Question about Motoros... fdg... hlth.... env.  6/19/09
Hello!
I have a 8 month old stingray. My question is simple. He ate well this am i feed him ghost shrimp. Tried to change him to live red wigglers this weekend and he ate about 3. But not he seems disinterested in food. This evening i gave him his 10 shrimp and he didn't even bother to catch them. I check the water and everything was normal ph-6.0 am-0 n-0. So i know its not the water. I know they go on hunger strikes but i was wondering should i be worried?. I looked at your web site to see if other people have the same problem but it didn't really answer my question. He does this i notice only when i try to change his food. Is he just spoiled? Or is he sick?.
Don't know what to think hope you guys can help me out a bit. THANKS!!!
<Maria, you absolutely *should not* rule out water chemistry or water quality issues! These are BY FAR the most common reasons Stingrays stop eating or otherwise behave abnormally. Because you have a very low pH, 6.0, your biological filter will be working at a very low efficiency, so nitrite and ammonia spikes through the day are possible. In case you're wondering, biological filter bacteria prefer pH to be in the range 7.5 to 8.5, and the lower the pH goes below that range, the less they work, and below pH 6.0 they don't usually work at all. A very low pH also implies minimal carbonate hardness (what you measure with a KH rather than GH test kit) and that means that pH may well vary through the day, so again, take pH readings several times: before you turn the lights on in the morning, around midday, and sometime in the evening, at least. Ideally, you would be keeping a Stingray in water with a moderate amount of carbonate hardness
(4-5 degrees KH) and a pH around neutral (6.5-7.5). But as you hopefully know, making sudden changes to water chemistry will stress a Stingray, so if you do decide to alter water chemistry, you need to do so very carefully and in small steps. If for some reason your Stingray doesn't particularly want to eat the food you're offering him, then try starving him for a couple of days and see what happens. Besides earthworms and river shrimps, Stingrays should receive a variety of foods so that shortcomings on one are balanced by the others. Frozen seafood often works well, and things like squid and cockles are particularly nutritious and lack the thiaminase found in mussels and prawns. Small pieces of white fish are good, too, and you can buy frozen lancefish that can be used whole. This said, earthworms and shrimps are favourites, so be critical of environmental conditions and fix them, rather than missing this "early warning" and not realising something
was wrong until the Stingray got sick. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Question about motors... Potamotrygonid sys.  6/25/09
Hello again.
<Hello,>
Got your e-mail back. To clarify a few things i KNOW for a fact there is not spikes in either Am or N because i have tested thru out the day (every couple of hours) and are reading zero plus i have two filters on my tank.
<It's good you can be sure that water quality isn't an issue. Having two filters doesn't automatically mean you have perfect water quality though, so I'd dissociate those two ideas! But let's assume these two filters are adequate to the task, i.e., big canister filters that are maintained at least monthly so that there aren't issues with either turnover or nitrate levels rising between each time the filter is cleaned.>
He eats fine just is burred more the usual. Going to be up grading him to a bigger tank and want to make sure he is health before moving because of stress.
<There are multiple things you can think about. Firstly, is water circulation adequate? Hang-on-the-back filters for example have their inlets and outlets close together, so are less likely to provide good water
turnover than canister filters positioned with the inlet and outlet at different ends of the tank. If you're using hang-on-the-back filters with large fish, providing additional circulation via powerheads is probably
essential, especially given that Stingrays get their oxygen from a layer of water at the bottom of the tank, the layer that contains the least oxygen because it's furthest away from the air. Secondly, is diet sufficiently
varied? River shrimps are fine when used some of the time, but shrimps contain a lot of thiaminase, and this leads to severe nutritional imbalances in the long term (vitamin B1 deficiency) so you need to balance
them out with food items that don't contain thiaminase, such as earthworms and cockles. Here's an article that summarises this very important but often neglected topic:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_6/volume_6_1/thiaminase.htm
Thirdly, consider "psychological" effects. Stingrays will become stressed if there isn't sufficient swimming room, if house with aggressive tankmates, and perhaps if housed in a room with a lot of noise. Review, and
act accordingly. Generally speaking fish don't go off their food for no reason, and assuming that they're simply not bored with whatever is being offered, there's usually some environmental or health problem that needs to be fixed. Cheers, Neale.>  

Re: Question about motors
Thanks so much!..i am trying to get him a more variety of diet but every time i do he only eats its the new diet for about a day or so then doesn't want to eat.
<Are they still alive/wriggling when offered?>
Anything you suggest on how to get him to eat a new diet. I did buy red wigglers for him and he like i said ate some of a day and then didn't want them. So i have been trying to switch up his food but un successful.
<There are numerous books on Stingrays; I'd suggest borrowing or buying one of them so that you have a detailed account of feeding this difficult and expensive fish. But in brief, pieces of squid, mussel, white fish and even small amounts of oily fish such as salmon have all been used successfully.
Live "feeder" fish are not recommended unless home-bred livebearers or killifish, which are "safe" in terms of fat content, thiaminase, and parasite risk.>
Maria
<Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Question about motors 6/25/09
Yes they are alive and moving he will attack them but then realize eww i don't want this.
<Odd, usually they love earthworms. Maybe try different types/sizes of worms?>
i do have a book on fw stingray got them before buying the ray to educate myself.
<Very good. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: Question about motors 6/25/09
I will try.
Thanks a bunch!!
<Most welcome. Cheers, Neale.>

Hopefully a quick question 05/27/09
Just was wondering my motoro that I have for the past seven months is doing great!. but this past weekend since we had the holiday and all my pet store was close where I get his food so he didn't have any food for almost 3 days. (feed him today and ate great) but I notice he was a little skinny.
Can just three days caused such a show of skinniness?
<Potentially, but not likely; it takes a good couple of weeks before fish really have to dig into their fat reserves, hence the standard advice that it's safe to leave fish without food over holidays than to risk have someone overfeed them during your absence.>
Of course I tested the water just to make sure things are ok and it was good (just a tiny spike in ammonia )
<No such thing as a "tiny spike" of ammonia with Stingrays, anymore than a person can be "a little bit pregnant".>
but he always cause it to go up because he plays in the sand so he brings it up sometimes. Stressing out because of the ammonia spiking up here and there and then he lost weight. just wanted to know if I should be worried?. How long will it take for him to put weight back on?(feeding 20 shrimp a day) Also as an added note. He didn't eat his shrimp today which is not like him!
<Would review water quality and maintenance procedures; Stingray health -- including appetite -- is closely correlated to environmental parameters, and they invariably feed readily on live shrimp and earthworms when properly maintained. So rather than worrying about the food, worry about the water. Do also vary the diet: shrimp is rich in thiaminase, and this means that while your fish can get the calories it needs, the thiaminase can lead to a Vitamin B1 deficiency. By all means use shrimp for one or two meals out of seven, but the rest should be foods lacking thiaminase, such as earthworms. See here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_6/volume_6_1/thiaminase.htm
This is a critical issue that aquarists are only slowly comprehending.
Cheers, Neale.>

Possible Motoro Parasite/Feeding Frustrations (RMF, second opinion please) 3/10/09 Hello, <Hello Kyle,> Before I ask my question I think it's important to note that my 7 inch Motoro was purchased and acclimated 3 days ago, so he is still undergoing the typical acclimation stress (and the underside of his disk is reddish). Now that he has become more acclimated and begin scrounging for food, I noticed a small brown spot on the underside of his disk in the shape of a butterfly, with a little raised light-colored bump in the center of the spot. I have attached the best picture I was able to get of the spot (my ray swims fast on the glass), but I was wondering if this could be a parasite that hitched a ride on my ray; and if so, where can I find instruction to remove it as safely and stress-free as possible? <It isn't clear to me what this is, and I'm asking Bob for advice here.> <<Isn't clear to me either, but at largest amplification, cleaning up... and the position of this mark... it appears to be more of a "bruise" to me than anything else. Not parasitic. RMF>> In case it helps, my tank is registering nitrates at 5 PPM, with everything else at 0. I have a fine sand substrate and filtration to turn 10 times the volume of the tank. In addition, I was wondering about feeding. I have read and heard of stingrays on "feeding strikes" or "not accepting food" but mine seems to be very fickle about his food, neither accepting nor rejecting it in any predictable way. He's nearly always blowing the sand around looking for food, but if he does pick up a worm or small piece of raw shrimp, he will sometimes spit it out of his mouth even if he's accepted it from me greedily before... only then to further swim around the tank looking for something else to eat. One example is just an hour ago, I put half a live nightcrawler in there, and he sucked it out of my hand hungrily, then spat it out. For the next half hour he would gnaw at it, spit it out and then swim around the tank, eventually eating it. So far, I have tried bloodworms, red wigglers, nightcrawlers, and ground raw shrimp; all which have been accepted and rejected in an unpredictable fashion. Thank you for your time and advice, I look forward to hearing back from you. Kyle <While these fish are finicky, one key thing about their appetite is stress. So your Stingray may simply be settling in and not ready to feed consistently. But it could equally easy be an issue with water quality or water chemistry stability, so think about these factors too. Review tankmates, and see if there's anything that might be stressing the Stingray. Take care not to overfeed; when we bring home a new fish, it's tempting to keep feeding the new fish to check it's healthy and happy. Cheers, Neale.><<Totally in agreement. RMF>>

Re: More: re: Possible Motoro Parasite/Feeding Frustrations (RMF, second opinion please) 3/12/2009 Hi, guys- thank you for your help and quick responses. I tried to see what might be stressing him, but the water seems stable, <"Seems"? You don't get this latitude with stingrays; the water MUST be stable. Keeping them in huge tanks helps, as does performing very regular (ideally, daily) water changes so that background acidification doesn't get a chance to occur. The carbonate hardness should be reasonably high; while soft water fish in the wild, pH variation is much more harmful than moderately hard water.> he has no tank buddies, and the temp is kept at 80 degrees. <Too warm. The usual 25 C/77 F is ample for these and indeed most Amazon Basin fish (with a few exceptions, like fish from the Xingu River which do like things a bit warmer). The warmer the water, the more active a Ray will become, but the cost of higher metabolism is increased demand for oxygen and a heavier workload on the filter. Unless you're breeding fish, it's usually best to keep them at the cooler end of their preference range. Not cold, by any means, but verify their preferred temperature range from Fishbase or similar, and work from there.> And I have decided to call that brown spot a "beauty mark" and will continue to do so until the moment (if and when) it appears to be a trouble spot. <OK.> I have noticed since my e-mail before that there is a small amount of regularity in his feeding. He seems to have no trouble accepting one nightcrawler in the morning and evening, but anything after that he will not eat. His belly also appears to be getting less and less red each day (although this may partly be wishful thinking more so than objective observation)... so I am taking that as a sign that he's getting better acclimated. <Yes.> It's still a little weird to me that he is spending a lot of time blowing sand around looking for food, but won't eat much, and then spends a lot of time swimming in the same pattern around the glass. <What kind of sand are you using? Anything likely to irritate? Many aquarium sands are too sharp for benthic fish. If in doubt, plain vanilla "smooth" silica sand is fine.> I actually had to put a book on the corner of my tank, because it appears as though he keeps trying to jump out that corner (I wont worry about a tank cover until I see him trying to jump out anywhere else). <Normal behaviour if they're stressed. Again, this may stop if the fish settles in, but if it persists, then review conditions and act accordingly. The usual problems with Stingrays are insufficient water volume, insufficient filtration (water turnover), and unsteady water chemistry.> Is it possible, since the tank at the store was decently decorated, that adding some small decorations would help him with his level of comfort, or are rays not as concerned with decor as some other fish? <Wild fish hide by digging into the sand. Floating plants will certainly be welcomed for the shade they provide, but bogwood, rocks, etc are redundant and indeed undesirable if they trap dirt.> Well, it seems this 'thank you' has turned into a "holiday mailer" so I will cut it off here. Thanks again for all your help, `Kyle <Cheers, Neale.><<Excellent resp. Neale... content, format wise... Have nothing further to add. BobF>> Re: More: re: Possible Motoro Parasite/Feeding Frustrations (RMF, second opinion please) 3/12/2009 With regard to the substrate, it is a very fine sand. It may be that the granules, although small, are sharp if the sand is an issue. <Feel the sand; smooth sand feels velvety, sharp sand feels otherwise.> If upon further investigation of his habits, I determine that the substrate is causing him irritation, would adding a small layer of a different, smoother sand work? <Replace all the old sand with smooth sand. No point being cheap here; for the sake of a few dollars' worth of sand, you could end up with an infected Stingray. Dump the old sand in the garden. Mixed with soil, it helps improve drainage. So no waste.> I am trying to avoid ripping out the bio-colonies in the sand by replacing the substrate altogether. <No useful bacteria in the sand.> Perhaps replacing the substrate over time, bit by bit? What would work best for that? <Replace all.> Now that I read what I wrote, I realized "seems" doesn't fit what I am observing with the water. That was my way of saying I am checking it daily, levels are fine, so unless there are fluctuations in the water source here in ways I can't measure, then water quality isn't the issue. So, in this case, seems=if something's wrong, it's going to catch me off guard. <Right, I see.> Sorry to be such a bother with all these questions and trouble. This is (quite obviously) my first ray, so I am erring on the side of cautiousness, which may not be an err in ray-keeping at all. <Very wise indeed. Do invest in one of the several books on the topic. Some are inexpensive (like the Barron's one) and will save much money in the long term.> `Kyle <Cheers, Neale.> Re: More: re: Possible Motoro Parasite/Feeding Frustrations (RMF, second opinion please)   3/15/09 I thank you again for your assistance. I don't know what the problem could be anymore, because the substrate feels soft and smooth to me, not scratchy like some sands I have used. <Well, that's good.> Water quality is fine and I have been changing at least 10 percent of the water every day. <Define "fine". The thing with Stingrays is that 99 times out of 100, problems are down to water quality and/or chemistry issues. Obviously you need zero levels of ammonia and nitrite, but nitrate also needs to be very low, realistically as close to zero as is practical. The water chemistry should be stable; ideally soft and slightly acidic, but regardless of the hardness level, the pH should be rock steady.> He simply is refusing to eat anymore. <Was he feeding at the aquarium shop? What were they feeding him? For all the usual reasons, I'd never recommend buying a specimen that was fed feeder fish, particularly goldfish. But if it was consuming earthworms and other safe foods, it should be in good shape. Assuming he's eating something, and has hitherto taken a meal every couple of days, he can be "starved" for a week or more without problems. But the flip side is this: Stingrays tend to be greedy feeders for things like earthworms and live river shrimp when happy, but refuse to feed point blank when stressed in some way.> There seems to be a connection between me coming into the room or near the tank to do maintenance and him going to hide in the substrate. <Some degree of nervousness is common initially after purchase, but fish generally settle down within a few days to a week. Do review the general environment though: loud televisions, slamming doors, busy corridors can all make fish much more nervous than otherwise.> I am honestly getting a little frustrated with this guy; I really only try to feed him morning and evening. Maybe I just need clarification on what people mean when they say "feeding strike." Obviously, there's an element of non-eating, but if he's on such a "strike" then why does he spend the whole day searching for food? <To some degree you must dissociate foraging behaviour with actual feeding; fish will instinctively forage for food all through their day (or night) activity cycle. They don't need to be eating constantly though, and simply because they're foraging doesn't mean they need to be fed.> Most times, he finds what I give him and greedily begins to suck it down but then spits it out or leaves it, and then goes to hide. <Maybe he doesn't like it? What are you offering?> I'm afraid I am going to lose this guy, and it just feels wrong because I have been doing everything that I have been told either by people or by my very deep research (I did get the Barron's book before I bought him). <My gut feeling here is this: [1] Review environmental/water conditions; [2] Double check them! [3] Turn the lights out for the next few days. [4] Don't feed him for at least 3 days. [5] Get some nice, fat, juicy earthworms and offer one of them late in the evening on the fourth day.> I am sorry there wasn't much of a question in this e-mail. I guess I figured I may have said something about his behavior that may show something we haven't noticed before. `Kyle <Cheers, Neale.><<I do agree with your probable prognoses... advice Neale... If none of these can be found to be at fault, when-corrected, restore this fish to feeding, I would return it to the store. BobF>> Re: More: re: Possible Motoro Parasite/Feeding Frustrations (RMF, second opinion please) 3/15/09 Hm... thank you for the distinction between searching and hungriness. That has helped me a little. When I bought this one, I was actually in the LFS looking at another stingray that they tried to feed an earthworm and he didn't go for it, but this guy came speeding up to it and started to eat it down; he looked healthy and obviously hungry so I got him instead. <An excellent way to choose Stingrays.> He did have a little trouble eating the whole thing because he's a smaller ray still, but he did (and still does) get the whole nightcrawler down eventually. I have also tried breaking the worms in half or 3 parts but he loses interest or only eats the front-worm part. Thank the Lord I care for an African clawed frog who will eat what my ray rejects. Other foods I used are glass shrimp and raw supermarket shrimp, and red wigglers. <Do try something very small, like bloodworms. Shrimp are fine up to a point, but because they contain a lot of thiaminase, it is sensible to use them in small amounts, no more than 25% the weekly food input. Earthworms are very nutritious, in part because they are 'gut loaded' with decaying plant matter and soil. While that sounds icky, it does mean they provide lots of useful vitamins, minerals and fibre.> I will try not feeding for a couple days. My only worry is that he's already looking very malnourished from his rejection of food (hip bones showing, dent in forehead, etc). I will do that if he can last the couple days without food even like this. <Well, if he's not eating, he's not eating. So whether you put food in the water or not, it hardly matters. I'd certainly stop offering food he shows no interest in. A day or two starving should make little difference, though I agree, a "skinny" Stingray is at risk.> Water quality (ammonia/nitrite/nitrate) is still stable, nitrate at 3 PPM and I am going to change 20% of the water again today. <The nitrate is fine; the nitrite is zero though?> I honestly do not know about PH... maybe I made an unsafe assumption that using the same water source each time gives the same PH. <Ah, yes, this matters. A lot of people in the US seem to have water that has been treated in various ways by the water company, presumably to improve its potability. But the chemicals used, such as flocculants, cause the pH to change dramatically within 24 hours of being drawn from the tap. Try testing the pH of some tap water now, and then leaving the same water for 24 hours and seeing what the pH is then. You might be surprised. Also, do of course remember the basics: don't use water from a domestic water softener, do use dechlorinator, and do use a dechlorinator that treats ammonia and/or chloramine if either are issues with your local water supply. You might also want to check for copper in your tap water supply. If your pipes are made from copper, it is possible for tap water to become contaminated. Copper is highly toxic to Stingrays, and such water supply will need to be treated with a water conditioner than neutralised copper.><<And copper ion presence would definitely send them off feed. RMF>> `Kyle <Cheers, Neale.>

A worm question (Horsehair worms; stingrays)   10/17/08
Hello,
<Hi,>
was just wanted to know I notice some of my ghost shrimp have worms in there intestines are to believe they are Gordian Worm, a.k.a. Horsehair Worms...one died bc the worm killed it but I never notice them b4 on my shrimp I feed these shrimp to my Motoro stingray which I have had for about a week I know they are prone to roundworms and tapeworms but I was wondering if I did feed some shrimp that had these in them can they kill my ray I called the pet store where I got my ray and they never really heard of these worms really and are not sure if they will harm the ray they feed there ghost shrimp to there rays and had no prob but they never looked at there shrimp to see if they had worms so they could be feeding ones that do so I don't know what I should do I don't want my ray to die and I don't know if I should get new shrimp the other ones seem to not have these worms in them..should I continue to feed them to my ray or go and get new ones??????
<Sheesh... not even a period or comma. Do please review our very modest "fee" before writing: we expect e-mails to be spell checked and written with proper grammar. Not much to ask, and the point is that we depend on properly formatted messages so that we can share them with other site visitors. The better Google can index our pages, the more people will view our pages, and the more revenue our advertising generates to pay for bandwidth. It's a simple deal really.>
HELP!!! PLEASE KINDA SCARED FOR MY RAY I LOVE HIM!!!
<Horsehair worms are not likely to cause your Ray any harm. Most parasites are species-specific, and while they may be harmful to the shrimp, they are unlikely to adapt to the particular anatomy of your Stingray. If you're really that bothered, don't use the shrimps. Earthworms are a very safe food if collected from an area that is "organic", i.e., not sprayed with chemicals. Most rays love earthworms. There's no reason to use live food with most Stingrays anyway, and a varied diet of mussels, prawns and squid is easily provided using foods sold for humans.>
thanks
Maria
<Cheers, Neale.>

FW Ray Feeding 03/19/2008
A quick question on my hystrix rays. They seem to want to eat constantly.
<Yes. A good sign>
They are on frozen foods, I think there's virtually nothing they wouldn't eat but I can't seem to figure out just exactly how much is too much or too little?
<Better to keep a bit hungry>
They are both young. The female is about 6 inches diameter and the male about 4 inches. She's the bigger piggy of the two but both are all about the food. This is my first time emailing you and your website is fantastic. I work in a pet store and recommend your site to my customers frequently.
<Have seen in some stores that they have terminals for all to peruse the Net... Neat idea!>
I hope this isn't listed in the FAQ section somewhere but for love nor money I could not find it.
<Ahh, this and life-times more info. to be added... as long as your Potamotrygonids aren't obviously concave in the tummy region, they're fine... Better for all to have them grow slowly, not pollute their tank. Cheers, Bob Fenner>

Stingray not feeding, FW    11/16/07
hi i have a young freshwater stingray it has not fed since i got it. i have had it for about 4 weeks. i have poot it in a new tank on its own.
<Sorry, what's the question? There are many reasons why Stingrays won't feed, and almost all of them come down to improper care. So the problem is much more likely with you and not the fish, and unless you fix that problem, it'll die. Stingrays are exceedingly difficult fish that should only ever be kept by aquarists with many years experience. They need big tanks in particular with a wide surface area, at least 75 cm by 200 cm, and filtration needs to be top-notch, of the order of 10 times the volume of the tank per hour. Water changes need to be not less than 50% per week, and really two or three times that. Water chemistry isn't critical, but water chemistry stability is, so that needs to be factored in, and chemical buffering used if appropriate. There are no "small" species, and the appealing little juveniles widely sold are even more delicate than their parents. I'd suggest that around nine out of every ten stingrays sold dies within the first six months. Almost no-one who tries keeping them succeeds, UNLESS they have lots of experience and done plenty of reading. And even then, it all comes down to having a big tank with perfect water quality. When healthy, stingrays will eat pretty much anything: river shrimp, earthworms, chunky seafood, silversides, etc. Cheers, Neale.>

Re: stingray not feeding – 11/17/07
thank you for your time, ill let you know if I get it feeding
<You're welcome. Good luck! Neale>

FW Ray fdg.  - 7/23/07
Hi Robert I am not sure if you are the guy to ask this question but her i goes.
I have a Motoro ray he is about 6" was doing real well. My water quality is perfect
<?>
and so is the temperature.
<Is this a guessing game? How about some clues if so?>
His tank mates are a Pleco and a couple surviving tetras (food) I made the mistake of just feeding him earth worms fro a couple months ( I know bad) Gave him kidney or liver failure. He lost tons of wait and is real skinny. I am trying to bring him back to his heath again.
I have been feeding him bud worms for the last few days he seems to be eating them but there not too filling I don't think. He does not want to eat any frozen krill or shrimp. I am even trying to feed him a small live 3/4" crayfish. But he does not seem too keen on it or the ghost shrimp.
Do you have any suggestions for me that might get him eating again.
<Mmm... need to know the values you hint at above... likely lowering the pH, raising the temperature, offering live food... maybe like ghost shrimp... Possibly soaking in a vitamin/HUFA supplement...>
Yes I learned my lesson f/w rays need variety for food.
Thanks in advance Kevin B
Me Kevin B.
<Please read here: http://wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwrayfdgfaqs.htm
and the linked files above. Bob Fenner>

Stingray issue  7/22/07
Hi there,
My question is about my fw stingray. I currently am housing 3 fw stingrays, 2 Motoros and one reticulata (teacup). Motoros are 12 in and 6 in and teacup is 6 inches . I have had them for about a year in a 265 gal with a large Pacu and 14 in silver arowana. As of late the smaller Motoro has been swimming above where the air bubble wand and filter outtake meet. Its def out of character for her. I am using a fluval fx5, an emperor BioWheel and Eheim canister for filtration. One of her eyes seems cloudy and closing. I lost the first ray I had a year ago and he showed some similar signs. Ammonia 0 nitrate 0 ph 6.0.
Temp about 82. I feed rays jumbo night crawlers I get from bait shop and once in a while feeder goldfish but not to much. I added Pimafix. She also has a little red around her mouth. The swimming funny really has me thinking somethings up. She eats and has not lost any weight. Any helpful hints. I would really appreciate any help your site is the best. Oh and substrate is sand very easy on them.
<Greetings. As you probably realize, freshwater stingrays are exceptionally difficult fish that are only suitable for very advanced, highly experienced fishkeepers. When it comes to disease, the problems are that [a] we don't really have a textbook list of stingray diseases yet and [b] many of the medications safe with bony fish are dangerous to cartilaginous fish. Now, as a general rule, when fish swim into the filter current it is usually because this is where the water quality is highest and the oxygen concentration highest. Likewise, when fish show red patches on this skin (signs of irritation) then again, water quality is something to think about. In your case, you need to be reviewing a variety of things. Ammonia and nitrite obviously (you say the former is 0, but how regularly do you test it? try testing over a week and at different times of the day, especially shortly after feeding). Nitrate needs to be as close to zero as possible, which you say is the case. But water chemistry is also important. Stingrays aren't that fussed about pH and hardness, but they are bothered by changes. So if you're manipulating your water supply to get the low pH and hardness levels you have, check to see you're being consistent. Another issue is air or water pollution: it's easy for things like paint vapours and tobacco smoke to end up in the aquarium, and these will irritate/poison the fish. Yet another issue is filter turnover. For a stingray, I'd recommend not less than 8x the volume of the tank in turnover per hour (i.e., marine quality filtration and twice that for regular small community fish like guppies and tetras). Given your aquarium is 265 gallons, that means you need filtration around 2120 gallons per hour, minimum. Your Fluval delivers about 600 gallons per hour, the Emperor 280 gallons per hour, and the Eheim I don't know how much because you don't say the model. But it needs to be *at least* 1240 gallons per hour to even make the baseline your stingrays need. Since even a really big Eheim like the Professional 3 is only producing a "mere" 450 US gallons per hour turnover, your tank is very likely (almost certainly) under-filtered. Some more general advice. Melafix and Pimafix are largely useless as treatments. While they sometimes work for some people under some conditions, they're too inconsistent to be relied on, and therefore of no value with expensive fishes like yours. Another problem is diet. Stingrays feed on a variety of animals in the wild including small fish, but never Cyprinidae. The nearest Cyprinidae are hundreds if not thousands of miles away from where they live. Why do I mention that? Because Cyprinidae -- things like goldfish and minnows -- have high quantities of Thiaminase that breaks down Vitamin B1 over time. They also contain a lot of fat. Fish that eat them in the wild, like pike, presumably are adapted to this, but most other predatory fish do not seem to be, and long term both these issues cause damage. Bob Fenner has written at length on the issue of feeder goldfish and marine predators like Lionfish. Since your stingray is, basically, a marine fish that happens to be living in freshwater because it got trapped on the wrong side of a newborn mountain range, your stingray likely will react the same way to a high fat, high thiaminase diet as any other marine predator (i.e., poorly). On top of this, feeder fish are the Number 1 best way to introduce parasites and bacteria into your nice clean stingray aquarium. To be honest, whoever advised you to feed cheap "parasite time bombs", sorry, feeder goldfish, to something as delicate and easy to kill as a stingray deserves to spend some quality time on the Naughty Spot. The ideal foods for stingrays are either terrestrial foods (like earthworms), marine foods (like mussels and prawns), or "clean" frozen foods (like bloodworms and lancefish). All these will be safe because they have no chance of introducing parasites or bacteria into the aquarium likely to harm a freshwater stingray. Over here in the UK, live estuarine river shrimp are widely used with success and these match very closely the preferred staple diet of freshwater stingrays in the wild: large crustaceans. As you realize, stingrays have teeth adapted not for catch fish but for crushing shells. Finally, the whole sand issue in aquaria for stingrays is debated endlessly. There's some good evidence that dirty sand can trap bacteria and cause infections. This has been observed on catfish barbels for years (erroneously put down by some people to "sharp" gravel wearing the barbels down). Catfish generally shrug off such infections and re-grow their barbels when conditions improve, catfish being, fundamentally, very hardy animals usually adapted to swamps and other horrid environments. Stingrays do not have this level of robustness. So double check the sand is spotlessly clean. You should be stirring it weekly and siphoning out any detritus. Many stingray keepers prefer to keep their rays in tanks without sand to side-step this issue. Finally, do check the fish aren't able to burn themselves. It is *extremely* common for stingrays to burn themselves against the heater. The heater should be either inside the filter or covered with a plastic mesh of some kind (called "guards" and these often come with the better heaters anyway). Hope this helps! Cheers, Neale.>

Motoro sting ray... RMF rant on the new trade, poor env., poisoning, lack of useful info.  - 02/15/07
Hello,
I have a motoro stingray with a sand substrate.
<Hopefully not silicate... but smooth...>
I was using new Tetra tec filters with internal heaters to protect the ray but the impellers kept failing.
<What is happening with the "new" Tetra? And while we're at it... Aquarium Systems salts? Oceanic Tanks...?  What gives with the "consolidation" of the pet-trade anyhow? The big owners are doing a crap job of "managing"...>
  I switched to Filstar Canistar filters
<Am not a fan of...>
and had a mild algae bloom.  I treated the tank with a small amount of "algae fix"
<NO!!! Toxic...>
which corrected the algae issue but now she refuses to eat.
<Poisoned...>
  It has only been three days and I have tried bloodworms, ghost shrimp, and krill all of which she used to love.  All levels are fine
<... worthless>
and she seems fine but I would like to know if there is anything I can do to get her back to eating regularly?
<...>
I do not think that the filter change is the problem because I changed the filter on another ray tank at the same time and that teacup ray is eating normally. I did a water change but she still refuses to eat.
Bob Fenner had some great advise which helped in setting up for both my ray tanks and I hope that he or anyone else can help with this question.
Please advise,
Thanks,
Joe
<Please take the (re)read here: http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/fwstingrays.htm
and the linked files above. I would do a series of water changes to remove the algicide, make sure the water is warm, soft, acidic per this species requirements... and be patient at this point. BobF>