7.9 during the day, 7.6 at night.
<Mmm, a clue>
Despite marine buffer being added every night, which raises to 8.3 but quickly falls again.
<Further clues>
Have not tested alkalinity. Other than that nitrite, ammonia both 0 and Nitrate is 6ppm. Calcium steady at 410-420.
So since conception of this tank in march of 2006, I have a continuous problem with microbubbles.
<Something about the water quality here...>
I would like to stress the point that I am not only talking about sump return and air leaks in the plumbing or cavitations of pumps I been through all that. What would cause such problems?
<The "encapsulation" if you will of existing fine material...>
I hope you will be able to point me in the right direction. No additives added to tank in the last month except buffer. Too much dissolved gases in the water?? For this question I think it would be great if you all gathered together and ponder this for a moment. Thanks for your time DJN
<... Need to fix the issue/s of your water quality... and the appearance of these "bubbles" will greatly lessen. You don't want to be "adding buffer" nightly... There are a few possibilities of actual root cause that could be at play here. Most likely a ping-ponging of disequilibria twixt your alkalinity and biomineral supplementing. Please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/calcalkmar.htm
and importantly, the linked files above. Do you have a/the "Kalk habit?", what other (specific) chemicals are you utilizing? Fix your water chemistry, physics and your bubble problem will "evaporate". Bob Fenner>

Re: Bubble king, make that queen part 2 7/19/06
I forgot a couple of important facts. I have been dealing with a horrible Valonia outbreak, despite good water (well except for the bubbles) And on Reef Central someone asked a simple question. Are the bubbles any better at night? Well until yesterday I never checked. After a hour of flashlight viewing I can say that the bubbles are less at night and much worse during the day.. I believe if we put the clues together we will find a answer. Well, you would find a answer.....thanks DJN
<... yes... related events. Photosynthesis, your water quality, algal (spore) profusion are conspiring to "make these bubbles"... Fix your water quality (again, many possibilities... all iatrogenic... read) (and scrub the Valonia off the rocks... outside the system) and all will clear. Bob Fenner>

Still bubbles... 7/8/06
Hello guys...
<And some gals...>
I have been searching through your wonderful website on how to get rid of microscopic bubbles that are being fed into my tank by the two mag pumps in the sump.
<Mmm... where is the air coming from eh?>
I followed some of the tips on how to find air leaks and bubbles that pass through the sump, but the bubbles are still there. Here is a breakdown of my tank.
120 gallon with oversized sump
Euro-reef skimmer
7.0 and 9.5 mag pumps with filter sponges attached to inlet micron bag for the inlet to the refugium micron filter pad for the water in the skimmer portion of the sump
PH 8.4
Salinity 1.024
No Nitrites
No ammonia
Very little Nitrates
So I have checked all of the lines from the pumps going up to the overflows for leaks and there are none. The return tube from the overflow is not next to the intake for the skimmer. I do not see any bubbles passing through the micron bag for the inlet into the refugium. I have put the sponges over the intake valves for the mag pumps and I am still getting air. If I turn off the skimmer, the bubbles are still there. Is there any chance that the pumps could be bad even though they are two months old?
<Mmm... "bad?"... as in had leaks in their volutes? Not likely>
This tank is only about two months old and I am reluctant to stocking it until I get the bubbles figured out. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks Justin
<I agree with you re finding, fixing this bubble trouble... how are these pumps, plumbing arranged? Are the pumps "pulling" against each other? Do you end up with bubbles whether one or the other is on? Have you tried turning the volume down, even capping the discharge/s to see if water "squirts" out of a fitting? There is/are a source or sources of air intake, entraining here... and you should find and fix it/them. Perhaps having another "reefer" come on by and look... they might see/hear something you've overlooked. Bob Fenner>

Bubble Trouble?...Maybe Not - 06/24/06
I recently moved to a 75-gallon Megaflow tank with a 30 gallon Rubbermaid sump.
<<cool!>>
My problem is that I am getting microbubbles from the return into the sump.
<<Very common>>
I have been working on the problem for 4 months without any luck.
<<Frustrated, eh?>>
What I have done is placed a small Rubbermaid container with holes in the bottom, I have a micron filter pad on the bottom and floss on the top. The water flows into the container drips down to another Rubbermaid container with holes on the bottom. From there it flows into a bucket, which then fills up and overflows into another bucket with holes on the bottom.
<<Mmm, sounds a bit complicated...but should eliminate the bubbles>>
With all this baffling I am still getting microbubbles into the display tank.
<<Ahhh...the problem is not your "sump return", but rather the pump/return line to the display tank>>
The sump is very quiet and very little flow inside. The bubbles can only be seen with a flashlight. I have tried several different sumps, and three different pumps. At this time I have a Mag-7 inside the sump for the return. I shut of ALL flow in the tank including skimmer and sump pump, I then waited for the bubbles to clear, and plumbed my UV sterilizer into the baffling system.
<<...?>>
At 150 gph flowing through all the containers I still have microbubbles.
<<Have you ensured all your plumbing joints are sealed?>>
Can there be a issue with the water perhaps?
<<Is more likely a matter of air entering your return line plumbing>>
The tank has been set up for 4 months yet I have bubbles constantly rising from the sand bed.
<<Hmm, I wonder if we have a different situation here? Bubbles rising from your substrate is a natural and desirable function of the nitrogen cycle which is always ongoing in your tank. As nitrate is converted to nitrogen gas in your substrate, the gas is liberated and rises as bubbles to the surface of the tank. if your "problem" is these bubbles you see when water movement is stopped in the tank, then you have no problem at all my friend>>
My pH I can not get above 7.8 during the day. That is with 432 watt t5s.
<<Likely something to do with how you prepare your water. Perhaps you need to buffer your make-up/top-off water>>
Any help would be appreciated thank you ...Laura Z
<<Do some reading here for more info on microbubble causes and solutions (http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm), and here for help with your pH (http://www.wetwebmedia.com/marphalk.htm). Regards, EricR>>

Bubble Trouble?...Maybe Not II - 06/25/06
Thank you for your time to respond.
<<You're welcome>>
I would like to make a few points clear.
<<Okay>>
As a test I installed my UV sterilizer to drain into my buckets which act as a baffling system. With only 150 gph I see Microbubbles emerging from the bottom of the holes in the bucket. Keep in mind that the water travels through 2 Rubbermaid containers and then flows into 2 buckets before entering the sump. I think if I am getting tiny microbubbles from the bottom of the bucket at only 150gph I am in deep trouble.
<<Mmm, or maybe making more of this than need be... I'm not making light of your concern, but unless the amount of bubbles is extreme, a few bubbles in your system are not going to be harmful, and is unavoidable for the most part due to water turbulence.
I figured out my pH problem I think. I use a powerhead in freshly made RO water for only a hour before I use it in the tank. Could that be causing the low PH?
<<Indeed it could...I would buffer and aerate the water over-night as a minimum, longer if possible>>
And if you could give me more of your thoughts on the microbubbles I would appreciate it.
<<Without seeing your system it's hard for me to ascertain the true problem here, if indeed there is one. But placing some fine polyester filter material in the bottom of the last bucket and submerging this a bit so the water doesn't "fall" to the sump should go a long way towards eliminating any bubbles from the water entering the sump. If after this you still have bubbles entering the tank, then I would look to making sure you don't have a pin-hole leak somewhere in your plumbing allowing air intrusion on the return side of your pump>>
Thanks again,
Laura Z
<<You're quite welcome. Regards, EricR>>

Equipment/Filters...Bursts of bubbles from a Magnum 350 5/25/06
Bob, <James today, Bob exploring the mysteries of the deep in HI> <<Heeee! RMF>>
 I noticed the question from Donna regarding air-bursts from her HOT Magnum. I have been using three 350's and two HOT's for several years and the only time I observed air building up in the canister (and causing bursts of bubbles) was when I had an airstone near the intake and it would suck in the occasional bubble until a larger bubble was built up inside the canister. and then it would periodically spew a mist of air droplets in the exhaust several times a minute. This sounds like it would have been obvious to the most casual observer, but it took me several days of messing with everything I could think of on the Magnum until finally I was glaring at the snorkels in frustration and saw a bubble spiral around into the intake side. (D'oh!!) Using 5 Magnums for the last three years and that's the only way I've seen air get entrained - through the intake. <Thank you for this, Mark, will post. James (Salty Dog)>
 Mark Hein

Microbubbles... ARGGGH 5/21/06
I went from a 3 year old 38 gallon reef tank to a 75 gallon tank with built in overflow. The tank has been set up for a month now, I have a tidepool sump with a Mag7 return, I have 2 Maxi Jet 1200's on a wavemaker set at 20 second intervals, I have been getting microbubbles from day 1 from my return, I have checked everything humanly possible for the cause and I mean everything. I shut off the sump and skimmer and let the 2 maxi jets run they are both under water about 6 inches they spit out microbubbles every time they come on and the bubbles are very slow to pop. I think there is something in my water carbon gas or something like that I am totally exhausted trying to find a solution to this problem all flow is off in the tank except powerheads and I still get the bubbles, I have posted videos and 32 threads on the subject for help from reef central to reef sanctuary to a few others with no help, it has to be something in the water my PH is 8.2
ammonia 0 nitrate 0 nitrate 10ppm. calcium level is at a 480.
<Laura, have you added any water conditioners/additives to the tank since you set it up? If so, you may want to get a good grade of carbon in your system to remove any such additives as some can cause this problem.>
Thanks,
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Laura

Re: Microbubbles - 05/22/2006
James the only thing I have added is "Purple Up" and " Coral Vital", could the purple up be the cause??
<Do not believe these products would cause this. Do read the FAQ's on this subject and see what others have done/suggested.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
James (Salty Dog)>

Microbubbles, insults, requests for help - 05/22/2006
 This question is for Mr. Fenner, I am asking you for help as your colleges <colleagues?> can not handle more then a 5 word response, which are inaccurate response to begin with.
<?...>
I have a 75 gallon reef ready tank, which has been running for 5 weeks. I moved from a 3 year old 38 gallon tank to the 75. I use a Mag 7 for the return pump which is housed inside a Tidepool 2 sump. I run a Coralife skimmer 125, and run 4 powerheads in the tank. My problem lies with microbubbles in the tank. I have 2 Maxi Jet's which are on a 20 second timer, which are continually spitting out microbubbles both are submerged under the water level 6 inches.
<... where is the air coming from? Are there venturi lines attached to these powerheads?>
I use Purple Up and Coral Vital for additives. I believe there must be some excess carbon dioxide or something to that nature in the water.
<Mmm, not likely>
As I shut off all flow in the tank the microbubbles are very very slow to rise to the surface of the water and dissipate.

 My return from the sump produces minimal bubbles, and there are no microbubbles from the skimmer or in the sump. I have checked all plumbing for air leaks and have found none, all hose clamps are firmly tighten, I even PVC glued my return pipe, and removed the lock fittings for a 45 degree elbow as I thought air may be entering from the lock line. Nothing has fixed this problem. As I am writing this, my tank has had zero flow and still has many microbubbles suspended in the water column. I have closely watched these to make sure they are not particles in the water. To confirm this I ran a Diatom Filter for 4 hours which produce no results. Any help you may give me I really appreciate. Ammonia is 0, Nitrite is 0 Nitrate is 8ppm PH is 8.32 and Calcium levels are at 476.3.
<Too high for my liking... I would settle on something in the 375-400 range... And stop with the carbohydrate/scam Weiss product>
I have read through your site for a answer but there is nothing that pertains to my problem. Thank you for your time.. Laura
<Not able to discern much from what is offered here... Unusual that the Diatom/Vortex product would not remove whatever this is... particle or bubbles... I would check the powerheads and assure that there is no air entrainment going on there... perhaps having someone else come by, take a look-see will help discover the source here. Have you read: http://wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
and the linked file #2? Some suggestions you might consider there. Bob Fenner>
Bob thank you for your response, I have had three "Reef Gurus" stop by to look at the problem no one can figure this out. I will continue to ponder this problem and search for a resolution. Thanks again Laura
<These sorts of mysteries can be very challenging. I hope you discover and solve yours. BobF>

Skimmers/Operation..."Tiny Bubbles" 5/21/06
Hi there! <Hello> I have a small 20 gallon tank with an Aqua C Remora skimmer.
Just got the skimmer up and running. It creates A LOT of bubbles in my tank. Bubbles are just floating everywhere throughout my tank. From the lowest part of my tank to the surface. Is this dangerous to the corals and fish?
<A typical trait of new skimmers, should be fine in a week.>
Thank you
<You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>

Standpipe plumbing, bubble-madness (and noise if you're really lucky!) - 5/12/2006
Hi guys I need some serious help. I just purchased a 75gal to replace a 75gal that was old and leaking. I got an All-glass with the MegaFlow overflow already installed.
<Hopefully one with the larger through-put/holes>
Ever since I installed it and turned it on, I have been having a problem with air bubbles in the drain line from the tank into my sump. Is there anything that can be done to correct this?
<... some>
It is the standard 1 1/4" standpipe with drilled aquarium bulkhead fitting, then it goes straight down to a flexible pipe (pool hose stuff) and into a 20gal sump.
<... have you tried aspirating this line?>
I have tried to raise the standpipe, lower the pipe etc. I do not understand why the air is getting into the drain line.
<It is "entrained"...>
Before I used the stand pipe, I had a corner overflow, with bioballs, on the drain line I had a valve and that regulated the flow so I would not empty the overflow. I have tried this with the standpipe and it does not seem to work. when you slow the flow, the water stacks up in the overflow.
I am at my wits end at this point and am very unhappy with the whole MegaFlow/standpipe thing. It looks like it might be a great setup, but mine just isn't working properly. any help would be greatly appreciated. I have a Quiet one pump to supply water back to the tank, not sure what the size is but I have not changed it from tank to tank.
Thanks,
Chris
<Mmm, this technique is described in various places on WWM, but basically, inserting a length (to be determined... so don't cut it just yet) of rigid or flexible "air-line" diameter tubing... nominally 3/16" into the standpipe... and trying this at different depths within the standpipe... should yield relief from the "entrainment"... try this and see. Otherwise, do Google on/with WWM re this issue, or read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
and the linked files above, where you lead yourself. Bob Fenner>

Micro bubbles returning from sump 5/2/06
Hello, thanks once again for your site... lots of great info! I am setting up a 125gal reef tank with a 30 gal sump. I divided the sump into 3 compartments.
Water drains from the tank through a 2" bulkhead ( 2 90's and a 45 elbow and pipe) into the first chamber which houses an EV-180 powered by a mag 7.
(tight space in here, nothing but the 2" return pipe, skimmer and mag 7 pump)
It then flows over, under, over 3 baffles into the center section (housing a Via-aqua 3600 return pump). Baffles are 1" apart (maybe a bit less) and
center has 1" space under it. The return plumbing has a T and a ball valve so I can send some of the water into the 3rd chamber (planning on using as a
refugium). the reason I set it up this way was so I can run 8" water depth in the first chamber, let the return chamber fluctuate a bit with
evaporation, and run 14" depth in the refugium ( planning on 5-6" aragonite and some live rock in the fuge) this seemed like a great setup but I'm
having lots of bubbles making their way into the return chamber of the sump.
If I open the ball valve all the way so most of the water is coming back into the sump and not being returned to the tank, then my bubble woes go
away ( seems like not enough water flow returning to the tank though)
<May have to increase this some other way...>
Should I change my design and put the fuge in the middle and the return at the end (chamber 1 would then be 9", fuge would be 8" deep, and return
chamber would be 6-8 depending on evaporation). this would give the bubbles more time to pop before getting to the return chamber ( going through the
fuge and another set of 3 baffles)... but I'd lose some overall water volume in the fuge.
<This is one approach... might want to experiment with a bit of mechanical media (large/r cell sponge, Dacron batting...) twixt the baffles as well... to see if this will solve the bubble issue... will have to be serviced often though>
I'm also in the process of plumbing a Mag12 on a closed loop so total water turnover in the tank should not be too big of a concern)
<Oh! Good...>
Thanks again, Mike
<All possibilities, plans sound good Mike. Bob Fenner>

Re: micro bubbles returning from sump 5/2/06
Thanks so much for the reply... I'll try some batting in-between the baffles and see if that helps (I'm assuming I can get it at the pet store, anywhere
else that would have it cheaper, like a fabric/sewing store?)
<Ah, yes... the latter is best>
Is my sump design flawed by having the return chamber so close to the raw water from tank/skimmer chamber?
<Mmm, no...>
One other question, the 2" drain pipe entering the sump has about a 13" vertical drop straight into the sump, is there a better way to have thee
water enter the sump to help get rid of the bubbles?
<A tee on the end may be of service here... as might a perforated "receiving chamber" that allows bubbles to coalesce...>
I did put a 4" piece of PVC around it so it dumps into the 4" and then flows out the top, this seemed to help some, I need to cap the bottom of the 4" though so the
bubbles are forced out the top and don't blow down and around the bottom, maybe putting a small piece of live rock in the bottom to keep it in place.
Thanks again, Mike
<Welcome. BobF>

Re: micro bubbles returning from sump - 5/2/2006
Putting a T at the end of the 2", so the water comes down and hits the T and has to go left or right?
<Yes>
If so, should that be partially or completely submerged?
<Yes>
 Would that be better than going straight into the 4" pipe?
<Yes... but try both out and see for yourself...>
My thinking is the 4" pipe would keep bubbles from going everywhere and force them up over the top and then flow over and drop into the sump with much
less force than coming straight down into the sump.
As far as the perforated collection chamber, would that be my 4" pipe but drilling a bunch of holes in it? Or capping the 2" on the bottom and
perforating it profusely and leaving it in the 4" pipe?
<... try it>
Sorry for being so brain dead... Thanks, Mike
<No worries. Bob Fenner>

Equipment/Pumps/Cavitation 4/10/06
Hi, <Hello Mark>
You're are best hope at solving this problem. I have had a reef tank for about 7 years now. I would now consider myself pretty experienced at all
things water/pumps/etc. I am now stumped. I have a 120gal w/55gal sump (sump is located below main tank in basement). It's a great setup since I
can do water changes, maintenance, etc. easily. In my continuing effort to improve things I removed the pump to my skimmer and I tapped into the main
return line (which goes to main tank) to run my skimmer. This pump can run both w/enough power to spare. My problem is the tee I inserted inline now
causes air bubbles in show tank. I thought of inserting a "Y" instead, however, I am not sure this will prevent air bubbles as well. Any and all
suggestions are appreciated. Thank you in advance for your help. <Mark, I believe you are drawing air somewhere in the newly inserted "T". James (Salty Dog)>
Best,
Mark

Re: Eliminate air bubbles on return to main tank Equipment/Pumps/Cavitation - 4/11/2006
James,
That's what I have surmised. I thought it might be occurring because of the way a tee is designed. <Shouldn't.> For example water flow on side of leg is slowed,
creating turbulence. Which can only be corrected thru a different design (e.g. wye or ~).
Instead, are you saying, I may be pulling air into one end of fitting? <Yes, pinhole somewhere.> (I am using 1" flex pvc which does not have perfectly smooth o.d.) FYI. I
removed tee and patched with 2 coupling & new length of flex pipe...back to original setup. The tee fitting is only perhaps 2-3' above pump head.
Thanks again for your help. <You're welcome. James (Salty Dog)>
Best,
Mark

Skimmer Troubles - 03/29/06 Skimming out of my mind with bubbles
Dear WetWebMedia:
<<Hello Pam>>
Hi, I have been reading your site for almost a year and recently decided I was ready for an aquarium.
<<Cool!>>
I purchased a complete set up from Oceanic. The Tank, canopy, stand, sump, plumbing, and lights. It is a 60 gallon reef-ready tank that has been cycling for 2 months. It was set up with 60 pounds of live Fuji <<Fiji?>> sand, 60 pounds of live rock, and RO saltwater from the LFS. It has cycled, but I haven't put fish or coral in the tank as of yet, just 4 hermit crabs.
<<Ok>>
I am still working underneath on the sump and deciding on what lights would be best for what I wish to keep in the tank.
<<Ah! Excellent to hear you are gearing towards your livestock rather than the other way 'round.>>
Here is my problem: I have a 20 gallon sump and in this sump is a Berlin hang on sock at one end (which I added) next (right before the return pump) a baffle with a sponge and then there is Rio 3100 that pumps the water back into the display tank. Everything ran smooth until I purchased and installed the AquaC EV-90 Skimmer.
<<Hmm...generally a pretty good choice of skimmer brand.>>
The skimmer was purchased used but looks brand new. It came with a Rio 2100 pump (I researched and found out it was originally sold with a Rio 1700). I downloaded the manual for the skimmer
and followed the instructions. The skimmer is placed inside the sump and elevated as the manual described. I have tried multiple elevations to try and resolve the problem with micron bubbles and overflowing water in the skimmer cup. My problem is that the collection cup fills with water and the skimmer puts out so many micro-bubbles that it fills the display tank up with bubbles.
<<Well...that's not good.>>
No matter how I position the skimmer the bubbles get past the baffle with the sponge into the return pump area and up into the display tank. I tried the 100 micron sock for the skimmer water to fall in and I still got bubbles in the main tank. I also tried turning the skimmer in different directions, I put extra sponges in the baffle on top of the sponge that was already there (don't really want to use sponges). Still micro-bubbles are in the main display in abundance. I don't have any added chemicals in the tank. It is very simple and basic. tank set up and cycling for 2 months.. no fish or coral...just water, rock, sand, and 4 hermit crabs. My questions are: Is my sump to small for this skimmer (micron bubble problem.. not enough baffles to run thru)?
<<Mmm, may not be a question of size so much as design. Are your baffles installed to direct water flow in an over/under/over (3 baffles) pattern to allow the bubbles to "escape" to the surface between the first two baffles before exiting the last baffle?>>
Is the Rio2100 pump to big for this skimmer (collection cup fills with water)?
<<I wouldn't think so, but try putting a valve between the pump and the skimmer and reducing the flow a bit...the skimmer cup should not be filling with "water." I assume since you downloaded the instruction manual that you have tried adjusting the gate-valve on the skimmer outflow.>>
Or am I missing something in my thought pattern on this set up?
<<Do try contacting the manufacturer to discuss this problem (support@proteinskimmer.com). Jason Kim (President) has always offered excellent customer service in my experience and should be able to offer some advice/guidance.>>
Thank you,
Pam
<<Regards, EricR>>

Bubble trouble... Unhappy Ecosystem customer 3/20/06
Hi,
<Howdy>
You seem to have deleted my email without even reading it,
<Mmm...?>
this is still very much in need of a response & I am very disappointed so far in your apparent lack of regard for your customers
<We don't have customers. Is this addressed to WWM?>
and your apparent unwillingness to help in any way once a sale of your products have been made - I hope this is a misconception on my part which you have an
opportunity to address now, however my perception is based on your action or lack thereof to date.
PLEASE DO NOT DELETE BUT RESPOND INSTEAD.
If I may quote from the front page of your website "We know that only by working together, we can make a difference. Therefore, our company's
goal is to assist each customer in realizing success with their aquatic showpiece." - please feel free to do so.
Chris
Note for Bob at WWM - For info & if you know of a route direct to Leng please do pass on - I would have thought as a businessman he would be
concerned, I would be if this were my business.
Cheers
 Chris
<... Chris, did you write to Leng (Sy) at Ecosystem? We are not messengers for disgruntled purchasers of others products, services. RMF>
_____________________________________________
From: Marine [mailto: marine@ecosystemaquarium.com]
 Subject: Bubble trouble
 Sent: 09/03/2006 11:29
was deleted without being read on 15/03/2006 19:27.
<By whom? Not WWM>
Attached below is my original message - deleted unread by you but still in need of a response I feel.
I have STILL had no response to my request for help with your system, your help in resolving this issue would be appreciated and you are best
placed to do this as the people with the most experience of your design. Please would you pass a copy of this email in its entirety to Mr Leng Sy
- I would have thought he would be concerned by your lack of support (or indeed any kind of response) so far.
I am VERY disappointed in your service so far, especially after placing my faith in your methodology over others despite the considerably higher
cost which I anticipated would at least prompt a response to my emails and an attempt to help me make your methodology/system work.
Chris
Subject: Re: Bubble trouble
Hi,
I could really do with your help here please.
Cheers
 Chris
Hi,
I was wondering if you could help -
I have a new system, 24" cube main tank with a miracle mud sump below (made to specifications kindly supplied by you, but 1" shorter than the standard 24" due to space restrictions (as discussed with you)). The system is now running however I am plagued by huge quantities of micro bubbles throughout the system.
These micro bubbles are caused by the crash of water into the sump in the first submerged bio ball chamber and from here flow through the sump
to the return pump at the other end of the sump and from here around the loop again. The system is all rigid (glued) PVC pipe work with a Tunze
recirculation pump connected to 25mm return piping (correct size for pump) - air leaks here have been eliminated as a cause by bypassing with
flex hose - with no reduction in bubbles. Overflow from the main tank is 50mm Durso style standpipe which flows down through a tank base
bulkhead to a 45 deg angle, into a 45 deg y-piece & finally into the sump. After calculating head loss etc I estimate about 2000 litres per
hour flow through the plumbing which is the recommended 10x tank vol. As stated it is the crash of water exiting into the sump which appears
to be the cause of these micro bubbles. What can I do to eliminate this problem?
Is this a common problem with such a high flow rate through MM sumps? - this was a concern for me in the planning stage however your assurances alleviated this concern. I have tried filter floss in chamber 3 (above bio balls) to trap bubbles - this has barely impacted & I see this as counter productive to the
methodology of MM sumps and have no desire to filter out plankton from the system. If I can provide any further relevant info please do let me know.
A speedy response, and, hopefully solution would be appreciated (I currently have 20 Kg of live rock sitting in a trash can which I need to
get into the main tank as soon as possible - however I am reluctant to do this until the micro bubble issue is resolved)
Currently the new tank - which has been a considerable investment for me is totally unusable & sits in the room bubbling at me & causing depression!
Please help me to turn an expensive bubble machine into the natural reef setup I dreamed of.
Cheers
 Chris
<... please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm
and the linked Files above, elsewhere on WWM re Algal/Mud Filters, Filtration... Bob Fenner>

Bubble Woes/Stocking Plan - 03/08/06
Hi everybody,
<<Greetings>>
Just after comments on my stocking strategy & hopefully some ideas on a little problem if I may.
<<Alrighty>>
Setup- New system, 24" cube 200litres (50ish USG) with closed loop (3000lph) - been running IO saltwater (from RO/DI source) for about 1 week now, Miracle mud sump 23"x10"x12" (to Ecosystem design) - just mud in so far, returning around 2000lph to main tank. No LR in tank yet or substrate - aiming for 20ish Kg.s LR & 1/2" CaribSea Fiji-Pink sand.
<<Sounds like a plan.>>
I've read the bubbles FAQ, most of the plumbing FAQ & much much more on WWM - I spend a great deal of time here!
<<Me too <grin>.>>
Many thanks as always.
<<Welcome, as always.>>
I ran the tank with fresh water in for over a week with no problems at all, however since filling with RO/DI & subsequently adding Instant Ocean (mixed in tank) I've had nothing but micro air bubbles running all through the system, I suspect that there is some suspended debris whizzing round the system as well but it seems to be mostly micro bubbles.
<<Ok>>
Pump return plumbing is 25mm (correct for pump) with overflow plumbing at 50mm. I understand from the FAQ's that the main suspect should be the return plumbing and pin-hole leaks in the glued joints & I have eliminated this as a cause by rigging up flex hose to bypass all hard plumbing, with no lessening of the bubble creation.
<<Hmm, okay...I would next look to see if bubbles in the sump are making their way to/being picked up by the return pump.>>
I suspect that it is the overflow plumbing (50mm) where it dumps into the end of the sump, pipe runs from in-tank Durso, through bulkhead fitting, 45deg bend & into y-piece to exit vertically into sump - slightly underwater.
<<Is the termination-end in the sump vertical? If so, you may want to consider adding a 45 degree fitting to the end of the pipe to help with air entrainment.>>
The first chamber is filled with submerged bio ball type media
<<This can work, but would rather see live rock utilized here for its buffering capacity/greater bio-diversity.>>
- blue drum shapes which are quite open & I am getting loads of bubble generation here which flow through the sump to be pulverized by the pump & returned to main tank to complete that loop once more.
<<Aha!>>
I was hoping the cause of this was just new plumbing or settling in or something however we are a week on with salt in & no reduction in micro bubbles (which look horrible with halide on!) I guess it's not going to fix itself now!
<<Mmm, indeed not. You will have to install some sort of bubble trap/baffle system. A Google search on our site re should provide ideas.>>
I intend to get some more conventionally shaped bio balls in the hopes these will trap some of the bubbles - do you think this will help? (I doubt it will cure the problem for sure!)
<<I don't see this making a difference. You need to contrive some method of slowing the bubbles as they travel through the sump to give them a chance to "escape." This is usually easily done with a series of baffles which won't allow the bubbles to travel to the pump once they rise to the water's surface.>>
Adding extra baffles is not an option here due to the size of the sump,
<<Uh oh>>
however at a push I could fit another 23 1/2" long, no more than 10" wide & tall as I like (within reason) sump to take the overflow from the main tank - this entire length could settle the bubbles from the overflow with baffles at the end before overflowing into the sump as is.
<<Ah yes! You could even employ the first vessel as your refugium and then devote your entire sump to holding your equipment, chemical media, etc..>>
This is quite drastic, involves replumbing & would just about fill the cabinet so is very much a last resort.
<<Mmm...but sounds like your only option since you can't modify the "existing" sump. Either this or reduce the flow through the sump and see if that makes a difference.>>
Any ideas for bubbles caused by overflows dumping into sump that don't involve more baffles or a second sump upstream?
<<Not other than greatly reducing flow (thus turbulence) through the sump.>>
I'm getting quite despondent & depressed here! - I'll also try to get a pic of setup to you shortly. Couple of points here - The salt was mixed in tank (I'll do it externally next time!) & has left some fine particles (which have formed a hard coating on the tank base) and some larger white grains/lumps which bob about - could this be connected in any way?
<>
Have I changed the salt blend in some way to be more prone to bubbling?
<<No>>
Doubtful I know but clearly even if not connected to the bubbling issues I want to start with chemically balanced salt water - is there any risk to proceeding with this water in terms of future livestock problems?
<<Not likely...have you performed any water tests?>>
Will my LR be OK added while these bubbles pervade? Currently it is sitting in a trash can with a powerhead & I want to get it into the tank ideally as soon as possible - it was bought on Sunday cured.
<<It's probably a fine point, but I would leave the rock where it is until you resolve the micro-bubble issue.>>
I have already caught a few very small crabs in this LR (Indonesian - about 18/19kg) should I try to bait any more out by laying on raised egg crate in the main tank (when bubbles/your advice permits) is this worth doing?
<<Unless this is how you plan to install the rock, no, I wouldn't bother with this.>>
Right, onto the stocking plan (which will certainly wait till the
bubbles are fixed),
<<And the tank has cycled/matured a bit hopefully!>>
which will cheer me up thinking about!. I plan to introduce slowly & quarantine in the following order - your
comments/suggestions/warnings would be most welcome -
<<Is my pleasure to provide.>>
Cleanups for main tank -
15 or so Nassarius Snails, 5-ish Turbo's from existing tank, maybe a few Ceriths if I can find any.
Would a crew for the mud sump be beneficial?
<<Not if it involves macro-crustaceans (crabs/shrimp)...defeats the purpose of the refugium in my opinion.>>
If so what critters/numbers would you advise?
<<If anything, a detritivore kit from one of the e-tailers offering such...but is likely the mud will populate from the live rock just fine.>>
2 or 3 Banggai Cardinals, 3 Blue Green Chromis (is there a difference between blue, blue/green & green Chromis? I have seen all offered & want the most chilled I can get!),
<<Yes, though Chromis viridis is often called/sold by all three of these common names.>>
2 black & white Clowns (in my existing tank currently) - these may end up going in first or possibly residing in the sump for a while due to logistics, 1 Orchid Dottyback, 1 Flame, Potters or Coral Beauty Angel (I guess you're gonna recommend the Flame?)
<<Yuh huh>>
That's probably it for the fish plan, still working on the coral list!
<<That pretty much fills you up. I would like to suggest that you skip the Dottyback...aside from your stocking density, I'm a bit worried about aggression in this size/stocked system.>>
Should I stock corals or fish first or does it make little difference?
<<Ideally...the tank would sit empty of both for 6-12 months, allowing the biota from the rock to develop. Then...were it me...corals before fish.>>
Hoping for a cure for the micro bubbles.
<>
Cheers,
Chris
<<Be chatting, EricR>>

Micro-Bubbles from my skimmer.... 2/14/06
Hey WWM,
<Angelo>
My tank has just cycled and I'm waiting to add livestock finally (woo hoo!). 50gal, Odyssea skimmer, AMiracle wet/dry sump. The return pipe from
the sump was spitting out micro-bubbles into my tank. I read page after page on your site about these bubbles, I went through all the steps (turn
the skimmer off, check for leaks etc...) After all the testing it I figured out it's the skimmer doing this bad deed. When I turn the skimmer off and
wait an hour all the bubbles are pretty much gone.
<Ah, yes>
The outlet on the skimmer already had a sponge on it. So my question is... how do I use my skimmer without making these bubbles?
<Mmm, a few possibilities... add more "sponge", an area to allow coalescence, dump into a more rear-ward sump area...>
Currently the skimmer is in the sump but it could hang on it. Also I'm not sure if your familiar with AMiracle sumps, but they don't really have baffles.
<Yes... I would add them... or go with another container that has these. Have you seen the CA article re?>
Any advice would be appreciated. I was thinking of making baffles in the sump and having the skimmer in the first baffle to allow the bubble to "pop" before it hits the
last chamber were the return pump is.
-Angelo
<Ah, an excellent idea, modification. This is what I would do as well. Bob Fenner>

Micro bubbles and powerheads 02-08-06
To the WWM Crew
<Hello Flávio, Travis with you today.>
Recently I put 2 Sicce Extrema power heads (2000 litres/hour each) in my 500 litres reef tank for more circulation.
Since then, a lot of micro air bubbles are all over the tank. They are ejected from the power heads periodically in a way that when the water is becoming "bubble free", from the last jet, another and new bubble jet comes again in the tank.
The main pump in the sump, is not the problem, because if I run it only the water becomes crystal clear.
The top of the powerheads are below the tank water surface about 12 cm and I do not notice any surface air suction.
Do you have some tips in order to solve the problem? <Remove the powerheads and build a closed loop.> To much propeller speed? <Very possible.> Bad design? <Possibly.> I've tried also with another brand, the New-Jet NJ 3000 from Aquarium Systems and the problem remains, maybe less notorious. In fact I do not understand from where are all these bubbles are coming from. <The bubbles are actually caused by what is called cavitation. This is due to high propeller speed. The suction of the propeller actually creates a void which fills with air. To relieve this the propeller needs to either be slowed down or the intake needs to be larger. Hope that helps explain your situation a bit. By going with a closed loop you will only have one pump to deal with and it can be throttled back if necessary. Travis>
Thank you very much for your attention
Flávio

Air bubbles, mis-stocked small mar. system 2/1/06
I am a newbie and just recently started my own reef tank. My friend gave me his tank after he lost just about everything in it after a week long power
loss from a hurricane. It is a 29 gallon tank. The sand and 1 hermit crab are the only hold overs from his set up. I got about 20 lbs of new live
rock, a new canister filter and a protein skimmer. I got new salt water from my local Big Al's Aquariums and had the new filter go to cycle. Took
about 6 weeks. After that I added about 40 zebra hermits and 5 turbo snails to help clean the tank. A few weeks after that, I added 2 clownfish and 2
cleaner shrimp. Now, last week I added 2 blue tangs.
<The latter species can't "fit" here>
Everything is going well except that the water surface is covered with very small air bubbles. What could be the cause of this and is it bad for my fish?
<Surfactants, oils... possibly from an aerosol source outside the system... foods... Can be real trouble... needs to be wicked off, removed by dipping...>
I want to start adding some polyps/mushrooms/corals but obviously I want to make sure there is nothing wrong.
<Already is mis-stocked...>
Ph is 8.1, Ammonia is 0, Nitrite is 0, Nitrate is 5ppm, calcium is 400, Phosphate is 0. For lighting my friend gave me power compacts. Any help would be appreciated.
Asher
<... I'd hold off on any changes period here... become familiar with the search tool, indices on WWM... perhaps a complete marine aquarium book reading... Bob Fenner>

Microbubbles in reef 1/2/05
MICROBUBBLES: A question for BOB if possible!
<Adam C. here today.... pretty sure Bob is out of the country.>
>Am back, but blurry<
Hi, I am running a 365 Gallon Reef and was wondering whether you can assist or have been involved in something similar to what I am trying. The Question: Do Microbubbles hurt inhabitants of the reef?
<The short answer is no, but there are caveats. In nature, even when large numbers of microbubbles are introduced, there is sufficient dynamic water movement to sweep them away again. Also, the bubbles can be harmful if trapped (under overhangs, etc.) against living sessile inverts.>
In nature micro bubbles are produced by the smashing of waves, so I am presuming no harm will be done to Fish and Inverts etc. Please advise, as I am trying an experiment to remove Cyanobacteria by over oxygenating. I have inserted an airstone into my return pump intake so as to inject microbubbles into the display. I will experiment over a few weeks and post results as they come to hand. I have heard that Cyano etc do not like oxygen as they are more interested in anaerobic conditions. Kind regards, Craig New Zealand
<I would strongly advise against this. Oxygen should be near saturation in a well kept reef tank to begin with, so your idea should not significantly increase it. Also, exposure to microbubbles is well tolerated, but not in the quantity that you will create or for extended periods of time. The kind of procedure you are describing will cause physical irritation and excessive mucous production in your corals, will decrease light penetration and will cause an awful mess with salt spray.
It is not true that Cyano prefers anaerobic conditions. If this were true, they would not grow in the highly aerobic conditions that they do. It is true that high ORP inhibits the growth of Cyano, but I doubt that your proposed procedure would significantly raise the ORP. Ozone or some other oxidizing chemical (very different than simply raising oxygen... these substances are very chemically active!) would be required for this. Best Regards. AdamC.>

Bubbles Galore 12/21/05
Greetings from UK and many thanks for a superb and informational web site.
<Thanks for the kind words.>
Recently I had a "boil up" in my hexagonal acrylic 55 gal reef tank. The heater just kept on heating overnight and the temperature must have gone into the 40's before I got to the tank the next morning. As you can guess almost everything perished.
Things are back to normal and the few surviving crabs and snails seem OK together with one clown fish. However, there is now a constant stream of bubbles coming from the live substrate and this has been going on for 2 weeks. I was used to seeing bubbles from the live sand and rocks previously but this is way over the top to the extent that I have to keep cleaning them off the tank sides in order to see anything. <I'm guessing the extreme temperatures caused a gas buildup in the substrate possibly from critters that were fried. I'd get a gravel vacuum and vacuum the substrate while doing your water changes. I think this will take care of your problem. James (Salty Dog)>
Any ideas please.

Question about 4-MDQX-SC; bubbles everywhere 11/29/05
Hi guys,
Thanks as always for all your hard work. I have Googled but cannot find an answer to this. I just upgraded from a Little Giant 2-MDQ-SC to a Little Giant 4-MDQX-SC. I have drilled out a new hole in my sump and installed a 1" bulkhead. I'm using a 2" long threaded connector to join the female pump to the bulkhead. Upon cranking up the pump, I've got micro-bubbles, everywhere!
I'm wondering if I'm starving the pump and should have used a larger bulkhead. The "instructions" that came with the pump gave no indication as to how to actually hook it up. What do ya'll think?
<A new pump may cause this for a few days. Are you seeing a whirlpool leading down to the inlet by any chance? If so, install a 90 degree elbow to the inlet inside the sump facing down of course.>
Also, I've built a Water Return Manifold as described by Anthony Calfo. I originally built it for my old pump, but the pump was too little to drive the four 1/2 inch outlets I put on it. I made it out of 3/4" pipe, so I think I'm going to replace it with 1" pipe to accommodate the greater flow of the new pump. Do you think that's worthwhile?
<Four 1/2 outlets will easily handle the new flow rate.>
Finally, my sump is a wet/dry filter. It can hold about 9 gallons, and I think it's way too small for this new pump. I'm considering drilling out a 20 high and using it as a pump. Do you think it will help to have more volume in the sump? Seems like it would. I'm going to call a glass place tomorrow morning.
Any advice you can offer is greatly appreciated! Thanks so much! Mark

Bubble Trouble 11/25/05
Hi There,
<<Hello David. Ted Here>>
I am in the final stage of setting up a 55g reef tank that began over six months ago. I am also as close as I can get to giving up, converting it to a vivarium and buying a snake.
My problem is, are, bubbles. I have read and read the FAQs but cannot resolve the problem. Most FAQs suggest that the problem stems from the return from the sump. However I have removed the return pipe manifold and set up a direct hose from the sump pump to the tank so there is no joint exposed to air, the pump is submerged so no air exposed joint there and still the bubbles go on.
<<Ok. So you've confirmed these are bubbles and that they are coming from the water in the sump?>>
Initially the drain to the sump was generating a boiling cauldron, but that has been tweaked so that there are no obvious bubbles at that point. The in sump Tunze DOC skimmer generates a level of fine bubbles but as this is designed as a hang in tank skimmer I assumed that this is either a: normal or b: temporary. I have tried creating bubble traps additional to the existing baffles, I have tried running the water over and through filter sponges in the sump in the hope of coalescing any tiny bubbles into larger ones that will rise and burst.
I cannot think of anything else to do apart from scrap and redesign the sump which would be expensive, basically confined to the same footprint as the current one and no guarantee of success.
The bubbles in the tank are far, far less than at the start. Basically there is a degree of fine bubbles that require serious squinting to define as bubbles and not fine particulates, and not a seething white mass as previously.
So what do I do? Should I just go ahead? I have postponed getting my rock twice now, or resign myself to redesigning? Is a level of "bubbular activity" acceptable or do I need crystal clear bubble free water as I used to have in my freshwater tanks? Looking forward to your suggestions.
<<Sorry that this is so vexing. Solving these types of problems is best done through steps where you eliminate possible sources of the problem. You seem convinced it is bubbles and not sediment. Ok. Hook up the return pump to return water directly to the tank and bypass the plumbing (as you have previously done and described above) and wait a few hours. If you still have micro bubbles then look at the overflow return as the source of the bubbles. Place the pump as far from the overflow return as possible, add rock or anything else to cause turbulence at the return point in the sump and slow the progress of the bubbles towards the pump. You want to give the bubbles a chance to escape. If the micro bubbles are gone, then hook up the return pump to use the normal plumbing and try again. If the micro bubbles are still gone, then the problem is the skimmer (or some other equipment) otherwise you've confirmed that the main pump plumbing is involved in the problem. Your goal is by process of elimination, isolate the source and then correct the problem. If the main plumbing is the problem, rework the plumbing. If the skimmer is the problem, consult the skimmer instructions and see if you can eliminate the bubbles returning to the tank from the sump.>>
David
<<Good luck - Ted>>

Micro bubbles and urge to throw filter in backyard!! 11/22/05
Hi. Sorry to bother all of you fine experts at the web today. I have searched and searched the FAQ's to no avail. I even posted a question in the chat forums, which I love by the way!! So now I am resorting to bothering y'all once again.
<No worries>
Here's the problem: I have almost solid sprays of micro bubbles blowing into my tank. They happen about every 20 seconds. My water looks extremely cloudy from this annoying and dangerous to my livestock problem. I have tried the following:
Listening thru a tube for air leaks, placing Vaseline over the joints of my connections and then removing it of course, wrapping connections in a special leak fixing tape, opening and re-closing lid, rearranging tubing, wiping around everything hunting a leak, and just getting mad and yelling!!! I cannot find what the problem is. So I am going to ask for a few solutions and then ask if they don't work, will my final solution be good for my tank?
<We'll see>
Okay, first things first: The setup: A 92 gallon corner saltwater tank. (Loaded with snails, stars, crabs, shrimp, fish, live rock, and sand) The plumbing: An intake pipe which converts to flexible tubing down to an Ocean Clear canister filter, 5" of flexible tubing to a Mag1800,
<Stop! Is this the order these items are in? The pump should go first, then the mechanical/cartridge filter, then all else... the pump is made to push, not pull...>
and then 4-5 more feet of flexible tubing going from the pump returning to the tank. All flexible tubing used was 3/4". My solution for today: replace all tubing coming from intake side of tank to pump with 1" or if I can swing it 1 1/4", which will cause less back pressure on the pump, making it easier for it to pull the water.
<... Ahhh>
Is this a waste of time? Oh yeah, forgot to mention that when I turn the control valve down on the output side of the pump, the bubbles do get a little better, but I have to turn it halfway shut, which causes me to lose valuable GPH.
<Just change the order here>
If this doesn't work, and you can't give me some miracle fix that I'm overlooking, I am considering removing the filter from the whole setup and placing the Mag1800 directly inside the tank, in the back corner in a plastic square container with sides of at least 5" to prevent it from sucking sand in, and using the prefilter that came with the Mag1800. Then
doing a "T" and run some tubing so that I have 2-4 outlet pipes under water to create LOTS of water movement in different directions. All of this would be hidden behind my rock of course. Then remove all powerheads from tank.
Okay, you may need to know what other equipment I have on the tank for this, so here goes:
An AquaC Remora Pro with Mag3 and prefilter/surface skimmer box (I get lots of tea colored skimmate daily, about 1 cup)
An Aqua clear 110 power filter (500 gph)
I have 130 lbs of different varieties of live rock which I will discuss further down
100lbs of sugar size live sand
I was trying for the "Berlin Style" filtration method, but had the filter attached to the Mag to filter a little extra due to a 7" Regal Tang and her waste products: She's quite messy, if you know what I mean.
Okay, the deal with the rock is: Currently 90lbs of it is in the tank, the other 40 is still "curing". The 90lbs in the tank has Cirolanid isopods in it, though I haven't seen one in a week or two. I have caught probably 30 in the past 2 months.
<You must be very good with a net>
I bought 60lbs of live rock from Florida (gulf-view) and though it is beautiful in it's diversity of life, it also has a very ugly side: Cirolanids!! So, I am removing the rock Dec. 8th and placing it in a 29 gallon for a 6-8 month quarantine to starve the isopods out. In the meantime all my tank will have is 100lbs of new live sand and 40lbs of Caribbean (Haiti) Lettuce Coral live rock. I know this will leave me on the low end for rock filtration, but in 6-8 I'll have plenty of live rock in there. If my suggestion of removing the Ocean Clear and placing the Mag in the tank will work, will it work without the 90lbs of rock?
<Yes, should>
I am so sorry to bother you with such a long e-mail, but I truly don't know what else to do, and I'm getting that desperate feeling of throwing the filter out in the yard, which is usually my cue to bother you guys and you usually talk some rationalizing into me. Thanks for the wonderful sight and on a side note, I'm getting "The Conscientious Marine Aquarist" and "Reef Invertebrates" for Christmas!! I can't wait to read both of them. Thanks again for being so nice. Christy
<Again, no worries. Move the pump to the first thing, have it pump through the OC filter... your problem will be solved. Bob Fenner>

Hi there. Yes I have read and read about microbubbles....I still can¹t figure it out. Please help me. 10/21/05
Quickly,
90 gallon reef.
As of yesterday, Phosphorus 0
Ca 300
KH 10
PH 8.2
Nitrite 0 nitrate less than 5ppm
Ammonia 0
Salt 1.025
O2=7
Various fish and corals. Everybody is doing great! Except for some pitting on the blue tang in front of his eyes that I can¹t beat no matter what I feed him! Maybe he has intestinal parasites and they steal his nutrients!
<Possibly>
Though my purple tang is fine.....sorry to ramble, that¹s not my question.
I use the tidepool 2 ( I like it-ease of maintenance) with a Mag drive 18 pump (sits in sump and all flex tubing with barbed fittings). Have the
Turboflotor skimmer, ozonizer. In the media trays I have pads and a bag of charcoal. I recently cleaned the pump and it now buzzes, vibrates loud.... I
just don¹t know..... I¹ve taken it apart and put it back together again with no luck.
<Likely a bit of air stuck, around the impeller... perhaps turning off/on a few times will clear this>
I have tightened all connections. I have turned off the skimmer and still bubbles so it¹s not the skimmer. These bubbles are like dust
particles. I am distracted when I sit down to watch my tank. It bothers me. Especially when the halides come on. (They only run 12-6...power
compacts alone the rest of the time) MH exaggerates them. It looks like I just blew dirt off the rock with a powerhead, or a fish stirred up detritus.
I have had experienced water so clear you wonder if water is in there.....I just can¹t put my finger on when these started......was it after I cleaned that pump?
<Maybe>
I have noticed that at the end of the day tiny bubbles are sticking to my rocks and then in the morning they are gone!
<May be formed via photosynthesis...>
But they are always present in the water. That never clears. I¹ve tried taking the carbon bag away, no luck. What else can I do?
<... replace, re-seal all plumbing, fittings... start from the beginning intake...>
I¹ve thought of a pre-filter sponge for the pump itself but they don¹t make them for this size.
<Can make/fashion your own>
They do for the Mag drive 5, or is it 7? I wouldn¹t mind cleaning it everyday. O well. How I long for that water that looks so clear again! Can you help me?
<Not with the information provided... You might ask about... the local marine club/s, fish stores, service companies if someone/a pet-fish guru will come by, look at, give you input in person. Bob Fenner>

Mag Drive 1200 in my 54 Gallon Corner Tank 10/13/05
I have a 23" deep 54 Gallon FOWLR tank. I have 1 Yellow Tang, 4 Green Chromis, 4 Convict Blennies, 1 Black Star Damsel, 1 Maroon Clown,
<Too much fish life...>
4 Turbo Snails and 1 Cleaner Shrimp. I have 55lbs of live rock. The bottom of the tank has cutouts for the plumbing. This is placed inside the corner overflow. The intake bulkhead fitting is 1.25 inch and the output that spills into the trickle filter is 1.5 inches diameter. I recently upgraded to a Mag drive 1200 pump to circulate the tank.
<The "intake" can't accommodate this pump's full flow>
The pump is 2 feet under the tank in a sump and pumps about 1200 Gallons an hour when using 1.5 inch inner diameter tubing. I'm using 3/4" inner diameter tubing from the pump to my tank.
<Not a good idea to downsize the discharge diameter from that of the size of the pump's volute>
The nozzle is pointed at the middle of the curved glass front causing the water to disperse evenly on both sides. I also have 2 Maxi Jets 900 pointed at each other on each side of the tank. Is the 1200 too much for my tank.
<Yes, in the current plumbing arrangement>
The fish are not getting blown around or anything. My one problem is the tank is full of tiny micro air bubbles. They are being released directly in the stream of water coming from the sump. The pump is completely submerged and is not sucking in air.
<... so... where is the air coming from? A leak in the discharge side's plumbing? You should find... and fix>
Is this normal and is there anything I can do to decrease the air bubbles.
<Not "normal" as in healthy... can be fixed... >
It makes my tank look cloudy and they stick to everything.
<And can be dangerous... emphysematosis... >
The Mag drive shares the sump with an AquaC Urchin protein skimmer. Shutting it off has no effect on the micro air bubbles being delivered by the Mag drive pump.
Thanks, Wayne
<Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm and the linked files above... quite a task, but necessary, to review what your situation is, options. Bob Fenner>

Bubbles in overflow 9/26/05
Hello,
I have a 55 gallon reef tank with a small refugium below. Until I get a drilled tank, I am using an overflow box. At times the water flowing in the grooves of the overflow cause a lot of bubbles to accumulate, ultimately in the apex of the U tubes. Which we both know is a bad thing. The size of the box just allows me to fit 2 u tubes for a little peace of mind. I have tried the drill the hole in the top of the tube and attach it to a venturi nozzle of a powerhead method, but had numerous problems. Something would always clog. At times there are no bubbles. I cant determine the variable of when it bubbles vs. not. When the water is not causing bubbles when it overflows it works perfectly. How can I stop them or find out what causes them? <Corey, if you are using any additives like Stress Coat etc, this will cause bubbles/foaming. The biggest problem with "U" tubes is that they are not sized correctly. Too large a tube results in low water movement giving bubbles a chance to built up in the top part of the tube. Using a tube just large enough to prevent the overflow box from draining is recommended. This results in a high water velocity through the tube which helps prevent the bubbles from being trapped and resulting in siphon loss. James (Salty Dog)>
Thanks for your time,
Corey

Mega bubbles 8/23/05
Ok first off awesome site. Your site has helped me out countless times and saved me a hundred other times. ok here is my main situation at the moment. I currently have a 65 gallon all glass aquarium with mega overflow. My issue is with the standpipe. When the water exits my aquarium through the standpipe and into my sump I get massive and I mean massive amounts of bubbles. I can change the plumbing if I need to I currently have it making a straight shot down from the standpipe into my sump and the outlet is about 2 inches under the water. I talked to rich Durso
<Good>
and he told me to contact all glass and I did as he said and they never bothered to get back to me.
<Poor>
 I feel that the massive amounts of bubbles may be hurting my skimmer but more so its just annoying and the splash and spray goes everywhere.
<Yes>
 My tank other then this issue is running great just for specs I have around 140 Lbs of live rock, 3-4 inches oolicit
<Better than illicit>
sand, 700 gph on my return to the tank plus three powerheads to keep the water movin really good, and tons of softies and hermits and snails and what not. I just recently had to move the tank so my fish are in my other tank at the moment. Thanks for any help you can offer and as I said awesome site.
<Mmm, please read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaq2.htm
and the linked files above, where you lead yourself... You have a few options... aspirating the discharge "mega" line/s, venting the discharge in your sump, coalescing the bubbles with an (Emperor Aquatics or similar) bag, building some baffles... Bob Fenner>
Thanks,
Stephen

Microbubbles... protein skimmer... dead fish 8/17/05
O.K. I think I have truly lost my patience. Tank is a 75 gallon Oceanic with overflow, currently been running 10 days.
<A bit soon...>
I was at the LFS this Saturday and as I was talking to the employee there he stated I could go ahead and get a damsel or cardinal. I ended up getting 2 of each. Fish were fine on Saturday, but on Sunday morning I found one cardinal dead. Did water test and Ammonia was only at .2.
<... should be zip>
On Monday fish looked o.k. damsels were eating and swimming well and Ammonia had climbed up more to 0.3-0.4.
It looked like the fish had "popped" the system and started the cycling process. Well today is a completely different story since all three fish
have died. The fish look like they are having a hard time breathing and took on a much more pale color (almost splotchy in appearance).
I have one other problem in that I have an enormous amount of microbubbles that are being produced in my sump (not a leak in the return line). I
believe it may be the ASM G1 skimmer, but I have two baffles that I thought would minimize the bubbles.
<Evidently not...>
They are bad enough that I can see them flowing in the water through the refugium and obviously out the return nozzles in
the tank. How can I stop the bubbles and what do you think caused all of my fish to die today?
<Posted and posted... start with the bubbles here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm and read on WWM re establishing cycling... You killed off these fishes, through "new tank syndrome"... and on to the linked files at top where you lead yourself...>
I appreciate the help in curing my desire to get the tank operating effectively. I may have been a little naive when I thought a sump would be easy to get working right.
Erik Poch
<Like all things, "is" easy once you understand, have done something successfully... take your time here... is one universal suggestion. Read for now. Bob Fenner>

Tank flow from Overflow ... not so "reef-ready" tanks 8/11/05
Ok I have read all over your site about micro bubbles and problems of the such, but my problem isn't exactly in that reading and I don't know where
else to turn. I have an Oceanic 75 gal with built in overflow and oceanic overflow kit. The line to the 38 gal sump is 1" tubing
<Too small...>
that goes directly into the compartment that contains the skimmer (ASM G1). There are three baffles, which flow into a refugium and then finally over one last baffle to the return pump (a Mag 9.5) that returns the water through a 3/4" line with a ball valve and then to a T joint to both corners of the tank. I cannot
get a steady flow of water through the line to the sump. It constantly takes in a lot of water mixed with small air bubbles and at times very large air bubbles.
<... yes>
I called the LFS and they said I should be getting a steady flow through my overflow to my sump with the setup I have with or without the ball valve.
<... no>
I have tried to move the standpipe up and down, add a small piece of air line tubing 3/4 the way down to the sump, and play with the ball valve.
<... won't work>
None of these have worked and I am out of answers. Is this a common problem or are there any solutions that I am not using.
Thanks
Erik
<Is a very common problem... with most all so-called "reef ready" tanks/kits... the through-puts (holes...) are too small and too few... You need a larger drain line... practically speaking 1 1/2 or two inch inside diameter... two would be better than one... Yes... requiring draining the tank... Please read here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/overfloboxfaqs.htm
and the linked files (till you understand) above.
Bob Fenner>

Fluval 404 bubbles 7/31/05
I recently purchased a NEW Fluval 404 on 6/27/05, I fought with it for 1 month adding new hoses, O rings, etc. even reshaping the hoses, and getting
down to shaking the canister on a regular basis to release air. My problem is that every 30 min to 1 hour My Fluval release a large amount of micro
bubbles into the tank. I have tried everything that HAGEN has asked me to do. I am running the Fluval only no airstones or any thing else in the tank.
It is a salt water new set up (2mos old) 40gl with live sand and rock. I returned the Fluval and the store replaced it with a new one. It has been
running for 2 days. and I still get a rush of micro bubbles. Question: is there a flaw in this design. or am I getting a bad batch?
<Likely there is a simple, poor/incomplete connection twixt a hard plumbing fitting and the flexible hose on the intake side...>
 Do you know of any other filter similar to the Fluval 404 that I can use that will no create this problem?
<... Please read here: http://www.google.com/custom?q=canister+filters&sitesearch=wetwebmedia.com>
I really do not want to use the Fluval anymore if the bubbles are always going to be there.
PLEASE ADVISE
Pam
<... as you will find, there are techniques for determining the source of entrained air... I would turn off, drain the unit, disassemble the intake side line... re-fit with a bit of silicone grease, making sure the flexible tubing is pushed on entirely over the hard plastic fittings. Bob Fenner>

Tunze Stream microbubbles and water circulation around Euphyllids. 7/22/05
Hi Anthony (or else...:),
<Hi Dominique, Ali here (please don't kill me)>
I bought two 6000 Streams and a 7095 controller for my system.
<Great pumps, great choice, great investment>
I have a 90 gal reef tank (48"x24"18") with sugar fine DSB. I have only Euphyllids (torch and hammer corals) and pulsing xenia. Will add some Montipora digitata at some point. I reduced the power to 30% on the streams. On the multicontroller I use the interval no 1 mode with around 30 seconds of interval and the flow is also pulsing from 30% to 100% on each of the two
streams each 6 seconds. This means going from 167 gal (2X per hour) to 555 gal per hour (6X per hour) on each pump alternatively. The two streams are symmetrically positioned to have their flow hitting the middle of the back panel. I placed them quite near to the surface. Also there is a 3X per hour
from the return pump from the fuge.
-Now there is some particles in suspension: dust or air bubbles I do not know (?). There is good agitation at the surface so could be air bubbles.
<Microbubbles are generally caused from your return pump or possibly your refugium output, turn them off and just run your stream pumps. If the microbubbles continue, then you'll know 100% that they are coming directly from the streams. Additionally, if you have the streams too close to the water surface, they will create a 'vortex' causing water and air to be sucked down, thus producing an occasional jet of bubbles. Here is a direct quote from Roger 'Tunze' Vitko himself regarding the microbubble issue: "Just my experience here- if your pump is making bubbles and it is not from vortexing you really should double check the hole in the magnet rotor for obstructions, your KH and your light intensity/duration. If the bubbles get worse as the day light hours progress it is definitely a gas saturation issue and removing excess algae, cutting back on lighting and lowering KH are the remedies. If the pump has any obstructions to the cooling system, the internal vacuum increases and more degassing occurs.">
-Could this be too much current for the Euphyllids? Is it ok when the polyps are bending from time to time (not just curling but really bending at a 90 degrees angle...). The polyps are still well extended tough.
<Don't sweat it. They're happy. Unless you see total tissue retraction and/or tissue literally being blown-off of the skeletons this is not something you should worry about>
I am only a beginner and I worry about those corals now...
< :D 90 degree bends, you don't have to worry about, it's those dreaded 45 degree angles that you should keep an eye out for,...only kidding of course.>
-Same for my new anemone (green Heteractis crispa with purple tips): some tentacles are sometimes completely twisted because of the current (giving the tentacle an hour-glass shape...). Can this cause problems?
<No>
-Do you have any advice for the settings of the multicontroller and
placement/direction of the streams that would be good for my set up?
<For further advice on how to get the most out of your pumps/controller set-up feel free to browse Roger's Tunze forum, here's the link: http://reefcentral.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=92 >
Thanks a lot!
Dominique
<No problem friend, enjoy your reef.>

Micro Bubbles
Let me start by saying that I have used your site many times as a reference and want to thank you for putting together such a wealth of information - very helpful. I have poured over the many faq regarding micro bubbles and though I don't consider my question to be "unique" in nature I was hoping that you could elaborate on a few suggestions that you have made in
response to similar questions to my own. I have a 125g reef/fish tank with an under tank sump (I
have removed the bio-balls) that now houses only my return pump and a reef devil (ETSS) protein skimmer. The sump, being very small has very little room as it remains divided with all of my equipment on the right side of the divide. I have changed very little from
the original setup. I have quite a few microbubbles being returned to my tank due to my protein skimmer. I recently replaced my Rio 1800 skimmer pump with a mag drive pump as the Rio gave out. After having added a valve to the outflow of the mag drive I finally have my skimmer under control but it certainly has increased 10 fold the presence of micro-bubbles in
my tank. You recommended to many of your readers that to reduce this effect there were a few things you could try. The first being to add a baffle. I'm humiliated to show my ignorance but what exactly is a baffle and how would I go about installing it in the sump? Another
suggestion was to add a foam block. The reef devil already has a ring of foam attached to its outflow. Should I add a sponge to my return pump or to the actual return pipe within my tank?
I realize that these questions are very basic but I had some difficulty finding a response in which you elaborated on these topics, specifically the baffle. <Ben, no need feeling humiliated. No one is born with info. A baffle is specifically a piece of acrylic separating the skimmer from the rest of the sump. The baffle is usually 1/2 to 1 inch above the bottom of the sump. The return from your skimmer should go through the baffle as near to the opposite end of the sump as possible. Being that bubbles do rise, most of the water flowing under the baffle should be bubble free. You may want to email the skimmer company. They may have a bubble trap as they are called. James (Salty Dog)>
Thank you.
Ben

Tiny Bubbles (Cue Don Ho) - 06/09/05
Hi, I've been having trouble having too many tiny little bubbles in my saltwater tank. The water doesn't look clear with all these bubbles.
<<That's a lot of bubbles.>>
My protein skimmer is always off so that cannot be the problem.
<<Having your protein skimmer always off is also a problem, IMO.>>
I tested the water in my tank and everything is fine. I've had this tank for about 3 years and I still have the same problem. Please email me back as soon as possible.
Thank You.
<<Likely a pinhole leak somewhere in your plumbing. Have a read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/bubtroubfaqs.htm>>

- Bubbles and Dump Buckets -
I've been reading your site, and in great detail. There's so much useful stuff here, it will probably take me months to go through it all!
Anyway, another question for the crew!
I had been toying with a small turf scrubber for a reef tank (strictly supplemental to a skimmer/refugium setup), and had been contemplating having the surge fall into a far end of the tank through a confined open air sheet. Splash out wouldn't happen, but...
I've now been reading through the part of your site where people go on and on about bubbles, and...
Am I to take it that my idea for helping oxygenate the tank (open air fall) was maybe not such a good idea?
<In the case of a dump bucket system, you don't have anything to fear from micro bubbles.> Anyway, I'm having second thoughts about the turf scrubber, but I still want some kind of surge device, ala Carlson. Should it return under the water, instead of splashing into it? <Splashing is just fine. In my opinion, the whole micro bubble issue is overblown - it is a genuine problem and does occur, just not as often as some folks make out, so that a large portion of the posts you may have read are really about the aesthetic issues of air in the water and the perceived problem of micro bubbles rather than an actual problem.>
I'd seen net photos of some turf scrubbers that had some very heavy surges. They appeared bubbly. I was simply assuming that bubbly was okay. No, eh? <Bubbly in this case is fine.>
Joe
p.s. I'm okay with the noise. :)
<Cheers, J -- >

A Baffling Problem (Stopping Micro bubbles)- Pt. 2
Thanks for your response.
<You're quite welcome!>
I will look into the baffles. What is Durso and Standpipes?
< "Durso" is Richard Durso, a hobbyist who perfected a silent overflow standpipe ("the Durso Standpipe) to feed water from your overflow into your sump. Check out his web site for more details: http://www.rl180reef.com/frames.htm >
As for the grouper, I have had him 5 years and he hasn't grown a total of an inch yet despite his enormous appetite and philosophy of "if it fits I'll eat it".
JB
<Most curious! Count your blessings! Regards, Scott F.>

Operating Sans Bubble Trap with Skimmer
Hey Hey!!
<Hey, MikeG here.>
I just got my BakPak 2r for my 10g nano.
<Rather large for such a small tank, but not really an issue (I shouldn't talk, I have the same on a 20, though I've been accused to being crazy a couple of times before ;) )>
I also got the bubble trap but it was so big' it wouldn't fit between my rockwork. So, I took the sponge from the bubble trap, and stuffed it right next to where the output begins (in the skimmer) and there are no bubbles and no need for a HUGE bubble trap.
<Good, glad you discovered a solution.>
I'm also replacing the maxi jet with the Rio 600. I heard that it is more efficient and quiet.
Trust me
<Thanks for sharing your wisdom, Mike G>

- Tiny Bubbles, Where's Don Ho When You Need Him? -
I just set up a new tank so far with salt water and live rock. I turned on the protein skimmer (AquaC Urchin in sump) yesterday and it's putting a lot of tiny air bubbles into the tank through the return line from the built in overflow. Will this eventually stop or is there some way to reduce the air bubbles in tank.
<They typically go away in a week or so once the skimmer breaks in, although there is always a little air introduced by the water falling back into the tank.>
It doesn't look very good.
I'd appreciate your comments.
Mitch
<Cheers, J -- >

Live rock and bubbles
Dear WWM crew,
<Hi Frank, MacL here with you.>
I am writing to ask if I am doing any harm to my live rock by placing an airstone underneath it to create an interesting bubble pattern as it flows through the calcareous rock. I could not find any specific info on this question in the archives (P.S. is it possible to identify the type of live rock from the pictures supplied, I know they are not the clearest).
<I can't get them to where I can see them Frank sorry : {. I think you are okay with the bubbles and the rock but watch your fish carefully. Sometimes the bubbles can be a problem for fish. Good luck, MacL>
Thanks in advance
Frank from Glasgow

Over filtering and aerating
Hello, and thanks for all the advice I have taken from your archives over the last 6 months!!
<Hi Frank. Thanks for researching before writing in and glad our site can help.>
I currently have a 20 gallon marine tank with 15lbs of live rock, 1 Clarkii clown, 1 false percula and a saffron blue damsel. All parameters I currently test for are normal ( i.e. ammonia 0, nitrite 0, pH 8.3,nitrate 0, SG 1.022 and temp 78 degrees) and I perform a 15% water change weekly.
<Ok, sounds good so far...>
The tank has been running for 6 weeks
<Has the tank finished cycling? That isn't very long. but do keep an eye on those water tests to be sure, as your canister filter might help keep levels in check during the process.>
My main question concerns my external canister filter (Fluval 404), I use this as a means of filtration and a power head. I have been currently turning the flow rate up to max after feeding in order to clear debris and provide a load of gas exchange and water movement, the water gets quite bubbly all over the face of the tank.
<lots of air bubbles are not good all over the tank, you might want to keep that down.>
The fish all swim to the top of the tank and swim against the current, so my question really is, can you overdo the water movement and aeration??
<Yes, if your tank is filled with tons of bubbles then your fish and corals can get sick and or die from the micro- bubbles. as for water movement. You can have too much if it pushes the fish into the glass. as long as there are places to go without strong currents that seems ok. However it's a lot better to have a turbid flow (water mixing [?] from all directions) then a flow from one side as it helps keep things stirred up and its more like the ocean. Maybe build a manifold out of PVC (read Anthony Calfo's no more powerheads article on the FAQ's) to better distribute the flow. but the massive filtration is a plus for a small tank. Be sure to clean the filters in the canister weekly as well in old tank water.>
Another quick question, should I be testing for calcium or adding any other trace elements?
<Yes if you want your live rock or corals to grow well, though the makeup saltwater has most trace elements besides calcium.>
Thanks for any help you can give. Frank from Glasgow, Scotland
<Good luck and hope this helps>
<Justin (Jager)>

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