wrasse question... Lined comp., Flashers sel.  – 1/26/08
Hello Bob and Crew,
A quick thank you for helping me so much with this hobby. Your site and books are invaluable. I have a 125g reef tank with 100 pounds of live rock, 130 pounds of live sand and miscellaneous corals. My question is, with a six line wrasse in the tank, could I add 1 male flasher wrasse and two females without the six line attacking them?
<Likely so here in this volume, shape system>
I've read that flashers get along with other wrasse and that you need a few females in order for the male to flash.
<This is so... and possibly another male>
I'm just uncertain about how the six line will behave.
<Lined wrasses can indeed be "bullies", but you very likely have enough room here...>
There are lots of hiding places and space in the tank as I hardly have much livestock to speak of. Thanks!
Just incase you were wondering
3 chromis
1 scribbled rabbitfish
1 six line wrasse
2 pajama cardinals
1 juvenile orange shoulder tang
<Interesting... will be the alpha animal here in time>
1 juvenile hippo tang
2 skunk cleaner shrimp
basic small clean up crew, snails, crabs, etc.
thank you,
Alan
<Bob Fenner>

Wrasse compatibility <Actually sel. to eat/control>, red bugs, <and comp. w/> Anthias    9/11/07 
Hi Crew,
Would you be able to help with the best choice for a small wrasse that likes to eat Acropora red bugs?
<Um, this is not how one deals with red bugs.>
From reading the FAQs it looks like the Six Line is an option, but I've seen them be aggressive and I have a trio of Bartlett's Anthias that I wouldn't want to be harassed. The tank is a 135G reef with 100+ lbs of live rock.
Can you think of a small, red bug eating wrasse (or other fish/invert) that would tend to be less territorial than a Six Line? And do you think I would need more than one bug-eater in this size tank?
<If you have a red bug infestation, you need to treat it with Interceptor. There's no aquarium fish (known to aquarists) that will solve this problem. See here: http://www.ericborneman.com/Tegastes-content/Dorton%20treatment.htm
And maybe here too:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/acrodisfaqs.htm>
Thanks,
Tom
<De nada,
Sara M.>

Re: Wrasse compatibility, red bugs, Anthias   9/12/07
Hi Sara,
Thank you, I do like getting more than one opinion because I did see suggestions in the WWM FAQs to "consider stocking some small wrasses", or to try a "Red Sea pseudochromid, small wrasse" when I searched WWM for info on red bugs.
<Yes, one of the cool things about WWM is that it stores queries spanning several years (and from many different people). The use of Interceptor for red bugs is still a very new idea. Dorton developed his protocol in 2004 (just 3 years ago). You must have read some of the responses of Eric R. who is not so warm to the idea of using of Interceptor or any such deadly (and largely under-studied) medication on whole systems. See here for his take on it: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/swmitefaqs.htm. Generally, I certainly agree with him. I do think aquarists often jump to extreme treatments too quickly. I even did it myself in my first response to your query. I jumped to the conclusion that you must have a pervasive and devastating infestation of the dreaded Tegastes acroporanus. But I did you a disservice in not explaining the very real possibility that these bugs you have might not be T. acroporanus. Regarding fish, many of them eat little bugs. And some fish are not so picky and could eat red bugs along with everything else they might be hunting. And so in that way, they might serve as a bit of a preventive measure. However, anyone who's ever had a really bad red bug infestation will tell you that the fish just don't eat them fast enough even when they do eat them.>
Also saw replies that made me think these critters may not be that much of a problem, potentially being more commensal than parasitic.
<Please accept my apologies for not thinking to mention this myself. It is a possibility. However, finding them on dying corals does make them a bit more suspect. Still, they could just be scavengers.>
What has your experience been with red bugs...big problem, or not so big?
<I've personally never had Tegastes acroporanus. However, I have been scared by many different hardly visible "bugs" I've seen crawling on my coral. I once had some that looked just like red bugs except that they were black. There are just soooo many different types of "bugs" that can get into our aquariums. See here: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-10/rs/index.php
Certainly there are people who can tell you all about how red bugs destroyed whole colonies of their corals. Others may tell you that they've seen them in their tank and they never became a problem. Personally, I wonder if the people who claim to have them but that the bugs never became a problem truly had red bugs (i.e. Tegastes acroporanus) and not some other kind of less aggressive copepod (like maybe my "black bugs" which disappeared as mysteriously and they came).>
The red bug infestation in my tank seems to be limited to a few of the weaker-looking Acro frags/small colonies, at least so far. I'm not sure if the red bugs are causing these Acros to be slower growing and have poor polyp extension, or if it's the other way around.
<very astute and good question to be thinking about>
I do pay close attention to the water conditions and husbandry, and have several other Acros and other SPS (Stylophora, Montipora, Seriatopora) that show good color, polyps, and growth. I've just figured that some specimens don't do as well in aquariums as others do, or at least in mine.
<This is possible. Or, you could have the dreaded red bugs. Hmm, this is where a picture could help.>
Also, thank you for the Borneman link. If I do go with the Interceptor treatment, could you help clarify a couple of things for me? Since several of these Acros are growing on very large pieces of live rock that are integral to the support structure, removing them for treatment would be difficult...would you consider treating your whole tank if you were in my situation?
<Actually, the protocol described on that site (developed by Dustin Dorton) calls for both quarantining of the corals AND treatment of the whole tank. However, as mentioned, the use of Interceptor is still a new idea. If you can confirm that you actually do have the predatory red bugs (and not just some kind of scavenging copepod), you could experiment with just treating the whole tank with a low dose (without removing the corals). However, you should definitely try to make sure you actually do have Tegastes acroporanus before trying this.>
I don't keep any crabs or shrimp. I know the pods would suffer, but those could be re-seeded. Also, is Interceptor considered safe for Crocea clams? From what I've read, it appears to be safe but would like to get your view.
<I don't see any reason to expect Interceptor to hurt clams. Clams are quite dissimilar from crustaceans biologically. But again [the disclaimer] we just don’t know a lot about this medication when using it on an entire “ecosystem.” >
Thanks,
Tom
<Thank you for the thought provoking query,
Sara M.> <<Well done Sara. RMF>>

Re: Wrasse compatibility, red bugs, Anthias
Sara, thank you very much for your time and advice. I'll see if I can get my hands on a better camera, but here's the best picture I could get with the camera I have. The color of this 1.5" Acro frag is normally more yellow, but is lately a lighter shade. You can see what looks like small reddish "bugs" on it.
<Ugh, yeah, it does look like these could be the bad guys. Have you tried to blow them off with a powerhead? ...because the bad ones tend to cling on hard to the coral and are difficult to remove. If the damage seems slow and confined to a few corals, you can still wait and see what happens with them. But if they start jumping to other Acropora colonies, I'd seriously start thinking about the Interceptor. You could always start off with a very low dose...>
Tom
<Best,
Sara M.>

Stocking Question: 75 Gallon Reef Tank. Tang and Wrasse? Stocking Question For A 75G Reef…A Little Paranoia Can Be A Good Thing – 09/01/07
Hello Crew Member,
<<Hello Skot>>
Awesome site.
<<Thank you>>
You've turned what was potentially an expensive and frustrating hobby into a rewarding and very expensive hobby ;)
<<Ha, indeed!>>
Seriously though, your site has kept me from "giving up" through a series of unfortunate events including a leaky tank, leaky protein skimmer and suspect stand… All problems I've solved with the help of your site. Thanks.
<<We are pleased to know this>>
Now for my Question. I have a 75 gallon acrylic tank. Around 80lbs of live rock. 3 inches of sand. Euro-Reef RS 80 skimmer.
<<Good skimmer>>
30 gallon sump with refugium (incidentally I'm completely fascinated by the refugium. When my main display lights go out and the refuge lights come on I sit and stare at all the life in there. Really cool.)
<<Oh yes…much interesting life to be observed in these “protected” environments that is overlooked/not seen/even missing, in the main display tank>>
This setup is about 3 months old and I plan to make it a reef tank. A majority of the water, sand and rock are from a 1 year old 55gallon system I was running. I've got 20 misc snails and another 20 misc hermits. I purchased the Indio-Pacific Sea Farms Refugium Starter Kit about 6 weeks ago for my refugium which also contains some Miracle Mud, sand, and live rock. I’ve 2 Percula Clowns, 2 Banggai Cardinals and 1 Orange Sleeper Goby (all from my previous tank). I also have a small patch of mushrooms and a small patch of zoos. Levels are: ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 5ppm,
<<Do strive to keep this from climbing any higher>>
79 degrees, pH 8.2, sg 1.22.
<<This last should be at NSW levels (1.025/1.026)>>
I'm paranoid about overstocking.
<<Mmm, yes…this will prove to be to your (and your livestock’s) benefit>>
There are two additional fish I have my eye on for down the line. First I'm interested in the six line wrasse.
<<Can be nasty little buggers>>
My research suggests I have room for this fish as it stays relatively small and appears compatible with my current livestock. Is my assessment correct?
<<In this instance, yes, I believe so…but addition of this wrasse will likely mean you won’t be able to add any other similarly sized/shaped fishes after it becomes established>>
Next I'm interested in a Yellow Tang.
<<Mmm…I knew there was going to be a “tang in the mix”>>
I realize my tank is the minimum recommended size for this fish.
<<Yes>>
Would it be wiser for me to steer clear of this guy?
<<Hmm…considering the size/number of tankmates, the fact you don’t have a “tank full” of rock which will allow this fish room to move around, and considering the refugium…yes, I think adding a Yellow Tang will be fine here>>
Is my tank already reaching capacity?
<<Not “right now”…but will be close once you add the tang>>
Will my additional (sump/fuge) 30gallons of water flow help provide a good home for this tang?
<<That…and the other considerations I mentioned>>
If the tang is a "no" do I have room for another smaller fish or am I at capacity?
<<Adding the tang will be fine>>
Sorry to bombard you with questions.
<<No worries>>
I've been at the hobby for a little over a year now and I consider myself a fairly disciplined person. I have no desire to irresponsibly overstock my tank or make a foolish misstep that can be avoided. Having said that, there's a whole lot I don't know.
<<Ah well then…there’s much reading/research ahead of you my friend>>
Thanks for the help,
Skot
<<Happy to assist. EricR>>

Vietnamese" Sixline Wrasse 3/3/2004
Dear Crew Member:
I was at my LFS yesterday, and they have now added the prefix "Vietnamese" to their sixline wrasses.  I do not currently have a world atlas, so I would like to know if this counts as Indo-Pacific or what?  Either way, is this location considered ideal for this species, or can you think of any other reason why they would indicate it's location?  They do not mention it for their other fish.  Thanks, Rich
<Hi Rich.  livestock sometimes carries the country of origin as a way to imply quality since some areas of collection have better reputations than others.  I don't know that Vietnam has a particularly good reputation, but livestock from Vietnam is a relative novelty in the trade (but becoming more common).   In most cases, by the time a fish gets to the retailer, there is no way to trace where it came from, and that is why it is uncommon for the country of origin to be listed.  Best Regards.  Adam>

- Six Line, Eight Line, Who's Counting? -
Hi crew,
<Hi.>
A few weeks ago, I bought what was supposed to be a 6-line wrasse (Pseudocheilinus hexataenia) from my LFS.  After closer observation and a quick review at fishbase.org, it appears that this fish was actually an 8-line wrasse (Pseudocheilinus octotaenia).  Unfortunately, the wrasse died mysteriously after 2 week in my QT so I was never able to see it swim in my 180g reef tank.  Bob suggested a shorter QT period for wrasses (with a FW dip) in one of my previous emails so I will try this next time.
My questions now are:
1.  Are there advantages/disadvantages of an 8-line wrasse vs. 6-line?  (I have read several WWM postings about aggressive 8-lie wrasses, but 6-line wrasse comments seem to be generally positive). <Not really... they both fill a very similar niche. Personally, I've found sixline wrasses to be just as pugnacious as eightlines... typically once they've been in the tank for a while. Either way, with some larger fish around they tend to stay in line, pardon the terrible pun.>
2. I would also like to add a flasher wrasse, such as a Paracheilinus carpenteri and a canary wrasse (Halichoeres chrysus).  Would these wrasses live peacefully with a 6-line or 8-line wrasse? <I think so, sure. I have a mix of wrasses in my tank... they tend not to bother each other, although my Tuskfish does have its grumpy moments and chases the fairy and mystery wrasses around, nothing ever results from it [no damage].> (I also have a mixture of several tangs, a pair of maroon clowns, Banggai cardinals, mandarin and firefish - all established for nearly 2 years).
3.  Since carpenter wrasses are difficult to find, could you recommend a similar flasher wrasse that would live peacefully in my tank? <Seems to me that these aren't all that hard to find... when working in a fish store in San Diego, we used to get these in pretty regularly and on demand. Depending on where you live, you may end up having to use The Marine Center or similarly well connected online supplier.>
4.  Since the QT period should be cut short, how much QT time is adequate to catch any problems yet not over-stress the fish? <With these fish, you'd almost do best to just give them a pH-adjusted, freshwater dip and put them directly in the display. If you do quarantine, a week should do... would give the fish time to relax, not be hassled by other fish/competition.> Is iodine helpful in a dip for fish or is this only useful for corals? <Really best left to the corals.> I typically use Methylene blue for freshwater fish dips but, considering this reduced QT period, I am not sure is this is adequate. <The Methylene blue doesn't really provide much in the way of direct therapy in a dip - it's dark color and oxygenating properties help calm the fish, but you could just as easily go without this additive. A good long dip - five minutes plus should do the trick.>
As always, thank you for taking the time to help all of us with our questions -  There is a wealth of invaluable information on wetwebmedia.com!
<Cheers, J -- >